Tips on applying for federal job?

[Free4Life11]

Thanks for the tips. I'm going to print out the job announcement and highlight all the "buzzwords" and work on my job description.

 

[Cindy B]

Not a one. I just dbl-checked my jobs email folder where I save all my job search related correspondence...I have the initial response from when I set up the account, my user name creation and password, back in Oct 2007, and a password change in 2008. that's it. Now there was a link on the usajobs.com website where I could look at the positions I posted to, to get a status. But I was never asked to interview. I probably applied for 35 or 40 positions at usajobs since I moved here. More than 800 positions in the private sector.

I have a master's and 20 years experience and I'm going to end up working at Denny's or Shop Rite.

Well its usajobs.gov not usajobs.com... that could be an issue. I personally would set up a brand new account and go from there. I've only been applying since January 2009.

 

[Uuaww]

usajobs.opm.gov

I am a federal employee. The whole process took me 6 months or so. This is my first real job after college and I applied to about 25 jobs on usajobs before I landed this one. I am hoping to use it as a stepping stone to other federal employment. Each agency is different in what they are looking for. my advice is to apply for as many as possible. luckily they all use the same info, so keep your KSAs and just keep applying.

 

[Pooh_Friend#1]

Wow, so many things to say and not enough time to say it. I work as an HR Specialist for a Federal agency, been here for 6 years.

All competitive jobs under Title 5 HAS to be posted on USAJobs with a public notice aka vacancy announcement. Note, I stated competitive jobs have to be announced. Under Title 5, there are two types of appointments; excepted and competitive. Excepted appointments are student positions, Federal Career Interns, VRA's, people with certified disabilities, etc. These type of appointments DO NOT need to be announced because they are considered non-competitive appointments. Also, if you have previously held the grade then you are also considered non-competitive and can be selected without a vacancy annoucement.

Some agencies use Resumix which looks for the Buzz words. There is also other staffing sytems like USAStaffing and QuickHire through Monster Solutions. My agency uses QuickHire and we do not use Buzz words. We use assessment questions that are selected and weighted by the selecting official and what they determine to be the most important aspects of the job. The selecting official will also develop a specialized experience statement that is stated in the announcement. Applicants must describe the duties they performed in their jobs that is relevant to that specialized experience statement. We want detail, not bullets. We CANNOT assume you have the experience just because you previously had that position. Example, if we are looking for a Secretary, we cannot assume you have answered phones, maintaned calendars, arranged travel, set up conference rooms, etc if it is not listed on your resume, even if your last job was an administrative assistant. Spell it out.

Also, some positions require a basic qualification of a specific education. We cannot get passed that. OPM sets that regulations so if you do not have that education or the required coursework, there is nothing we can do about it.

Now there is two ways a job can be announced. Internal to current federal employees (also known as MPP, Merit Promotion) or External out to the public (aka DEU, Delegated Examining). When an announcement is open to the public, BY LAW, we can only refer the top 3 names. Keep in mind veteran's with preference gets an additional amount of points. You could score 100, but there could be a preference eligible that scores 105. Depending on the position, disabled veterans can "float" to the top of the list no matter what their score is and block everyone. By law, you cannot select a non-vet or a vet.

We are under a 45 day hiring. This means we have to get a person onboard within 45 BUSINESS days. They count starts from the time the vacancy closes to the time the person is onboard. My agency's average is 27 days.

Pay close attention to the vacancy announcement and READ the announcement. This will tell you everything that is required. People are marked ineligible all the time for not following directions such as submitting required documents. So write in detail the duties you performed and really describe what you did, address the specialized experience, and submit the required documents.

Just a reminder, my agency falls under Title V, other agencies fall under something different so this may not be the case for those agencies. I can only speak to what Title V agencies are required to do.

 

[mikehn]

Another thing to keep in mind and someone else already mentioned it. No matter how talented you are, you will have zero chance at getting many of the jobs posted on usajobs simply because that job posting is already targeted to a specific internal candidate for a promotion or something like that.

Generally, entry level jobs (say grades 5-11) are easier to get than higher graded jobs (grades 12 and up). If you've been unsuccessful in your attempts to get an interview, you may consider applying to lower graded jobs. The government doesnt penalize you for being overqualified, as long as you are not grossly overqualified. I know this can be tough on your ego, but it's most often the path of least resistance. Sometimes you have to take a step backward in order to take a step forward. Once you get your foot in the door, and you are talented, your career will excel very quickly.

 

[Pooh_Friend#1]

Another thing to keep in mind and someone else already mentioned it. No matter how talented you are, you will have zero chance at getting many of the jobs posted on usajobs simply because that job posting is already targeted to a specific internal candidate for a promotion or something like that.

If the announcement is open to a specific agency or bureau then yes, that job is probably targeted for someone else, but if it is open to the public that is generally not the case. Why would they open it up so wide that outside people could apply when they really want an internal candidate?

 

[Cindy B]

Now there is two ways a job can be announced. Internal to current federal employees (also known as MPP, Merit Promotion) or External out to the public (aka DEU, Delegated Examining). When an announcement is open to the public, BY LAW, we can only refer the top 3 names. Keep in mind veteran's with preference gets an additional amount of points. You could score 100, but there could be a preference eligible that scores 105. Depending on the position, disabled veterans can "float" to the top of the list no matter what their score is and block everyone. By law, you cannot select a non-vet or a vet.

.

So, I have a few questions on this section.

What do you mean top three names? So when I have been interviewed with various agencies, does that mean top three names?

Is there any truth in what I have been told about points in score? For example, if I score a 97 with no eligibility points and someone that has some type of eligibility get a 98-105 they in effect "bump" me out of a position?

I'm a little confused what you mean by "cannot select a non-vet or a vet".

Is there that much of a difference between a 97 score and a 98 score?

 

[Christine]

If the announcement is open to a specific agency or bureau then yes, that job is probably targeted for someone else, but if it is open to the public that is generally not the case. Why would they open it up so wide that outside people could apply when they really want an internal candidate?

We open jobs to the public but we are almost always targeting a specific person from the private sector. We have contractors who perform the exact same tasks as the government employees and we often use them as our "farm team". So, even though the announcement appears to be open to the public, we are looking for specific people. Unlike the private sector, we cannot go out and just hire who we want. We must make the announcement public. Now this doesn't mean that everyone else is out of the game. If you are very qualified for the advertised job, you could actually beat out that targeted person, but it is hard to do since that targeted person is often performing that job, just in a private sector capacity.

 

[wvjules]

We open jobs to the public but we are almost always targeting a specific person from the private sector. We have contractors who perform the exact same tasks as the government employees and we often use them as our "farm team". So, even though the announcement appears to be open to the public, we are looking for specific people. Unlike the private sector, we cannot go out and just hire who we want. We must make the announcement public. Now this doesn't mean that everyone else is out of the game. If you are very qualified for the advertised job, you could actually beat out that targeted person, but it is hard to do since that targeted person is often performing that job, just in a private sector capacity.

That's me. I'm patiently waiting for my contractor job to be made into a federal one. I am the targeted person but I will be told specifically what words to use in my resume. (Even though I do the EXACT job they will be advertising I need to make sure to get those darned words in there.) There is a chance I will get beat out by an outsider to do my job. How crappy would that be? lol

 

[DisneyBlonde]

Well its usajobs.gov not usajobs.com... that could be an issue. I personally would set up a brand new account and go from there. I've only been applying since January 2009.

Yes, usajobs.gov is the site I have bookmarked.

 

[Christine]

That's me. I'm patiently waiting for my contractor job to be made into a federal one. I am the targeted person but I will be told specifically what words to use in my resume. (Even though I do the EXACT job they will be advertising I need to make sure to get those darned words in there.) There is a chance I will get beat out by an outsider to do my job. How crappy would that be? lol

I had to go through this process too (last year). Very nerve wracking!

 

[Piecey]

You will probably have to make your resume specific for each job you apply. If job "A" has a lot of "logistics" in it then make sure you have "logistics" in your resume atleast a dozen times.

Pick up on the key words they have in the job description and use them frequently in your resume.

Also, all previous job descriptions should be in paragraph form do not use bullets. (Atleast that's how ours works.)

Thats what DH and I have always heard.

He has a Federal job.
DH is a disabled Veteran, though, and that helped tremendously.

 

[Cindy B]

Thats what DH and I have always heard.

He has a Federal job.

Didn't he also have Vet preference as well?

 

[Christine]

So, I have a few questions on this section.

What do you mean top three names? So when I have been interviewed with various agencies, does that mean top three names?

Is there any truth in what I have been told about points in score? For example, if I score a 97 with no eligibility points and someone that has some type of eligibility get a 98-105 they in effect "bump" me out of a position?

I'm a little confused what you mean by "cannot select a non-vet or a vet".

Is there that much of a difference between a 97 score and a 98 score?

On our last hire, we were given 7 names. We were told that we pretty much had to hire from the top 3 (which were all on the 90point scale). We could appeal that if we had serious issue with how they were rated. Fortunately we didn't. Our number 4 candidate was a veteran with a 5 point preference. He came in as a 75, which mean that experience-wise, he was a 70. He beat out three other 70s below him. We could NOT get to the 70s below him. We had to hire him. We could only get to the people equal to or below his score if he declined.

Basically if a vet shows up on the list rated equal to you or higher, the government MUST offer the job to the vet. They cannot offer to a non-vet.

 

[Piecey]

Didn't he also have Vet preference as well?

Yeah, I went back and edited that in. I don't doubt that the preference got him his job.

 

[mikehn]

If the targeted individual just happens to get beat out by some other candidate, another strategy used by the govt is that the entire job announcement is cancelled to avoid them from having to hire someone they didnt really want. They repost it again later after the dust is settled. That is life.

 

[Christine]

If the targeted individual just happens to get beat out by some other candidate, another strategy used by the govt is that the entire job announcement is cancelled to avoid them from having to hire someone they didnt really want. They repost it again later after the dust is settled. That is life.

Very true.

What I liked is that we were given a choice on the top 3. We had two positions open. We got three people to choose from. Two of them got 90 points and one got 80 points. We hired one of the 90-pointers and the 80-point person.

 

[Pooh_Friend#1]

If the targeted individual just happens to get beat out by some other candidate, another strategy used by the govt is that the entire job announcement is cancelled to avoid them from having to hire someone they didnt really want. They repost it again later after the dust is settled. That is life.

That is very true. We have a policy in my agency that if an annoucement is cancelled, it cannot be readvertised for 90 days so they think very hard if they want to wait those 3 months or not.

We are starting to do a new category ranking that allows more than the top 3to be referred, but the veteran's still block, meaning you cannot hire a non-vet over a vet.

What do you mean top three names? So when I have been interviewed with various agencies, does that mean top three names?
Meaning, the people with the 3 highest scores. If you have been interviewed it is quite possible you have been within the top 5 or 6, depending on how many positions are vacant

Is there any truth in what I have been told about points in score? For example, if I score a 97 with no eligibility points and someone that has some type of eligibility get a 98-105 they in effect "bump" me out of a position?
Yes, that is correct. That is what being blocked by a vet with preference means. If you scored a 97 and three other people scored higher, you would be bumped.

I'm a little confused what you mean by "cannot select a non-vet or a vet".
Christine explained this well when she stated, "Basically if a vet shows up on the list rated equal to you or higher, the government MUST offer the job to the vet. They cannot offer to a non-vet."

Is there that much of a difference between a 97 score and a 98 score?
In our agency there is. We have it broken down into decimals. Someone can score a 97.25 and someone else a 97.65 while someone else could score 98.05 or 98.00. If there are a few people who scored the same and are all in the top 3 scores, we have to do a tie breaker based on a random number of the day. For example if the top 3 scores are 105, 100, 98.5 and there are 5 people whose score is 98.5 we have to do a tie breaker on those 5 people to determine who will be the 3rd person referred to the selecting official.

 

[Cindy B]

Thanks Christine and Pooh Friend#1... that helps a lot!

So I guess being 97 or 98 helps tremendously. I did get a 100 score on one job (teaching position at a Vet facility) but I did get a notice that said something like a qualified veteran beat your civilian score...

As a straight civilian with no true connections or even qualifications, is a 97 or 98 score good? I understand the premise of hiring with preference, but in one hand it seems unfair that a disabled vet with a 70 score got the job whereas capable individuals got hirer scores and NO job... I know it is a law that has been around since the Civil War, but it does seem unfair in some ways.

 

[Uuaww]

Thanks Christine and Pooh Friend#1... that helps a lot!

So I guess being 97 or 98 helps tremendously. I did get a 100 score on one job (teaching position at a Vet facility) but I did get a notice that said something like a qualified veteran beat your civilian score...

As a straight civilian with no true connections or even qualifications, is a 97 or 98 score good? I understand the premise of hiring with preference, but in one hand it seems unfair that a disabled vet with a 70 score got the job whereas capable individuals got hirer scores and NO job... I know it is a law that has been around since the Civil War, but it does seem unfair in some ways.

As an agriculture specialist, i scored an 88. though i was fresh out of college and they were hiring about 150 new ag specialists a year.