When OK is not OK

[sam_gordon]

I understood the point perfectly. The point is moot. It has become such a symbol. It is such a symbol. One shouldn't use it unless they mean it. And if by chance they didn't know, once it is explained they shouldn't use it again.

So one should never use the OK symbol again? That's it, if you use it, you're a racist? Anyone reading here now knows, so don't do it?

And to tack on, where does it stop? If a white power group says "we're going to adapt blue as our color. Wear blue shirts everyone!", then no one should wear blue shirts?

I'm not making any claims on the incident I linked. But at what point do people say "enough is enough" and not let others co-opt symbols, colors, whatever?

 

[dez1978]

I understood the point perfectly. The point is moot. It has become such a symbol. It is such a symbol. One shouldn't use it unless they mean it. And if by chance they didn't know, once it is explained they shouldn't use it again.

You know, I'm on board with this for most words and things that historically have a derogatory meaning or that can clearly be seen by everyone as derogatory. But taking a symbol that has been around since the 1800's and literally means ok and because 4chan, as a hoax, decided to say its a symbol for white power and some idiots started running with it, now no one can use it? Thats ridiculous. This is nothing like a Nazi flag, which has only ever stood for one thing, or certain words, which have always been derogatory. This is stupid, and allowing others to make something into something it def is not, and never has been.

 

[okeydokey]

I think the point is who decided this was a white power symbol? Why is this suddenly now a thing? Why does everything have to be something?

Neo Nazis and white supremacicsts decided this. They have adopted this as a sign of solidarity amongst other white supremacicts. The way this was displayed on the shoulder of a black child was not accidental nor harmless . It was deliberate and very uncalled for.

 

[dez1978]

So one should never use the OK symbol again? That's it, if you use it, you're a racist? Anyone reading here now knows, so don't do it?

And to tack on, where does it stop? If a white power group says "we're going to adapt blue as our color. Wear blue shirts everyone!", then no one should wear blue shirts?

I'm not making any claims on the incident I linked. But at what point do people say "enough is enough" and not let others co-opt symbols, colors, whatever?

Apparently, because some stupid 4chan thing decided it should be as a hoax, so now no one can ever use it again. *eyeroll*

 

[Searc]

Something that bothers me is that the hand gesture has had the okay meaning associated with it for as long as I remember. I've never heard of it being a hate gesture until this news cycle. Do I live under a rock and everybody but me is aware of this suddenly being a hate gesture?

Yes.

 

[kimblebee]

It isn’t ‘just an ok sign’. When you do it, do you do it upside down or right side up? Right side up is still 100% normal. Upside down like the picture is absolutely a specific signal.

Doesn’t matter who started it or when. The fact is, that’s what it’s equated with now, so knock it off.

 

[Eeyore daily]

If you do a little research or look at photos of certain white supremacy groups you will see the men holding up the symbol. They've adopted it recently. Just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean it's not true.

 

[Kitty 34]

Neo Nazis and white supremacicsts decided this. They have adopted this as a sign of solidarity amongst other white supremacicts. The way this was displayed on the shoulder of a black child was not accidental nor harmless . It was deliberate and very uncalled for.

It's nice we are adopting their meanings now after all these years.....NOT.

 

[DLgal]

It was recently classified as an official hate symbol by the Anti Defamation League. So yeah, it is a thing now, regardless of the fact that it didn't always used to have nefarious meaning.

The fact that this girl was biracial says it all. I'm glad the employee was fired.

 

[L&Lfan]

In the same vein, the Betsy Ross flag is now a goner.

 

[robinb]

I understood the point perfectly. The point is moot. It has become such a symbol. It is such a symbol. One shouldn't use it unless they mean it. And if they mean it, well then they've showed everyone who they are by doing so. And if by chance they didn't know, once it is explained they shouldn't use it again.

I agree. Even if the 4Chan jerks started it as a joke, it is now known to be a symbol that many feel to be about racism and white supremacy (white power). One can argue until they are blue in that face that "It's only the OK sign upside down" or "It's only the circle game!" but that sign is no longer innocent and hasn't been innocent for quite a while. People who use it risk having people, especially people of color, think that they are racist. The friend of Gru should not have used it no matter what he thought he was doing and I think that Universal is doing the right thing.

This reminds me when Disney took Steven Tyler's "the shocker" hand gesture out of Rock and Roll Roller Coaster. Maybe Tyler didn't mean it that way, but that's how many people thought his gesture meant and Disney took care of it (finally!).

 

[disneychrista]

I think the point is who decided this was a white power symbol? Why is this suddenly now a thing? Why does everything have to be something?

My guess is the white supremacist did. Who decided thumbs up was either a symbol for hitchhiking or "good job"? Someone along the line did and we accepted it.

 

[mrodgers]

Apparently doing an OK sign with your hands upside down means you're a racist. I had heard among my kids friends that if someone "flashes" this sign and you look at it, they're supposed to punch you in the shoulder or something stupid like that. That's going back a couple years though.

So here's my question... why do we allow people to "take over" the symbol? It only means something if we (whoever views it) feel it means something.

Thoughts?

It goes way back before a couple years. It's called the circle game that you can look up on the net. We played it way back in elementary school which was the 80's for me.

The game has cropped up on Facebook. People like me in their 40's are posting videos such as the last one I saw showing a fishing hole in ice and a hand with the OK symbol appearing and all my school day friends from 30 years ago laughing saying, "You got me" in the comments. A kid recently video bombed a news reporter's camera at a sports stadium and did this gesture and it was deemed a hate crime and he is banned now from said sports stadium. Anyone with half a brain knew what that actually was as it is as rampant on Facebook the last few years as it was all through grade school and high school in the 80's.

 

[msjprincess]

This seems purposeful on the employee's part... otherwise, I'd say it was ridiculous.

Exactly

I don't know how anyone watching that video could think it was accidental

 

[robinb]

It goes way back before a couple years. It's called the circle game that you can look up on the net. We played it way back in elementary school which was the 80's for me.

The game has cropped up on Facebook. People like me in their 40's are posting videos such as the last one I saw showing a fishing hole in ice and a hand with the OK symbol appearing and all my school day friends from 30 years ago laughing saying, "You got me" in the comments. A kid recently video bombed a news reporter's camera at a sports stadium and did this gesture and it was deemed a hate crime and he is banned now from said sports stadium. Anyone with half a brain knew what that actually was as it is as rampant on Facebook the last few years as it was all through grade school and high school in the 80's.

Neither the "kid" at Wrigley nor, I suspect, the friend of Gru are in their 40's. This is not the circle game.

 

[mrodgers]

I understood the point perfectly. The point is moot. It has become such a symbol. It is such a symbol. One shouldn't use it unless they mean it. And if they mean it, well then they've showed everyone who they are by doing so. And if by chance they didn't know, once it is explained they shouldn't use it again.

No one other than the constantly offended by everything crowd knows anything about this gesture being misdiagnosed as a white supremacy hate symbol. Most people who would make this hand gesture understand it as a childhood elemetary and Jr. high school game. If no one but the constantly offended take it as a hate gesture, why should no one use it? They use it and they mean it, as a childhood game.

 

[tinkerbellandeeyor]

I am a kid of the 90s and i remember when it just ment okay

 

[luvsJack]

That Dog aint a gonna hunt. Either it's
A. I've been living under a rock for years and I didn't know. I'm so sorry. I didn't mean to mess up your picture. And in that case, he gets a chance but is on a short leash.
or
B. He knew what it meant in which case he or she should be disciplined according to Universal policy.

And no, doing these things under the guise of it only means something if we let it won't cut it.

Don't flash white power symbols. Don't fly the Nazi flag. Don't use racial slurs and do all kinds of other stuff like that unless you mean it.

So do you have a list of them so we know what not to "flash". I don't have a Nazi flag. Don't have a confederate flag. I don't use racial slurs. Just want to make sure I don't flash one of these ever changing symbols that "MIGHT" mean something tomorrow.

 

[sam_gordon]

Upside down like the picture is absolutely a specific signal.

OK, what's the signal? According to the link someone posted earlier, a "right side up" OK sign is for WP (white power)... the three fingers are the W, the circle of the forefinger and thump the hole of the P and the wrist is the stem. But if it's upside down, it means???? MB?

I've caught a couple HS boys trying to show the upside down version in some pictures. I had them change it. I had no idea (at the time) about the white power, but I did know about the circle game.

 

[AustinTink]

It makes me so mad that disgusting people can take over a widely used sign like that. I don't walk around saying "OK" with my hands all the time, but now I have to remember never to do it. All because some horrible people claimed it as theirs.

Edited to add: It makes me even angrier that someone with that hate-filled mindset was allowed to work around children in the first place.