We just signed up!!! Questions on VB

[Desnik]

O.K. I must say that from some previous posts it sounds to me that I am being called a liar. I do not and will not disclose the names of my guides to prove validity to my statements. I did not post my experience to slander any DVC rep. but to only prove Richyams point that some people are being lied to or misled. I do plan on buying at BCV when they become available and have already requested not to be contacted by the previous reps. we had so when we do purchase we will be working with a different rep. We called the proper people to complain about our first rep. and believe me the things this woman was saying especially not pertaining to DVC were so outlandish! I do not care whether people agree with me or not, how can you no one else but me and my DH were there, you don't know what exactly was said or the context in which it was said. It does matter what my home resort is if I specifically state I plan on vacationing at WDW most of the time, so I was LIED to. If I bought 150pts. that's enough for us, we vacation at off peak times and only need a studio. I also made our guide aware of this. IMHO it is a lie to say if I have pts. at VB and want to book a BWV room during x-mas time that it would be "no problem". Please correct me if I am wrong, but I do think that a VB resale and a BWV resale will be very different per pt. I checked the resale board on this site and there is a VB resale for $55 per pt. and a BWV resale for $66 per pt. I think that speaks for itself. And all my quotes were actual acurate direct quotes. This rep. was at the sales office at BWV and our second was at VB but was much better than the first but was still mis leading on alot of important facts. I also don't remember saying I felt abused by my experience. I am from N.Y. and it takes alot more than a DVC rep. misleading me for me to feel abused!!! I refuse to let a bad experience rob me and my family of wonderful DVC vacations and look foward to being a member.

 

[Richyams]

You are absolutely right. Furthermoer, for anyone to say that "The eleven month window doesn't matter" is not a lie is just plain silly.

There are MANY instances where it is very important.

A big, unarguable one is the peace of mind knowing that you will have a room for your anniversery during Walt's 100th birthday celebration.

The peace of mind knowing that when your daughter gets married or you want to have a family re-union at OKW, you have the ability to get a grand villa for sure.

The ability to get studios if your points are limited for a year, the ability to reserve any room at BWV and make a request for a Boardwalk view at the eleven month window, nothing is ever a guarantee and you can get a BW view on a days notice, but you maximize your chances with that eleven month window.

To say that the eleven month window doesn't matter is a lie!!!

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?

 

[SwampFox]

Desnik- I don't think anyone was calling you a liar. I certainly wasn't. I was trying to show where your examples of "lies" could have been taken another way. I'm sorry if you felt attacked by that.

I would agree that people should purchase where they will stay the most- but the program certainly does allow for staying at the other resorts- if you consider that to be a lie- that is another issue.
Your original post stated that the guide used Christmas as an exception to the comment about "no problem"- I guess I misunderstood your original comment. That aside- reservations are available at Christmas thru the "Special Seasons Priority List"- as members may request reservations at any WDW resort during that time. The SSPL allows for these reservations to be made 14 months in advance. Perhaps your guide didn't explain that feature to you.
The "value" (what a point will get you) of a DVC point is exactly the same at each resort. Your guide surely didn't discuss buying a resale and I wouldn't expect them to do so. The purchase price of resale points is NOT the "value" of the points it is merely the "cost" of those points. I purchased a resale at OKW for $50 per point not too long ago. Apparently some would feel that the "value" of OKW is low?
I'm glad you would still consider a direct DVC purchase- even when you state you are still getting misleading information. Sorry you feel that way.

 

[SwampFox]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>To say that the eleven month window doesn't matter is a lie!!! [/quote]

THE ELEVEN MONTH WINDOW DOESN'T MATTER!!

Since I usually go during soft times (May, Sep) and am quite flexible with my dates and can't usually plan ahead more than 6 months and could care less about a GV.......
THE ELEVEN MONTH WINDOW DOESN'T MATTER to me and I have never had a problem getting the villa I want.

If you have other travel needs, then it could have other importance for you. I'm happy you have that 11 month priority, as it sounds as though it is very important for your needs. That doesn't make it a lie though!

 

[Richyams]

It does make it a lie.

To make a blanket statement, as DVC sales does, that the eleven month window doesn't amtter is a blatant lie.

How does that sales person know that the person they are pitching doesn't have interest in a Grand Villa? How does that sales person know that the prospect doesn't ever want a standard view at BWV?

How does he know that the prospect doen't ever want to travel in early December?

How does the sales person know all this?

He doesn't, and to make a statement like that to a prospective customer is a lie and fraud!!!

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?

 

[LooHoo]

Desnik,
I realize that you are a tough New Yorker but I will try to be more sensetive in responding to you so you do not take offense or get your feelings hurt. I know that what I posted no way inferred that you were lieing. I simply stated that these dues are not subjective and can be reviewed by the consumer. So, for a guide to make a statemnt like that is BIZARRE!. I really thought that there must have been miscommunication to explain this statement. You say she was saying outlandish things overall. That should defenitly put up a big red flag to you as a consumer. No one here thinks that DVC sales is a maluable benine entaty that spues gospell. However, I also do not think that they purposfully mislead or commit fraud. Once again even if you spend most of your time at WDW resorts it is still not a lie to inform you that 7 month availability is most likely going to secure you a room. The key that you are missing is flexibility with your resort choice and times. If you have these key ingredients than the 7 month window will offer you the security one is looking for. If I make my ressies at 6-7 months out on average it does not matter where I buy in at. The 11 month window has passed and I am subject to the same options as everyone else is. Why would I pay more for a resort when I would not take advantage of the 11 month window. Makes no sense. Earlier in your other post you say that the rep did not state that you would get Christmas time at 7 months but rather peak times except for Christmas. Now you say that they told you Christmas time. You see how easily mistsakes can be made when passing on information. Generally speaking most people report having very good luck with peak times at the 7 month window. I do not want to verify your story and think that you had a bad experience for whatever reason. I still think there was miscommunication that went on but I can tell you from my own experience that everything my guide said to me about 7 month widow has held true. I stay wherever I want to but I have the flexibility to do so and he knew that. Perhaps your guide thought you could be happy at any WDW resort at the 7 month mark and thats what threw things off. I think you are confusing point values at DVC with the resale market values. Vero Beach points are valued exactly the same at every DVC resort as any other home resort would be. It does not take more Vero points to stay at OKW or BWV than it takes OKW points and BWV points to stay there. The resale market is different all togeather . OKW and BWV are going for more because of several reasons 1 both are sold out. 2 people paid more for these resorts than vero owners. This has nothing to do with the value of Vero vs other resorts within the DVC system all resorts are valued the same so that statement is not a lie in any way. It sounds like you have made a decsion that is right for you and thats what counts for all of us. People here are trying to offer that same information so that mere opinions dont scare people from making a truely educated decision. Hope you have better luck next time when you purchase and wish you years of happy vacations.

KAY

 

[Desnik]

I am not dealing with the people that gave me misleading info. and will not in the future. I would consider a direct DVC purchase because no one has to sell anything to me. I know I want to buy at BCV and how many pts. it's all a matter of paper work. I have heard of alot of people having great reps. and hopfully we will too. I did feel attacked and appreciate the apology but I still don't get why you stated you are "sorry for me feeling that way". What way are you referring to? <IMG WIDTH="15" HEIGHT="15" SRC="/infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif" alt="razz">

 

[LooHoo]

I agree with SwampFox:

THE ELENTH MONTH WIDOW DOESN'T MATTER!!!!!

Maybe for others but not for me . Will never want a grand villa not now or ever no kids to marry off no worries! I think it is important that people educate their guides about their needs and not expect the guides to be mind readers. Just like when your buying a house your real estate agent doesnt ask Gee maybe your kid will want to get married someday in your back yard I think you need a bigger piece of land. Lets be reasonable at some point we have to educate ourselves and not expcet others to do it.

 

[Richyams]

So by this reasoning, if the DVC sales guide says to me, "The moon is made of blue cheese", that is not a lie since I won't be vacationg there???

I think that it is HIGHLY disengenuous for someone to say that just because some part doesn't matter to them, it can't matter to anyone, so telling things that are untrue...is OK....do I have that right?

Or did some people get duped into buying at VB with the lies and fraud and are trying to legitimize it?

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?

 

[Desnik]

LooHoo, In my previous posts my response was directed towards the post made by Swampfox and in answer to questions made by garrett79. I don't even remember what you posted. Your first sentence was really cute I almost choked lol so much. Thanks for trying to explain things to me but I'm well informed about the DVC. All I was doing was answering questions, telling my story. I never once told anyone not to buy at VB or that I was so distrought and heart broken over my experience with a misleading guide. I never said anything that was told to me was done on purpose. Obviously her statements sent up a red flag if I did not purchase through her. The point is that I stated what would work for us to this guide and was still mislead. I really don't have an opinion on Garrett79 purchase at VB and never stated anything negative about it. I'm sure they made a purchase based on what was best for them and I am happy they didn't have to deal with what I had to deal with.

 

[LooHoo]

Rich ,
Unfortunatly, you seem to be taking both sides of the fence. What Swampfox and myself are saying is that to say the 11 month window matters for everyone is untrue . Like you have stated several times. You seem to be making blanket statements that are scareing people. When others try to share their own perspective and experiences you just dismiss them. We are the ones telling people to make a decision based on there own circumstances and not take evry word off this board as total all knowing truth. Your remark about trying to legitimize being duped I think speaks for itself. Obviously, your mind may work this way but mine does not. I would never intentionally mislead someone for my own gain, and what gain would that be? Now not only DVC misleads people but posters do as well . When will this giant conspiracy at Vero Beach end. Once again you dismiss experiences that I have shared to try to show that 11 months is the only way to get into WDW properties. Not the case over and over again not the case. I will not reiterate what has been intellegntly stated by others. Sufices to say that your main reason seems to be rather self serving so you can secure reservations at your home resort at later dates. Sorry, but that is not how the program works, not for you and not for me.

 

[Richyams]

I understand completely that what may work for some won't work for others.

My continued abjections are to stating that DVC sales is not lying when they say "The eleven month window doesn't matter" to a new prospect.

I mantain and will continue to mantain that saying that the eleven month window is meaningless is a lie when told to a prospect unless it is VERY SERIOUSLY qualified, which it isn't, therefore it is a lie!!!

So, DVC sales staff are lying to new prospects.

Is a true statement!

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?

 

[LooHoo]

Rich,
We have come to some meeting point here I can just feel it my bones. We all agree than that 11 months is important for some but not for others. Hence, Vero is a good option for some people. Saying this to someone in my position would not be a lie but saying it to someone who only wants to stay at WDW resort at a particular time of year or other circumstances would most defenitly be an untruth! If DVC tells someone somthing that seems to be untrue than I think we all would chime in and help that person if we could. It seems that you have helped people make a better descion for their own needs. I also think by your strong unyeilding statements about Vero that you may have steered some people away from making a toally objective decsion for their needs. I have enjoyed many of your posts and will gladly agree to disagree on some points that have been mentioned. Lets just try to help educate with our own experiences rather than our own feelings. I do not want to negate the importance of the 11 month widow for some but remember this window does not apply to everyone and lets not speak as if it does. I would be pretty upset if I was told the opposite and boght at BWV instead of the deal I got at Vero. The 11 month window schpelle can work both ways when considering a purchase.

 

[PamOKW]

It seems as if there are more resales appearing on the Timeshare Store site including a pretty even divide among resorts for sale. It seems as if BWV may be moving into the "real" world where people are selling due to life changes (divorce, death, etc.) or because they realize it's not for them. I wonder if this will bring the prices back down from the upward spiral that took place last month?

 

[garrett79]

I will try to repeat this one last time. We were not duped, pressured, tricked or fraudulently schemed into VB. Again, if there is a problem with DVC sales go to them rather than try to scare people away on this board. We are all educated adults who bought where we bought for a reason specific to each and every one of us. I bought VB because I liked the plan and am very flexible on when I go to the WDW resort. I am not trying to legitimize anything. I would be curious why someone chooses to carry out a vendetta against buying at VB and posting a negative OPINION every time someone shows an interest.

 

[Richyams]

I must assume that you aren't refering to me...I think VB is a beautiful resort and a very wise decision for someone that plans to visit there often, this was my first post:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Vero is a great place, really one of the most beautiful resorts with good size rooms in the world.

I hope that you are planning to stay there most of the time. We have had many reports recently of DVC sales staff telling people that if they want most of their vacations at WDW DVC resorts, they can save money and buy at Vero. It is not a good idea to follow that advice.

For being in a quiet place, secluded and with great beach all around, there aren't many places that can compre to Vero. The saving staying there on points as opposed to spending manoey to stay anywhere even close to comparable, is truly staggering. They have great activities for the kids and the place even feels like Disney.

[/quote]

I did caution you because there have been several paople new to DVC that had been deceived by DVC sales people. As long as you are going in with your eyes open, great, more power to you. If my cautions can save one person from a mistake they will regret for the next forty years, I feel great.

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", Karl Marx, pretty sick, huh?

 

[LooHoo]

PamOKw,
This is a good question. My feeling is that the resale market will even out in a short while. Whenever something is going to sell out and people perceive they cant get something it always makes it more attractive. I think we saw a great deal of impulse buying caused by the psychological effect of a sell out. Time will tell though. The feeding frenzy that went on was very interesting to watch and we saw it carry over into the resale market.
P.S. I always enjoy your posts- well thought out and interesting topics.

KAY

KAY

 

[LooHoo]

Garrett,
Nice to hear from you again. I thought you might have gotten lost in the waves at Vero! Glad you feel good about your purchase. You should and you will enjoy it for years to come. I am glad that you werent scared off. Just as it is important to share information to save people from making a mistake by buying at vero, so is it just as important to share information for those people who would be better off buying at Vero. There are many of us as well!

KAY

 

[Dean]

As with any timeshare, it usually takes a few years for resales to start showing up and a few more years for them to be readily available and the price to stabalize. You will likely see OKW continue to be the most easily available resort for resales because it's older and there were more points sold, almost as many as the rest of the resorts combined. The fact it's on WDW property will keep it popular and the prices higher. As HH and VB sell out and enough people have grown tired of the visits as well as having life changes for many, the number of resales will increase somewhat and prices are likely to dip modestly. Just remember that only about 4% of timeshares offered for sale are ever sold so Marriott and DVC are on the high end of resales both in price and ease of selling.

As a side note and to keep in Rich's theme, I can see a group of DVC buyers that want to stay at DVC but won't or can't buy more than the minimum. I could see these new owners with 150-170 points buying at WLV and then staying at OKW most visits. Their points would go much further. I know there are those that have used this strategy for BWV and suspect it will be more prevelent at WLV. Since that frees up availability at WLV, I suppose it's alright by me.

And since we're talking of Rich, he loves to play the devil's advocate. While his way of emphasizing the DVC sales problems may be a little forceful, his points are well taken.

Dean

 

[kem330]

It looks like Disney is no different than any place else in the real world. There are good sales people and there are the BAD ones who will do anything to make a sale. I personally believe that life will catch up to the bad ones. It would be nice if all DVC guides were perfect, unfortunatley with the low unemployment rate, that aint gonna happen. So like ANY sales transaction, BUYER BEWARE! If you are going to spend $11- 20,000.00 don't you check it out first?
Obviously Garrett did and should be commended on making an informed decision. I don't think it's fair to lump all DVC guides into the same class.
Thank god ours was good or I don't think we would have been interested in DVC at all! I felt she deserved half the commision on our resale because we would have never bought in if it hadn't have been for her. I think it would be more appropriate to give opinions and refrain from calling DVC and its reps liars, when perhaps only a small percentage are misrepresenting the program.
P.S. I agree with Mary Ann and Dean- Rich's comments have been very helpful and if you read enough of the boards , you understand where he's coming from. I just think for the new lookers, they might get too biased an impression from his remarks. But I do so love a devils advocate!


[This message was edited by kem330 on 02-12-01 at 11:53 PM.]