Time to pay the piper, boys...(long) NEW & IMPROVED contract #50

[minkydog]

Just stop the internet now and that will inspire them to get out and get a job. Why are you catering to these grown men? Do you pay for their cell as well?

I think you had a great idea, just might need to be more firm.

The rules in our house are simple and easy to follow:

If your in school you pay no rent, but follow my rules and have housework to do....

If your not in school you pay rent and still follow my rules as its my house, my way...... if you dont like that your welcome to get your own place with higher rent and no rules...

This applies to all the kids regardless of age...they all know it, even the 7 year old so no issues in that regard.

All good ideas. I know we have been lackidaisical in requiring them to be responsible. You think that at 23yo you wouldn't have to tell them to keep their place neat and clean up after themselves. It's easier to just keep letting it go, ya know? So, bad on us.

I bolded your CJG--that's pretty much what we're saying in the contract. I think we need to tweak the consequences though. I like the idea of cutting off the internet immediately. I think that would galvanize them to get jobs and get out.

 

[Angelhalo]

I'm sorry to rain on your parade, but I think it's ridiculous. If you take out the boys ages, the contract reads like it's geared towards a high school student.

These are grown men. Give them 2 months to find an apartment then show them the door. But you have to be serious about it. It seems like if it's gotten this far, you may not have been serious enough up to this point. There are two of them, they can get an apartment together!

Agreed. This contract just kind of seems mor elike you want someone to do your housework for you. Hire a maid and kick the boys out!

 

[disykat]

Agreed. This contract just kind of seems mor elike you want someone to do your housework for you. Hire a maid and kick the boys out!

This post had me going back to re-read the OP. Why would she need a maid if they are gone? Most of what she is asking them to do is keep their own rooms clean, do their own laundry, along with taking turns at the kitchen and yardwork. How is that wanting them to do HER housework? Do you seriously clean all your kid's rooms for them and not expect them to contribute to any of the rest of the household?

I agree that it's sad that adults have to be told to do these basic things, but it seems to me those are basic things any person living in a house would be expected to do, not the "OP's housework." Yikes! I do still clean my boy's bathroom, but I sure won't be doing it when they are adults! They've been cleaning their own rooms since they were itty bitty.

 

[Scornelius]

I just want to commend you for still allowing your foster son to stay with you. The future for kids who age out of the system is horribly bleak, and it warms my heart to see that he's got a supportive family and chance to do well. Kudos.

 

[ChrizJen]

I just want to commend you for still allowing your foster son to stay with you. The future for kids who age out of the system is horribly bleak, and it warms my heart to see that he's got a supportive family and chance to do well. Kudos.

I second this. There's a lot of criticism being thrown out here, and this was the first mention of the GOOD things you've done as a parent. None of us is a perfect parent. Anyone who says they are is kidding themselves. Some get lucky and seem to do enough right by their kids that they turn out OK.
Bottom line, I respect and admire you for getting to this point with 2 boys who have severe ADHD and Bipolar disorder. Those are terribly difficult obstacles to overcome, and many of the parents here who are so quick to judge have probably never dealt with them.
Have you made mistakes with your kids? Probably. But as I said before, we all do. Parenting is basically doing the best we can and hoping for the best outcome.
Take some of the suggestions here and tweak your contract. But I think that as long as you and your DH stay firm with them, you've got the right idea!
Good luck to you and your DH. Hopefully you can get your boys on the right track!

 

[Disney Doll]

These aren't boys, they are men. Tell them they have X amount of time to find a job and contribute to the household or they can find another place to live.

Then stick to it.

 

[minkydog]

Agreed. This contract just kind of seems mor elike you want someone to do your housework for you. Hire a maid and kick the boys out!

No, I'm not going to hire a maid. I want them to clean up after themselves. We're all eating and cooking. There are 2 teens and 2 adults using the one guest bathroom. From the age of 12 I have expected my kids to do their own laundry. DH takes care of ours. I do not expect anyone to launder my unmentionables.

My DD16 keeps her things picked up, for the most part. I never have to ask her to do laundry. Any time I assign housework, like cleaning up the kitchen, vacuuming, cleaining the bathroom she does a good job without complaint. That's what I expect from the boys.

This post had me going back to re-read the OP. Why would she need a maid if they are gone? Most of what she is asking them to do is keep their own rooms clean, do their own laundry, along with taking turns at the kitchen and yardwork. How is that wanting them to do HER housework? Do you seriously clean all your kid's rooms for them and not expect them to contribute to any of the rest of the household?

I agree that it's sad that adults have to be told to do these basic things, but it seems to me those are basic things any person living in a house would be expected to do, not the "OP's housework." Yikes! I do still clean my boy's bathroom, but I sure won't be doing it when they are adults! They've been cleaning their own rooms since they were itty bitty.

Exactly. If the boys didn't live here I would only be cleaning up after DH, myself, DD16 & DS14. And DH & DD16 clean as well as I do (DS14 is severely mentally handicapped, like an 12-18 month old; he cannot do any chores.) I'm not looking for free maid service. I'm just asking them to do their fair share.

I just want to commend you for still allowing your foster son to stay with you. The future for kids who age out of the system is horribly bleak, and it warms my heart to see that he's got a supportive family and chance to do well. Kudos.

Thank you. This young man had a difficult upbringing. His parents kicked him out when he was 17yo with nowhere to go( they have 5 kids younger than him; they just wanted him to be on his own--without a HS diploma.Sheesh.) We took him in and helped him graduate HS. His mother died 2 years later of alcoholism. Eric is really trying to make a future for himself. I have an extra bed so I gave it to him. He's a good young man and he likes to cook for me sometimes. I think he wants to "pay his way." I am happy to let him save face.

 

[minkydog]

I second this. There's a lot of criticism being thrown out here, and this was the first mention of the GOOD things you've done as a parent. None of us is a perfect parent. Anyone who says they are is kidding themselves. Some get lucky and seem to do enough right by their kids that they turn out OK.
Bottom line, I respect and admire you for getting to this point with 2 boys who have severe ADHD and Bipolar disorder. Those are terribly difficult obstacles to overcome, and many of the parents here who are so quick to judge have probably never dealt with them.
Have you made mistakes with your kids? Probably. But as I said before, we all do. Parenting is basically doing the best we can and hoping for the best outcome.
Take some of the suggestions here and tweak your contract. But I think that as long as you and your DH stay firm with them, you've got the right idea!
Good luck to you and your DH. Hopefully you can get your boys on the right track!

Thank you. You are so right. It's not easy.I have made mistakes. But we are trying to right our wrongs and help these young men.

These aren't boys, they are men. Tell them they have X amount of time to find a job and contribute to the household or they can find another place to live.

Then stick to it.

Thank you. Thus we have the contract.

DH & I are definitely going to tighten up the contract. I know a lot of you disagree with the contract, but with these two young men, with their disabilities it really does take more effort on our parts to get them to understand the rules and consistently comply with them. Having a written contract that they (and we) can refer to will help them get the jobs done. I know it seems silly, but that's how it is. You're welcome to come walk in my shoes for a week or so. Oh, and you get DS14 while you're at it.

 

[Jennasis]

Thank you. You are so right. It's not easy.I have made mistakes. But we are trying to right our wrongs and help these young men.



Thank you. Thus we have the contract.

DH & I are definitely going to tighten up the contract. I know a lot of you disagree with the contract, but with these two young men, with their disabilities it really does take more effort on our parts to get them to understand the rules and consistently comply with them. Having a written contract that they (and we) can refer to will help them get the jobs done. I know it seems silly, but that's how it is. You're welcome to come walk in my shoes for a week or so. Oh, and you get DS14 while you're at it.

I know it must be incredibly rough but PLEASE do not make excuses for them (the ADHD/bipolar issue). If they aren't under a doctor's care and medicated for these disorders, make it part of the contract.

I have supremely low-functioning Special Olympic athletes who tow the line better than your grown high functioning boys do.

Be tough.

 

[minkydog]

Okay, here's an updated contract. This contract gives them 6weeks to be fully up to speed and paying their own way. The reason i have included specific dates is so I will know who didn't do their chores. It will also prevent the "not my turn" arguments. I have included the exact cleaning instructions so that there is no misunderstanding what is expected of them. I took out the penalties because there needs to be more flexibility. There are penalities, however, including being asked to leave our home.


House & Yard W
ork Contract
Eric & John


Mon & Thurs----1. Clean room. Sweep, fold or hang clothes, CDs/DVDs put away, trash out, wires neat. Laundry in basket. Sheets on bed.

Tues(Fri) -------2. Clean kitchen--wipe counters microwave dishwasher & stove, dishes in dishwasher, wash any dishes that don’t fit in dishwasher, trash out, sweep floor.

Tues(Sat)------------1. Do all your laundry, including sheets. Gather towels, washcloths, & mat: wash them. Put clean sheets on bed

2. Clean hall bath. Sweep, wipe counters & toilet. Bleach tub (bleach solution: ¼ cup bleach, small amt shampoo, small tub water). Replace towels and mat.

Sep1--------------Mow grass every other month. chore already done by Eric yesterday
Weeks 1 & 3-----Blow driveway to street. Use 2-3 orange cords
Week 2 & 4------Pick up pine cones in front yard(back yard)

Deadlines:
Sep 20--- Must have some kind of job.

Oct 1----Rent $25/week is due on Sunday of each week, or $100 every 2 weeks.


Finding a job is your Job 1. If you are not actively looking(that is, going out for face to face encounters) the internet will be permanently cut off, beginning in 7 days.

If you are going to school full-time , part-time work is expected.

If you are not going to school, full-time work is expected. Get two part-time jobs if necessary.

You must be out of the house between the hours of 10am and 4pm, unless you have a job that requires you to work night shift.




I agree to abide by these house & yard rules. If I have a conflict I will bring it to Mom & Dad for careful consideration and I will abide by their decision. I understand that this contract will be reviewed and may be changed Oct 1.

_(signed)_________________________________________ __

 

[minkydog]

I have supremely low-functioning Special Olympic athletes who tow the line better than your grown high functioning boys do.

So do I.

 

[piglet too]

OK, this may be my brain not working right, but I am confused on the rent. Why is it $25 every week or $100 every two weeks?

 

[RitaE]

Sorry, but I have to think they're going to sign your paper, secretly roll their eyes, and continue to act the exact same way they're acting now.

 

[minkydog]

OK, this may be my brain not working right, but I am confused on the rent. Why is it $25 every week or $100 every two weeks?

Oops! my mistake. Thanks for pointing that out to me.

Sorry, but I have to think they're going to sign your paper, secretly roll their eyes, and continue to act the exact same way they're acting now.

Maybe they will, but it won't come as any surprise to them when we ask them to move themselves and their stuff out.

'Course, I guess we could always turn to Dr. Phil(!)

 

[lovetoscrap]

An idea I have read from others regarding the rent: Unless you really need that money to help cover the additional expenses (and it sounds like you don't) you might secretly put the money they pay away in an account for them -- or just a hidden envelope. They in a few months when they are ready to fly out of the nest you have some savings of theirs to help them out with an apartment deposit or furniture. Don't tell them you are doing it! Let them think they are paying rent you need. But it makes a nice gesture to help them out when they do leave.


And when they leave this time? Sell their furniture, paint their rooms pink with flowers all over it, turn it into an office, craft room, work area etc and change the locks! No option to come back!

Best of luck, keep us updated. I am interested to hear how this works for you.

 

[Luv2Scrap]

An idea I have read from others regarding the rent: Unless you really need that money to help cover the additional expenses (and it sounds like you don't) you might secretly put the money they pay away in an account for them -- or just a hidden envelope. They in a few months when they are ready to fly out of the nest you have some savings of theirs to help them out with an apartment deposit or furniture. Don't tell them you are doing it! Let them think they are paying rent you need. But it makes a nice gesture to help them out when they do leave.


And when they leave this time? Sell their furniture, paint their rooms pink with flowers all over it, turn it into an office, craft room, work area etc and change the locks! No option to come back!

Best of luck, keep us updated. I am interested to hear how this works for you.

I agree with this 100%! Until my parents did this, my younger brother always had the attitude, "Well, if I can't make rent, I can always go back to mom and dad's..." And he did... many times...

 

[PinkRhombus]

Sing it sista'! They're 23 years old! PS... I use the 24hour no internet on my 5yo!

NO KIDDING!

Maybe they will, but it won't come as any surprise to them when we ask them to move themselves and their stuff out.

'Course, I guess we could always turn to Dr. Phil(!)

Asking and telling are two different things.

You don't need a silly contract. Chores aren't going to make a bit of difference to some ADULTS who have been treated like and allowed to behave like children.


Tell them they have 30 days to have a job, find an apartment and move out. Period.

And then don't say a darn thing to them after that. Don't nag them, don't say "Did you hear me?" Don't remind them about how many days they have left.

If the time comes where you have to move them out, leave them a duffel bag with their toiletries and a few changes of clothes on the doorstep with a note to let you know where you need to send the rest of their stuff.

They'll be resourceful when they're made to be.

 

[golfgal]

This is just childish. Just show them the door and the problem is solved.

I agree. You have one month to get a job or leave??

With their ADHD and bipolar disorder I think going to school full-time and working full-time is probably not realistic. Our goal is for them to actually finish their training. I'm glad that your husband has got his act together. I don't think these boys are quite as mature as your husband.



Well, the military didn't want either of these boys due to their disabilities(ADHD and bipolar--seriously, would you want to hand either of them a bazooka?) If I have to restrict them from the internet I will be confiscating their laptops. they can go to the library and use the internet for free if they just have to have it. I do like your suggestion of getting a fulltime job or going to school within 2 months and I may change the contract to reflect that.

It sounds like you are still making excuses for them and perhaps that is why they are the way they are. So what if they have ADHD-so does our pediatrician but that didn't stop him from going to medical school. People will live up to their expectations and if you are using their "conditions" as an excuse, so are they. Show them the door and if they have to eat Ramen noodles for a month before they get it, so be it.

 

[phorsenuf]

I know it must be incredibly rough but PLEASE do not make excuses for them (the ADHD/bipolar issue). If they aren't under a doctor's care and medicated for these disorders, make it part of the contract.

Be tough.

I totally agree with this. You are making excuses for them right off the bat. There are plenty of people out there with ADHD and Bi-polar that lead a very productive life.
Maybe they just bum around because they have it in their head they can't be productive because of their issues?

 

[minkydog]

And when they leave this time? Sell their furniture, paint their rooms pink with flowers all over it, turn it into an office, craft room, work area etc and change the locks! No option to come back!

Oh, yeah. That is part of the plan!

NO KIDDING!

Asking and telling are two different things.

You don't need a silly contract. Chores aren't going to make a bit of difference to some ADULTS who have been treated like and allowed to behave like children.

Actually, we do need a contract. Between my poor memory and theirs we all need to have the specifics in writing.


Tell them they have 30 days to have a job, find an apartment and move out. Period.

Seriously? If you had no skills, no savings, no family assistance, and no job do you really think you could realistically find an apartment, pay the deposits, get the utilities turned on and eat? I'd be very surprised
If the time comes where you have to move them out, leave them a duffel bag with their toiletries and a few changes of clothes on the doorstep with a note to let you know where you need to send the rest of their stuff.

Absolutley. We will set their belongings on the driveway and give them 24hrs to pick them up. But we're going to give them a chance to redeem themselves before we go to that extreme.
They'll be resourceful when they're made to be.

I agree. You have one month to get a job or leave??



It sounds like you are still making excuses for them and perhaps that is why they are the way they are. So what if they have ADHD-so does our pediatrician but that didn't stop him from going to medical school. People will live up to their expectations and if you are using their "conditions" as an excuse, so are they. Show them the door and if they have to eat Ramen noodles for a month before they get it, so be it.

I'm not making excuses, I'm telling it like it is. I have a sister who is mentally ill, and she can't work or keep an apartment on her own either. If you met her you'd understand why. She stopped maturing when she was 19, the same year she became psychotic. If not for family helping her get medical help and assistance finding a secure place to live she would be living under a bridge. We don't want that for our young men.

We are trying to change the way we have been dealing with the guys. The fact that they have ADHD and bipolar inherently makes it more difficult for them to be successful in the traditional way. Perhaps you don't understand that--bipolar can be every bit as debilitating as heart disease or stroke. The reason we're going slow with this is because they need help learning. We have obviously not been too successful with this, which is why we are tightening up now and making much stiffer penalties. Setting them both in the street isn't going to teach them to swim. It may very well exacerbate their mental illness and make it very hard for them to continue going to school and finding a job.

Today I sought out some counseling to help me figure out how to approach this. The therapist is in agreement with everything--the contract, the penalties, the deadlines. We have decided that 30 days will give them time to get enrolled for the fall quarter, if they're going to do that, and get a job.