We own resale and are debating buying direct..

[LAX]

Thanks Bill, I think feeling excluded sums it up well. We bought VGC because that was our first choice, but we also would like to get some points at a WDW resort in the near future. At Aulani there was a feeling of being excluded. We are given member wrist bands because we own DVC, but then we can’t actually access some of the member benefits. Several cast members told us about the special member only photo booth, but then we didn’t know if we would actually be allowed to participate due to lack of membership cards. It’s a lot of various small things which make me wonder if I would be happier buying some points direct instead of more resale.

I am curious what DVC member benefits were you excluded from at AUL as a post-4/4/17 member.

LAX

 

[TexasChick123]

The AP discount is probably the most valuable, but it would take ~26 years to recoup the cost for a single AP purchase. I can buy one AP for myself every year for the next 26 years, receive generally better discounts (as of this writing) at restaurants and shops than the true DVC membership provides and not have to spend an additional $4K up front for the privilege. When I look at it critically, it doesn't make any sense to buy an add-on.

We bought resale in March 2016 just before the changes happened. We had no idea they were coming btw. The only member benefit I used was the 20% off merchandise for my kids souvenirs. We aren't AP holders because we live in Texas with young kids and cannot go to WDW multiple times a year. I would LOVE to visit more than once a year or every few, but we have too much going on. The point that I'm making is that you need to be sure it is worth the $$$.

Also, at $7.33pp MF's at CCV, that's a lot to commit to every year just for dues. Add the $176pp price, and it's too high for the benefits you want IMO.

 

[LAX]

We bought resale in March 2016 just before the changes happened. We had no idea they were coming btw. The only member benefit I used was the 20% off merchandise for my kids souvenirs. We aren't AP holders because we live in Texas with young kids and cannot go to WDW multiple times a year. I would LOVE to visit more than once a year or every few, but we have too much going on. The point that I'm making is that you need to be sure it is worth the $$$.

Also, at $7.33pp MF's at CCV, that's a lot to commit to every year just for dues. Add the $176pp price, and it's too high for the benefits you want IMO.

IMHO, I think it's a big financial mistake for anyone to buy any DVC resort where resale is available with the only possible exception being PVB at the moment. Like you and many others have mentioned numerous times, the extra costs for direct purchase far outweigh any benefits one might reap. Now, it's a different story if someone wants to buy direct because he/she wants to be "included as a full member of the club." However, if that's the sole purpose, what not just buy the minimum 25 points and the rest resale. 25 points direct is just as good as 1,000 points direct (at least for now until DVC decides to change the rules again).

LAX

 

[Tardisblue]

We bought resale in March 2016 just before the changes happened. We had no idea they were coming btw. The only member benefit I used was the 20% off merchandise for my kids souvenirs. We aren't AP holders because we live in Texas with young kids and cannot go to WDW multiple times a year. I would LOVE to visit more than once a year or every few, but we have too much going on. The point that I'm making is that you need to be sure it is worth the $$$.

Also, at $7.33pp MF's at CCV, that's a lot to commit to every year just for dues. Add the $176pp price, and it's too high for the benefits you want IMO.

I agree with all of your points. I purchased an AP late last year when they were offering the extra month, so 13 months instead of 12. I used it while I was down for the marathon in January and we will be going as a family in May, so it's been worth it this year. The discounts on dining and merchandise have been nice. I'm now considering getting a Tables in Wonderland card for our May trip - I think it will be worth the $150 price, need to do a little more homework.

Getting back on topic - there is no way I would ever consider buying a contract at $176/point when I just saw an OKW contract resale this morning for $76/point and a Boulder Ridge contract for $82/point.

 

[FireflyTrance]

I am curious what DVC member benefits were you excluded from at AUL as a post-4/4/17 member.

LAX

They have a Member lounge there, and I was told they were giving out 25th Anniversary pins and had a photo booth. I assumed you would need a card to get those things, but I didn't actually go over there to ask since I didn't want to be turned away. They also have a Members get together on Monday mornings and I assumed you also needed a card for that. They also give out bracelets earlier for Members at the towel station close to the beach and it states you do need to show a card for that.

I'm actually not 100% sure I couldn't get the pin and photo, but I didn't want to go to be turned away so I just didn't go at all. I actually would like to find out since I plan to visit Aulani again.

 

[mustinjourney]

I came to search this forum specifically for feedback like this. We bought resale last year and will be staying at BWV in May for our first visit as owners. The allure of being an actual "member" is hard to price. I know that we can add on a 25 point contract and get the membership extras, but I'm struggling to justify the cost ($4,000 if points are 160 direct?) plus the additional dues. I'm reminded every time the Disney Files magazine arrives and I see Ken Potrock's smug blurb about all the cool membership extras followed by an the asterisk staring back at me seemingly screaming "NOT YOU CHUMP! YOU BOUGHT RESALE AND ARE SECOND CLASS!".

So I try to put a value on the membership extras: Epcot Lounge - I'd pay maybe $25 to access that and I'd be able to use it once or twice annually, so it's value to me is less than $100; Member Cruises: no value to me at this time, I don't see us going on a cruise in the near future; Special Member Events: only have value if you live nearby or just happen to have a trip booked when one takes place so no real value for me there. Emotion of being a real member? How do you price that?

What else am I missing? I'm hard pressed to justify the additional cost to become a real member but fear that after downing a Nautilus at Trader Sam's in May that I may get sucked into buying another 25 points.

The $200 discount on APs and 20% dining (this year at least) are nice if you go more than once in a year.

 

[ELMC]

Keep in mind that all these discounts apply to new money that you are spending at Disney. That's how they get us with DVC. Sure we're getting 20% off, but we're still spending a new 80%. Maybe that's money we would have spent elsewhere if we weren't DVC owners.

But as was said above, the real situation where the math favors a direct purchase is the AP discount, where it is very easy to recoup the difference between resale and direct on a 25 point purchase for a family of 2 or more.

 

[stratus]

We bought 50 pts direct and 150 pts at resale.

Personally we have decided that we wouldn't do resale again. Everyone has a time calculus and its possible we just had a bad experience but we found the whole resale process a gigantic pain. We arent buying thousands of points and for the difference in price for the number of points we are likely to add on, I'd rather just eat the cost. I am frugal in day-to-day life but with the philosophy that money is there for me to use for things I don't want to deal with. In this case, we had to coordinate trips to lawyers with 4 people (2 owners, 2 witnesses), the time waiting, the sheer difference in paper work between resale vs not, the loan process (because lets be honest I wasn't going to wire more than what was required as I am still very skeptical of wiring money anywhere), and then we had unclear instructions for wiring money etc (which incidentally caused the money to go into limbo because the first attempt was wired it a non-existant account).... And there were other hassels trying to get a hold of the seller etc.

With Disney I called up and within I'd like to say 5 minutes I had my points. Here is my CC, and like that I had an account, my membership card was in the mail and we were off.

Some people would value the extra cash, but we have used our discount for the AP and I travel for work, so time at home is very limited and at a premium. With all these concerns we have already decided that if/when we can get a BWV contract, it will be direct.

 

[frank808]

They have a Member lounge there, and I was told they were giving out 25th Anniversary pins and had a photo booth. I assumed you would need a card to get those things, but I didn't actually go over there to ask since I didn't want to be turned away. They also have a Members get together on Monday mornings and I assumed you also needed a card for that. They also give out bracelets earlier for Members at the towel station close to the beach and it states you do need to show a card for that.

I'm actually not 100% sure I couldn't get the pin and photo, but I didn't want to go to be turned away so I just didn't go at all. I actually would like to find out since I plan to visit Aulani again.

We own both direct and resale before the restrictions so have a blue card. I have never needed to show a card to take pictures from the kiosks at aulani or vgc. Don't know if they will ask at vgc as we were there to sign paperwork for a vgc add on in july. We just used the machine when we were waiting for the paperwork. Cool thing is the pics were loaded on the memory maker as i swiped my annual pass.

They did not ask us for a membership card at aulani to use the photo machine as we have just walked in to take pics and noone asked us. Also the member mingle that we have been to in years past no one asked us for a membership card. But the last member mingle we attended monday morning was before the latest round of restrictions. To us it's the same ol same ol and not worth waking up early for the swag.

You can try to get on the vgc waitlist if they are still allowing it as we have been on there for a while now and are slowly getting points. While at vgc in july i noticed a foreclosure notice in the lobby by the elevators and read it. There was a foreclosure action in june, just weeks prior to our stay. Lo and behold we got a call a few days after arrival by our guide that some points we wanted in our use year was available. She told us they could fedex us our documents or we could do do the paperwork here in anaheim since we were onsite. Told her we didn't want to waste our time while on vacation. She promised us some swag and a bunch of anywhere fastpasses except for rsr if we came in to sign to make up for lost time. We agreed and my son and i got to ride space mountain 14 times in one night. So inquire to see if they will add you to a waitlist for vgc points. I dont know if it is possible but no harm in inquiring. Sorry for the long rant at the end. But buying 25 direct and resale will only be at $1600 difference so you have to ask yourself is $1600 worth it to have a blue card?

 

[ziravan]

Yeah it's just basically a lot of little things.

This is my biggest gripe about the April 2016 changes. The 2011 changes removed a few technical benefits from resale buyers, but they were bad uses of points anyway.

It allowed DVC to make an argument to new buyers without alienating resale buyers. I bought resale after the 2011 changes and never felt like I was a second class member.

I strongly disagree with the notion that resale buyers aren't customers. Resale buyers are committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars at Disney, over decades. And many of them, like me, end up direct buyers by adding on anyway. That might not always benefit DVC, but when a division becomes so myopic that they can't see the whole company's benefits, that's a problem for the whole company.

Ask ESPN and its devastating month over month subscription losses if a division getting too big for its britches is more important than the company as a whole.

Unlike the 2011 changes which essentially were designed to create a sales pitch, the 2016 changes were mean spirited and designed to punish resale buyers. It wasn't very magical and it certainly wasn't necessary.

Telling customers who are committed to spending tens of thousands of dollars at the parent company that they don't count because they don't directly or immediately affect the division's bottom line - that sends a very powerful message, as I'm sure it was intended to do. "You don't really count" isn't a message that Disney should allow one of its divisions to give to its customers. Again, ask ESPN about that.

 

[Paula Sedley-Burke]

We bought SSR direct then did VGF add on then 2 SSR add on direct. Direct works for us. It's a personal decision. We paid by cash. We have never regretted buying direct despite folks mocking on the disboards saying you waste your money etc. I think it's great that people buy resale it helps the DVC membership in general and like cars everybody buys in at a different point. But we like the speed, the non hassle etc. I have health issues and very disabled our life is very stressful. It just was the answer for us.

I am so tempted by Copper Creek also! It is a small resort like VGF. I think it will be hard to buy resale and get in at 7 months. I might be wrong of course. But Wilderness Lodge is delightful!

 

[ziravan]

I think they should change the color the magic bands make for resale buyers at the park gates.

That way, they can say, "Welcome Home!" to direct buyers and "You Again?" to resale buyers.

 

[disneynutz]

I think they should change the color the magic bands make for resale buyers at the park gates.

That way, they can say, "Welcome Home!" to direct buyers and "You Again?" to resale buyers.

Just wait until direct buyers get a different phone queue with no MS wait and resale buyers have to wait 40 plus minutes.

Bill

 

[crisi]

The member cruises do have some extras that a regular cruise doesn't but member cruises are more expensive so you are paying for the extras.

Bill

Quite a bit more expensive, and often scheduled for times when Disney can't sell out the ship. So you need to be able to travel when the member cruise is scheduled.

 

[TCRAIG]

From my understanding of the information I could gather on Copper Creek, the room options will be similar to Boulder Ridge and at similar (or exactly the same) points per night. So you're right, there isn't a big difference. I guess the biggest difference I can think of is that Boulder Ridge expires in 2042 and Copper Creek will likely expire in 2067, so Copper Creek can be used twice as long. So I guess I have to debate if the longer contract + perks is worth paying at least twice the resale prices.

Something else to consider - WLV/BR small contracts are not that easy to find - and not cheap - so if you want WLV - CC might be your only option

 

[ELMC]

This is my biggest gripe about the April 2016 changes. The 2011 changes removed a few technical benefits from resale buyers, but they were bad uses of points anyway.

It allowed DVC to make an argument to new buyers without alienating resale buyers. I bought resale after the 2011 changes and never felt like I was a second class member.

I strongly disagree with the notion that resale buyers aren't customers. Resale buyers are committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars at Disney, over decades. And many of them, like me, end up direct buyers by adding on anyway. That might not always benefit DVC, but when a division becomes so myopic that they can't see the whole company's benefits, that's a problem for the whole company.

Ask ESPN and its devastating month over month subscription losses if a division getting too big for its britches is more important than the company as a whole.

Unlike the 2011 changes which essentially were designed to create a sales pitch, the 2016 changes were mean spirited and designed to punish resale buyers. It wasn't very magical and it certainly wasn't necessary.

Telling customers who are committed to spending tens of thousands of dollars at the parent company that they don't count because they don't directly or immediately affect the division's bottom line - that sends a very powerful message, as I'm sure it was intended to do. "You don't really count" isn't a message that Disney should allow one of its divisions to give to its customers. Again, ask ESPN about that.

You make some excellent points. My question for you is, how to you communicate to Disney as the parent company that what one of their divisions is doing is bad for the overall company image? DVD is responsible for the profits of its division, and they're doing everything they can to squeeze every last dime out of their customers. The fact that those customers then go on to spend tens and hundreds of thousands of dollars in the parks/resorts/gift shops, etc. does not impact them at all and they certainly aren't given any credit for that (despite the fact that they are directly responsible for bringing those customers in year after year). So as long as the parent company is holding them responsible for the profits of their division, I don't see them then restricting what they can do in order to be profitable. But again you're right, it's a bad look for Disney overall.

 

[ziravan]

You make some excellent points. My question for you is, how to you communicate to Disney as the parent company that what one of their divisions is doing is bad for the overall company image? DVD is responsible for the profits of its division, and they're doing everything they can to squeeze every last dime out of their customers. The fact that those customers then go on to spend tens and hundreds of thousands of dollars in the parks/resorts/gift shops, etc. does not impact them at all and they certainly aren't given any credit for that (despite the fact that they are directly responsible for bringing those customers in year after year). So as long as the parent company is holding them responsible for the profits of their division, I don't see them then restricting what they can do in order to be profitable. But again you're right, it's a bad look for Disney overall.

http://www.laughingplace.com/w/news...s-buys-execs-name-web-domain-open-letter/amp/

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

They have a Member lounge there, and I was told they were giving out 25th Anniversary pins and had a photo booth. I assumed you would need a card to get those things, but I didn't actually go over there to ask since I didn't want to be turned away. They also have a Members get together on Monday mornings and I assumed you also needed a card for that. They also give out bracelets earlier for Members at the towel station close to the beach and it states you do need to show a card for that.

I'm actually not 100% sure I couldn't get the pin and photo, but I didn't want to go to be turned away so I just didn't go at all. I actually would like to find out since I plan to visit Aulani again.

Member lounge at Aulani? There's a lounge that can be used say for example you have a late flight out but it is not anything more than to get cleaned up and maybe print out a boarding pass before your flight. You would have been allowed to do that. It's not a Member Lounge per se. And the photo booth shouldn't have been an issue. From what I'm reading it feels like you have built up more thoughts that you are missing out on things than there actually are but of course that also is something DVC would like to build on I'm sure. The bracelets are not bracelets - no matter what they say - they are just the wrist bands that you are staying at the hotel and can use the pool. You cut them off at the end of the day just like the others. They tend to be more shiny than the hotel guests get but I think that if you showed your online card you'd get them too. If not it's really nothing - I really wouldn't care which they gave me when staying there. I've gotten nothing extra because I had the "shiny" ones.

Start pulling out your online card and see what it gets you. I think you'll find that it's more than you think and in many cases you won't need it anyway.

This is my biggest gripe about the April 2016 changes. The 2011 changes removed a few technical benefits from resale buyers, but they were bad uses of points anyway.

It allowed DVC to make an argument to new buyers without alienating resale buyers. I bought resale after the 2011 changes and never felt like I was a second class member.

I strongly disagree with the notion that resale buyers aren't customers. Resale buyers are committing to spending tens of thousands of dollars at Disney, over decades. And many of them, like me, end up direct buyers by adding on anyway. That might not always benefit DVC, but when a division becomes so myopic that they can't see the whole company's benefits, that's a problem for the whole company.

Ask ESPN and its devastating month over month subscription losses if a division getting too big for its britches is more important than the company as a whole.

Unlike the 2011 changes which essentially were designed to create a sales pitch, the 2016 changes were mean spirited and designed to punish resale buyers. It wasn't very magical and it certainly wasn't necessary.

Telling customers who are committed to spending tens of thousands of dollars at the parent company that they don't count because they don't directly or immediately affect the division's bottom line - that sends a very powerful message, as I'm sure it was intended to do. "You don't really count" isn't a message that Disney should allow one of its divisions to give to its customers. Again, ask ESPN about that.

2011 had the most spiteful restriction IMO and one I have always said was a very poor display by DVC and shouldn't be done. Restricted from the member cruise even if paying cash. That's when they displayed outright that they were just a timeshare - not a club. (which I knew, but really that was poor)

 

[ziravan]

2011 had the most spiteful restriction IMO and one I have always said was a very poor display by DVC and shouldn't be done. Restricted from the member cruise even if paying cash. That's when they displayed outright that they were just a timeshare - not a club. (which I knew, but really that was poor)

I've never been on a member cruise and that perk was never important to me so I never gave it much consideration, but you're right, of course.

 

[ELMC]

http://www.laughingplace.com/w/news...s-buys-execs-name-web-domain-open-letter/amp/

Interesting read, thanks for sharing. It's also interesting to note that the website was taken down.

Unfortunately the stance they are going to take is that this move protects their members who shelled out the big bucks to purchase direct. It's a hollow excuse, of course, because what they are really doing is lowering the cash exit value of the timeshare that they are selling to direct members. There are people who buy resale who aren't inclined to buy direct. There are people who buy direct who aren't inclined to buy resale. But both groups need each other.

You think they have it tough when someone realizes that points they just paid $160 for are only worth $120? Just wait until they further devalue resales and they find out they're only worth $70.

Unfortunately, as time goes on, there are fewer and fewer executives at Disney who truly understand the values that the company was founded upon. They're a publicly traded company with executives too young to even remember Walt. All they care about is money.