What is your line in the sand?

[CTDisneyfan816]

I can't think of any realistic change that would do it for me.

 

[ArwenMarie]

Right now, the tickets are still worth it to us. We feel we get a decent value out of the ticket price, for our family anyway. If the ticket price goes up much more, that might change though.

We've already started to stay offsite because the value of the Disney resorts just wasn't there for us anymore. But we love that there are so many great lodging options in Orlando to pick from.

We've also cut back on the amount of meals we eat onsite, but staying offsite helps with that. It's literally half the price for any given meal offsite versus onsite, comparing similar types of meals.

The other big factor for us is airfare since we are too far to drive. We add that into a price-per-day calculation, and that can make a big difference in terms of perceived value.

Anyway, for us, it's still a decent value and we still enjoy the Disney Parks but we've altered how we do Disney quite a bit.

 

[ArwenMarie]

They generally have a number of on site dining options as opposed to one food court as well as usually being walking distance to additional options.

Personally not a perk for me, but disney often touts it, so i assume they consider it a perk

Disney does tout the dining options as a perk for Deluxe.

On our last couple of visits, I started thinking it was a negative in some cases, for the people staying there. Having very popular restaurants at your resort isn't necessarily a good thing when you are staying there. They can bring a lot of crowds through and make the lobbies crowded. I'm thinking specifically of Chef Mickey's and Ohana. And the Grand Floridian is a big draw for visitors as well.

(Not that I'm against people visiting other resorts, it's one of my favorite things to do, so I'm part of the traffic)

 

[CAmommy]

I recently visited WDW for the first time and I don't really plan on returning since IMHO, Disneyland is a far better less intensely planned experience. I will return to Disneyland time and time again. They can't get rid of me.

 

[BuzzinDownToDisney]

Interesting thread. They put one toe on the line changing park hours 2 weeks prior to our trip and we've been back and forth about cancelling, but ultimately have not. That was very close. For us definitively it is crowd levels. While I understand there is no such thing as a 1 or 2 day anymore, if we can not find a time to go where the crowd calendars are below 5, we simply will not go anymore. Prior to our son being born my wife and I had no problem being in the MK on the 4th of July and other 9 & 10 days. With a kid it is a recipe for disaster. On our last trip we slammed into a day that felt like a 10 despite the sites calling for it to be a 4. So if the crowds reached a point of always being over 5, or more people began waking up early and eliminating the benefit of RD, we'd take our vacation money elsewhere.

 

[Mkrop]

For me it is a general attitude that seems to be slipping away. I've been going since the early 70's. Even though Walt died before the park opened, for many years WDW remained true to the ideas he outlined. There was always something new to discover, the parks were spectacularly clean, the customer service was exceptional.

I feel like Disney has lost their way. It isn't so much one thing, as a series of things that have made Disney a shadow of it's former glory. Instead of improving the product, they decided to punish the customer and destroy the product.

The no-show fee is one example. If the prior system wasn't working well, then Disney should fix it, but punishing/restricting every customer is not the creative and intelligent solution. Disney used to take the opposite approach. They improved the product.

There's a glaring shortage of places to eat in the Magic Kingdom. I can't see where Disney wouldn't do better if they offered more places to dine in the park.

Likewise, if MK is getting crowded, the solution isn't to punish guests who want to go there. It is finding ways to make AK, Epcot, and HS more appealing.

The line in the sand for me, is the feeling I now get when ponder a return trip with my extended family. I used to enjoy planning trips for everyone. Now the prospect makes me sad.

 

[PEC]

Cost is naturally a choice. Of course that said cost is a factor to everybody. IF they charge too much a billionare couldn't afford to go.
Bad maintenance and or too many closings? I guess that is the things that would stop me. The closings recently have not affected any of my plans recently. American Idol? Never did it. My family never had interest. Maelstrom? Will miss it but far from being a showstopper. Backlot Tours? Once again will miss it but being I believe they will eventually do something with the space created I am fine with it.
As far as FP+. My plan for my next big vacation has had minimum if any changes because of it.
So far Disney hasn't come close to a line in the sand for me. When they do I will come to this site one last time and tap out and turn it over to a new bunch of Disney fans.

 

[gorkt]

Crowd levels. If it gets to the point that the crowds are wall to wall year round, I will probably stop going.

I feel like when the original FP was implemented, this made the parks more congested because people weren't waiting in lines as much - an unintended consequence probably. I have heard that they are removing seating areas in an attempt to get people moving into gift shops or sitting in dining rooms instead of sitting and resting, not spending money. From a short term business perspective, I get it, but it makes the park experience incrementally less enjoyable.

One thing Disney does better than almost anyone else is atmosphere and attention to detail, but if you are fighting crowds all the time, then you lose it.

Maybe things like the hub construction will make crowd congestion better, but adding another park might also help at this point.

 

[Jhuff8181]

I'm not sure what it is for me I guess when it is no longer enjoyable. I do wonder though, there seems to be a lot of people who say their line in the sand is high crowd levels and no more slow times...sounds like Disney is still doing something right

 

[smiths02]

I think it is cost for our family.

We don't go to Disney all the time because we can't afford it. But when we go, I want a full vacation experience. Something better than value accomodations, want to be on-site, want to eat at some fun places, maybe have a few extras (tour, dessert party, etc.), and ride a few rides (more than 3 a day please)...


We will see how our upcoming June 2015 trip goes. I am guessing I will get DH on-board for one more family trip when our twins our old enough to remember it (maybe around 6-7? 2018/2019). Then, I am thinking we will explore other destinations.

 

[btk2333]

I'm not sure what it is for me I guess when it is no longer enjoyable. I do wonder though, there seems to be a lot of people who say their line in the sand is high crowd levels and no more slow times...sounds like Disney is still doing something right

Yeah I find this ironic as well.

 

[robinb]

I'm not entirely sure where the line is for us, but I know it is very, very close. Here are the things that are pushing us away from WDW:

• FP+. It is perhaps the worst thing to happen to the parks ... ever.
• Annual ticket increases. In just 5 years a 7-day base pass went from $234 in 2009 to $324 in 2014. That's an increase of 38%.
• Food price increases. We were priced out of most TS meals years ago, especially the buffets. I simply cannot bring myself to pay $46-$50 per person to eat at Chef Mickey's when it was $32 5 years ago. That's an increase of 44% - 56%. CS meals are really no better. Back in 2009 a meal at Pecos Bills (pork sandwich, carrot cake, large soda) was $14.46 with tax. Today the same meal is now $18.60, a 29% increase.
• The requirement to plan our vacation to the minute 60-90 days in advance and needing to be online at midnight when your FP+ window opens up to get the FP+s you really want.
• The necessity to "walk" a DVC reservation in popular resort categories or risk not getting the room you want.
• The homogenization and reduction in quality of both food and merchandise.
• The little touches of pixie dust magic now gone: waking up Tink, paint brushes at Tom Sawyer island and divers with messages at Coral Reef to name a few.
• We went on a non-Disney cruise last Spring Break for a fraction of what a Disney vacation would have cost.

Add the insane crowds of Christmas, Spring Break and Summer when our DD doesn't have school to that list and yes, we are very, very close that line in the sand. Our next trip is in a few weeks and we have another short one planned for Spring Break. Depending on how those go we may be back for Christmas 2015 or we may be somewhere else on the proceeds from renting out our DVC points.

 

[trainingupmy4princes]

Fair enough. We are still talking hypotheticals right now as Disney isn't actually doing this. The question would be- does Disney get more money by filling their deluxe resorts to make up for the money lost by non-deluxe guests deciding not to go to WDW? I think the current fast pass window test is a good test for this (and maybe Disney feels the same way).

Either way I'd say it won't be long until the deluxes get more FPs. Maybe there will be an option to pay more for extra FPs if you stay at the values call it a "deluxe value package" or something like that where you pay an extra $50 a night for an extra FP every day.[/QUOTE
We stayed deluxe once and it wasn't the lack of in-park perks that had us back at moderates. The deluxes are way overpriced so I think they need to price them reasonably. Also, we paid way more but got less in terms of transportation. At BC we watched several boats skip us as they were already full to HS one night. (full from a non-Disney owned hotel that is actually cheaper ,the Swan/Dolphin) I know we could walk but our kids were little enough to be tired from the walk at night but not little enough to be in a stroller. We also had SRO on busses to AK for same reason as we shared busses with the Swan/Dolphin, BW and YC. I would think for deluxe prices you shouldn't have to share transportation with that many resorts except for really slow times. Ironically, we had far better transportation at all the moderates for way less money.

 

[mi*vida*loca]

I think it is cost for our family.

We don't go to Disney all the time because we can't afford it. But when we go, I want a full vacation experience. Something better than value accomodations, want to be on-site, want to eat at some fun places, maybe have a few extras (tour, dessert party, etc.), and ride a few rides (more than 3 a day please)...

This is us too.

After this trip I don't know when our next big family trip to WDW will be. We haven't been in 4 years and we like to do different things in between. We did Central America in 2013. We do the Jersey shore every year for weekend trips. We want to do something else (and cheaper) in 2016. The caribbean or DR or Cancun. Who knows.

DS goes to WDW for his senior trip in 2018. I'm thinking of doing a mother/son trip with him in 2016 and then one with DD in 2017. Then he's off to college and who knows if he will want to go on another family trip with us. Then it might just be DD and myself going to WDW. Going down as two people instead of 4 (SO goes on our trip with us too) is so much cheaper and I can easily swing that.

 

[eXo]

The reasons given here run the gamut of reasonable to downright picky (I mean, the removal of chicken fingers... really?).

But I think I also approach it from a different perspective. I went to Mk for the first time this past Oct (I'm 35), and before that a few years ago we stopped in and did one day at Animal Kingdom and 1 at Epcot.

As soon as I returned from MK I booked a trip for next year to take our kids for the first time (will be 5 and 2 at the time).

That is an incredibly different scenario from those who have been going for years. So I can see how those of you who have seen it all multiple times may become transfixed on certain things that made a previous vacation special.

That said, parks will change, CM's will come and go, prices will go up (always up), and new properties will come to the parks. I think WDW has done a decent job adding in some newer properties without doing damage to the older properties. I was MUCH more cynical about Disney before my trip as I was pretty much locked in as a huge fan of Universal for the past 10+ years. I used to book all my vacations there and this last trip really converted me.

For me there is no line in the sand because the experience of introducing my kids to the park superceeds any rational business practices. We will likely go again in 2-3 years once my younger child is around 5 so he can experience the park as a child as well. After that, who knows. There is so many amazing things to see in this world. I can't imagine flying to Florida every year when there are amazing things to introduce the kids to all over the country, let alone world travel.

So I guess, as a casual visitor to the parks (despite my intense interest in the history of the parks, Disney himself, and all the inner workings of the business in general) this topic isn't especially geared towards me.

FP+ didn't bother me much. I don't know what it used to be like, but other than the new mine train ride, we got to do everything else, so FP+ can't be THAT bad. At Universal we had to pay a premium for the fast passes, and they didn't even apply to their newer rides, leaving us to wait a fairly long time for a harry potter ride that consistently broke down and wasn't all that impressive in the end.

Some of you come across as creatures of extreme habit. I'd suggest to try finding NEW things to love about your trips instead of obsessing over recreating the same memories from the past. Things change. Maybe that's my line in the sand. The day the parks stop evolving and become some time capsule of the past is the day I loose all interest in going back. Change can be very good. It makes the park relevant to newer children (of any age) instead of catering to those of a previous generation only.

 

[SmithSmith]

Well said, eXo.

 

[wdw4rfam]

Interesting thread. They put one toe on the line changing park hours 2 weeks prior to our trip and we've been back and forth about cancelling, but ultimately have not. That was very close. For us definitively it is crowd levels. While I understand there is no such thing as a 1 or 2 day anymore, if we can not find a time to go where the crowd calendars are below 5, we simply will not go anymore. Prior to our son being born my wife and I had no problem being in the MK on the 4th of July and other 9 & 10 days. With a kid it is a recipe for disaster. On our last trip we slammed into a day that felt like a 10 despite the sites calling for it to be a 4. So if the crowds reached a point of always being over 5, or more people began waking up early and eliminating the benefit of RD, we'd take our vacation money elsewhere.

this is what we felt like in September. We had 3-5's and it felt like 7-8. We did have one day it felt slower on a party day at MK, but other than that it was as busy as our last April trip if not worse. We got to MK at rope drop and only got 2 rides in before the lines started getting long. We got to Epcot at opening also, rode spaceship earth, got back to TT and it was already at 40 minutes. If it's busy in September, that's telling me that what we saw was as good as it gets, and we rode half of what we used to. We have 2 trips planned in 2015 elsewhere, each for a week, (one of them right down the road from disney) and not one once of me feels sad about not going back. That's how I know they pushed me over my line.

 

[Adlergray]

We go to WDW for a couple reasons and when/if those arn't there anymore we probably will go a lot less. My main reason for going is that some of my best childhood memories with my family were at WDW. Both sets of my grandparents lived in FL and every time we would go we would spend a couple days at disney too. I have always wanted to make those same memories with my children but when they ask not to go we wont. We also really love doing club level and the DDP. (I know we are in the minority that do this on the boards) We like to spoil our selves on vacation and worry about as little as possible.The price hike hasn't felt huge but between the growth of our family and the increase in price our trips have doubled and I have started to think about all the other things I could do with that money. (We have attempted planning disney trips other ways but its just not appealing to us. It's just how we like to enjoy our vacation.) And if one of those ideas starts seeming more appealing then the $$$ for Disney then we will also probably really cut our trips back.

But my actual line in the sand would probably be 2 trips in a row where I walk down main street the first time and don't feel the magic or see it on my children's faces.

 

[DakotaRose]

Last trip felt like a lot of planning and physical work (time on our feet) and expense for the experience. There were only three new attractions for us -- Frozen Sing Along, Osborne lights, and MVMCP. The Christmas party was the turning point for me. It was stressful, slow going through the crowds, and we missed a few shows due to having no place to stand where we could see. Or taller people would walk right in front of us. Or five year olds were hoisted onto shoulders in front of us. Not magical!
So cost, planning required, hours and hours on our feet for few new experiences = not returning for foreseeable future.

 

[olwyngdh]

I guess my DHs line is different from mine. I said I would like to do Universal at some point, he said, "Have Fun. I'll be at Magic Kingdom."