What if buses came BEFORE the storm?

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

DH and I were just watching the "lessons learned" thing on CNN. Now we have a question.

If buses had been dispatched to low income areas BEFORE the storm to take people to safety - real safety, not the SuperDome - how many people do you think would have gotten on the buses?

 

[bsnyder]

Some. Definitely not all.

What were the lessons learned on CNN? I didn't watch it.

 

[momof2inPA]

Not many would have gone unless they were made to leave. Most of the New Orleans folk didn't believe the levee could actually break. Look how long it stood. Then there was the "Weather Channel" effect, meaning the Weather Channel acts like every hurricane will be a huge disaster. People just don't believe it, anymore. Plus, if pets weren't allowed on the busses or the busses weren't equipped for the ill or handicapped, those people wouldn't have left either.

To be honest, I think the number and percentage of people that actually evacuated before the hurricane was a pretty decent accomplishment, and you'll never get 100% evacuation.

I hope most of the lessons learned will be in supplying designated shelters and evacuating after a national disaster.

 

[bsnyder]

Not many would have gone unless they were made to leave. Most of the New Orleans folk didn't believe the levee could actually break. Look how long it stood. Then there was the "Weather Channel" effect, meaning the Weather Channel acts like every hurricane will be a huge disaster. People just don't believe it, anymore. Plus, if pets weren't allowed on the busses or the busses weren't equipped for the ill or handicapped, those people wouldn't have left either.

To be honest, I think the number and percentage of people that actually evacuated before the hurricane was a pretty decent accomplishment, and you'll never get 100% evacuation.

I hope most of the lessons learned will be in supplying designated shelters and evacuating after a national disaster.

You're right, you'll never get 100%.

I've been wondering ever since this happened. In the future, should people be forced to leave? Not sure I've decided how I feel about it yet, it's not an easy question.

 

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

I was watching while we were eating, so between taking bites and trying to keep the cat out of my plate I am sure I missed some key points!

Most of what they were saying was related to immediate response and evacuation more than the aftermath.

They were saying that a drill had been done with the fictional "Hurricane Pam" and the things they predicted were things that DID happen, only on a larger scale. A professor from LSU said they spent twelve DAYS talking about it. Talking about evacuating, etc. He said they knew it would take 72 hours to empty the city, but the mayor didn't say to leave until 24 hours before.

There are reserves that belong to the gov't (radios, scuba gear, all sorts of things) that weren't brought in because nobody requested them.

Then they showed this big lot full of school buses and implied that those buses could have been used to move people out of the city. The problem was the buses were all sitting in several FEET of water, which prompted my question of what if the buses had come BEFORE? Once there were thousands of people at the SuperDome the buses were already flooded and no longer a viable option. But I wonder if people really would have taken the chance to get our beforehand if a bus had come through each neighborhood.

 

[janette]

Everyone wouldn't have but that was the optimal time to save lives and they weren't even offered that option. Sadly I think the elderly would have been the least likely to go but also most at risk.

 

[frozone]

"What if" is a pretty big universe.

I'll only speak to what I would have done.

Had I been living with just me and my daughter in NO and had no car and was given the choice between the Superdome and a bus out of the city, I would have taken the bus. No way would I have wanted to take my DD into a place so big with only me to protect her. I would have gotten out of the city as quick as I could and contacted relatives ASAP.

 

[jackskellingtonsgirl]

Oh, they also said the city had been advised that they would need approximately 1000 shelters to house the people that would have to be moved out, which makes me think the SuperDome might not have been identified as a shleter in the drill.

 

[bsnyder]

The Superdome was not an approved FEMA shelter.

And heck, even if they hadn't moved the people out with the buses before hand, I sure wish they had moved them to higher ground, so they could be used after the storm.

 

[Jamesbyr]

The Superdome was not an approved FEMA shelter.


Wow. What WAS an "approved FEMA Shelter" after all?

 

[froglady]

The Superdome was not an approved FEMA shelter.


Wow. What WAS an "approved FEMA Shelter" after all?

Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner! The Superdome was a shelter of last resort; WHERE were the other shelters? THAT'S the question that has not been answered by ANYONE so far! CITY, STATE, FEDERAL...in that order...WHERE were the evacuees supposed to go once the order to evacuate had been given?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

For this particular incident--I don't see how it would have changed much in the end...numbers-wise. You would have had additional people who could have left the city--but as for last minute commandeering....I think much less people would have been moved than what were eventually accomodated in the superdome. Approved or not--that dome--before it became the hell hole that it was...did save lives.

Poverty and health were issues this hurricane...as was everybody's friend "complacency".

Using the busses--would have just earned the mayor a pat on the back for "trying" and then a smack in the face for not trying hard enough to get those people on the bus.

 

[HaleyB]

First of all the buses DID come before the hurricane. They did use buses to evacuate people. Those school buses got left behind because the people that drive them headed the evacuation order, so they could not drive the buses.

There is a huge amount of misinformation about what did and did not happen. WHat I know for sure is the head of FEMA said on national television saying that he didn't even know there were people in the convention center. Hello. So no one at FEMA watches TV or reads the newspaper. Good greif it was on CNN for goodness sakes.

read at salon.com they have some really good timelines and such.

 

[Bunch24]

First of all the buses DID come before the hurricane. They did use buses to evacuate people. Those school buses got left behind because the people that drive them headed the evacuation order, so they could not drive the buses.

There is a huge amount of misinformation about what did and did not happen. WHat I know for sure is the head of FEMA said on national television saying that he didn't even know there were people in the convention center. Hello. So no one at FEMA watches TV or reads the newspaper. Good greif it was on CNN for goodness sakes.

read at salon.com they have some really good timelines and such.

Haley, you are taking the FEMA directors comments out of context. I watched the entire interview and the question was posed "Why wasn't any aid sent to the Morial Convention Center?"

His response was that he didn't even know (at the time the first response was ordered) that the convention center was being used as a shelter, that the convention center was never mentioned as a shelter. The only shelter he knew of was the Superdome.

The convention center was never meant to be a shelter, but somehow it became one.

The lack of communication between Mayor Roy Nagin and Governor Blanco and FEMA is to blame for the late response to the convention center.

The truth is out there, you just have to read between the lines and the agendas.

 

[catherine]

Ding Ding Ding! We have a winner! The Superdome was a shelter of last resort; WHERE were the other shelters? THAT'S the question that has not been answered by ANYONE so far! CITY, STATE, FEDERAL...in that order...WHERE were the evacuees supposed to go once the order to evacuate had been given?

I read that a lot of the designated shelters were under water. If that is the case, what I don't understand is, why they would pick shelters in areas that could possibly be flooded!

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

catherine--it is b/c they weren't shelters, they were "refuges of last resort". A safer haven..not a safe one.