Why is airfare so much from Canada?

[fundy_dreamer]

OK having just returned from my second trip to WDW, my question is why is it so tough to find decent air travel to central Florida? If Bangor, ME can have direct flights with a population of 40-50k why can't Moncton or Saint John, NB? You'd think that charter airlines would at least provide some flights during the March break season. Are there restrictions on Canadian airlines flying into the US that make it cost prohibitive?

It just seems crazy that so many of us from the East coast to the West coast have to drive for 3-8 hours south to hit airports in relatively small northern US cities. It looks like even folk in GTA consider going to Buffalo or Detroit.

Our family drove to Portland, ME (5.5 hours) to fly Jetblue last month because we couldn't find anything out of the Maritimes. Although driving through the border means no need for clearing customs at an airport, the convenience of flying closer to home would outweigh that.

Any thoughts or discussions.

Maybe we can band together and lobby the air industry.

 

[4orm]

We have fewer options. The airlines don't the same competition as in the US and we have to pay insane taxes compared to the US. Plus we have to pay taxes for cross an international boarder. There was once talk of opening our skies to non-Canadian carriers but the government nixed that.

OK having just returned from my second trip to WDW, my question is why is it so tough to find decent air travel to central Florida? If Bangor, ME can have direct flights with a population of 40-50k why can't Moncton or Saint John, NB? You'd think that charter airlines would at least provide some flights during the March break season. Are there restrictions on Canadian airlines flying into the US that make it cost prohibitive?

It just seems crazy that so many of us from the East coast to the West coast have to drive for 3-8 hours south to hit airports in relatively small northern US cities. It looks like even folk in GTA consider going to Buffalo or Detroit.

Our family drove to Portland, ME (5.5 hours) to fly Jetblue last month because we couldn't find anything out of the Maritimes. Although driving through the border means no need for clearing customs at an airport, the convenience of flying closer to home would outweigh that.

Any thoughts or discussions.

Maybe we can band together and lobby the air industry.

 

[tgropp]

In one word. TAXES !!

Any airplane that lands in Toronto will pay more to land there than any other airport in the entire world. That is what I had read.

 

[fundy_dreamer]

Taxes would only seem to explain the cost not necessarily the frequency or the variety. The open skies issue might be part of it but there are carriers in Canada that charter south (Westjet, Canjet, Sunwing) so they must be able to make a buck. It seems like there are increasing options to travel to other sun destinations like Cuba, Mexico and Dominican but fewer good choices for Florida.

I wonder if demand is off from families and others heading to central Fla?

The Dis Unplugged gang are saying that Orlando is in a deep downturn (except WDW). I certainly noticed how quiet Universal was when we were there first week of March.

 

[dis_guy]

Well, from Edmonton, it would be something like 4-5 days driving each way, hotels, food, traffic, tolls, etc. Now ask me if it is worth $657 pp (the price we got for our Dec trip) to get there in 7 hours flat. I think so.

Would I rather pay $99 US each way like you can from Buffalo? Sure, but it isn't gonna happen out here. I honestly can't see how Southwest, Jetblue, and the others stay in business. They must be cutting corners all over the place. Not sure how I'd feel flying with them.

Airfare is what it is.

 

[braddillman]

I don't think taxes and exchange rate account for the whole difference; out flights are still quite a bit more. It must be fewer competitors.

 

[fundy_dreamer]

Well, from Edmonton, it would be something like 4-5 days driving each way, hotels, food, traffic, tolls, etc. Now ask me if it is worth $657 pp (the price we got for our Dec trip) to get there in 7 hours flat. I think so.

Would I rather pay $99 US each way like you can from Buffalo? Sure, but it isn't gonna happen out here. I honestly can't see how Southwest, Jetblue, and the others stay in business. They must be cutting corners all over the place. Not sure how I'd feel flying with them.

Airfare is what it is.

Good points...everything is relative. My experience with Jetblue was very good...flights on time, friendly staff, new terminal at JFK and it wasn't dirt cheap out of Portland, ME (about $400 CDN PP booked 6 months in advance). But for instance Edmonton has a pop of what 800k - 1 mil, so it just seems that there should be more options for a city that size compared to the options for a comparable US city.

It must come down to the limits on competition due to the lack of 'open skies'. I'm definitely going to do more research and perhaps in time we can band together to lobby for some changes to the policy. (Not to get into politics...I just want to get to Disney easier and cheaper).

Certainly given Air Canada's situation, current policies aren't helping domestic carriers enough to survive.

 

[dis_guy]

Actually, Edmonton is 1 million plus now and there is choice. There's Air Canada, WestJet, Delta, United, and Northwest but NO direct flights. It's just that they're all pretty equally expensive. When we went in late March we flew UA connecting in Denver for about $350 CAN pp. Now, if you see sub $700 pp fares you'd better grab then because they'll be gone soon!

 

[colin25]

Where I live, we only have Air Canada and a local airline which only flies to Vancouver, and it usually costs about $450 return from here to Vancouver(on either airline), even though it's not that long of a flight. Flying out of Vancouver, there's lots of choices, and a lot cheaper flights, but living in the north, we don't have any choice but to pay AC what they want. I've seen return flights as low as around $550 from here to LA, but a return flight just to Vancouver around $400. Something just ain't right about that.

 

[Cdn Friends of Pooh]

Actually, Edmonton is 1 million plus now and there is choice. There's Air Canada, WestJet, Delta, United, and Northwest but NO direct flights. It's just that they're all pretty equally expensive. When we went in late March we flew UA connecting in Denver for about $350 CAN pp. Now, if you see sub $700 pp fares you'd better grab then because they'll be gone soon!

I agree ... We also fly out of Edmonton and the cheapest we've found for our October flights are $630/pp CAD return on NWA. That is about double what we paid in January and May 2008. Our October 2008 flights we used miles to upgrade but even then the base fare was around $700.

In our experience, AC and WJ prices have been much higher than the US carriers - but it appears that they are all very close in price now

 

[DisneylandGuy22]

I just paid $387.00 return. I am flying from Calgary to LA with a 2 night stop over then i fly direct from LA to Orlando and then on the 30th i fly from orlando connecting in denver back to calgary. I am flying Aircanada then United.

 

[dis_guy]

Actually, Edmonton is 1 million plus now and there is choice. There's Air Canada, WestJet, Delta, United, and Northwest but NO direct flights. It's just that they're all pretty equally expensive. When we went in late March we flew UA connecting in Denver for about $350 CAN pp. Now, if you see sub $700 pp fares you'd better grab then because they'll be gone soon!

Just thought I'd mention that was March 2008 when the fares were $350, not this past month. You got a good deal there, Mr. 22.

 

[squirrel]

The best we can find so far is about $436 pp Canadian, flying out of Seattle.

Last year we paid about $277 pp Canadian and no baggage fees.

 

[tlcdoula]

The best we can find so far is about $436 pp Canadian, flying out of Seattle.

Last year we paid about $277 pp Canadian and no baggage fees.

Oh Ya I forgot about the baggage fees.... grrrr When we flew to Mexico I had bought the tickets just before they made the change phew!!!

Wonder how much I can fit in a carry on? I might be able to get away with 1 or 2 checked bags instead of once for each of us...

tlc

 

[OntFamily]

In one word. TAXES !!

Any airplane that lands in Toronto will pay more to land there than any other airport in the entire world. That is what I had read.

Though this doesn't explain why there are not more direct flights from Halifax to Florida...... They wouldn't have to pay any fees to Toronto Airport.

Also, while landing fees are purported to among the highest in the world at Toronto airport, you can't call them taxes. The fees are levied by the GTAA (Greater Toronto Airport Authority) - they run the airport. The gov't has no input into the fee structure.

Having said that, there are higher taxes in Canada contributing to higher costs for air travel. Plus, when you cross the US border while flying, the US gov't does add security taxes.

 

[OntFamily]

Would I rather pay $99 US each way like you can from Buffalo? Sure, but it isn't gonna happen out here. I honestly can't see how Southwest, Jetblue, and the others stay in business. They must be cutting corners all over the place. Not sure how I'd feel flying with them.

We haven't seen many of the $99 airfares over the past year. Also, when there was $99 (I've paid as low as $69) you still had to add in taxes and airport fees. People always seen to "forget" the extra costs when describing their low air fares.

Plus, you also have to add in extra fees the US airlines charge. I paid $50 Cdn (each way) to check two bags on US Airways a couple of months ago.

 

[fundy_dreamer]

Congrats on that fare from Calgary...but you've reinforced my original point (while one of my thoughts anyway ) It shows that there is a complete lack of sensibility in airfare pricing. Plus it may help explain AC's current financial situation.

These people running the airlines are bright and I'm sure if they can make a buck flying planes to Orlando they'll try. The security tax for flying into the US is interesting, I was unaware of this. And maybe there just aren't enough planes for those peak periods when we Canadians want to get south...although from what I read in the papers that shouldn't be an issue right now the way they're mothballing planes.

Anyone have any ideas about what charter flights were available in your area this past Christmas or Spring Break season? Did anyone fly one of these (Canjet, Transat, Westjet, Sunwing, etc) and were the planes full?

 

[tribus121]

we payed aprox $ 275 cdn in january ( including all taxes and fees )for direct flights portland me to mco on Air Tran the best we could get from here in Fredericton was was over $900 this was booked 4 months in advance i did however notice that the last few seats on our flight sold for over $500usd

 

[fundy_dreamer]

Definitely going to keep Airtran in my browser from now on. We booked the Jetblue flight out of Portland in Sept '08 and it was around $1,800 US...so about $2,100 CDN (good exchange then) for 5...so about $420 CDN each. The best we could find at home was close to $1,000 each. That was for travel first week of March (Sunday - Sun).

Anyone with experience on the pricing benefits to flying on off-days (i.e. not Sunday)?

 

[braddillman]

In one word. TAXES !!.

I just priced AirTran from Portland, ME to MCO for $210 USDpp ~= $263 CDNpp. The cheapest from YHZ is $527 CDNpp (Delta). Air Canada prices at $642, WJ at $776.

So that's $264pp more for Delta ($379pp AC, ) from YHZ.
That's $115pp more for AC over Delta.

I believe the fees + taxes on these YHZ->MCO flights are around $130 CDN... so why is the DIFFERENCE in taxes + fees greater than the TOTAL fees out of YHZ? The only way this could mathematically be true, is if the f+t out of BGR was actually a negative number, implies that the US flights are somehow subsidized, which I doubt very much.

Why is AC so much more than Delta for the same flight?
Why is WJ so much more than AC for the same flight? (Personally, when I do comparisons WJ rarely beats AC, but others find the opposite... maybe out west WJ beats AC due to volume?)