Why buy more DVC points as compared to another timeshare.

[3DisneyNUTS]

Of course I see the value of more points if say you only owned 150 like me. BUT why go into 600 points or more rather than buy another timeshare say with RCI that has more trading choices? I think aside from adding onto our 150 our next big timeshare purchase would be from another company just for the variety.

 

[B'rer Karen]

Well I'm not even close to the 600 point mark personally, but off the top of my head I would think if you only planned on using your points at DVC properties, an add-on would make more sense than a purchasing another timeshare.

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by 3DisneyNUTS
Of course I see the value of more points if say you only owned 150 like me. BUT why go into 600 points or more rather than buy another timeshare say with RCI that has more trading choices? I think aside from adding onto our 150 our next big timeshare purchase would be from another company just for the variety.

Actually buying less DVC points and one or more other timeshares or systems may be the best choice for most people. Depending on the choices, made, it's very possible to give ones self a lot more choices without even joining an exchange company. DVC fits extremely well with Marriott and with several other points systems including Bluegreen, Farifield and WorldMark. In large part it depends on where one lives, how flexible one can be on times of year, how picky you are, how far in advance you can plan and if you need full weeks or less.

 

[spiceycat]

i though so too back in 95 when I brought Westgate - back mistake on my part.

but since then thanks to tug - I have also brought a timeshare that my family will use for many years - in Panama City Beach - I also have one is South Africia for trade purposes.

both are great for the reason I brought them.

I love my DVC - but Orlando has a lot to see and do besides WDW - which is why I though the Westgate would work - it did not - so now I use my SA to trade into much better resorts in Orlando for my non-DVC times....

 

[chainkid]

I own over 600 points now and am waiting for ROFR to okay my purchase of an additional 150 points. In my case I love the location of the BWV and all the activities and restaurants in the area. I don;t like owning a timeshare and wouldn't if it weren't Disney where I know the value and maintenance of the property will be maintained. I know of several horror stories where people have to pay high maintenance fees, have run down properties after a few years of ownership. This isn't to say there aren't great timeshares just that I don't have the time or will to research them. When I travel I like to stay in concierge type accomodations so timeshare living is too limited an option for me. I'm sure their are others in DVC just like me.

 

[Tiggery]

Why would I want to go anywhere else???

 

[gjw007]

Hi;

Like many members on this board, I have a timeshare in Orlando (Orange Lake) and I am in the process of closing on DVC. I also have a timeshare Alhambra Villas I bought for the express purpose of exchanging, In addition to the normal annual dues, to exchange you must have a membership in an exchange company ($$) and pay an exchange fee ($$) to make the exchange. I have exchange the time periods with my Orange Lake using the exchange company but mostly I go back there every year during the same time period (week before Xmas).

If you purchase a timeshare offsite in Orlando, I would recommend that you utilize TUG to get an understanding of the resorts. Orange Lake, Sheraton Visatana Resort, Hiltons Grand Vacation, etc. are all extremely highly rated. There are a lot of very nice timeshares in the Orlando area but a lot are not as good. The sales staff will all make it sound great.

If the time period is not critical, considering buying resales, especially if you are looking to use it for trade purpose. If you buy directly from the company, the value that you can get drops tremendously (you might be able to get a 1/3 of what you paid). DVC has had the advantage that even on resales, many people have been able to recoupe their expense. In part, this is because of Disney's ROFR but unlike the other timeshares, Disney is the destination as well. Still, don't treat this as an investment. The discussions on this board comparing it to an investment are amusing but off-base.

Now, since I do own several weeks off-site, why did I purchase DVC. Well, there's nothing quite like being in the middle of the activities rather than on the peripherals. I spend 1 week a year doing what I refer to as the "Disney Vacation" where I head to Disney. The other times, I am at the resort to relax. A big open resort like Orange Lake fits my needs perfectly.

One thing that hasn't been discussed it the power to trade. Disney has great power to trade. It is where a lot of people want to get into. That makes the site attractive. Orlando, because of the power of Disney, is an attractive site. RCI (so does II) uses a color system to determine the attractiveness of a site. It uses red to indicate high demand, white and blue for less demand. Orlando is red all year long as there is that much demand. Other sites, such as a resort in Maine may be white (lower demand) in April. A site that has high demand will generate more power in a trade than a site that has lower demand (it is easy to find people who want to exchange into a high demand area but not as many who wish to exchange into a lower demand area).

Another factor is ratings. RCI use Gold, Resort of Distinstion, and regular. A gold crown resort has more trading power than a ROD or a regular rated resorts. II uses a 5-star, I think, for its highest ratings. Room size also plays a role. A 3-bedroom has more trading power than a 2-bedroom, etc.

DVC are at the top of the list for all these factors, so you don't really have to worry about trading power. With offsite resorts, there are a number of things to consider that the salesperson will gloss over. If you are looking to exchange to various times of the year, the resale market makes more sense when looking at these resorts and purchasing a resort like those I listed in this account. Even if you purchased directly from the resort, you would still be going through the expense and time of going through the exchange process. Purchasing resales will easily save you over $10,000.

 

[3DisneyNUTS]

Originally posted by gjw007
Hi;

Like many members on this board, I have a timeshare in Orlando (Orange Lake) and I am in the process of closing on DVC. I also have a timeshare Alhambra Villas I bought for the express purpose of exchanging, In addition to the normal annual dues, to exchange you must have a membership in an exchange company ($$) and pay an exchange fee ($$) to make the exchange. I have exchange the time periods with my Orange Lake using the exchange company but mostly I go back there every year during the same time period (week before Xmas).

If you purchase a timeshare offsite in Orlando, I would recommend that you utilize TUG to get an understanding of the resorts. Orange Lake, Sheraton Visatana Resort, Hiltons Grand Vacation, etc. are all extremely highly rated. There are a lot of very nice timeshares in the Orlando area but a lot are not as good. The sales staff will all make it sound great.

If the time period is not critical, considering buying resales, especially if you are looking to use it for trade purpose. If you buy directly from the company, the value that you can get drops tremendously (you might be able to get a 1/3 of what you paid). DVC has had the advantage that even on resales, many people have been able to recoupe their expense. In part, this is because of Disney's ROFR but unlike the other timeshares, Disney is the destination as well. Still, don't treat this as an investment. The discussions on this board comparing it to an investment are amusing but off-base.

Now, since I do own several weeks off-site, why did I purchase DVC. Well, there's nothing quite like being in the middle of the activities rather than on the peripherals. I spend 1 week a year doing what I refer to as the "Disney Vacation" where I head to Disney. The other times, I am at the resort to relax. A big open resort like Orange Lake fits my needs perfectly.

One thing that hasn't been discussed it the power to trade. Disney has great power to trade. It is where a lot of people want to get into. That makes the site attractive. Orlando, because of the power of Disney, is an attractive site. RCI (so does II) uses a color system to determine the attractiveness of a site. It uses red to indicate high demand, white and blue for less demand. Orlando is red all year long as there is that much demand. Other sites, such as a resort in Maine may be white (lower demand) in April. A site that has high demand will generate more power in a trade than a site that has lower demand (it is easy to find people who want to exchange into a high demand area but not as many who wish to exchange into a lower demand area).

Another factor is ratings. RCI use Gold, Resort of Distinstion, and regular. A gold crown resort has more trading power than a ROD or a regular rated resorts. II uses a 5-star, I think, for its highest ratings. Room size also plays a role. A 3-bedroom has more trading power than a 2-bedroom, etc.

DVC are at the top of the list for all these factors, so you don't really have to worry about trading power. With offsite resorts, there are a number of things to consider that the salesperson will gloss over. If you are looking to exchange to various times of the year, the resale market makes more sense when looking at these resorts and purchasing a resort like those I listed in this account. Even if you purchased directly from the resort, you would still be going through the expense and time of going through the exchange process. Purchasing resales will easily save you over $10,000.

GARY THANKS SO MUCH! My God there is so much I do not know This is such a new thing to me and my family. I feel I would never have such a grip on all these details.

I am definitely going to join TUG and see if I could learn more about this. I don't even know if purchasing another timeshare is the right thing after that explination!

Now say I wanted to travel to Arizona and Cali etc. Would it be better economically to buy more DVC points and trade those OR by another timeshare to use for offsite vacations. If so do I buy in orlando which is always red like you say or do I go somewhere completely different to give variety to my own vacation experiences? Gosh this is overwhelming LOL AND what about trading to Europe. Does that make it insane? Also trading out of one place into another I would assume involves fees like trading in DVC does. Are other timeshares as economical as DVC as far as exchange fees?

 

[Dean]

If one is inclined to buy a timeshare to complement or instead of DVC, Orlando is almost never a reasonable choice. Exceptions would be those that need a 3 BR or those that decide not to buy DVC, even then it's usually not the best choice. Also buying Marriott in Orlando may work well for some, not for others.

 

[Lisa P.]

Now say I wanted to travel to Arizona and Cali etc. Would it be better economically to buy more DVC points and trade those OR by another timeshare to use for offsite vacations.

Generally, another timeshare - resale, red week or points, away from Orlando, with lower maint fees.

what about trading to Europe. Does that make it insane?

Depends on where you want to go in Europe.

trading out of one place into another I would assume involves fees like trading in DVC does.

It may. Or it may be an internal exchange using a points system with resorts in your desired destinations. Most of those do not charge a reservation fee (like using OKW DVC points to vacation at HHI DVC).

Are other timeshares as economical as DVC as far as exchange fees?

Slightly more expensive II/RCI fees but usually lower annual maint fees and lower resale purchase price. So in the long run, there are many, cheaper alternative timeshare purchases for the purpose of trading.

BTW, WorldMark, Fairfield, and Sunterra all offer resorts in AZ, CA and HI within their points systems (Sunterra's in Europe too). Marriott has nice resorts with full weeks in all those places. Those may be some places to start your research since internal trading is usually much easier & less expensive than external trading via II or RCI. Do read whatever you can on TUG before making a purchase! HTH!

 

[bwvBound]

Originally posted by 3DisneyNUTS
Of course I see the value of more points if say you only owned 150 like me. BUT why go into 600 points or more rather than buy another timeshare say with RCI that has more trading choices? I think aside from adding onto our 150 our next big timeshare purchase would be from another company just for the variety.

We've structured our "vacation portfolio" using multiple properties to maximize flexibility and reduce costs (where possible). We have two that we use for trading through RCI (one high-end, one low-end), one used for local travel (West Coast, points system), one for use of resort amenities (horseback riding, golf, and hot springs pool) ... and a small block of DVC intended specifically for DVC stays.

We maintain memberships in both RCI and II -- taking advantage of both exchanges and "bonus vacations/getaway weeks' (inexpensive rental weeks).

A mix of properties works best for us!

 

[gjw007]

If one is inclined to buy a timeshare to complement or instead of DVC, Orlando is almost never a reasonable choice. Exceptions would be those that need a 3 BR or those that decide not to buy DVC, even then it's usually not the best choice. Also buying Marriott in Orlando may work well for some, not for others.

Dean;

I'm not so sure about that. There are many great timeshares outside of Orlando that are very nice and have great trading power. If you are looking to trade, it is the factors that make up the power of the trade. It is hard to trade a unit where there is limited desire to trade into. Orlando, because of DisneyWorld, and Hawaii are sites that people want to trade into. Of course, I had mentioned the various factors that make a unit good to trade. A lot of Orlando area timeshares have these features. So if you are buying strictly for trade, it makes sense.

If you go to Orlando yearly, it also makes sense. A two-bedroom at Orange Lake is much less expensive than Disney and its yearly maintenance fees are also less. Sheraton's Visatan Resort's 2-bedroom are about $25,998 (quote when I was at a timeshare presentation in May) and I think the maintenance fees were in the $800 to $900 range. It also has its own points based system that can be exchanged within its private network.

If you don't go to Orlando yearly and you don't expect to, it makes no sense unless you are purchasing for trade purposes only. It is much easier to trade a timeshare in Orlando and get what you desire than to trade a timeshare in Bismark, ND in the middle of the winter. I don't understand the rationale to buy a timeshare near home and then trade into Orlando. Many timeshares have a provision where you can only trade in once every 3 or 4 years. So you may not be able to trade into a resort that you like on a yearly basis. In addition, you are forcing yourself to pay the exchange fees.

The key is understanding what your rationale for purchasing is. An important factor is the developer. I am heading to Detroit Lakes, Mn staying in a timeshare for week. The developer, running into financial problems, dumped the timeshare on the owners. They are trying to operate it but a developer is so important to the operations. The timeshare is a standard resort in the RCI measurement so it has limited trading ability (it can be traded, there are other factors has well such as when you bank your week, when you make your request, etc.).

I think most of us would agree that there is no "ONE BEST" solution or recommendation. In many cases, the best solution may not be to invest in a timeshare property.

 

[Dean]

gjw007, of course everyone's situation is different and it's not possibly to make an all inclusive blanket statement. Here are some ideas.

First, if I read your assertion that Orlando has high trade power, that is absolutely false. Orlando and Branson top the list of overbuilt locations. While the demand is fairly high, the supply is even higher. Great resorts like Marriott's top resorts have decent trade power at best and even that is held up mostly by the internal trading option. It is not at all difficult to buy elsewhere for a few hundred dollars with fees less than $400 per year and trade in EVERY year to top weeks and top resorts costing at times tens of thousands $$$ more. Even buying South Africa for $1000 including several years of RCI AND yearly fees less than $200 will work well for most of the weeks and resorts, especially with RCI. The bottom line is that anyone, any where and almost any time can trade into very good resorts in Orlando. It's also gospel that Orlando owners have a somewhat difficult time trading out unless they have something special like DVC, Marriott or similar and/or are very flexible and plan ahead.

It is not difficult to find 5* or Gold Crown Orlando resorts for $4000 per week or less, even 3 BR lockoff's at times. I've seen Marriott Grande Vista and Cypress Harbour for $5000 for 2 BR units. Vistana, Orange Lakes, Summer Bay, etc, etc, can all be bought for a fraction of the developer prices.

Still, there are those that owning Orlando is the right thing. DVC is one for many. The need for a specific week and/or unit size every year is another. But even for one that goes to Orlando every year, it's usually better and cheaper to own something fairly cheap to trade in rather than own there, with the exception of DVC for the true believers. And that's doubly true if one wants to trade out a portion of the time.

 

[Cruelladeville]

You are using the developer's prices, and you almost never should buy from the developer. A resale is much cheaper. Vistana, as you mentioned, runs about $25,000 from the developer, but you can pick up a Vistana at the TUG site for as cheaply as $4000, depending on the time of year.

That's one reason for buying DVC--you will recoup your investment if you need to sell for some unforseen reason. Some of us even make money if we have to sell our DVC, which is rare in the timeshare market. That's why I have 650 pts, and may even buy more--my investment is somewhat protected.

I also own a Marriott, and it trades well, but I bought it resale for $5000, the developer's cost was $18,000. It trades well and I like it, but there are so many hidden costs! If I own in the fall and I want to stay in the summer-$79. If I want to stay at a different Marriott--$79+$79(Interval). To bank it--+$79 more. You get the idea. But for $5000, I banked two weeks and got 2 weeks as a bonus, for a total of 4 weeks. If I figure those weeks are worth $1000 each, I have already about broken even on my $5000 investment.

Timeshares are great for those who love to vacation, but you have to understand the market before you invest your cash in it. The trick is to invest the least amount possible to get the greatest return, but you have to clarify to yourself what kind of return you want. Some people can't get the return they want by investing in a timeshare, and those people shouldn't be buying any timeshare, whether it's Disney or not.

 

[bwvBound]

Originally posted by gjw007
I don't understand the rationale to buy a timeshare near home and then trade into Orlando.

Well ... I agree with you on that point. I wouldn't trade my SoCAL weeks for Orlando (other than for DVC). When my Orlando stays don't require DVC ... you'll find me using Getaway weeks (II) or Bonus Vacations (RCI).

However ... owning at local properties does offer great advantages:

• Day use!! (depending on the resort property)
• Bonus Time!! (Inexpensive rental of "last minute inventory")
• Direct membership with RCI/II (vs DVC's Corporate membership)
• Ability to use my timeshare investments frequently (usually 2x/month)
• Plenty of destinations! (Worldmark offers 50+ resort locations via points with no exchange fees or hassle)

 

[gjw007]

Cruelladeville

I had mentioned that it would be better to purchase a resale. I didn't get into the point about buying any resort and having the RCI membership so that you could use the vacation getaways that will also get you into Orlando (or other locations). One problem with these is that you really can't guarantee a time (although most of the times that I travel, they seem to available but the price will range from $200 per week to over $1000 for a 2-bedroom). If you are flexible, you can use these to get inexpensive rooms. I definitely agree that you have to understand how to utilize them to your best advantage.

Dean First, if I read your assertion that Orlando has high trade power, that is absolutely false.

While I will agree with your that Orlando is probably overbuilt, that doesn't mean the demand is low because there may be an excess of supply versus demand. The demand is still there. It means somebody trying to get in has more choices. Rather than being given one choice, there may be 15 or 20. In addition, it also means that a person is probably able to trade in at most times of the year. My assetion is that it is better to have a timeshare where many people want to get to rather than a timeshare where few people want to get to. A reality in all this is what you can get from the exchange companies to allow. Sometimes I don't think RCI follows their own guidelines. I've heard too many horror stories on timeshares in South Africa to even think about owning there. I've never had problems trading out of Orlando but I have had problems trying to exchange for specific times of the year within Orlando. Theorically, for every unit to be available, somebody must already bank their unit. I'm not sure if we're not splitting hairs here. Again, each situation is different. Interesting exchange. Thanks.

Just out of curiousilty, what is at Bransom to have it overbuilt. I thought Orlando and Las Vegas (hotels) had fit that description because they both depended on tourism. I've seen units for sale but it held no attraction to me.

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by gjw007
While I will agree with your that Orlando is probably overbuilt, that doesn't mean the demand is low because there may be an excess of supply versus demand. The demand is still there. It means somebody trying to get in has more choices. Rather than being given one choice, there may be 15 or 20. In addition, it also means that a person is probably able to trade in at most times of the year. My assetion is that it is better to have a timeshare where many people want to get to rather than a timeshare where few people want to get to. A reality in all this is what you can get from the exchange companies to allow. Sometimes I don't think RCI follows their own guidelines. I've heard too many horror stories on timeshares in South Africa to even think about owning there. I've never had problems trading out of Orlando but I have had problems trying to exchange for specific times of the year within Orlando. Theorically, for every unit to be available, somebody must already bank their unit. I'm not sure if we're not splitting hairs here. Again, each situation is different. Interesting exchange. Thanks.

Just out of curiousilty, what is at Bransom to have it overbuilt. I thought Orlando and Las Vegas (hotels) had fit that description because they both depended on tourism. I've seen units for sale but it held no attraction to me.

Gary, trading is a funciton of demand and availability. While Orlando has a lot of visitors, it has a lot more availability. Same for Branson and Williamsburg. LV is getting closer in that regards as well. I can't speak directly for RCI searches but I can for II. Orlando is ALWAYS available, always multiple units and always great resorts. The only times that are even as issue or the ones that are premier at DVC, Easter and Xmas. From exposure to literally thousands on TUG along wiht timesharing today and other BBS, ALMOST everyone's impression is the same. That it's EASY to trade to Orlando and hard to trade out of unless you own DVC. And the fees are too high compared to most. As I said, there are those that owning Orlando makes sense, just not very many unless you're set on DVC. While DVC is technically a timeshare, the purchase, ownership and usage mentality is differnt for most than regular timeshares.

I'm not sure your experience as you seem to know a fair amount about timeshares. You should go to TUG and search about this topic. They also have a trade test set there that will likely provide you some info. Since RCI has more resorts, encourages deposits 2 years out and is less strict about qualilty of resorts differences, it's actually easier to get in as I understand it. Orlando is till the one big option that SA makes sense for.

 

[bwvBound]

Originally posted by gjw007
Just out of curiousilty, what is at Bransom to have it overbuilt.

Lots of shows, lots of golf, plenty of fishing and at least one themepark.