Universal In, Disney Out.

[morethananyonex]

The other thing is -- and this is subjective, I know, but it feels a lot more transient, a lot more "right now" to me. The reason the Little Mermaid took 30 years to get built -- at least in my opinion -- is that Disney wanted to see if it had legs enough to be considered a classic years later. (Iknow they've been wrong a few times, too. Like the treehouse or the now departed 20,000 Leagues). And Disney doesn't put all it's eggs into a single basket -- there's no World of Toy Story over there. Harry Potter were pretty good movies and pretty good books, but will they resonate in 10 years like they do now? Maybe. I don't think it's a given. Same thing with things like Jurassic Park or the Simpsons or Transformers. They were hit movies or franchises, but those things all fade. I mean, would a Rambo ride catch any attention these days? Disney will spend the marketing money to keep their characters relevant -- I don't know whether US will do the same. About 10 yeas ago, the Six Flags franchise did a few things like that -- Looney Tunes themes everywhere. Those things don't register with kids anymore, but parents will always show their kids Snow White or Cinderella.

You are aware of Avatar, correct?

What you said doesn't make much sense when you consider that yes, Disney is putting all it's eggs in one basket. World of Toy Story? Nope. Just Pandora, which is one of the newest franchises out of all being discussed and has only had one of its movies being released to boot. Also, it may have brought in the money but doesn't have a rabid following like HP or Star Wars. If any of them haven't proven staying power yet, it's Avatar.

Now, Pandora may very well be excellent and well done, regardless of whether someone has seen the movie. I'm just saying that Disney is doing exactly what you're talking about the other parks doing, except their franchise is much less proven at this point. No doubt in my mind HP would outlast Avatar if you're just comparing franchise to franchise. I could understand when HP first opened that Disney fans may have been skeptical and glad Disney didn't do a movie themed land, but it doesn't make much sense now, as they are doing the exact same thing.

 

[EMode]

After years of WDW vacations we have finally decided to skip it and focus on Universal trips from now on. We haven't even been there (going later this summer ) but many of the points brought up in this thread are exactly why WDW is now "out" for us. I wish it wasn't the case because I do love Disney, but OTOH I can picture my kids years from now bringing their own kids to Universal because it will mean to them what WDW has meant to me through the years.

 

[glocon]

Growing up we didn't take family vacations because my parents couldn't afford it. Our first visit to WDW was when our son was 5 and it was more magical than we ever expected. We all saw WDW for the first time together, and that will always make it near and dear to my heart. I haunt these boards for that nostalgic feeling.

But we love UO also, it also holds a nostalgia because our second trip to WDW included UO. And now my son who is 17 will pick UO over WDW every time. Me- I want both!

The UO franchise is almost microscopic compared to the Disney franchise- but it sure does give at least WDW a run for the money!

 

[texhanddoc]

LOL. A 7 page discussion about UO v Disney on a Disney site.

OP: If you had just wanted to get an answer to your question, you could have just asked in the UO forum about other, more active UO forums without the "why I am breaking up with Disney" section of your original post.

I think most of us can agree that UO and Disney offer slightly different products although they are both theme parks. Some people will love UO so much that they wont return to Disney and there are die hard Disney fans that wont go to UO. Personally, I think UO has Disney beat in the "thrill ride" category, even though Disney has a couple decent thrill rides. We now incorporate both into our Orlando vacations. My kids love both.

If someone wants to go to UO exclusively, great! One less person to fight in lines. However, UO doesn't attract the same amount of rabid fans as does Disney, so I think you will be hard pressed to find forums this active about UO.

 

[lugnut33]

That about covers is.

Queue enhancements do absolutely nothing for me. I be most people have their heads buried in their phones these days anyway. I really have no interest in a few preschool-like interactive elements.

Guess I'm a pre-schooler because I cannot walk past the queue elements at HM, SM, BTMRR, and Pooh without playing and messing around. I actually have let people go by me so I can keep messing around.

 

[Brad Bishop]

Now, Pandora may very well be excellent and well done, regardless of whether someone has seen the movie. I'm just saying that Disney is doing exactly what you're talking about the other parks doing, except their franchise is much less proven at this point. No doubt in my mind HP would outlast Avatar if you're just comparing franchise to franchise. I could understand when HP first opened that Disney fans may have been skeptical and glad Disney didn't do a movie themed land, but it doesn't make much sense now, as they are doing the exact same thing.

I think you're dead on there. HP can easily outlast Avatar. People will go back and watch Harry Potter or give the books as kind of standard staples for their kids to read.

Avatar's big selling point was really well-done 3D. Watch it in 2D and there's not much there. The characters aren't memorable. The story is pretty canned (evil corporation wants to rape planets because of greed - that's the story). There are no memorable songs. No memorable music (Everyone recognizes the theme for Star Wars - you can play the first 2 secs of that and people immediately know what it is). Their betting it all on: some colorful (over saturated) plants and animals and floating islands.

I really think someone up the Disney chain just thought, "Avatar is a GREAT idea! We're going through with it no matter what!"

I think there's another problem with it - it's sort of being built in a "dead spot" in AK. All parks have odd dead spots but Camp Minnie Mickey was one. If you weren't seeking out Festival of the Lion King you were not likely to wander into Camp Minnie Mickey. I think people will initially seek out Avatarland/Pandora but after that initial curiosity (advertisements) wears off, I could easily see them walking right by it without much of a thought.

I know, you're thinking, "but it's a major attraction!" Yeah, that's true, I just remember things like when Busch Garden Williamsburg put the Drachen Fire (roller coaster) in. I knew the park pretty well and had a hard time finding it. It was just oddly off in it's own little corner. It had it's own problems but it was off the beaten path that I think it missed out on a lot of foot traffic.

The "Life" building at Epcot has a similar problem. You just don't happen upon it unless you're seeking it out. Sure, you can put Body Wars in there and advertise for it but once that advertising is done, it goes off the radar for folks.

I could be wrong about Avatar, it just seems like:
- a poor movie choice to make a ride after, much less a whole themed area
- it'd be a better fit in Hollywood Studios, if anywhere (actually be a better fit at Universal)
- a different continent / area of the world would have been a better fit or the original idea of mythical creatures for Animal Kingdom. I think you still have the foot traffic/pattern problems but at least it'd more logically fit.

 

[lugnut33]

For those claiming that US has a grip on future nostalgia because it has Harry Potter, what else does it have beyond that?

I look at Disney and the intellectual properties it has the ability to pull from and the line-up is stellar. Look at the phenomenon that is Frozen. Let's not forget Tangled, which was huge. Then Disney also has all the Pixar movies past and future. If you think about it, Pixar really is the soundtrack of most kids childhoods. John Lassiter is truly a modern day Walt Disney in terms of storytelling and creativity.

I'm not trying to defend Disney, I stated what I think pages ago.

 

[tony609]

I am in the minority again. I have absolutely no desire to go to Universal/IoA. Those rides do not appeal to me. Harry potter doesn't do anything for me. I saw the first 3 movies and gave up. I didn't care that much anymore. I have no desire to spend the extra money on top of what I am ready spending at Disney to go to those parks. I agree the new Fantasyland isn't anything amazing. But it's nice. I also have no desire/ connection to Avatar being built at AK. I have never even seen that movie.

BUT I still love what Disney offers me. I enjoy many of my favorite rides again and again. I enjoy the characters/dining etc.. I also love the magicbands. Wearing them for me is not an issue. I don't think everything Disney does is golden but I still love it.

 

[clsteve]

And Disney doesn't put all it's eggs into a single basket -- there's no World of Toy Story over there. Harry Potter were pretty good movies and pretty good books, but will they resonate in 10 years like they do now? Maybe. I don't think it's a given. Same thing with things like Jurassic Park or the Simpsons or Transformers. They were hit movies or franchises, but those things all fade. I mean, would a Rambo ride catch any attention these days? Disney will spend the marketing money to keep their characters relevant -- I don't know whether US will do the same. About 10 yeas ago, the Six Flags franchise did a few things like that -- Looney Tunes themes everywhere. Those things don't register with kids anymore, but parents will always show their kids Snow White or Cinderella.

But you can't hug Rapunzel anywhere else. That's what WDW offers -- something that feels like a lasting connection.

No worries about Harry's staying power. I was astounded by how many large groups of 20-to-50+ year-olds were throughout both USF Parks sporting full Hogwarts regalia: robes, scarves, wire-rimmed glasses, wands, the whole works. As others have said, it truly is a multi-generational and international phenomenon. My kid's grandkids will be reading those books and watching the movies. Both our boys have read all of the books (multiple times) and it is the only series of books all of their friends (boy and girl) have read at least some of.

I do think Disney is risking putting all of their eggs in one basket -- the "Princess basket", and it's easy to understand why. Merchandise.

Disney has ignored the young-to-teenaged boy for a long time. Our sons now have a much more nostalgic link to Universal due to how many of their themes resonate with their interests- books, TV shows, and movies. This has nothing to do with ride thrill factor, since my oldest is very much not a thrill seeker. Long term, that would concern me if I was a Disney Exec. Well, if they were thinking that long term. Disney wasn't that way when I was a boy.

DW very much feels the same way, and it was a huge surprise to her after our USF trip. So much more there was new, fresh and relevant. None of the recent Disney movies our family enjoyed are represented unless it ties back to a Princess. And nothing on the horizon.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

I am in the minority again. I have absolutely no desire to go to Universal/IoA. .

I don't think that's a minority opinion at all. When I'm in Orlando, I'm not wasting time at Universal when I could be on Disney property.

 

[Tramp68]

1. This has been one of the most civil and productive discussions on this topic in a long time. The bickering and trolling did not happen until the person came on and incited people by calling the OP a troll.

2. The moderators here are inconsistent at best. They are biased in their doling out of infractions and do not even understand their own rules. Many posts go for weeks of endless ranting insulting and arguing and then they pop in and hand out an infractions to the people whose opinions do not reflect their own

3. I am very confused by anyone who claims US is not themed well When I go into any of the lands in IoA I feel completely immersed in the world. US is the same way but from a movie studio standpoint. I think Disney nails this with WS and AK but MK and HS are random at best in overall area theming. I still enjoy them both for their own reasons.

 

[bshawcrew]

This entire discussion has me planning a US trip. We are Disney vets and just got back last week. It's definitely losing the magic that we noticed 16 years ago. But mainly, for us, it's just too dang much work to go to Disney now. Plan where you wanna eat 6 months in advance. Plan what you want to ride 60 days in advance. Don't hit the snooze button and miss rope drop. I don't want to think that much and plan that hard for vacation. I don't think US is better.. Just different. Like comparing apples and oranges. But I'm definitely ready to add a variety of fruit at this point.

 

[MightyGitis]

Honestly Harry Potter has us coming to Universal more but I still think the quality is at WDW. We tend to skip most things at Universal OTHER than Harry Potter and only a lot one day for it. Their customer service is crappy. We get tired of being forced to shove things into lockers. Theming is lacking outside of HP areas too. Their hotels are not good. Including the high end ones.

They get us for the potter and then we are OUT.

 

[metzgardesign]

1. This has been one of the most civil and productive discussions on this topic in a long time. The bickering and trolling did not happen until the person came on and incited people by calling the OP a troll.

That was my thought, as well.

This entire discussion has me planning a US trip. We are Disney vets and just got back last week. It's definitely losing the magic that we noticed 16 years ago. But mainly, for us, it's just too dang much work to go to Disney now. Plan where you wanna eat 6 months in advance. Plan what you want to ride 60 days in advance. Don't hit the snooze button and miss rope drop. I don't want to think that much and plan that hard for vacation. I don't think US is better.. Just different. Like comparing apples and oranges. But I'm definitely ready to add a variety of fruit at this point.

And this is sort of where we are, in our family. We generally travel with another family, who does like some of the rides we do, and some we don't (and their son likes some that we do, but his parent don't.....you get the picture).

And I was sitting there think about the nightmare it would be to try and coordinate all those attractions beforehand (as planning ADR's with them has always been my thing, and that I did not really mind). We would usually get FP's as we wanted to ride things (if we even needed them). In other words.....not a structured park touring style, at all.

I just don't really see how the FP+ planning needs will work well with that at all. And that has pretty much solidified our decision to not return (we may go for a hard-ticket event such as a Halloween party at MK.....maybe).

 

[NYDisGuy]

Honestly Harry Potter has us coming to Universal more but I still think the quality is at WDW. We tend to skip most things at Universal OTHER than Harry Potter and only a lot one day for it. Their customer service is crappy. We get tired of being forced to shove things into lockers. Theming is lacking outside of HP areas too. Their hotels are not good. Including the high end ones.

They get us for the potter and then we are OUT.

We are the exact same way. I'm not a thrill ride person so nothing in that park catches my attention besides Harry Potter (And i'm not really a Harry Potter fan). I understand everyone's love for HP in here but to dismiss Avatar after one movie is ridiculous after they grossed well over a billion dollars. Not to mention, 2 3 and 4 will be launching year after year and the park will open right in the middle of the 2nd sequel.

The concept art looks amazing too. People want to be immersed yet don't see the potential in a re-created PLANET to walk around on. I don't get it.

 

[ArwenMarie]

This entire discussion has me planning a US trip. We are Disney vets and just got back last week. It's definitely losing the magic that we noticed 16 years ago. But mainly, for us, it's just too dang much work to go to Disney now. Plan where you wanna eat 6 months in advance. Plan what you want to ride 60 days in advance. Don't hit the snooze button and miss rope drop. I don't want to think that much and plan that hard for vacation. I don't think US is better.. Just different. Like comparing apples and oranges. But I'm definitely ready to add a variety of fruit at this point.

Not having to book so much in advance is so nice. Lets the vacation feel like a vacation

 

[W.E.D.]

In the two solo trips I've taken to Disney, I've NEVER felt like I was treated "less than" because I didn't have kids with me. And that includes character meets.

I agree. There are some issues at WDW, but this is certainly one we've never encountered. I don't personally do the M&Gs, but DW loves them and the characters always seem to give her plenty of time.

 

[FLchick415]

My biggest "gripe" with UOR (and really, it's probably my only one) is that so few of their rides accommodate people that are Pooh-sized. I know there's at least one seat on the Hulk, but I can't think of any others off-hand. (Admittedly, it's been a couple years since I've been back, so maybe this has changed)

 

[MightyGitis]

My biggest "gripe" with UOR (and really, it's probably my only one) is that so few of their rides accommodate people that are Pooh-sized. I know there's at least one seat on the Hulk, but I can't think of any others off-hand. (Admittedly, it's been a couple years since I've been back, so maybe this has changed)

Oh I forgot this. I forgot the mortifying time I didn't fit in the HP ride. I've slimmed down since then so last time I had no problem but it was handled embarassingly.

 

[agavegirl1]

Not having to book so much in advance is so nice. Lets the vacation feel like a vacation

Interestingly, this is exactly one of the reasons the OP cannot find a really active US/IOA message board...very little planning is required for a Universal Vacation. After your initial questions are answered, usually found in a "sticky" there isn't much to do besides book and go.