What do do with a St Bernard, the Rescue won't take him

[johnsontrio]

No one is saying that it would be simple to find a new home for the dog. Just because something is difficult doesn't mean that it shouldn't be done and certainly doesn't mean that everyone should default to euthanasia, as many in this thread has.

This is no different than any dog. As a responsible pet owner, you ensure that 1) no one can possibly come into contact with your dog when the animal is not under your control and 2) you maintain control of your animal when it is around others.

No one is suggesting that Cujo be taken to the nearest off-leash park for a play date. Rather, he needs a very structured environment where the owner gives him proper training and authority is made clear. The animal should not feel threatened, not should he believe for a second that he is alpha.

I've seen mistreated pit bulls that had been used for dog fighting turned around. I hardly feel that this saint bernard is a lost cause.

I guess I am wondering how could I possible have 24/7 responsibility for a dog that can't be around all kinds of folks. I travel with my family and my dogs are left with a neighbor sitter. I also had major surgery this past January where I had a 5 pound weight restriction for 2 months. Anyone that would take this dog would be committing their life to this dog if they were to be responsible about it.

I agree with others that feel that irresponsible breeding/training is at fault for this. However, I would not be willing to live my life catering to the limitations of this one dog. I would be afraid that someone would take this dog thinking "everything is OK, I don't have kids" and not be responsible for all the "what ifs" that can occur.

My original question remains. If the rescue doesn't want him and there was no original breeder to go back to, how would you find a proper home? I realize it would be difficult, but what specific steps would you take to find this person?

 

[sbell111]

I guess I am wondering how could I possible have 24/7 responsibility for a dog that can't be around all kinds of folks. I travel with my family and my dogs are left with a neighbor sitter. I also had major surgery this past January where I had a 5 pound weight restriction for 2 months. Anyone that would take this dog would be committing their life to this dog if they were to be responsible about it.

By your own admission, you are not able/willing to be responsible for a dog. Therefore, you shouldn't have one.

I agree with others that feel that irresponsible breeding/training is at fault for this. However, I would not be willing to live my life catering to the limitations of this one dog. I would be afraid that someone would take this dog thinking "everything is OK, I don't have kids" and not be responsible for all the "what ifs" that can occur.

What a strange statement. I have a hard time wrapping my head around it. You see, I'm of the belief that in acquiring a dog, you are making a commitment to that animal. That commitment should not be tossed aside when it becomes inconvenient any more than a commitment to my wife or children would be tossed aside. Others clearly disagree.

My original question remains. If the rescue doesn't want him and there was no original breeder to go back to, how would you find a proper home? I realize it would be difficult, but what specific steps would you take to find this person?

I'm not sure what answer you are trying to force, but it is different for each of us. Basically, you would work your contacts and keep working them until you found a satisfactory resolution, just like you do with every crisis that comes up.

 

[happygirl]

My original question remains. If the rescue doesn't want him and there was no original breeder to go back to, how would you find a proper home? I realize it would be difficult, but what specific steps would you take to find this person?

Like I said early on in this post. I would take him if I lived close enough to get him. There would be lots of training and postive reinforcemnet to go throught but I'm sure this dog is trainable. If I would be willing to do it I'm sure they would be others willing to work with him as well.

 

[sbell111]

If we didn't have a baby on the way, I would take him. I just don't think that I would be able to commit to him what he needs.

 

[bumbershoot]

I think they just got an ill-bred dog, with a temperament not typical to its breed. He always sorta seemed to have a screw loose.

Our last malamute was like that. We met his sire *after* my mom committed the money towards the puppy, which was a mistake. He ended up going, basically, crazy at the end of his life. He was dangerous and scary at times, and had to be put down before he died on his own, because he freaked out when my mom went to get a beach towel from the backyard, and when he saw it he got possessive (darn my first stepdad for playing tug of war with a malamute puppy!!!), growled and bared his teeth at her (and she'd been solid as the Alpha for years), then gulped down the towel. The beach towel. Went too far down to be pulled up, but couldn't be taken out by surgery either. He would have starved. So they ended his life. And he was always a bit off...we felt strongly that his mom's owner's son dropped him on his head as a tiny puppy at some point, b/c the boy was allowed 100% access (we were never allowed that much access when our second malamute had puppies and we were gentle kids) and he was NOT gentle.

On top of that, the vet thought that maybe he had a brain tumor, and they were living in Miami at the time where poisonous toads live, and my mom wondered if he'd eaten one and was reacting to it. But a couple years later when BSE info hit the airwaves, we noticed that the sick soon to be "downed" cows had a loss of backside muscle control *just like he did*, and we wondered if he'd gotten a cross species form of it from his food or the big ol' cow femurs my mom used to get him as a treat.

Anyway, I feel for them.

It's sad that this is not going to happen.

It is. There's no place to put him while they find that perfect place.

Wow just wow, before anyone takes the time to find the poor animal a good home they just assume kill it. Geez I hope they don't get another dog ever!!!!!!!!

Where should they keep the dog during that process?

Like I said early on in this post. I would take him if I lived close enough to get him. There would be lots of training and postive reinforcemnet to go throught but I'm sure this dog is trainable. If I would be willing to do it I'm sure they would be others willing to work with him as well.

I think you said that you wish you could afford the dog...just not being close is very different! Maybe the OP's sister in law lives closer to you than you think? Perhaps they'd be willing to drive the dog out to you? If you want him, please do PM her so you can help the dog.

If we didn't have a baby on the way, I would take him. I just don't think that I would be able to commit to him what he needs.

Which is pretty much what johnsontrio said, that s/he wouldn't be able to commit to this dog, but you felt that was not an OK response.

 

[happygirl]

Our last malamute was like that. We met his sire *after* my mom committed the money towards the puppy, which was a mistake. He ended up going, basically, crazy at the end of his life. He was dangerous and scary at times, and had to be put down before he died on his own, because he freaked out when my mom went to get a beach towel from the backyard, and when he saw it he got possessive (darn my first stepdad for playing tug of war with a malamute puppy!!!), growled and bared his teeth at her (and she'd been solid as the Alpha for years), then gulped down the towel. The beach towel. Went too far down to be pulled up, but couldn't be taken out by surgery either. He would have starved. So they ended his life. And he was always a bit off...we felt strongly that his mom's owner's son dropped him on his head as a tiny puppy at some point, b/c the boy was allowed 100% access (we were never allowed that much access when our second malamute had puppies and we were gentle kids) and he was NOT gentle.

On top of that, the vet thought that maybe he had a brain tumor, and they were living in Miami at the time where poisonous toads live, and my mom wondered if he'd eaten one and was reacting to it. But a couple years later when BSE info hit the airwaves, we noticed that the sick soon to be "downed" cows had a loss of backside muscle control *just like he did*, and we wondered if he'd gotten a cross species form of it from his food or the big ol' cow femurs my mom used to get him as a treat.

Anyway, I feel for them.



It is. There's no place to put him while they find that perfect place.



Where should they keep the dog during that process?



I think you said that you wish you could afford the dog...just not being close is very different! Maybe the OP's sister in law lives closer to you than you think? Perhaps they'd be willing to drive the dog out to you? If you want him, please do PM her so you can help the dog.



Which is pretty much what johnsontrio said, that s/he wouldn't be able to commit to this dog, but you felt that was not an OK response.

Oops I did. I changed it I don't know what goes through my mind and the time it gets to my fingers lol

 

[johnsontrio]

By your own admission, you are not able/willing to be responsible for a dog. Therefore, you shouldn't have one.What a strange statement. I have a hard time wrapping my head around it. You see, I'm of the belief that in acquiring a dog, you are making a commitment to that animal. That commitment should not be tossed aside when it becomes inconvenient any more than a commitment to my wife or children would be tossed aside. Others clearly disagree.I'm not sure what answer you are trying to force, but it is different for each of us. Basically, you would work your contacts and keep working them until you found a satisfactory resolution, just like you do with every crisis that comes up.

Maybe you're taking things out of context or maybe you're just trying to pick a fight.. My quote says I wouldn't be willing to live my life catering to the limitations of this one dog. As in this specific dog. I actually have 2 dogs and have always had dogs since my childhood. But I am not the only person that cares for these dogs, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. I don't feel I need to justify my ability to care for these dogs.

I do know that my dogs are properly socialized and can be left in the care of other people.

I guess what I am looking for is once you've contacted the rescue and gone back to the breeder (in this case, not possible) I wouldn't know where to turn next. My contacts are not people that are capable of the intense training that this dog would need. Additionally, most the people I know have children or grandchildren that are in their lives and their homes.

As another poster stated, where would this dog live until a home was found?

 

[happygirl]

Maybe you're taking things out of context or maybe you're just trying to pick a fight.. My quote says I wouldn't be willing to live my life catering to the limitations of this one dog. As in this specific dog. I actually have 2 dogs and have always had dogs since my childhood. But I am not the only person that cares for these dogs, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. I don't feel I need to justify my ability to care for these dogs.

I do know that my dogs are properly socialized and can be left in the care of other people.

I guess what I am looking for is once you've contacted the rescue and gone back to the breeder (in this case, not possible) I wouldn't know where to turn next. My contacts are not people that are capable of the intense training that this dog would need. Additionally, most the people I know have children or grandchildren that are in their lives and their homes.

As another poster stated, where would this dog live until a home was found?

I believe there quite a few people would be willing to take this dog. Is this dog neutered if he's not it sounds like he needs to be. You could contact The National St. Bernard Club of America I bet they would know someone who is willing to take him.

 

[CathrynRose]

I'm so sorry.

As much as it sucks, it's the right thing to do.

A child - especially a child whom lives in the home (i.e. part of the 'pack') should never be the victim of their dog. Even if it is a 'nip'. The initial one - okay, maybe it was a warning, but the dog continued to show aggressive (perhaps warning) behavior to kids, and that could be a scary thing, with a big dog. What if the next 'warning' wasn't a warning, anymore? KWIM?

We took Charley to a dog expo, where lots and lots of dogs were - and lots and lots of kids.

A group of them came up to him and asked to pet him, and proceeded to hang, hug, rub, smoosh and get all up in his face. Charley's a big dog, with a big ol' mouth, so I watched his reaction. There was none, other than the look he gave me after wards like "Thanks a lot"

I think dog's (and this is my opinion) should be able to determine children vs. adults, as well as real threats vs perceived threats (especially again, from their own 'pack')

I'm sorry though... that stinks.

 

[goofy!]

I agree that this dog has a very unfortunate mixture of bad breeding (pet shop puppy mill dog) and owners that never had the opportunity to learn how to properly socialize and train a giant breed.

As for the 24/7 "catering" of your dog, it is hard work. But it is also responsible dog ownership. With my breed, it is pretty much mandatory. but it should be a no-brainer with any any dog. Every dog owner should socialize, train, and have their dog under control 24/7. I know it can be done because we live it everyday and have for 12 years without an incident or a single nip, with a guardy dog.

That said, I cannot agree with the suggestion of using your contacts to find a suitable home for this dog. That is well and dandy for those of us that are in the dog loop and actually have contacts, but this family is not even the least bit qualified to assess and evaluate a proper home for a known aggressive dog.

If they had contacts in the first place, this dog probably wouldn't be in this situation.

Their best resources, rescue organizations that are experienced in this kind of thing, have already refused to take the dog. Without the contacts of a breeder or a rescue organization, how in the world would this family go about finding and properly evaluating a suitable home for the dog and know enough to protect themselves from lawsuits should the dog attack again?

It is an extremely sad thing, and as I said, I give aggressive dogs the benefit of the doubt, mostly believing it is the human that caused the problems, but there are some times where the most humane thing to do would be to euthanize the dog. Epecially when there are so many more dogs in rescue that are far better candidates to be rehabilitated. This might just be one of those times

 

[happygirl]

http://www.saintbernardclub.org/2008Redesign/rescue.htm. OP Check this link out I hope maybe the can give you some guidance.

 

[Imzadi]

I agree that three bites is too many. Even if you only "count" two of the bites because he was antagonized before the second bite, it's still too many. The dog has now learned it can bite children.

I take it, the owners never had the first two bites reported to Animal Control, because the matter would be taken out of their hands.

As for your nephew feeling guilty, he should be reminded the order of events and certain distinctions made clear: The dog had already bitten 2 children. The dog, unprovoked went after him. While it will be sad and unfortunate to have the dog put down, your nephew has nothing to feel guilty for.

 

[johnsontrio]

I agree that this dog has a very unfortunate mixture of bad breeding (pet shop puppy mill dog) and owners that never had the opportunity to learn how to properly socialize and train a giant breed.

As for the 24/7 "catering" of your dog, it is hard work. But it is also responsible dog ownership. With my breed, it is pretty much mandatory. but it should be a no-brainer with any any dog. Every dog owner should socialize, train, and have their dog under control 24/7. I know it can be done because we live it everyday and have for 12 years without an incident or a single nip, with a guardy dog.

That said, I cannot agree with the suggestion of using your contacts to find a suitable home for this dog. That is well and dandy for those of us that are in the dog loop and actually have contacts, but this family is not even the least bit qualified to assess and evaluate a proper home for a known aggressive dog.

If they had contacts in the first place, this dog probably wouldn't be in this situation.

Their best resources, rescue organizations that are experienced in this kind of thing, have already refused to take the dog. Without the contacts of a breeder or a rescue organization, how in the world would this family go about finding and properly evaluating a suitable home for the dog and know enough to protect themselves from lawsuits should the dog attack again?

It is an extremely sad thing, and as I said, I give aggressive dogs the benefit of the doubt, mostly believing it is the human that caused the problems, but there are some times where the most humane thing to do would be to euthanize the dog. Epecially when there are so many more dogs in rescue that are far better candidates to be rehabilitated. This might just be one of those times

Thank you for posting this. You have managed to convey my viewpoint more eloquently than I ever could.

As for catering to the dogs, we do so here as well. Most people I know say we treat our dogs better than kids. My mini dachshund was inherited from a family friend that had 3 little ones under the age of 3 and was having huge issues in that home. He is now on Prosac and his hiding and shaking are greatly reduced. He has to be coaxed to eat due to the meds and we handle that. Our English Cocker is a dream with no behavior issues. The key is neither dog is a danger to other people and can be cared for by others as well.

I'm not sure we would be a good match for a large breed dog. My DH is actually a little afraid of big dogs and I'm not extremely rigid in my training. I don't think all breeds are appropriate for all people. When we got our first English Cocker we spent many months visiting breeders and going to dog shows to determine what we were best suited for. I have 2 sets of friends that got a new dog. The first set can't understand why their Beagle barks so much and the second can't understand why their Sheltie runs circles around her girls in the house. Many people do not do the proper research needed prior to acquiring a dog.

 

[taximomfor4]

Three bites is too many - regardless of the situation.. If a childless home can't be found the only alternative is for the dog to be put down..

It's a sad thing - but a child being maimed or killed would be even sadder..

The Animal Rescue who has the dog now won't even put it in a childless home, because my nephew is adult-sized and not energetic like a child.

 

[taximomfor4]

I agree with the poster who said somone at some point failed this dog, it is a very sad story. I wish I could offer advice she called the rescue, did she speak with her own vet who is familar with the dog? I had a neighbor who wanted to put down their golden because they said it nipped, well the vet took it. I guess a lesson to all who read this do not buy from a pet store, proper training and eduaction when you are taking on a pet. My heart breaks for the dog. I hope your nephew is ok. I just finished reading a book "The life of a stray" an autobiography, what a tear jerker.

what stinks is that they saw this dog, that had been at the pet store for so long already. THey went home, researched the breed (they had young kids!) and 2 MONTHS later went back and the poor dog was still there, growing out of its cage. They bought him to give him a chance. They did everything they should have, to give him the best chance possible. Worked with vets, training, etc. Socialized him, on and off his own property.

He was NEVER how St Bernards are "supposed" to be. Always too exuberant, too hyper.

 

[rottiemom]

I agree that this dog has a very unfortunate mixture of bad breeding (pet shop puppy mill dog) and owners that never had the opportunity to learn how to properly socialize and train a giant breed.

As for the 24/7 "catering" of your dog, it is hard work. But it is also responsible dog ownership. With my breed, it is pretty much mandatory. but it should be a no-brainer with any any dog. Every dog owner should socialize, train, and have their dog under control 24/7. I know it can be done because we live it everyday and have for 12 years without an incident or a single nip, with a guardy dog.

That said, I cannot agree with the suggestion of using your contacts to find a suitable home for this dog. That is well and dandy for those of us that are in the dog loop and actually have contacts, but this family is not even the least bit qualified to assess and evaluate a proper home for a known aggressive dog.

If they had contacts in the first place, this dog probably wouldn't be in this situation.

Their best resources, rescue organizations that are experienced in this kind of thing, have already refused to take the dog. Without the contacts of a breeder or a rescue organization, how in the world would this family go about finding and properly evaluating a suitable home for the dog and know enough to protect themselves from lawsuits should the dog attack again?

It is an extremely sad thing, and as I said, I give aggressive dogs the benefit of the doubt, mostly believing it is the human that caused the problems, but there are some times where the most humane thing to do would be to euthanize the dog. Epecially when there are so many more dogs in rescue that are far better candidates to be rehabilitated. This might just be one of those times

This post is so well written...thank you.

OP, I am so sorry that you & your family are going through this. I am extremely glad that the children are OK and everyone is VERY LUCKY that this is the case. The dog has repeatedly bitten unprovoked. Each time the bites have escalated in severity. Sadly, I do not think that this dog can be re-homed. The next bite could end in tragedy.

I'm not sure we would be a good match for a large breed dog. My DH is actually a little afraid of big dogs and I'm not extremely rigid in my training. I don't think all breeds are appropriate for all people. When we got our first English Cocker we spent many months visiting breeders and going to dog shows to determine what we were best suited for. I have 2 sets of friends that got a new dog. The first set can't understand why their Beagle barks so much and the second can't understand why their Sheltie runs circles around her girls in the house. Many people do not do the proper research needed prior to acquiring a dog.

This cannot be emphasized enough. Every breed is different. Pet stores aren't in the business of trying to educate potential buyers about a 10-15 year commitment. They're selling an adorable, small product that comes from a puppy mill. Puppy mills have no interest in breeding for temperament or health, they have no regard for the animals themselves.

That said, my rescue girlie is obviously from a puppy mill or BYB and has turned into a lovely dog. She has been a LOT of work & continues to be and I'm always vigilant when I take her out because I don't want to set her up to fail (she's a rottie and she's adorable). But she has never bitten. She bared her teeth at my husband once, in the first week when we brought her home. She experienced a true CTJ moment and has never done it again...to any of us. She would bare them at other dogs (she was never properly socialized...another mark of the puppy mill dog because they're separated from the litter very young) and I had to make it a point to always keep meetings brief and praise her for being good & not baring her teeth. We still do this now...nearly 7 years later. But I am very aware of the fact that she is a Rottweiler, a heavily stereotyped breed. St Bernards are stereotyped too, as big, gentle, cuddly giants. It could be easier for potentially bad behaviour to go uncorrected or unnoticed since you don't expect them to act viciously (as opposed to...say...a rottweiler).

Again, OP, I am so very sorry.

 

[taximomfor4]

Like I said early on in this post. I would take him if I lived close enough to get him. There would be lots of training and postive reinforcemnet to go throught but I'm sure this dog is trainable. If I would be willing to do it I'm sure they would be others willing to work with him as well.

What if I were willing to pick him up when I visit her, and DRIVE him to you? I KNOW she'd help me with gas money. I don't even mind driving far! *Just not CRAZY FAR!)

 

[Mermaid02]

If you can find an adult only home that knows the dogs history and is willing to take the dog despite- that's great. However, that dog would not be coming back to my house and in good conscience I could NEVER give him/her to a home with children.

 

[taximomfor4]

I believe there quite a few people would be willing to take this dog. Is this dog neutered if he's not it sounds like he needs to be. You could contact The National St. Bernard Club of America I bet they would know someone who is willing to take him.

Yes, he was neutered right away when they got him (4-5 months old???)

She contacted all the St Bernard clubs & rescues she could find, in ANY state. The rescue seems to have him in a foster home right now. I know my SIL talked to her yesterday, and his foster "mom" said that he's been fine so far. But also told SIL that while he hasn't bitten, nor has he threatened to, she just can't, in good conscience, advise SIL to take him back. Originally, they were encouraging her to let them keep him for his 2 week quarantine, then have him home again.

As for nephew, the swelling in his face has really kicked in. He eats and talks with difficulty, for the next few days till the swelling begins to dissipate.

 

[pyrxtc]

We had a dog who the vet thinks had that "Rage" disease. He suddenly turned on us, tried to bite DH and snapped at the kids if they even walked near him. with 4 kids, we were not taking any chances. We had him put down. we were not waiting for him to draw blood or get worse. It killed us but it had to be done.

I think the same has to be done to the St Bernard. After the first bite/nip, the dog would ahve been gone from the house. If you need to lock a pet up so they won't attack friends and family, they should be given up or put down.