VWL Expansion pics, Castle View?

[Granny]

Bill they better not price us original owners out. Not looking to add additional points but I'm afraid of different booking categories which means they can up those nightly point requirements.

If I'm reading this correctly, you are concerned that the new expansion might impact current VWL owners? As I understand it, the expansion of the bungalows and WL room conversions will be part of a new DVC resort with separate contract end date. VWL II, so to speak. If so, the expansion won't affect current VWL point schedules.

 

[wdrl]

Bill they better not price us original owners out. Not looking to add additional points but I'm afraid of different booking categories which means they can up those nightly point requirements.

Every indication from DVD is that the new cabins and villas will be a separate condominium association from the current VWL condo association. As such, the two associations will function independently as two separate DVC resorts. Each will have its own point chart and home resort booking period. In other words, VWL will continue to offer the exact same accommodations and point costs as it does now once the new Wilderness Villas & Cabins begins operations.

 

[disneynutz]

Every indication from DVD is that the new cabins and villas will be a separate condominium association from the current VWL condo association. As such, the two associations will function independently as two separate DVC resorts. Each will have its own point chart and home resort booking period. In other words, VWL will continue to offer the exact same accommodations and point costs as it does now once the new Wilderness Villas & Cabins begins operations.

What do you think they will offer over the existing VWL to attract new buyers besides the cabins?

Bill

 

[wdrl]

What do you think they will offer over the existing VWL to attract new buyers besides the cabins?

Bill

By the time the new WL Villas & Cabins condo association opens in 2017 or 2018, the Wilderness Resort will have a new lake front restaurant, a renovated quiet pool, plus a bar/grill located by the quiet pool. Also, we know there will be lakefront cabins coming with the new WLV&C, and quite possibly villas that will be located in the main Wilderness Lodge. There will probably be other amenities that we don't know about yet, such as new gas grills.

 

[jade1]

and quite possibly villas that will be located in the main Wilderness Lodge.

That would be very nice actually.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

If I'm reading this correctly, you are concerned that the new expansion might impact current VWL owners? As I understand it, the expansion of the bungalows and WL room conversions will be part of a new DVC resort with separate contract end date. VWL II, so to speak. If so, the expansion won't affect current VWL point schedules.[/QUOT

Every indication from DVD is that the new cabins and villas will be a separate condominium association from the current VWL condo association. As such, the two associations will function independently as two separate DVC resorts. Each will have its own point chart and home resort booking period. In other words, VWL will continue to offer the exact same accommodations and point costs as it does now once the new Wilderness Villas & Cabins begins operations.

I would love to believe this. However I don't think current owners will be unscathed with the addition of VWLII. Certainly views will be created at VWLI now that the trees are cut down. It's very likely DVC will have different view categories at the original DVC building and thus you have a point reallocation increasing those nightly points in about 66% of the rooms.[/QUOTE]

 

[Granny]

I would love to believe this. However I don't think current owners will be unscathed with the addition of VWLII. Certainly views will be created at VWLI now that the trees are cut down. It's very likely DVC will have different view categories at the original DVC building and thus you have a point reallocation increasing those nightly points in about 66% of the rooms.

To do that, they would have to decrease the nightly points in the other 1/3 of the rooms...decreasing twice as much as the other rooms go up to keep the math simple. I kind of hope they do end up with Lake View and Standard View categories...with the Standard View becoming a great bargain at a lower point per night than the current requirements. We'll just have to see.

As for the current owners being unscathed, well there's always the division of "common costs" among Wilderness Lodge Resort, VWL and VWL II. How those are figured out is anyone's guess, but that's where current owners could take a hit if anywhere.

 

[Granny]

What do you think they will offer over the existing VWL to attract new buyers besides the cabins?

Bill

I think they will offer a 50 year contract vs a 25 year contract. That alone will provide a pretty strong differentiation for the sales people. For the uneducated buyer, they could just say that VWL II is worth twice as much per point as VWL I since it lasts twice as long. For the general DVC sales pitch, this should more than suffice for many prospective buyers. Especially if they're relatively young.

Also, we know there will be lakefront cabins coming with the new WLV&C, and quite possibly villas that will be located in the main Wilderness Lodge.

I think the conversion of the south wing of Wilderness Lodge is a done deal. I'm pretty sure Disney has already announced that some of the resort rooms will be converted to DVC.

 

[wdrl]

I think they will offer a 50 year contract vs a 25 year contract. That alone will provide a pretty strong differentiation for the sales people. For the uneducated buyer, they could just say that VWL II is worth twice as much per point as VWL I since it lasts twice as long. For the general DVC sales pitch, this should more than suffice for many prospective buyers. Especially if they're relatively young.

I just looked at the VWL resale listings on the Timeshare Store's website. Of the 17 deeds listed, 10 have asking prices of $95 a point or more, and the cheapest deed (at $89/point) is stripped with no points coming until June 2017. Given that VWL has less than 26 years left before it expires, those resale prices won't seem that attractive if DVD's direct price for VWL2 is in the $170 range for a 50-year deed. Even "educated" buyers may be hard pressed not to choose VWL2 over the current VWL.

I think the conversion of the south wing of Wilderness Lodge is a done deal. I'm pretty sure Disney has already announced that some of the resort rooms will be converted to DVC.

Disney has filed paperwork to remodel some rooms at WL, but has DVD officially announced it is converting any of the existing WL hotel rooms to DVC villas? Many, including myself, think some hotel-to DVC Villa conversion will have to occur. I can't see DVD establishing a new DVC condo association that has only the lakeside cabins; it will need to offer at least some studios, such as what has happened at PVB. But so far, I haven't seen anything official from Disney about a conversion.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Disney has filed paperwork to remodel some rooms at WL, but has DVD officially announced it is converting any of the existing WL hotel rooms to DVC villas? Many, including myself, think some hotel-to DVC Villa conversion will have to occur. I can't see DVD establishing a new DVC condo association that has only the lakeside cabins; it will need to offer at least some studios, such as what has happened at PVB. But so far, I haven't seen anything official from Disney about a conversion.

It's about the same as the building that no one seemed to know about at BLT. I've read more than one report that CM's at WL are saying they are being converted to DVC.

 

[Granny]

I just looked at the VWL resale listings on the Timeshare Store's website. Of the 17 deeds listed, 10 have asking prices of $95 a point or more, and the cheapest deed (at $89/point) is stripped with no points coming until June 2017. Given that VWL has less than 26 years left before it expires, those resale prices won't seem that attractive if DVD's direct price for VWL2 is in the $170 range for a 50-year deed. Even "educated" buyers may be hard pressed not to choose VWL2 over the current VWL.

If someone is age 50 or over, current VWL with 25 more years may be a good fit at a huge price discount. But I agree that eventually all the 2042 DVC resorts will have minimal value.

Disney has filed paperwork to remodel some rooms at WL, but has DVD officially announced it is converting any of the existing WL hotel rooms to DVC villas? Many, including myself, think some hotel-to DVC Villa conversion will have to occur. I can't see DVD establishing a new DVC condo association that has only the lakeside cabins; it will need to offer at least some studios, such as what has happened at PVB. But so far, I haven't seen anything official from Disney about a conversion.

I agree with KAT4DISNEY since they have closed the South wing of WL. Not something they would need to do for a room updating (which they did not all that long ago at WL). I don't know why Disney won't tell people something that is obvious. And yes, Kathy, it does remind me of BLT going up and the DVC reps saying "new building? what new building?".

 

[disneynutz]

I think that VWL II will offer something different than VWL I. Maybe larger rooms or a CL.

Bill

 

[BWV Dreamin]

If new direct pricing for VWL2 is $170/plus per point, surely there will be a market for VWL1 points even at today's resale prices. Even if resales prices drop back into the 80's that is still way above the original $60/pp that VWL was sold at when it opened.

 

[wdrl]

I agree with KAT4DISNEY since they have closed the South wing of WL. Not something they would need to do for a room updating (which they did not all that long ago at WL). I don't know why Disney won't tell people something that is obvious. And yes, Kathy, it does remind me of BLT going up and the DVC reps saying "new building? what new building?".

I agree that something is going on at WL with room renovations. The only point I was trying to make was that, to my knowledge, Disney has not officially announced a hotel room-to-DVC villa conversion.

I imagine that Florida's timeshare laws limit what developers can and cannot say about projects before they have been licensed by the Florida Department of Business & Professional Regulation. At the 2015 Annual Meeting, Ken Potrock briefly mentioned the cabins being built at Wilderness Lodge and that it would be part of a "new" DVC property. But then he went on to say that he could not divulge any more information about the project at that time.

ETA: Left out the key word "not" from my last sentence.

 

[Granny]

wdrl...I think you've hit the nail on the head. It just seems weird that they can confirm the cabins but nothing else? Seems like the timeshare laws would be an all or nothing kind of thing. And you're right, we haven't seen an official announcement from Disney. It will be interesting if they add a club level option as they did at AKV. My guess is that is totally dependent on the occupancy rates of the current club level rooms.

 

[disneynutz]

If I remember correctly the law has something to do with percentage of new filed project completed. That's why converting existing rooms is great for business, the project is completed sooner and they can start marketing and selling sooner.

Bill

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

wdrl...I think you've hit the nail on the head. It just seems weird that they can confirm the cabins but nothing else? Seems like the timeshare laws would be an all or nothing kind of thing. And you're right, we haven't seen an official announcement from Disney. It will be interesting if they add a club level option as they did at AKV. My guess is that is totally dependent on the occupancy rates of the current club level rooms.

I was thinking the same thing Granny. Confirming cabins seems to be talking about the project so it doesn't seem to be that or else they already violated the requirements. But, by not saying anything, it does allow them to make changes if they decide things are not looking good and to not have to go thru the problems they did in earlier years with announcing projects and then not following thru.

On the resorts board I believe someone might have been told that there won't be any concierge but I personally think we just need to wait for DVC to tell us about that. They are apparently changing the concierge lounge at WL so it could be speculated as happening either because they are reducing the size or else to provide a little different experience because there will be DVC added to the mix. And yep - it's just my speculation.

 

[mlayton14]

Since these will be separate associations, does that mean current VWL
owners won't have a home resort booking privileges for the new rooms and vice versa? TIA

 

[beer dave]

I think that VWL II will offer something different than VWL I. Maybe larger rooms or a CL.

Bill

Club level--- my thoughts exactly.... ala akv....

 

[beer dave]

Since these will be separate associations, does that mean current VWL
owners won't have a home resort booking privileges for the new rooms and vice versa? TIA

Correct.