Why are RCI trades a bad value???

[Derf]

I've been following these boards ever since we started our DVC Resale Purchase back in July. I've always read on these boards that RCI trades are a bad point value (similar to DCL, and other non-DVC point options). Why is that? On the surface, it looks like a decent deal as 160 points for a 1 bedroom for a week is a lot less than most times at DVC for the same type of accommodation. Is it because of the $95? Is it the quality? Or is it something else that I am missing?

 

[chalee94]

On the surface, it looks like a decent deal as 160 points for a 1 bedroom for a week is a lot less than most times at DVC for the same type of accommodation.

rates onsite at wdw hotels tend to be higher than hotels of similar quality offsite, right? same issue. if you pay disney $90 per night to stay at a value hotel and decided to trade out for a $35 motel 6 in georgia, it's a bad value.

Is it the quality?

partly. a few of the hiltons and gold crown RCI resorts are comparable or better quality to DVC but not that many.

but it's also that you could trade into many of those 1BR RCI choices for a $1 timeshare bought on ebay with $500 or less in annual dues. so trading DVC points that cost thousands upfront and thousands in annual dues is too much like paying for a cadillac and trading for a chevy.

it's a nice option to have from time to time with DVC, but if you are going to trade into RCI on a regular basis, go to TUG and buy one of those $1 timeshares to do it...

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

A DVC-to-RCI exchange can be a good deal or a bad deal on a case-by-case basis.

I agree with the advice not to buy DVC points primarily for RCI exchanges. There are much cheaper ways to get timeshare ownership that can pull good RCI (or II) exchanges.

I don't agree that using DVC points to stay at an RCI resort is always a bad deal. In fact, it can be a good option for years when you don't want to go to a DVC resort. There are some excellent properties on the World Passport Collection list. (However, the best, most desirable properties are also the hardest ones to get into.)

The case has also been made that it can be better to rent out your DVC points and use the resulting cash to rent at another timeshare resort. If, for example, you can get $1600 for 160 DVC points and you can rent another timeshare resort week for $1000, you can pocket $600. I don't want to go to that trouble. And the best RCI resorts will seldom be available for such a low rent.

 

[JimMIA]

I generally agree with Horace above on all of his points, but I have a few additional comments.

Is it because of the $95?

No. All systems using RCI have some kind of fee -- often several fees. I also own Wyndham, and I believe our RCI fee is $189 or something like that.

Is it the quality?

That would be the concern I would have with anything you could get for 160 points. Whatever you select, research your choice carefully -- preferably by talking to someone who has visited that resort recently.

The other aspect has also been mentioned -- the comparative cost/benefit with other systems. Other systems have lots of tricks and benefits that may provide much better exchanges, and their initial cost may be a tiny fraction of DVC's cost. So the advice you'll often hear is, if you are interested in exchanging out very often, go on eBay and buy a timeshare for $1 + closing costs. That's certainly a better bargain than buying DVC to exchange with.

However, if you already have DVC and don't want to buy anything else, then evaluate your choices with DVC. If you find a resort you are happy with, at a destination you want to visit, and you are satisfied with your points cost, then that is a good exchange for you.

Is it the best possible use of DVC points? Possibly not, but that doesn't matter. What matters is that you are satisfied with the trip.

 

[dclfun]

The only time I stayed at an RCI property I paid very little cash- I reserved through Skyauction and paid $129 for a one-bedroom, one week Sat-Sat stay at what was listed as a 5-star property. It was, compared to the DVC resorts, a dump. They did have daily activities but there were many sales opportunities that we received by phone that were quite annoying even though they offered incentives to attend their presentations. I have friends who own with RCI and have shown me photos of their vacations and their resorts and I've never been impressed with the accommodations. I'm sure there are nice places, but I'm not risking my family's vacation time or my points. With DVC I know what I'm getting and that it will be the quality I expect. There are many resort options out there for cash and as others have mentioned, you can always rent your DVC points and take your cash to a destination of your choosing. For me, it's not about the $$ as much as the quality. The lucky ones are the RCI members who get DVC quality at a very low price, but for DVC members I feel it works against us as far as value for dollar.---Kathy

 

[KiminChicago]

Actually 160 points is the cost for low season; I think the high season is 270 points, which is a very different number.

Actually, according to the charts on the dvcmember website, a one-bedroom during high season is 160 points, 270 points is for a two bedroom.

DH and I bought DVC so that we'd have an excuse to take a vacation every year. We prefer to use our points at a Disney resort, but we haven't ruled out an occasional RCI trade. That's the nice thing about having the points -- we can choose how we want to vacation.

 

[Dean]

I've been following these boards ever since we started our DVC Resale Purchase back in July. I've always read on these boards that RCI trades are a bad point value (similar to DCL, and other non-DVC point options). Why is that? On the surface, it looks like a decent deal as 160 points for a 1 bedroom for a week is a lot less than most times at DVC for the same type of accommodation. Is it because of the $95? Is it the quality? Or is it something else that I am missing?

It's always a bad deal to buy extra points to use for the exchange but not all exchanges are a bad deal. The issues are several. Exchanges aren't guaranteed and the ones that are a fair trade, are very unlikely to be available. All exchanges can be gotten cheaper and more easily by other timeshare options that are much cheaper and will give you more choices and control. Most exchanges can be rented for less than the value of the points in question. 160 is for a 1 BR HIGH season but if a resort only has larger units, you'll have to pay the higher price even if you don't need the larger unit. Lastly, if you have to change or cancel, your DVC points are gone.

Assuming an exchange to a 1 BR every 3 years, would you pay $4-6K extra up front plus another $1800 every 3 years for the right to make the exchange that may or may not be available? Clearly the answer should be no given that situation. I'd suggest buying less points and IF one wants to exchange, buying a better timeshare to do so or simply renting privately when needed.

 

[dbs1228]

Dean - do you have any recommedations for better timeshares that have strong trading power? I have dabbled on TUG and guess I have to spend more time there but I just seem to go in circles on that website. We love the caribbean and would love to start traveling to Europe more once our last DD is in college in 3 years. I keep asking my parents what exactly they have for timeshares (mom told me she has 5 weeks to use by Feb) yet I cannot even research anything due to having no idea what she has.(not sure she exactly knows)
Not sure if this is approperiate post -sorry in advance if it is not allowed, I was just curious what the experts recommend. Thanks

 

[chalee94]

Dean - do you have any recommedations for better timeshares that have strong trading power?

not dean - but here are a couple of issues you might want to be aware of, if you are not already:

1) TUGers have noticed that as they have bragged on their best traders in the past, lots of folks bought those resorts to trade...which meant there was a glut of those resorts in the exchange pool. and as high supply means lower value, their best traders lost trade value over time.

so most TUGers are unlikely to openly recommend their best traders, which helps maintain their trading power.

2) trading is always going to be a risky business.

i bought a resort that has pulled DVC in the past. when DVC moved from II to RCI, that changed things. when RCI recalculated trade power, that also caused many resorts to lose trading power. some resorts have a gold or silver rating when you buy them, but lose that rating and therefore lose trading power.

there are no guarantees. a strong trader might not have the same trade power in 5 years. might not have the same trade power next year.

if you buy an oceanfront resort for a summer week when kids are out of school, then your trade power will tend to be pretty good. naturally it also helps if it's a high quality resort (hilton, marriott). but that will push your costs up also.

on the other side, certain resorts are extra tough to trade for. the owners at harborside at atlantis, for example, tend to buy there to use there (or rent it for cash...similar to many DVC owners). so if you want to trade for harborside...you're usually out of luck no matter how strong your trader.

(RCI and II also may continue to raise their fees to the point where it's not worth it to trade through them.)

these are some reasons why veterans are careful about recommending timeshares specifically for trading. generally, buy a timeshare if it's within driving distance and something you'd actually want to use...with trading being a bonus.

 

[dr&momto2boys]

I think they're a bad use of points because we have a "regular" timeshare that we paid about $7000 for 50 years and much less maintenance than DVC that we can exchange. Our DVC is of much greater value to us--and costs us a lot more! We do have a hard time getting some trades with our regular timeshare though--like Hawaii (but have done it!) So if you want something highly desired like a nice timeshare in Hawaii, then it may be worth it.

 

[firstcruise]

I've been following these boards ever since we started our DVC Resale Purchase back in July. I've always read on these boards that RCI trades are a bad point value (similar to DCL, and other non-DVC point options). Why is that? On the surface, it looks like a decent deal as 160 points for a 1 bedroom for a week is a lot less than most times at DVC for the same type of accommodation. Is it because of the $95? Is it the quality? Or is it something else that I am missing?

I think it's all a personal decision. We just got back from a week in Hawaii and stayed at an RCI property (Kaanapali Beach Club) and paid 160 pts for the week and $95 exchange. I'd say we made out pretty darn good myself and I'd do it again in a heartbeat. We did get several calls to join a presentation, but to us it wasn't worth it when we can stay there anytime we want (depending on availabilty).

 

[Dean]

Dean - do you have any recommedations for better timeshares that have strong trading power? I have dabbled on TUG and guess I have to spend more time there but I just seem to go in circles on that website. We love the caribbean and would love to start traveling to Europe more once our last DD is in college in 3 years. I keep asking my parents what exactly they have for timeshares (mom told me she has 5 weeks to use by Feb) yet I cannot even research anything due to having no idea what she has.(not sure she exactly knows)
Not sure if this is approperiate post -sorry in advance if it is not allowed, I was just curious what the experts recommend. Thanks

I think the first question is whether to go that way or not (additional timeshare) or just use cash. Clearly using cash is a better choice than buying extra points with the purpose of exchanging. Whether buying and learning an additional system is user dependent. For many it is, for others it's not.

If one decides to go the non DVC timeshare route for non DVC trips, there are an infinite number of variables. The best choice for you would not be the best choice for me. Questions you'd want to ask yourself might include.

• How flexible you are.
• Where you want to go and how much variety you might require.
• Unit sizes needed.
• How long you'd normally travel.
• How far in advance you'd plan.
• How stringent your expectations were.
• Budget
• etc.

As a rule I prefer the other systems that give you built in options like Bluegreen, Wyndham, Marriott, Hilton, etc. I find BG seems to me to be the best trade power for the money and the best balance between using and trading (of the ones I know well at least). Wyndham has more and better resorts overall but comes up short for trading. Marriott might be the best for many due to their qualify but may be the worst for many due to their recent changes and all that those changes entail.

I'd say decide what's most important for you, see who has resorts that seem to fit where/when/how for you and the spend a few months getting to know 2 or 3 systems that seem to work best. There are resources here and other locations for certain options.

Chalee mentioned that trading is inherently risky. I'd say yes and no. If you do your homework UP FRONT and position yourself correctly, get something you don't mind using and get a great price and then plan according; your ahead of almost everyone else trying for the same options. A given option may be risky at $10K but no big deal for $500.

I think it's all a personal decision. We just got back from a week in Hawaii and stayed at an RCI property (Kaanapali Beach Club) and paid 160 pts for the week and $95 exchange. I'd say we made out pretty darn good myself and I'd do it again in a heartbeat. We did get several calls to join a presentation, but to us it wasn't worth it when we can stay there anytime we want (depending on availabilty).

That's a great example. KBC is a property that is very good, not great, but very good. IMO it's a notch below DVC but it's the best RCI option in the area and on Maui. They also have mostly 1 BR units. However, one can almost certainly rent a 1 BR mountain view (view you're most likely to get as an exchange) for $1000 for any week you have a real chance of getting an exchange.

 

[dbs1228]

Thank you Dean and Charles! I plan on doing a lot of research and homework for sure! I have plenty of time since my youngest DD still has 3 years of High school to go. I wish I had researched DVC a bit more before buying, I do not regret buying at all I just would have done things a little different. I did not know there were so many resources, then again I did not plan on going to another dvc presentation while on vacation! I know Disney is a destination we will always want to go even for non-park trips, so it was the right time for us.

 

[Derf]

Thanks for the input everyone. I guess it is one of those things where your mileage may vary. It does look like a select few of these nicer properties available for exchange would be a great deal as cash prices in some markets for a week would exceed $2,000 (Hawaii, Manhattan, Miami, Major European Cities).

I guess if I was able to score a 1 bedroom in the Manhattan Hilton Club for 160 points and $95 for a week I would be ecstatic. But probably wouldn't be too thrilled if I spent the same for something not as nice in Tampa.

Still, I really see it as a great option for those years you aren't able to or don't want to visit WDW. Also, it appears to be one of the better value options out of all the non-DVC opportunities. I agree with all that it would not be smart to purchase extra DVC points for the sole reason of trading.

 

[shalom]

I also recommend another points-based system for people who like DVC. Much less hassle trading within a system than trading through RCI, at least in my experience. And with most points systems, you know going in what you'll be able to trade into. RCI, OTOH, has been adjusting things on a regular basis the last few years, and looks to be playing with the balance for some time to come.

If you like the points aspect of DVC, but feel constrained by the fact that there are so few locations available, then another points system of similar quality with a wider variety of locations available might be a great fit. Worth looking into, anyhow.

I find BG seems to me to be the best trade power for the money and the best balance between using and trading (of the ones I know well at least).

Be aware that Bluegreen is changing its trading policy. Currently you can choose what resort and date you deposit with RCI; they're changing that so you just decide how many points you want to spend, and BG decides what resort and date to deposit. So while it's been a good trader in the past for people who are fairly savvy, that may or may not continue to be the case.

 

[Dean]

Be aware that Bluegreen is changing its trading policy. Currently you can choose what resort and date you deposit with RCI; they're changing that so you just decide how many points you want to spend, and BG decides what resort and date to deposit. So while it's been a good trader in the past for people who are fairly savvy, that may or may not continue to be the case.

That's not my understanding. You may be referring to the Travelers plus exchange option which links to RCI points rather than RCI weeks and does use a points conversion grid. This is an add on, not a replacement for the BG historical weeks trading. Still, things change with timeshares and you can bet that it's usually not for the better. That's why price and up front investigation are major factors so that the person is question is less affected than most people.

 

[shalom]

You may be referring to the Travelers plus exchange option which links to RCI points rather than RCI weeks and does use a points conversion grid.

Nope, doesn't have anything to do with RCI points. I was referring to the third post in this thread.

http://www.timeshareforums.com/foru...n-vacation-club-annual-meeting-9-21-10-a.html

Dunno when it will be implemented, but personally I'm unenthused.

 

[Dean]

Nope, doesn't have anything to do with RCI points. I was referring to the third post in this thread.

http://www.timeshareforums.com/foru...n-vacation-club-annual-meeting-9-21-10-a.html

Dunno when it will be implemented, but personally I'm unenthused.

We'll see what happens. They can't totally take it away due to the fact that most have an underlying fixed week, some own fixed weeks or non point based options. Request first would be good, generic deposits like Wyndham would be bad.