To the DISer whose husband was looking for a teaching job

[paysensmom]

I never said that I don't get lunch. As for benefits. I chose not to take any. My husband is in the military so I chose to keep my money. Yes, I would have had money taken out of my check to get the medical, dental and life insurance benefits. Another benefit, I get 5 personal days per year that can roll over IF I stay in the same district. If I go to another district I lose them. I will lose all 5 of mine this year because I will be moving next year and I do not plan to take any personal days because my kids at school need me to be there every day.
Your disctrict does not define what happens in any other district! I am not and have not compared my job to any other. Why are you? If you think teachers have it so great; go to school for education and start teaching.

 

[Hannathy]

I never said that I don't get lunch. As for benefits. I chose not to take any. My husband is in the military so I chose to keep my money. Yes, I would have had money taken out of my check to get the medical, dental and life insurance benefits. Another benefit, I get 5 personal days per year that can roll over IF I stay in the same district. If I go to another district I lose them. I will lose all 5 of mine this year because I will be moving next year and I do not plan to take any personal days because my kids at school need me to be there every day.
Your disctrict does not define what happens in any other district! I am not and have not compared my job to any other. Why are you? If you think teachers have it so great; go to school for education and start teaching.

No need to go to school I was a teacher. There are no jobs around here because no one every quits!! why would they? You have to be willing to sub about 3-5 yrs to even have a shot at an opening.

I have worked as a teacher and as an RN and believe me teachers have it much easier than nurses and a heck of a lot better hours.

 

[DVCBELLE]

No need to go to school I was a teacher. There are no jobs around here because no one every quits!! why would they? You have to be willing to sub about 3-5 yrs to even have a shot at an opening.

I have worked as a teacher and as an RN and believe me teachers have it much easier than nurses and a heck of a lot better hours.

Did anyone knock nurses? Why drag that comparison in? Besides all the nurses I know - make an INSANE amount of money. I agree that nurses work their butts off in high stress jobs and I appreciate nurses as much as I appreciate my teachers. I odn't see any point in knocking teachers. They work hard - well at least the good ones do. And most teachers don't make $70,000. The median teacher salary is 52,000.

It is also interesting that not one teacher on here complained about how much of their OWN money they spend on classroom supplies.

 

[pearlieq]

I have to agree that around here I really have trouble getting my violin out for most teachers. I don't think their job is any more taxing or difficult than any other professional job.

My friend is a suburban teacher. She's 3 years out of school and makes $45,000. Her contract is for 182 days/year. She gets to school at 7:30 and leaves at around 3:30 3 days a week, and stays until about 5:00pm two other days per week. She does about 10 hours of grading a week, plus a few hours of prep. So she works about 55 hours/week, give or take a few, during the school year.

I had a professional job. At 3 years out of school, I was making about $33,390. I worked 229 days a year (I got 2 weeks vacation, 2 weeks of sick time, 2 personal days, and 11 company holidays). Between office work, business travel, and night/weekend checking in, I averaged about 48 hours per week, year round.

When you adjust her salary against the actual days a typical worker like me does in a year, she makes the equivalent of $55,621. Not too shabby for a B.A. and 3 years of experience. Teachers nearing retirement regularly top $100k.

If we're talking about some inner city or rural teacher squeaking by on $18,000 and no textbooks, fine. They have my full admiration and support. But around these parts I can't tolerate any bellyaching about the "plight" of teachers.

 

[wdw_girl_18]

Ok, I have to disagree here. Maybe I'm just not understanding the full story but as a teacher why should we give up any of our lunch breaks. That is our time to relax for 40 minutes, grade papers, make phone calls, use the bathroom, etc. If they are being expected to tutor after school, are they getting paid? Our teachers do. Teachers have more and more thrown onto their plates it seems like year after year, then we get less and less time to do it in. I'm curious to see other opinions.

I agree with you. My mom is a teacher (her lunch is 20 minutes) and some days that is the only break she gets.

 

[disneyjunkie]

As an aside with your $36,000 a year how much are your benefits worth? In most places teachers have Rolls Royce benefits compared to the market and generally pay very little towards them. For a single teacher in our district benefits add another 25,000 to the compensation package of which they pay next to nothing.

Add in job security. It is almost impossible to fire a teacher for not doing their job.

No need to go to school I was a teacher. There are no jobs around here because no one every quits!! why would they? You have to be willing to sub about 3-5 yrs to even have a shot at an opening.

I have worked as a teacher and as an RN and believe me teachers have it much easier than nurses and a heck of a lot better hours.

You seem to be basing your opinion on the school system you are familiar with. Each state is different. I've taught in New York and North Carolina. The two are like night and day. You couldn't pay me enough to teach in North Carolina again.

While teachers in area may "have it good," that may not be the case for teachers across the country.

 

[Boston Tea Party]

OP, if you are/were a teacher then why engage in bashing? Is it that you aren't able to get a job and that you are bitter?

 

[disneyjunkie]

OP, if you are/were a teacher then why engage in bashing? Is it that you aren't able to get a job and that you are bitter?

The OP didn't bash anyone

 

[snowy76]

I think the super's ultimatum was short-sighted (as most ultimatums are). Where on earth is the district going to find enough qualified teachers to replace the staff? You're going to get a lot of inexperienced teachers fresh out of college with no classroom management skills (and I would bet the bank the fired teachers spent way too much time on discipline issues). Or, you're going to get more experienced teachers who are just lousy and were let go from other districts. As a PP mentioned, you're going to get people desperate for a job, that's all.

As for the lunch break thing, I worked in an urban charter school where over 90% of the kids lived below poverty level. I had a lot of unidentified special ed kids, a few emotionally disturbed kids, etc. We were required to eat with our kids daily. It was supposed to build the idea of a classroom family. You know what though? When family members argue or have conflict, sometimes they need to be apart for a little while to calm down and regroup. The kids needed to be apart from me as much as I from them.

 

[Mrs. Bradbury]

OP, if you are/were a teacher then why engage in bashing? Is it that you aren't able to get a job and that you are bitter?

I'm the OP, and all I was trying to do was notify the DISer whose husband was looking for a teaching job. She was so upset for him, and I remembered her post once I read the article. This was never about my opinion (or the lack thereof) regarding the situation.

For what it's worth, I try not to make judgments anymore; having been in some very bad situations, most of my preconceived notions about pretty much everything were swept away. I did consider that the openings came about because a bunch of other people lost their jobs, but I nor the person to whom I directed the message can change that. If they're going to replace teachers, her husband may as well be one of the replacements - the bottom line is, he needs a job. Here are some.

To answer the rest of your post, I am not and have never been a teacher, but my mother was a teacher, my grandfather was a teacher, my aunt was a teacher, several good friends are teachers, and I voluntarily served on a BOE committee in my school system. I also was a founding board member (again, volunteer) of a preschool in my community.

However, my reason for posting was regarding JOBS, not to start an argument about teaching.

 

[moongirl]

deleted as OP essentially ended the thread with her last post

 

[KKB]

I think the super's ultimatum was short-sighted (as most ultimatums are). Where on earth is the district going to find enough qualified teachers to replace the staff? You're going to get a lot of inexperienced teachers fresh out of college with no classroom management skills (and I would bet the bank the fired teachers spent way too much time on discipline issues). Or, you're going to get more experienced teachers who are just lousy and were let go from other districts. As a PP mentioned, you're going to get people desperate for a job, that's all.
.

You nailed it--do they really think they can get the cream of the crop to fill these positions? NO...those teachers ARE taking the cushy jobs...

I'd like to point out again...a 52% graduation rate is a PARENTING problem. Too many parents feel that education is only a school's responsibility...but simply making sure students get enough sleep, healthy meals, get to school on time everyday & making sure students do their homework (NOT do it for them...) is such an important part of education--makes classroom learning nearly impossible if these parenting responsibilities are shirked. You would be amazed how epidemic lack of parenting is...

 

[karinbelle]

I hate to tell you but arguing that you only get paid for 10 months makes it actually worse! So you are getting $70,000 for only 10 months of work. As far as giving up a lunch maybe you should talk to the rest of the working world no one has a guaranteed lunch, if you are needed you work.

The teachers at our Highschool arrive between 7 and 715 and the lot is empty by 3:30 They teach five 50 minute periods, they monitor a study hall or lunch or watch a door for 1 period (during which they can do work or eat), They have 1 period as planning plus they have 1 period for lunch. so they have 3, 50 minute periods a day off of teaching to prep and eat. so they teach for 300 minutes a day that is 5 hours plus 1 hour of monitoring(which they either eat or correct papers) EVen if they go home and put in 2 more hours it only brings them up to about what most professionals are putting in every day. After the first couple of years of teaching a subject if you can't manage your time to get your work done in 3 hours everyday I wonder what you are doing, you wouldn't make it in business.
In this economic climate you either put in extra time and effort or you are out so it is time for teachers to also give up a few things like everyone else has.
I would really like to see these schools that the teachers are there to 5 because that has never been anywhere I have lived. Heck parent orientation night is limited by the union to 1 night in the whole year and limited to a certain number of minutes approximately 180 for the year. When my DH needed to stay over for a project no one counted the minutes it was just expected.

Trust me they will have no problem filling those jobs in RHode Island and that is the real test of whether a job is adequately reimbursed.

Hannathy,

Please sign up to volunteer at the low income school nearest to your home. When you experience a day in the life, you may change your mind.

 

[karinbelle]

Yes I do have kids and I do spend a lot of time in the schools volunteering, that is how I know what their work schedule entails. I also have relatives who are teachers and administraters. I also know directly from the high school principal the fact that he is allowed to require the teachers to work 1 evening in the school year and it can not go over 180 minutes. Doesn't sound very giving to me.
I would like to know where these teachers are that don't get lunch? And guess what lots of professions aren't guaranteed a lunch, ever work in an ICU?

As an aside with your $36,000 a year how much are your benefits worth? In most places teachers have Rolls Royce benefits compared to the market and generally pay very little towards them. For a single teacher in our district benefits add another 25,000 to the compensation package of which they pay next to nothing.

Add in job security. It is almost impossible to fire a teacher for not doing their job.

So your children go to a school that is in a low socio-economic area? With little parental support? They are in high school?

If not, I challenge you to volunteer in that school.

Schools in rich suburbs with lots of parental support are not the same.

 

[DVCBELLE]

So your children go to a school that is in a low socio-economic area? With little parental support? They are in high school?

If not, I challenge you to volunteer in that school.

Schools in rich suburbs with lots of parental support are not the same.

I live in a

rich suburb with lots of parental support

We pass our levy's and are considered one of the best districts in our state.

And I can see how hard our teachers work - anyone who doesn't see that either have inadequate teachers or are not truly involved.

I don't see quality teachers taking a job in that community - where is the job security. They fired the entire teaching staff - you can't tell me every single one of them deserved to be fired.

 

[karinbelle]

I live in a We pass our levy's and are considered one of the best districts in our state.

And I can see how hard our teachers work - anyone who doesn't see that either have inadequate teachers or are not truly involved.

I don't see quality teachers taking a job in that community - where is the job security. They fired the entire teaching staff - you can't tell me every single one of them deserved to be fired.

DVCBELLE,

You and I are on the same page.

Thanks for recognizing that most teachers work so hard to help their students. Our job is easier with adequate financial and parental support - that way we can focus on the teaching instead of the drama. Without those two factors, we are set up for a low success rate no matter what we do.

 

[CowboyCO]

The utter ignorance of people about what the job of a teacher entails is astounding.

6 hour days? Please. My DW goes to work at 7 am, gets off at 4 and has a 30 minute lunch break. She teaches 6 classes with 148 students in her classes. When a student needs to go to the restroom, they get a pass from the teacher or go during the passing period (5 minutes in her HS). Teachers? They, of course, cannot leave their class and during the passing period they are required to be in the hallways monitoring students. They are on duty nearly every moment after they hit the door. She also has one planning period a day to prepare for classes, grade papers or work with colleagues and administration. Just one writing assignment, such as a book report, creates a mountain of grading exceeding 1,000 handwritten pages to be graded. Needless to say, there are 5-10 hours of grading PER WEEK that come home. I've asked her why she doesn't just give a multiple choice test on a book instead of assigning a written paper to keep that mountain of grading down. Her response is because English is reading and writing and critical thinking. Multiple choice is critical guessing, she said.

What else is there to the job? My DW was asked recently to organize a career day, where she and two other teachers recruited over 100 professionals to give presentations about their careers to small groups of the entire student body. The three of them spent all of their planning time for three weeks, plus additional time in the evenings working and preparing for it because they believed it would be of value to the students. But those hours spent on that project mean even higher mountains of grading that has been delayed, which will mean more hours after school.

She makes $36K a year and pays for part of her health benefits OOP after 16 years of teaching. She works on a 10-month contract, but works a year's worth of hours in that time. Why? Because in spite of having to deal with the scorn of stoopid people who have no clue what the job of teacher entails, she loves teaching and inspiring kids to become something more.

This school in question in RI has tons of 1-parent families, many are ESL, they are transient, with drugs and unemployment running rampant in the community. The reason this school is poor-performing is because the COMMUNITY is poorly performing. Geez, all they want is for the teachers to work an extra 5-6 hours a week, and do extra training in the break times for no pay, when the problem is with the socioeconomic issues in the area.

Seriously, it's like telling a person with heart and lung disease to train harder and longer because they can't win a marathon. Most of these kids will never win this marathon because the schools can't fix those problems that start at home.

 

[Eeyore's Wife]

I am a retired teacher who now homeschools.

I have taught along side teachers who were amazing. They came early, stayed late, inspired, instructed, and illuminated.

I have taught along side teachers who were horrible. They came late, left early, yelled, bullied, or just ignored their students.

I have had administrations which were empowering, enjoyable, and excpeted results.

I have had an administrator who came up and Touched My Calf to see if I was "bare legged" or wearing stockings. (I was at a public school with a "no bare leg" policy. We were to wear trousers or stockings and skirts/dresses.) In other words, I have taught under some horrible administrators.

There are some teachers who need to be fired.

There are some teachers who deserve to be cannonized and made Patron Saints of Education.

There are administrations which deserve respect and awe.

There are administrations which foster frustration, failure, and fear.

As for myself, I spent hundreds of dollars out of pocket each year to add the Extras to my class I felt my kids deserved, but for which there was no budget. I came early, stayed late, tutored kids, wrote recommendations, called parents daily, coached, and poured out my heart and soul into my kids every year.

My students have gone on to do amazing things and I hear from them regularly. It always brings a smile to my face and deep joy to know that my life's work had such meaning and importance. I spoke yesterday to a young man I taught in middle school who is now applying to Medical School. He asked me to write one of his recommendations, since he was passionate about medicine even from that young age.

I have a Master's degree and worked at least 60 hours every single week during school, taught summer school, coached, and still made less money, by far, than my husband who has a bachelor's degree in the same field.

He became an engineer while I became a Math and Science teacher.

Frankly, most of the best and brightest, especially in tech areas, are no longer entering the profession of teaching.

I understand the need and/or desire to fire teachers who are just doing less than the minimum and picking up a paycheck. I also understand the need for paying the good teachers a wage that matches their skills, education level, experience, and results.

I made the same amount of money as the teacher next to me whose students did worksheets until the cows came home and whose students regularly scored lower, by fifteen or more points, than my student on the end of course exams, which were department wide exams.

In the end, this is a complicated issue not likely to resolve itself with blanket recriminations, personal attacks, whining, or complaining. . . . . on either side.

 

[MM27]

It is also interesting that not one teacher on here complained about how much of their OWN money they spend on classroom supplies.

I don't complain about it because I do it for my students. I know plenty of teachers that refuse to spend one cent out of pocket, but for me, if I need something to make a lesson better, if I need something to help the kids, I am willing to buy it myself. I had been asking for years for a skeleton for science and I kept getting the we don't have the money answer. I put out two hundred something dollars and bought one myself. What a difference it makes when the kids are learning about the human body in science. They get so excited. That's why I do it.

Same thing with the basic supplies. Thank goodness for Staples. I stock up every year on crayons, markers, binders, notebooks, folders, you name it. We are not allowed to send home supply lists.

I have to agree that around here I really have trouble getting my violin out for most teachers. I don't think their job is any more taxing or difficult than any other professional job.

I don't think anyone said that one job is more difficult than another and I know I certainly am not looking for anyone to feel sorry for me. I just think it's plain ignorant when people make generalizations about something that they know nothing about. I teach in an urban district and believe me, it is nothing like suburbia.

I hate to tell you but arguing that you only get paid for 10 months makes it actually worse! So you are getting $70,000 for only 10 months of work. As far as giving up a lunch maybe you should talk to the rest of the working world no one has a guaranteed lunch, if you are needed you work.

And you know what? I am worth every penny I make
That's fine that some people are not guaranteed a lunch. I however have a contract that states that I am entitled to one. I don't get overtime at my job and some people in the rest of the working world do. Different jobs have different benefits I guess. I have a friend that works in Manhattan for a brokerage firm and while the hours are longer than mine, the perks are greater. He gets a Christmas bonus that is almost as much as my yearly salary. I don't get a Christmas bonus. When he has to work late they give him dinner vouchers and a car to take him home. When I work late I pick up some McDonald's on my way home and I drive myself to my house.

Every district is different as to what they require teachers to do. That's the point of the contract agreement. In my district we have to do 5 night events. We also have to be available 2 days a week for 1/2 hour before or after school and we have a required meeting after school every Monday.

I actually plan my lessons around my students. So the idea that once you've been doing it for a while you shouldn't have to plan is ridiculous. Maybe high school teachers can do that, I don't know, but in elementary school I can't. The standards are the same but the kids are not.

I just don't understand why people get so riled up when it comes to teachers. It always comes down to salary. So here's a salary example to ponder. I have a friend that graduated college at the same time as me. He joined the local police department and I got my teaching job. 10 years later he is making more than double my salary as his base salary and then on top of that he gets overtime. Yes he has weird hours, but he knew that going in. (same as me) He has great benefits, a terrific pension when he retires and he didn't have to buy his own gun, baton, etc. Is his job hard? I guess so, when he is out chasing the bad guys, but I know he also has a lot of down time too. If I wanted that, I very well could have become a police officer, but it just didn't interest me.

 

[HsvTeacher]

The average salary at the High School in question is 72,000-78,000. Yes you make 36,000 in your first year but you will go up every year. Guaranteed- I know of no other job you are guaranteed to go up every year. Teachers start low but they top out high for the amount of time they spend at their jobs. The us median I think is around 52,000 not bad for 10 months, every weekend off, every holiday off, spring break, Christmas break, and compensation for every minute over what is required, plus personal days.
Yes Teaching is a job but it isn't slave labor and is a very desirable job or else there wouldn't be waiting lists a mile long every time there is an opening.

I want to know what fantasyland you're living in, because I want a job there!

I don't make anywhere near $70,000 a year. I also don't get holidays "off." I get paid for 187 days of contracted work. I don't get a lunch break, because I am required to sit with my students during lunch. I do get a 30 minute planning period, but that is used to call parents, make copies, do paperwork, go to the restroom, etc.

Since I'm on salary, I don't get paid one penny for any extra time over eight hours that I put in each day. I can also guarantee you that there were many years when I did not get a pay raise due to lacking of funding. (And no, I didn't start my teaching career making $36,000 a year. I wish!)