What the heck is going on at WDW this week?

[focusondisney]

I have been going to WDW ever since it opened and for the last 8 years, going at least 4-5 times a year. The serivce is going down hill ever time I go, they are just getting greedy and really don't care about service anymore. We loved WDW, people would tease us about it, it is the only place we ever went. At this pont, WDW will not get another dimes from me. They are pushing everything to the limit. Also everytime we go, multiple things break. They need to get their stuff together. I can expect to see more and more of this type of thing happening, with the money you spend at WDW, you should expect more.

Sorry about the rant, it is a sad day as we have given up the mouse, he just is too greedy and the service and value not worth it.

Sorry it has gotten to you. I'm starting to think it's just a big down hill spiral: things are bad, Disney makes cuts, things get worse, Disney makes more cuts etc. All the while, other places like Universal & Las Vegas (another adult vacation option) are spending money to increase their venues & resorts.

While we haven't gotten to the point of giving up yet, I think it's because we go in mid Sept. And we stay deluxe & spend lots of resort down time. BUT, I expect good discounts. Won't pay Disney full price EVER again, not at deluxes. Or probably moderates, either. So if discounts go away, we'll start vacationing elsewhere, too.

 

[Geoff_M]

Now add to all this the increasing number of wheelchair accessable buses. I think these buses take fewer passengers. And take longer to load. At least that's how it seems to me after riding Disney buses for the last 13 years. So if you can get fewer bodies per bus but you still have to transport the same number of guests, you need more buses. So if you previously ran 3 buses per hour, now you need 4 or 5. I don't see that Disney did this.

I REALLY noticed this issue when we were there last year for Christmas. As our society has become less and less ambulatory, Disney transportation seems to be straining to adapt. Stops took a lot longer due to constant wheelchair/ECV loading and unloading. On top of that, demand for wheelchair/ECV space on buses often outpaced available spots on our trip. IIRC, the newer wheelchair/ECV-friendly buses can handle up to 3 such units at a time, but on more than one occasion during our trip the bus driver had to leave someone, and their family, in a wheelchair/ECV at the bus stop because all of the spots were full.

I suppose "more buses" is an easy answer, but I'm not sure of the logistics and business sense of expanding the fleet of buses and hiring/training more drivers for a problem that only peaks a few weeks out of the year.

 

[mhsjax]

Sorry it has gotten to you. I'm starting to think it's just a big down hill spiral: things are bad, Disney makes cuts, things get worse, Disney makes more cuts etc. All the while, other places like Universal & Las Vegas (another adult vacation option) are spending money to increase their venues & resorts.

While we haven't gotten to the point of giving up yet, I think it's because we go in mid Sept. And we stay deluxe & spend lots of resort down time. BUT, I expect good discounts. Won't pay Disney full price EVER again, not at deluxes. Or probably moderates, either. So if discounts go away, we'll start vacationing elsewhere, too.

I think the discounts are part of the problem. Yes, I am with you on paying the full amount, won't do it. We spent 6 nights at the Grand Floridian the week after Thanksgiving, 6 years ago. Now you can't even get that rate even during the most discounted time. We also tend to stay deluxe and spend a lot of down time, but you can only do so much down time, and because we do go so much, our kids don't feel the need to get to the parks and do everything, I mean really we go on the rides and recited every word , we know it backwards and forwards.

I do think that WDW has upped their pricing so much that they need discounts otherwise people can't go, but with these discounts and "free dining" come the crowds, and they aren't equiped to handle them at all. They push for more and more people into the parts while cutting down on the people working.

I have also learned through personal experience about some of their business practices and am not impressed.

Have a great time, there will be at least 5 less people there.

 

[GeorgeG]

I mentioned this on another thread and somebody disagreed over the amount of buses added over the years, but here goes... again:

We started going to WDW in 1986 when there were only four onsite resorts (Contemporary, Polynesian, Disney Inn (now Shades of Green) and Fort Wilderness. Since then, Disney has added at least two dozen resorts and have plans for at least another in the near future. For transportation, nothing has been added to the monorail and boat transportation systems and relatively few buses have been added. Obviously, the bus transportation system is now the primary mode, but it is woefully inadequate for even what would be moderate crowds today. Everything Disney does is geared for bringing more people into the resorts and parks all year and there really isn't much of a slow season these days. I have to believe there is more than enough justification for more buses and drivers. Disney may be enjoying the profits for now, but I fear they are driving people away in a hurry with all the cutbacks and lack of concern for the guests.

 

[Aimeedyan]

This discussion is backing up my decision to ALWAYS rent a car at WDW. ALWAYS.

I think I've ridden the bus once or twice in the last 5 years and each time, think "Why didn't I just take my car?" I think they do a poor job of managing crowds in peak times among the transportation system so I just chose another option for us. Problem solved!

 

[LisaNJ25]

This discussion is backing up my decision to ALWAYS rent a car at WDW. ALWAYS.

I think I've ridden the bus once or twice in the last 5 years and each time, think "Why didn't I just take my car?" I think they do a poor job of managing crowds in peak times among the transportation system so I just chose another option for us. Problem solved!

I agree!! We always drive and have a car but this past summer was the first time we used the car to drive to each park daily. I cant believe we didn't do it earlier. I see everyone complaining at POR but we never had problems we didn't encounter at other resorts and have been there multiple times.

 

[ilovefh]

I REALLY noticed this issue when we were there last year for Christmas. As our society has become less and less ambulatory, Disney transportation seems to be straining to adapt. Stops took a lot longer due to constant wheelchair/ECV loading and unloading. On top of that, demand for wheelchair/ECV space on buses often outpaced available spots on our trip. IIRC, the newer wheelchair/ECV-friendly buses can handle up to 3 such units at a time, but on more than one occasion during our trip the bus driver had to leave someone, and their family, in a wheelchair/ECV at the bus stop because all of the spots were full.

I suppose "more buses" is an easy answer, but I'm not sure of the logistics and business sense of expanding the fleet of buses and hiring/training more drivers for a problem that only peaks a few weeks out of the year.

According to DH there are some new buses that hold 4 wheelchairs. But also, the extra wheelchairs cuts down the number of people they can fit on a bus. For one wheelchair it takes up three seats. That eliminates two seats per wheelchair.

All of Disney's need for more transportation aside, is this something that people should be doing, even if it is to make a point to Disney? Walking down a poorly lit stretch of road with no sidewalks, under the waterway where the road is already tight and darting out in front of both cars and buses. At what point does personal responsibility come in? At what point is your family's safety your responsibility rather than "Disney made me do it because of the long waits"? I think that is the point I was trying to make with my posts. Disney may need to add more transportation during busy times, but I don't think it calls for unsafe behavior to make a point.

And is one ever justified in pushing someone, especially a sheriff, when they are just trying to get you to comply with rules that are clearly for your safety?

I understand Disney may need to step up their game, but to me this kind of behavior, that puts your life and the lives of others at risk, is not justified


I think part of my problem is that these people feel justified, however when they dart out in front of a bus on a poorly lit road where there are not supposed to be any pedestrians and the bus can't stop they will be the first to sue. It bugs me because as bad as I feel for the family of the man who was hit at POR, I also feel terrible for the driver. How do you live with yourself knowing you killed someone, even though it wasn't your fault? DH is a bus driver and I don't want him to ever be in a position like that. And being smart about your own behavior will eliminate these kinds of situations. If you're not walking down World Drive, there is no way you can be hit!

 

[michst8alum]

Wow! I have to say how surprised I am to hear this. We just got back this morning from a wonderful trip. We stayed at POFQ and shared buses with POR several times. Yes, the lines were longer, but we were always able to get on the first bus. The crowds were large, but I had not heard of the "incident" that was mentioned about the MK. I asked a CM if there were any closings on Christmas, as we went to HS and she said that they had a brief closing to outside ticket holders, but it lasted only a couple of hours. I think for what it is worth that Disney does a great job getting so many people around. Yes, it can be hard when everyone leaves after the parade or illuminations, but unfortunately in today's society everyone wants everything NOW. We saw a white van at the entrance to the theme parks giving instructions to buses at the busy times, trying to minimize the wait time. They try their best. We had a great trip, did everything we wanted multiple times and Christmas is not a time to avoid, just realize that planning and patience are the key!

 

[kaytieeldr]

Can you physically walk from the MK to TTC. Yes but its not lit, no sidewalks for most of the trip and utterly stupid and dangerous as that part of the road is deadly for even people in cars...

How do you even get from the TTC to World Drive? You first have to walk allllllllll the way through the parking lot, then through the toll booths... Crazy people.

I completely and totally agree with this. I was at WDW, staying at POR the first week of Food and Wine, and IMHO transportation was insane. Long waits for buses, way too many people squashed into the buses when they get there

Respectfully disagree. Another WDW bus driver has stated that there's a counter on the bus that indicates when the bus is at capacity. Drivers won't - can't - allow more passengers on the bus than its maximum. While it may be crowded, there won't be too many people on the bus for safe transport.

and monorails constantly and mysteriously being "offline", especially at peak times.

Again elsewhere on the DIS, it was reported that one of the issues is the unusually cold weather is causing the monorail sensors to read the doors as being not closed even though they're actually closed. It won't move with the doors not closed (or sensed as such) since that's not safe, so, since safety is more important to Walt Disney World than convenience, they're having to use buses instead.

 

[ilovefh]

How do you even get from the TTC to World Drive? You first have to walk allllllllll the way through the parking lot, then through the toll booths... Crazy people.

These were people walking from MK to TTC (or wherever they were planning to go). The road that runs from MK to TTC (in front of the Contemporary) is still World Drive. They were walking down that stretch of the road, under the waterway.

 

[Handbag Lady]

Can you physically walk from the MK to TTC. Yes but its not lit, no sidewalks for most of the trip and utterly stupid and dangerous as that part of the road is deadly for even people in cars...

Can you tell I was one of the drivers who got to deal with said people last night as I was going home from work, who had people darting in front of my car with young kids on a darken stretch of road- I pretty much had a meltdown once I got home

I really want to know what went wrong with transportation cause that is an experience I do NOT want to have again...

I'm so sorry! I'm glad you made it home safely. I'll share with Derek, he's always wanted to know what would happen if something like this came down. It was so peaceful in November!

 

[sorcerormickey]

How do you even get from the TTC to World Drive? You first have to walk allllllllll the way through the parking lot, then through the toll booths... Crazy people.

Um, NO, lol. If you are at TTC: You walk thru the parking lot @TTC that is for off-site buses, there is a small service road that spills out onto WD, make a left, walk past CR, and then you hit the CR/MK walkway. No one is supposed to be walking there - there is no sidewalk down the service road.

 

[JoiseyMom]

This discussion is backing up my decision to ALWAYS rent a car at WDW. ALWAYS.

I think I've ridden the bus once or twice in the last 5 years and each time, think "Why didn't I just take my car?" I think they do a poor job of managing crowds in peak times among the transportation system so I just chose another option for us. Problem solved!

I agree!! We always drive and have a car but this past summer was the first time we used the car to drive to each park daily. I cant believe we didn't do it earlier. I see everyone complaining at POR but we never had problems we didn't encounter at other resorts and have been there multiple times.

ITA! We always have a car and use it. Unless we stayed at the Poly or GF and would use the monorail, we used the car!

 

[kaytieeldr]

I bet most average vacationers wouldn't even think about a taxi as an option. Wouldn't know how to get a taxi at the Magic Kingdom. Or maybe just can't afford it.

If you're waiting for a WDW bus right outside the Magic Kingdom, no. But if you're at the TTC or at any other park, taxis are readily available. Okay, at Epcot the taxi stand is in the middle of all the buses - VERY handy for frustrated bus passengers.

Now add to all this the increasing number of wheelchair accessable buses. I think these buses take fewer passengers.

Every bus is wheelchair accessible, there's no 'increasing number'. When there are Guests using wheelchairs/EVCs, each wheelchair Guest uses three or four seats, each ECV Guest uses four seats. Each bus holds upwards of, I believe, eighty passengers.

WDW is really screwing up, they aren't providing enough busses, monorails for people to use and you end up waiting forever.

Logistically and for safety, the monorail has to be spaced out. Two trains run on each MK/TTC loop; I'm not sure how many run the TTC/Epcot loop at one time, but it makes sense it'd be more than that. "Waiting forever" is hyperbole unless one has been at a monorail station for the last three months waiting for a train .

All the while, other places like Universal & Las Vegas (another adult vacation option) are spending money to increase their venues & resorts.

Just got back. Spending money to build new, okay - but not to improve or renovate what's already there. A lot of neon out; much marble worn out and chipping at the Bellagio(!); Harrah's almost as run-down as the Imperial Palace; second-tier shows "just okay"...

 

[focusondisney]

According to DH there are some new buses that hold 4 wheelchairs. But also, the extra wheelchairs cuts down the number of people they can fit on a bus. For one wheelchair it takes up three seats. That eliminates two seats per wheelchair.

All of Disney's need for more transportation aside, is this something that people should be doing, even if it is to make a point to Disney? Walking down a poorly lit stretch of road with no sidewalks, under the waterway where the road is already tight and darting out in front of both cars and buses. At what point does personal responsibility come in? At what point is your family's safety your responsibility rather than "Disney made me do it because of the long waits"? I think that is the point I was trying to make with my posts. Disney may need to add more transportation during busy times, but I don't think it calls for unsafe behavior to make a point.

And is one ever justified in pushing someone, especially a sheriff, when they are just trying to get you to comply with rules that are clearly for your safety?

I understand Disney may need to step up their game, but to me this kind of behavior, that puts your life and the lives of others at risk, is not justified


I think part of my problem is that these people feel justified, however when they dart out in front of a bus on a poorly lit road where there are not supposed to be any pedestrians and the bus can't stop they will be the first to sue. It bugs me because as bad as I feel for the family of the man who was hit at POR, I also feel terrible for the driver. How do you live with yourself knowing you killed someone, even though it wasn't your fault? DH is a bus driver and I don't want him to ever be in a position like that. And being smart about your own behavior will eliminate these kinds of situations. If you're not walking down World Drive, there is no way you can be hit!

I certainly don't agree with anyone walking places without sidewalks or without pedestrian areas. And to agrue or physically confront a sherrif is not to be tolerated. But the fact is, society is becoming more about instant gratification & people are simply not going to wait for what they see as unreasonable amounts of time. These types of things are probably going to happen again unless Disney gets it's act together. Remember the man who punched a driver last spring?

As I said above, Disney uses the free transportation as a big on site perk. They can't screw that up big time & expect their guests to be happy. And if someone was trying to get to the TTC, that means they are probably off site day guests, with few options to get back there.

If Disney can't keep up with timely bus transportation, maybe they should install safe, lighted walkways. They did it to the Studios from the Epcot resorts. And it's a good alternative. It could go away from bus & car traffic by going to the Grand Floridian & Poly.

Bottom line, things are not good & are getting worse. I certainly appreciate the job your DH & his fellow drivers do. They are not to blame, but they take a lot of the heat. I would never want any of them to be involved in a fatal accident, either. So for everyones sake, I hope the powers that be start looking at the issues & making some needed improvements.

 

[Sorsha]

Respectfully disagree. Another WDW bus driver has stated that there's a counter on the bus that indicates when the bus is at capacity. Drivers won't - can't - allow more passengers on the bus than its maximum. While it may be crowded, there won't be too many people on the bus for safe transport.

Well of course there won't. It would be silly to suggest that Disney would put more people on the bus than would be safe.

BUT. Disney DOES put more people on the bus than is COMFORTABLE. When I have been standing in line for 2 hours already waiting for the cursed bus to get there, and then I still have to stand, and I am holding my asleep-on-her-feet child lest she get crushed in the throngs of other squashed-in standing people, and the guy behind me is holding his bag of Very Pointy Crap from the Magic Kingdom and the Pointy Crap is poking me in the back, and the lady in front of me might have forgotten to shower or put on deodorant this morning and she has BOTH arms stretched above her to hold on to the bars, and we go bouncingbouncingbouncing and swayyying swayyying all the way back to my hotel then YES there are too many people for my COMFORT squashed onto that one bus.

And yes. That run-on sentence was justified.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I think the discounts are part of the problem. Yes, I am with you on paying the full amount, won't do it.

Um, you do realize that if discounts are part of the problem and you won't pay full price in the future, you'll be contributing to the perpetuation of the problem, right?

 

[MushyMushy]

Well of course there won't. It would be silly to suggest that Disney would put more people on the bus than would be safe.

BUT. Disney DOES put more people on the bus than is COMFORTABLE. When I have been standing in line for 2 hours already waiting for the cursed bus to get there, and then I still have to stand, and I am holding my asleep-on-her-feet child lest she get crushed in the throngs of other squashed-in standing people, and the guy behind me is holding his bag of Very Pointy Crap from the Magic Kingdom and the Pointy Crap is poking me in the back, and the lady in front of me might have forgotten to shower or put on deodorant this morning and she has BOTH arms stretched above her to hold on to the bars, and we go bouncingbouncingbouncing and swayyying swayyying all the way back to my hotel then YES there are too many people for my COMFORT squashed onto that one bus.

And yes. That run-on sentence was justified.

Or the woman who is so squished into position that she has to straddle the leg of a seated person (ME!!!) the entire trip. I felt like she owed me dinner after that bus ride.

 

[kaytieeldr]

As I said above, Disney uses the free transportation as a big on site perk. They can't screw that up big time & expect their guests to be happy. And if someone was trying to get to the TTC, that means they are probably off site day guests, with few options to get back there.

Four words: The MONORAIL / the FERRY. Don't try convincing anyone that somebody trying to get to the TTC had few options. We're not falling for it. With, probably, two ferries running at closing time with a capacity of about 400 people each (no UG handy, so I don't have the exact number) every ten minutes, plus the (likely) two monorails), they likely had safer and faster options than walking down an unlit road.

 

[focusondisney]

If you're waiting for a WDW bus right outside the Magic Kingdom, no. But if you're at the TTC or at any other park, taxis are readily available. Okay, at Epcot the taxi stand is in the middle of all the buses - VERY handy for frustrated bus passengers.Well, apparently the problem was a lack of buses from the MK. So taxi's weren't an option, even if someone thought of it, or could afford it.
Every bus is wheelchair accessible, there's no 'increasing number'. When there are Guests using wheelchairs/EVCs, each wheelchair Guest uses three or four seats, each ECV Guest uses four seats. Each bus holds upwards of, I believe, eighty passengers. Sorry, I don't know if every bus is accesslble or not. They weren't when we started going 13 or 14 years ago. We now stay at YC & walk or take the boat to 2 parks & don't use all the buses. But again, if seats are lost due to wheelchairs or ECV's, capacity goes down. More buses would still be needed to transport the same amount of people.

Logistically and for safety, the monorail has to be spaced out. Two trains run on each MK/TTC loop; I'm not sure how many run the TTC/Epcot loop at one time, but it makes sense it'd be more than that. "Waiting forever" is hyperbole unless one has been at a monorail station for the last three months waiting for a train . Agree, not much can be done to hurry the monorails.

Just got back. Spending money to build new, okay - but not to improve or renovate what's already there. A lot of neon out; much marble worn out and chipping at the Bellagio(!); Harrah's almost as run-down as the Imperial Palace; second-tier shows "just okay"...

But as a whole, new venues are being built. Things are being done to bring people in & keep them coming back.

My comments in red.