When did traffic laws become traffic "suggestions"?

[Katieinwonderland]

I never intentionally speed. Unless I don't know the speed limit or I somehow get distracted, I don't speed. I always signal when I make a turn and I do try to follow all traffic regulations. Am I perfect? No. I make mistakes, but I don't do it intentionally.

I am 57 years old and have never had a traffic ticket. I'm not bragging. It is just a fact.

Having just moved close to the Windermere area, I don't speed anymore! Those Windermere cops really aren't kidding around with the rules!

 

[NikitaZee]

Actually, chapter 5 of NY's driver manual says this:

You may not enter an intersection if traffic is backed up on the other side and you cannot get all the way through the intersection. Wait until traffic ahead clears, so you do not block the intersection.

I saw that part - on the same page. Further up on the page, says this:

Example: You want to turn left at the intersection ahead. A vehicle is approaching from the opposite direction, going straight ahead. You must wait for approaching traffic to go through before you turn. You may enter the intersection, however, to prepare for your left turn if the light is green and no other vehicle ahead of you is preparing for a left turn. (see "Turns" later in this chapter). When you enter the intersection, stay to the right of the center line. Keep your wheels straight to avoid being pushed into oncoming traffic should a rear-end collision occur. When approaching traffic clears or stops for a red light, complete your turn.

My point remains the same - different states may have different traffic rules.

 

[Feralpeg]

In this thread, we have seen people gave the following reasons why it was OK for them to break the law:

"I didn't know"
"My parents told me to"
"I was distracted"
"I usually don't go this way"

Why are these better excuses than this one:

"I checked first to make sure it was safe"

It seems to me that the only one that took safety into account is better than all those other excuses.

The topic of the thread is "when did traffic laws become suggestions?". I believe all of those of us quoted above do not knowingly disobey a law. We believe in the laws and try to follow them. We are not perfect and we make mistakes. You, however, seem to think it is okay to selectively follow traffic laws as long as you break them carefully. Okay. I disagree with your philosophy, but I'm not the one giving out tickets.

 

[Feralpeg]

Having just moved close to the Windermere area, I don't speed anymore! Those Windermere cops really aren't kidding around with the rules!

Wize decision! When the speed limit in Windermere says 25 mph, don't think they mean 28!

 

[John VN]

I saw that part - on the same page. Further up on the page, says this:

Example: You want to turn left at the intersection ahead. A vehicle is approaching from the opposite direction, going straight ahead. You must wait for approaching traffic to go through before you turn. You may enter the intersection, however, to prepare for your left turn if the light is green and no other vehicle ahead of you is preparing for a left turn. (see "Turns" later in this chapter). When you enter the intersection, stay to the right of the center line. Keep your wheels straight to avoid being pushed into oncoming traffic should a rear-end collision occur. When approaching traffic clears or stops for a red light, complete your turn.

My point remains the same - different states may have different traffic rules.

Very good reply.

At the end of our street is a stop sign. At 4:30AM when going to WalMart I still come to a complete stop. I wonder how many other people would.

The stopping point for a stop sign is the big white line or adjacent to the sign, not past it.

The stopping point for a red light is the big white line not after the line. The stopping point for a right on red is that same white line. Not 2 feet past the line or into the pedestrian crosswalk. I wish every signaled intersection had cameras to catch traffic signal violators.

 

[C.Ann]

I think that's the OP's point. Whether you think the law is stupid or not really doesn't matter. It is a law. If you don't like the law, work to get it changed. A lot of people only obey the laws they like. So, where does it stop? If I don't like the idea of stop signs, should I just blow through them?

It's like people and speed limits. The speed designations are not a suggestion, yet people think it is okay to drive at the speed they want.

If it is a law, obey it or don't drive. This isn't directed at you sbell111, you just happened to hit a sore spot.

Excellent post! Sums it all up quite nicely..

 

[kaytieeldr]

Have you ever exceeded the speed limit? Have you ever changed a lane without signalling first? Do you signal prior to turning into your own driveway? Do you always signal when you are leaving a streetside parking space? Have you ever cut someone off, even accidently? Have you ever walked across the street in the middle of a block?

How about the OP or the other posters to this thread?


Here's the takeaway: 1) People who are shocked when others choose whether to obey a specific law but do the very same thing would be called hypocrits by some and 2)

As the OP, and since you asked - pointing out first that I did not mention speed limits, yes, given a choice between exceeding the speed limit and getting rear-ended, I have exceeded the speed limit.

However. I stop at stop signs (and count to three). I stop at red lights; if there is no "no turn on red" sign, and it is safe to go after the same three-count, and I'm turning right, I proceed. If I'm the second, third, etc., driver at either the stop sign or turning right on red, same thing - stop, three-count, proceed if safe (MANY people seem to think if one car goes, everyone goes ). I signal. I signal turning. I signal merging. I signal entering a highway. I signal exiting a highway. I signal changing lanes. I signal when there's only one way TO go. I signal pulling into my parking lot. I signal pulling into a parking space. I signal pulling out of a parallel parking space (admittedly, not out of a perpendicular space because there's nobody affected by my action who can see a directional). I signal when the road seems to go straight but I know that's really a turn. I signal when there's any question.

Yes, I have probably accidentally cut someone off. I wasn't aware that's in the same category as traffic suggestions, but okay.

No, I don't cross in the middle of the block (jaywalk).

Next question?

 

[kaytieeldr]

If you can see in both directions, you can verify that it's safe.

Respectfully, the traffic engineers disagree with you.

 

[kaytieeldr]

People often don't completely understand traffic regulations even when they are spelled out for them.

Check out the bolded bit on page 90 of the MA driver's manual.

As well, it might be advisable to check out the top of page 83 of that same manual

 

[DVC-Don]

I recently saw a lady trying to make a left turn even though there was a no left turn sign there. A Deputy pulled up and pointed at the sign and told her to move on. She started arguing with him that the place she wanted to go was on the left so therefore she HAD to turn left there.

 

[DisneyBamaFan]

Respectfully, the traffic engineers disagree with you.

Traffic engineers make these determinations based on worst case traffic conditions. At 3am (for example), those worst cases do not exist. Many cities have started making these types of "no right turn on red" intersections into "no right turn on red between xxx hours".

 

[Feralpeg]

Traffic engineers make these determinations based on worst case traffic conditions. At 3am (for example), those worst cases do not exist. Many cities have started making these types of "no right turn on red" intersections into "no right turn on red between xxx hours".

I think that is a wonderful idea. If it is during that time period, then go for it. If it isn't during that time period, don't do it. It's time for people to start obeying laws whether they are fond of them or not.

There is always a way to have laws changed. If a law doesn't make sense, then I am all for getting it changed.

 

[ChrisFL]

As posted, laws can vary by state and honestly....once we've had our drivers test at age 16-18...we are never required to test again! Unless we get a ticket and decide to take school, which I've done.

Even the driving tests we have in the U.S. are a complete joke. I took a whole semester of driver's education in high school and still didn't get taught some fundamentals, but I passed the test with flying colors.

We seem to have forgotten (for the most part) that driving is a privledge, not a right...but we are unable to avoid using cars for the most part in the U.S.. Hopefully that will start changing.

 

[golfgal]

I just found out that I've been doing something illegal for years - and only because my mom just got issued a warning for doing it. When I took driver's ed, we were instructed to pull to the middle of the intersection while waiting to turn left. That's what I've always done - sitting under the green light waiting for my turn to go. I've even gotten annoyed at other drivers who didn't pull into the intersection while waiting to turn left. Now I've found out that it's not legal, and I'm not supposed to enter the intersection at all unless I can complete my turn without stopping. Now I know better - but I didn't know that I was disobeying traffic rules all these years!

From the MN driver's manual:

• When waiting to make a left turn at a green traffic light with
oncoming traffic, position the car into the intersection where your
body appears even with the curb line. The only opportunity to make
a left turn may occur when the green light changes to yellow.

They even tell you HOW to pull into the intersection and that your only chance to cross may be on a yellow light .

I was following a woman yesterday that slid through 4 stop signs in a row. She would just keep going with the car in front of her. I finally had a chance to get around her--as she was driving 15 mph under the speed limit after she slid through a stop sign to pull out in front of me--anyhooo. At the next stop sign I timed it just right so she couldn't slide through the stop sign and had to wait. She is an accident waiting to happen.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I recently saw a lady trying to make a left turn even though there was a no left turn sign there. A Deputy pulled up and pointed at the sign and told her to move on. She started arguing with him that the place she wanted to go was on the left so therefore she HAD to turn left there.

Several years ago, I was at a (long) red light in Boston with my left blinker on. The driver behind me kept honking, but of course there was nothing I could do, right? He got out of his car, came up to mine, and kindly pointed out the "NO LEFT TURN" sign I'd missed!!!! Yes, the light stayed red that long

 

[kaytieeldr]

Traffic engineers make these determinations based on worst case traffic conditions. At 3am (for example), those worst cases do not exist. Many cities have started making these types of "no right turn on red" intersections into "no right turn on red between xxx hours".

Sure. One of the intersections I encounter (from a direction not affected by such signage) has an electronic 'No turn on red' sign. It's on during the day and evening, and - as you indicate - off in the middle of the night.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Let's see...

In addition to the several, not-unexpected, drivers who ignored stop signs and 'no turn on red' signs, and/or ran red lights,,, there was the one traveling about 30% below the speed limit (20 mph vs 30 mph) who proceeded to stop where she/we actually had the right of way and allow a number of drivers with BOTH the stop sign AND the flashing red light to proceed; and the driver who apparently felt my driving at the speed limit on a local, one-lane-in-each-direction curving road with a pair of solid yellow lines was too slow, and despite those several conditions all making it either stupid or illegal, decided to pass me.

Now, this wasn't a matter of driving several miles directly in front of someone in a hurry - because I pay attention to ALL my surroudings (traffic ahead, oncoming traffic, side streets, driveways, and yes, traffic behind me) and this vehicle couldn't have been behind me for more than twenty seconds. Probably (a lot) less, because there's little traffic in my direction that early on a Saturday, and I'd seen nobody waiting to pull out of a driveway or enter from a side street.

I do pay attention. I really do.

 

[Maridw]

We have a couple "No turn on red" signs in our area and they are there for a reason. At one if a car were to turn on red at this light (Baldwin Ave) during rush hour the straight traffic (East Ave) would never move. There is a light for a major highway within a hundred yards of this one light. Way too busy at the "no turn on red" light to allow without backing traffic up.

The other has a main green left arrow unless there is traffic coming in the opposite direction. So is would be unsafe to turn on the red at this light.

I have seen people turn on to a one way street going the wrong way. At that corner there are two signs that say "Wrong Way - Do Not Enter" and they still turn down it. I have seen people make a left turn from the right lane, a right turn from the left turn lane.

At the intersection I talked about first, I was waiting to make a left turn onto Baldwin from East. The light was green and a car was coming toward me. I waited for the oncoming car to pass and started to make my turn. As I did so, a car in the straight lane proceeded to make a left turn in front of me. I honked my horn and the guy honked his back. We went the same way for quite a ways and then he made a right turn (thankfully from the designated right turn lane) and as I pulled past him, he gave me a dirty look. I kept going and just shook my head. I was in the right and if I had hit this guy, he would have been the one to get the ticket and be at fault. But the look I got from this guy was that I was the one who was wrong.