Wheelchair abuse?

[SueM in MN]

We did have moms own wheelchair- It was mentioned to me that if you use your own wheelchair not a ECV guests & some CMs treat you better. I don't know if this is true or not.

My DD has always had her own (very obviously custom) wheelchair.
That has not stopped some of the other guests from making comments though.
There are people who will say something, no matter what.

I hope I didn't upset anyone by renting an ECV. It would have been faster it I could have walked it. Using an ECV is not as easy as some people think.
tigercat

Anyone who would be upset by it does not have an opinion worth anything.

Interestingly, in some of those 'anti-wheelchair or ECV' threads, there is usually someone who writes that they used to be one of the most vocal complainers about ECVs, until they had to use one and found out that the 'perks' they thought would be there are not. And, as you posted, they usually find it's not as easy to get around as they thought.

you know what i realized? I was just going through some of the pics posted on the CB forum, and i did not see a SINGLE person in an ECV in any pictures! people keep complaining about scooter users, and yet I cannot find any of them in pics... so either there is a conspiracy to keep people in scooters from being photographed, or it is not nearly as big a deal as people say!

i think, personally, that people are just looking for something to complain about!

I think you are right.

 

[KPeveler]

Ha.. well that's one of the ironic things about being in a chair/scooter. Our height is about half "normal" so we miss seeing a lot of things at places like Disney that are pretty cool. Our view is very often a crowd of butts and feet (we won't mention the smells along with the sights here now will we??) The whole chair/scooter abuse topic postings seem to make a regular frequent cycle started by different names and somewhere in there comes the inevitable "you get to the front of the line"... which is so so so wrong. Even the issue of "first on the bus" (which is for safety) - don't forget it's also LAST OFF the bus -- and it's pretty hard to beat all those healthy running rope drop fans to the front of the turnstyles if you're last off the bus.
20,15, even 10 years ago there was a lot of front of the line or fronter and such but mainstream is here now .. and it's here to stay.. and that's a good thing for disabled and non... we all want to be 'normal'. It would be nice though if one day we won't have to miss some of the really cool pre-stories in the queue and such because we have to go to another entrance or something. But it's coming in time.

One of my favorite gifts given me is a bumper sticker that says "yes you can have my placard and parking space BUT you MUST take my disabilities and pain with them."
Which reminds me, for those who might not know of it... the website InvisibleDisabilities.org is great.

I love that shirt the mom told about "I know I'm perfect, you can stop staring now" too... awesome!

it just was funny because a lot of them were from the main street station, and it is an elevated view. so if there are scooters, we should be able to see them. i did see a couple people in park rental manual chairs, but that is it.

people seem to think that we get the best of everything because we are sitting, when in fact we just tend to watch other people's hiney's all day...

one benefit is that you get to see the cinderella fountain from a kid's view, which means that the crown is on her head!

sue, i too have heard that you get treated better in a personal chair rather than a rental or a scooter... that is one reason i want to bring my own, rather than use a park rental (although that is hardly the most important reason)

 

[luvyawdw]

you know what i realized? I was just going through some of the pics posted on the CB forum, and i did not see a SINGLE person in an ECV in any pictures! people keep complaining about scooter users, and yet I cannot find any of them in pics... so either there is a conspiracy to keep people in scooters from being photographed, or it is not nearly as big a deal as people say!

i think, personally, that people are just looking for something to complain about!

Coming from a person in a wheelchair, It is a little frusterating when you see a little girl with an ace bandage (not even limping) using a rental chair go to the front of the line and then see her getting up and running to the ride car. She is getting the same treatment that a disabled person would receive for no reason whatsoever. The way i look at this is that it is only fair for people with disabilities to have an opportunity to go through a separate line because the time spent on everthing else ( eating, navigating aroud the crowd, even using restrooms) takes us longer than we actually spend having fun on attractions. Then to see people abusing chairs is upsetting and is somthing to complain about. Disney sees this and that is why they have taken away special accomadations, such as having a shorter wait in line. But now the sad thing is people who need it can't get it. People are abusing rental chairs and ECVs at WDW, you may not see it on acouple pics but you do see it when you're there.
- Bethany (luvawdw's daugter)
PS. We wrote a letter to WDW EXEC. offices and got a long response explaining that they have been working on this issue and they take it very seriously.They thanked us for the letter and said that they are working on this problem.

 

[Mason7AK]

PS. We wrote a letter to WDW EXEC. offices and got a long response explaining that they have been working on this issue and they take it very seriously.They thanked us for the letter and said that they are working on this problem.

As a mother of two children in wheelchairs and one with Developmental Delay and Hearing Loss, here is my fear! The more people - both abled and disabled - that complain about the "wheelchair and ECV abusers", the more likely it will be that Disney will take away ALL special accommodations for people with disabilities (hidden or otherwise), like the GAC. And the wheelchair abuse (which I believe is a minority of people using the rental wheelchairs and ECV's) will continue anyway as WDW cannot legally deny anyone the right to rent the wheelchairs and ECV's. So who will be hurt in the long run? Those children and adults who need these things the most! My DD absolutely could not tour WDW at all without the GAC card. I just hope and pray that WDW never does away with it as their way of trying to "cull out" the cheaters? Just my humble opinion and observation.
Angela

 

[KPeveler]

while i wholehearted approve of disney mainstreaming lines so disabled people can have equal (not special) access, and wait in line like everyone else, that does not always solve everyone's problems. i use a chair at disney, but i require no other accommodations. therefore i would prefer to wait in line like everyone else. however, that does not work for everyone. i sincerely hope that disney continues to provide a GAC for those who have problems with lines for whatever reason...

 

[madenon]

It just keeps cracking me up. People advising others on this same part of the board to 'do go ahead, get that rental ecv/wc, you'ld be stupid not to' if they talk about...... oh....... let's say..... their young daughter or son that has a problem with stamina or prolonged standing/walking and the parent explains being afraid of being judged when somebody else sees the kid getting up and walking -or heaven forbid!- running for a while. We're all full of a lot of pc about not being influenced by such ignorant persons, yadieda.

And than here we look at this topic and find some wc/ecv users judging others, because 'they ARE faking, see; rental + walking/running the few minutes I saw them!'. Now it might be me, but have we got a real big double standard here?

 

[KPeveler]

yes, there is always a double standard... even i do it, although i try very hard not to. i saw a woman getting in her car the other day in a handicapped spot, and she had no problems lifting groceries and getting in the car. my thought: she doesnt need that spot! but then i realized that there may well be something going on that we can't see...

i know i try not to judge why people are in chairs, because i will be getting up and going through non accessible lines when i can, so i may be standing for 20 minutes with just my cane. but i can do this with my illness, and if people judge, so be it...

but yes, there is a double standard, even if it is an unintentional one

 

[luvyawdw]

It just keeps cracking me up. People advising others on this same part of the board to 'do go ahead, get that rental ecv/wc, you'ld be stupid not to' if they talk about...... oh....... let's say..... their young daughter or son that has a problem with stamina or prolonged standing/walking and the parent explains being afraid of being judged when somebody else sees the kid getting up and walking -or heaven forbid!- running for a while. We're all full of a lot of pc about not being influenced by such ignorant persons, yadieda.

And than here we look at this topic and find some wc/ecv users judging others, because 'they ARE faking, see; rental + walking/running the few minutes I saw them!'. Now it might be me, but have we got a real big double standard here?

I didn't mean that people should not rent a wheelchair if they have injured themselves or have a disability, but when you see a person get special access to the front of the line then run to the ride car with an ace bandage on (clearly not limping) its a little frusterating. It's simple, there are people who do fake it. I completly understand when i see a person with a disability, cast etc. but when you see them having no problem "running" to the ride car, that it a whole different story. I am very aware that there are some disabilities you can not see. When I was yonger, you could barely tell i had muscular weakness just by looking at me. But my stamina was very limited, and i fell very easily. I don't have any double standards, if someone has a disability/injury and needs special access i'm totaly supportive of that. The topic is wheelchair abuse and i am not supportive of that.
Bethany (luvyawdw's daughter)

 

[madenon]

You know what? All I know is that I'ld rather miss a person that should be judged for faking it, than judge a person for being a faker that might not have deserved it.

 

[luvyawdw]

You know what? All I know is that I'ld rather miss a person that should be judged for faking it, than judge a person for being a faker that might not have deserved it.

Again, the topic is wheelchair abuse. I'm not trying to be the judge of who and who isn't faking it, im just saying its not fair when people do fake it. I think if you read al lot of these posts, you will see a lot of people are getting upset about wc abuse.That is why there is a topic about this. I am not tring to force opinions on people i am just sharing mine. I respect yours and everyone elses.
- Bethany

 

[KPeveler]

i think what madenon meant was that some people would judge that the little girl with the ace bandage running to the ride car does not need the wheelchair. in fact, she probably does. now, if the line is accessible, then she should certainly wait in it if her issues are helped by a wheelchair. that is what i plan on doing.

i understand that it is difficult to watch people take advantage of a situation, and do things like go to the front of the line when it is not necessary. i know i do not want head of line if i can wait - it feels like i am cheating somehow...

 

[Mickiethepooh]

I didn't mean that people should not rent a wheelchair if they have injured themselves or have a disability, but when you see a person get special access to the front of the line then run to the ride car with an ace bandage on (clearly not limping) its a little frusterating. It's simple, there are people who do fake it. I completly understand when i see a person with a disability, cast etc. but when you see them having no problem "running" to the ride car, that it a whole different story. I am very aware that there are some disabilities you can not see. When I was yonger, you could barely tell i had muscular weakness just by looking at me. But my stamina was very limited, and i fell very easily. I don't have any double standards, if someone has a disability/injury and needs special access i'm totaly supportive of that. The topic is wheelchair abuse and i am not supportive of that.
Bethany (luvyawdw's daughter)

You know, I get so tired of people posting about getting front of line access in a wheelchair, YOU DON'T and haven't for years.
So if you saw someone getting front line access then there was more going on than a faked wheelchair requiring injury.

 

[KPeveler]

You know, I get so tired of people posting about getting front of line access in a wheelchair, YOU DON'T and haven't for years.
So if you saw someone getting front line access then there was more going on than a faked wheelchair requiring injury.

the only time a person does not go through the regular line is when the regular line is not accessible - such as most of the line at splash mountain, where there are stairs.

even with a GAC, you are not supposed to get head of line privilege. this is not to say that some people don't deserve it, or should or should not get it, but the policy is that there is no such thing as head of line privilege any more.

of course every CM does things differently, so sometimes circumstances differ.

 

[luvyawdw]

You know, I get so tired of people posting about getting front of line access in a wheelchair, YOU DON'T and haven't for years.
So if you saw someone getting front line access then there was more going on than a faked wheelchair requiring injury.

People with disabilities that can not wait in a wheelchair line or long line for a specific reason/disability there certainly is accomodations made for them to access a line faster, if their disability requires more than a wheelchair or wheelchair access, I believe that is when it becomes necassary to obtain a GAC.
We completly understand this I believe what my daughter is saying is that their are people who may use these accomodations that have been put in place that do not really need them. I do believe there are people who go further than renting a wheelchair to get quicker access to the ride (that may be dishonest about their needs). I think that is what this topic is about,"wheelchair abuse in the park". I really don't think anyone would care if people rented wheelchairs and didnt need them if they were not taking it a bit further than that. I or my daughter would not look at anyone and judge them, we know first hand that many disabilities are not visable. There may be no way to know if someone is or is not "faking". Her feelings are just toward the people who have done this. She or I won't let it ruin our day, its just annoying. Maybe the girl in the rental wheelchair with the ace bandage running to the ride needed a wheelchair, maybe not, but did she need to bypass the line ??? We really have no way of knowing but it does look a bit odd! I can't say I did not wonder myself.
Luvyawdw (Lisa beths mom)

 

[alizesmom]

I think the whole issue should be equal, not better or worse, access. If that somehow could be acheived there would be no problem with cheaters because there would be no benefit. We, as chair users or parents of chair users, are going to be watched by the general public to see if we really want equal treatment or expect something more. Most will want the equal access (treatment) but there are bad eggs who have disabilities just like there are bad eggs who have no problems. WDW isn't there yet but they are awful close. They try. Karen

 

[Mickiethepooh]

People with disabilities that can not wait in a wheelchair line or long line for a specific reason/disability there certainly is accomodations made for them to access a line faster, if their disability requires more than a wheelchair or wheelchair access, I believe that is when it becomes necassary to obtain a GAC.
We completly understand this I believe what my daughter is saying is that their are people who may use these accomodations that have been put in place that do not really need them. I do believe there are people who go further than renting a wheelchair to get quicker access to the ride (that may be dishonest about their needs). I think that is what this topic is about,"wheelchair abuse in the park". I really don't think anyone would care if people rented wheelchairs and didnt need them if they were not taking it a bit further than that. I or my daughter would not look at anyone and judge them, we know first hand that many disabilities are not visable. There may be no way to know if someone is or is not "faking". Her feelings are just toward the people who have done this. She or I won't let it ruin our day, its just annoying. Maybe the girl in the rental wheelchair with the ace bandage running to the ride needed a wheelchair, maybe not, but did she need to bypass the line ??? We really have no way of knowing but it does look a bit odd! I can't say I did not wonder myself.
Luvyawdw (Lisa beths mom)

I know all about GACs and one was not mentioned only that she was in the WC then ran to the ride. Many of the Autistic children discussed here use wheelchairs and bound out of them and rush to rides. it was mentioned by someone with regard to their son just the other day and that was my point the WC does not get you front of line access and you often have to wait longer in one. But there was an implication that this girl because she was in a WC with an ace bandage and ran was somehow suspect. and as I said more has to be going on [GAC] for whatever the reason, than just being in the chair.

 

[Shorty82]

These cheaters are just cheating themselves. No where do they get to bypass the line. Even if they have to use another entrance (only applies to a few rides in the Magic Kingdom and maybe Epcot) they aren't skipping the line, just waiting elsewhere. Even if the line is mainstreamed wheelchair users may wind up waiting even longer than everybody else once they are pulled from the line to go to the handicapped boarding area due to boarding and safety restrictions.

The ONLY people who can bypass lines completely are Make A Wish children on their Wish trip. It doesn't matter what disability one has they still have to wait for rides.

 

[luvyawdw]

I know all about GACs and one was not mentioned only that she was in the WC then ran to the ride. Many of the Autistic children discussed here use wheelchairs and bound out of them and rush to rides. it was mentioned by someone with regard to their son just the other day and that was my point the WC does not get you front of line access and you often have to wait longer in one. But there was an implication that this girl because she was in a WC with an ace bandage and ran was somehow suspect. and as I said more has to be going on [GAC] for whatever the reason, than just being in the chair.

I don't think there would have been anyway for us to know if the visitor (young girl) that my daughter was referring to had a GAC? That is why we could not mention it.
Yes, we too know about waiting in longer lines with WC's. Beth is in one. She and I also realize autistic visitors may appear that they don't need a wheelchair, we attended our 2 week class to obtain Behtanys service dog with some families that have autistic children, we all came to understand each of our childrens disabilities with great respect. We are not at all suggesting they or anyone with a disability is being dishonest. Just the ones everyone was talking about in the begining of this post, topic, "wheelchair abuse" There are members discussing there thoughts on this subject, we are just doing the same I think enough people have noticed it enough to start a topic on it? I am no expert on WDW, and I think as another poster mentioned many castmembers have different ways they handle a specific situation. We have found this to be true for us, we could go to the same attraction twice and have 2 different outcomes. All in all, I do believe WDW is doing the best they can. Not trying to change the "World" just being realistic I think there may be some visitors that beleive they could get some perks for being in a wheelchair......for us, Beth would love to not be in one!!
Anyway, just trying hard not to be misunderstood here
Lisa, Beth's mom

 

[luvyawdw]

My family has been visiting Disney for over 25 years, we love it. My father is confined to a wheelchair because of injuries sustained years ago. He has no use of his legs at all and his wheelchair is his sole form of transportation.

In recent years I've seen glaring abuses of the wheelchair rental service at Disney. I do realize not all disabilities are seen with the eye. These individuals however, made it clear through their actions and words that they were only using the wheelchairs and ECVs as a "luxury." One group of women even went so far as to laugh at the people who had to stand in line and wait for another bus. The woman in the ECV said, "See I told you we wouldn't have to wait, I'm gonna rent this thing from now on."

Wouldn't it be better for everyone if Disney required a doctor's note to rent a wheelchair or ECV? I can't help but think of all the people who truly have a need for a wheelchair, but can't get one because someone is abusing this service. God forbid those abusers really need a wheelchair someday. I'm sure they will cease to see it as a "perk". It is not a luxury to have to rely on something as your personal transportation, it's a luxury to be able to walk.

ok, rant done for now.

I just wanted to add that this is the original first quote on this topic my daughter and I were really responding to. Just to say that we also believe their are people who may abuse the whole system. Again realizing that their are disablilities that are not visable.There are people in the general public that still think if you are in a wheelchair at WDW you get some special access (faster). Many don't know that over the years they have really mainstreamed many of the lines. We have pp in our family that will say to Beth, " I want to go with you to WDW because you get to go in the front of the lines" she always corrects them and says "No I don't". So we really see Sarubo's view on this. Their are some areas where WC users may get through the line a little faster, some alot longer, in any case I still think their is some who will take advantage of an accomodation they may not need, taking up space for many that do need it? I do think Disney has really tried different ways to help this problem, I think they are still trying... and they do recognize it.Also, I wanted to add, our daughter is 13 , I allow her to post with me with my supervision. When you read her post remember her age, her perspective and interpretation on issues like this will be a bit different than an adults. I allow her to post with me bc she loves the involvment, I think its good for her if she enjoys it... and.. I admire her for wanting to be involved at age 13.

 

[OneLittleSpark]

I think actually a lot of us are saying the same things, but talking at cross purposes. Basically, as far as I understand it, we all agree that:

Being in a wheelchair rarely (if ever) gets you through a line faster, even when using an alternative entrance

Not all disabilities are visible

No one can really tell what problems someone has, or why they are using a chair / GAC / ECV etc

There are some daft and dishonest people in the world who will pretend to have a disability to get extra 'perks'

The people mentioned above are likely to change their minds fairly swiftly, and will probably get their comeuppance in some form of ironic karma (or whatever you choose to go for)

We all know what it's like to have a disability, know it can suck at times and get annoyed at those who think we get wonderful advantages and perks

Just thought I'd make sure we're all on the same page here! It's good that we can have such discussions, regarding access and disabilities, without them turning into the shouting matches they tend to become on other boards. Thank you everyone for being so lovely!

to all!