Third Wave is Here...

[tlcdoula]

OY VEY. BC is in rough shape... highest cases YET. EVER.

Every day when we get our new numbers I am more and more worried about how long this is going to go on for. I am grateful my mom has an appt for her vaccine this month so we can stop worrying about her so much. Just seeing the amount of travel that happened over the long weekend has me nervous about the areas where people flocked to for their non essential vacations.

 

[pigletto]

OY VEY. BC is in rough shape... highest cases YET. EVER.

Ontario too. We are a hot Covidy mess and I think many people have been hearing it for so long they aren’t fully realizing how bad it is at the moment . We are in deep right now .

 

[OnceUponATime15]

Ontario too. We are a hot Covidy mess and I think many people have been hearing it for so long they aren’t fully realizing how bad it is at the moment . We are in deep right now .

We were having this conversation over dinner tonight. People are so covid fatigued that they’ve simply tuned out. I had to run over to work mid afternoon to deal with a deadline, you would never have known there was a stay at home order, it could have been any other early spring day. The roads busy with loads of traffic, people out enjoying the beautiful day, playgrounds full,.. people in groups no social distancing - masks about 50/50.

It would have been easier to get compliance to the order in the cold dark winter months.. perhaps the Christmas stay at home order should have been extended? Right now, people are tired of being held in.. they are done with being given direction that clearly doesn’t solve the problem. They are frustrated.. frustration only adds fire to the idea of another four week inconvenience - fingers crossed it is only 4 weeks. The statistics are incredibly worrisome

 

[mshanson3121]

OY VEY. BC is in rough shape... highest cases YET. EVER.

I know NB numbers are nothing like BC, ON, but relatively speaking, we're not doing great in part of the province. I think 80% of our cases are the UK variant, we've got the highest number of hospitalizations, including ICU that we've had yet, and this time we have 20 and 30 year olds in ICU, too Three or four of the 20 hospitalized have already been vaccinated.

 

[mshanson3121]

We were having this conversation over dinner tonight. People are so covid fatigued that they’ve simply tuned out. I had to run over to work mid afternoon to deal with a deadline, you would never have known there was a stay at home order, it could have been any other early spring day. The roads busy with loads of traffic, people out enjoying the beautiful day, playgrounds full,.. people in groups no social distancing - masks about 50/50.

It would have been easier to get compliance to the order in the cold dark winter months.. perhaps the Christmas stay at home order should have been extended? Right now, people are tired of being held in.. they are done with being given direction that clearly doesn’t solve the problem. They are frustrated.. frustration only adds fire to the idea of another four week inconvenience - fingers crossed it is only 4 weeks. The statistics are incredibly worrisome

Agree. Fatigue is a problem. We're finding more and more people and businesses alike not complying.

 

[TammyLynn33]

I wonder if we over pushed the pandemic at the start. Maybe had we warned of future waves possibly being worse lol would be more apt to listen . The sky wasn’t falling earlier but now it may be .
I’m also frustrated with the focus on Canada from the US. Personally o know three families who tested positive in the past week. One is mid 50s breast cancer survivor who has been traveling everywhere the whole family got it at a family birthday party..and a guy fritt er me texted me last night and he’s angry b. He’s “ done everything right “ eating in restaurants, seeing all his family .. I feel like they are in a new wave too.. imo but you don’t hear their numbers anymore if you turn on CNN. But my ex is calling all smug about how bad Canada is handling this, how they had to help us giving us vaccines they haven’t approved yet. Like a tree falling in a forest .. Are you in a wave of no one knows or cares ?
Everyone is so angry .. mad at Walmart for being open. Now mad because they aren’t selling this or that .. I’m just over it all at this point ..

 

[momof2gr8kids]

I wonder if we over pushed the pandemic at the start. Maybe had we warned of future waves possibly being worse lol would be more apt to listen . The sky wasn’t falling earlier but now it may be .
I’m also frustrated with the focus on Canada from the US. Personally o know three families who tested positive in the past week. One is mid 50s breast cancer survivor who has been traveling everywhere the whole family got it at a family birthday party..and a guy fritt er me texted me last night and he’s angry b. He’s “ done everything right “ eating in restaurants, seeing all his family .. I feel like they are in a new wave too.. imo but you don’t hear their numbers anymore if you turn on CNN. But my ex is calling all smug about how bad Canada is handling this, how they had to help us giving us vaccines they haven’t approved yet. Like a tree falling in a forest .. Are you in a wave of no one knows or cares ?
Everyone is so angry .. mad at Walmart for being open. Now mad because they aren’t selling this or that .. I’m just over it all at this point ..

I guess finding the positive in all of this is that you're not stuck in lockdown with your ex ........ right??? lol

But yeah, tired of the people yelling to close things down, yet gathering with their families or cohorts that they always hang out with cause "they're safe". My aunt who is a breast cancer survivor mentioned getting together at one son's house over the other for Easter. I said oh, why, does he have room to have it outside? No, he's in the country and long driveway so people wouldn't be able to see them gathering and call on them. Um.. ok... this is why it's spreading, not because I run into a store with a mask and social distance and use hand sanitizer. We will only take our grandkids outside for walks or bike rides and our DIL pouts we don't take them over night, but they're in and out of many households, playing at friends, other grandparents for sleepovers. It's so annoying.

 

[mshanson3121]

I wonder if we over pushed the pandemic at the start. Maybe had we warned of future waves possibly being worse lol would be more apt to listen . The sky wasn’t falling earlier but now it may be .
I’m also frustrated with the focus on Canada from the US. Personally o know three families who tested positive in the past week. One is mid 50s breast cancer survivor who has been traveling everywhere the whole family got it at a family birthday party..and a guy fritt er me texted me last night and he’s angry b. He’s “ done everything right “ eating in restaurants, seeing all his family .. I feel like they are in a new wave too.. imo but you don’t hear their numbers anymore if you turn on CNN. But my ex is calling all smug about how bad Canada is handling this, how they had to help us giving us vaccines they haven’t approved yet. Like a tree falling in a forest .. Are you in a wave of no one knows or cares ?
Everyone is so angry .. mad at Walmart for being open. Now mad because they aren’t selling this or that .. I’m just over it all at this point ..

I think the problem is - back then, they didn't know how bad that first initial wave was going to be. All they had to go on at that point was China/Italy and they were BAD. Even the US wasn't great. We weren't in any way prepared, so they HAD to be heavy handed. As a result, we absolutely lucked out in the first wave. But had they not been as strict? I doubt we'd be as well off as we are now - even though I realize we're at our worst point yet, it could be a lot worse.

Unfortunately, the fatigue is real and I think it would be here no matter how this was handle. Pandemics aren't short things. All we have to do is look at history - they are almost always multi-year events. Even some of the ones that weren't as bad as Covid. We're on track to have our pandemic declared over within 2 years (by this fall/winter). The end is in sight, even if it doesn't feel it.

The US looked like they might be starting a new wave, but honestly the numbers levelled off. Per capita, they're doing much better than we are. But that's to be expected - they're well ahead of us in the vaccine campaign AND they've had so many more cases, they have areas of herd immunity. Now - the next 2 weeks will tell the tale for both Canada and the US, on how badly we behaved over Easter. And will definitely help us see how much the vaccines help. Theoretically, with the US so much farther ahead, they shouldn't see a large Easter spike, whereas I'm expecting we probably will.

 

[hdrolfe]

Agree with the fatigue. And I think part of the add on is the weather finally getting nice. My son is desperate to play with friends now but can't. He's having a rough time this week, and I am too. I am just hopeful these 4 weeks are enough, that enough people get vaccinated, that cases start dropping, that we can return to life this summer. I think if we can do something this summer, have that to look forward to, it will be easier to get through. I do try and ignore almost everyone else But it's hard when we go to the park to play basketball and see other groups of people there, many who obviously aren't from the same household. Makes it harder to explain to kiddo why I can't call his friends to come play.

Deep breaths, we will get through this...

 

[samsteele]

back then, they didn't know how bad that first initial wave was going to be. All they had to go on at that point was China/Italy and they were BAD. Even the US wasn't great. We weren't in any way prepared

TBH the Canadian govt did know how bad it was in China and Italy. But chose to rely on WHO rather than our own intelligence services, UK intelligence and US intelligence reports. International flights from key hot spots should have been halted asap. Better leave it there or I'll wander into politics. Look, I may have misread the spirit of your post. But not much was heavy handed about the feds response for months. It was a unquestioning trust in WHO which in itself is heavily influenced by politics. Our senior civil service knew it was bad. Certain top policy makers chose not to act quickly. The US, UK and most of Europe did the same.

 

[mshanson3121]

TBH the Canadian govt did know how bad it was in China and Italy. But chose to rely on WHO rather than our own intelligence services, UK intelligence and US intelligence reports. International flights from key hot spots should have been halted asap. Better leave it there or I'll wander into politics. Look, I may have misread the spirit of your post. But not much was heavy handed about the feds response for months. It was a unquestioning trust in WHO which in itself is heavily influenced by politics. Our senior civil service knew it was bad. Certain top policy makers chose not to act quickly. The US, UK and most of Europe did the same.

I meant they didn't know how bad it was going to be here. I actually stated that all they had to go on was China and Italy.

 

[TammyLynn33]

I guess finding the positive in all of this is that you're not stuck in lockdown with your ex ........ right??? lol

Yes I am very thankful as I probably wouldn’t be alive .

and yes I know of people all of a sudden parking on the street so they can hide their out of town visitors cars in their driveway .

I’m frusturated with People yelling Walmart is open selling non -essentials now groups yelling they aren’t selling baby clothes r Thai or that .People yelling schools aren’t safe then yelling if they go remote. I feel some people just want to be angry.


But yeah, tired of the people yelling to close things down, yet gathering with their families or cohorts that they always hang out with cause "they're safe". My aunt who is a breast cancer survivor mentioned getting together at one son's house over the other for Easter. I said oh, why, does he have room to have it outside? No, he's in the country and long driveway so people wouldn't be able to see them gathering and call on them. Um.. ok... this is why it's spreading, not because I run into a store with a mask and social distance and use hand sanitizer. We will only take our grandkids outside for walks or bike rides and our DIL pouts we don't take them over night, but they're in and out of many households, playing at friends, other grandparents for sleepovers. It's so annoying.

 

[damo]

I think partly what frustrates people is that we just keep doing the same closures over and over and we just keep going in waves. We need to be doing other things when we are NOT CLOSED to keep us from having to close. Studies have shown that the major spread is from offices, distribution centres, construction, factories and processing plants yet we make no changes in those areas.

Warehouses, factories, construction sites responsible for far more workplace outbreaks than retail and restaurants, data shows.

https://www.thestar.com/business/20...s-than-retail-and-restaurants-data-shows.html

 

[TommyJK]

I think partly what frustrates people is that we just keep doing the same closures over and over and we just keep going in waves. We need to be doing other things when we are NOT CLOSED to keep us from having to close. Studies have shown that the major spread is from offices, distribution centres, construction, factories and processing plants yet we make no changes in those areas.

Warehouses, factories, construction sites responsible for far more workplace outbreaks than retail and restaurants, data shows.

https://www.thestar.com/business/20...s-than-retail-and-restaurants-data-shows.html

This has been a key part of the problem with how the vaccine has been distributed with it being primarily age based only up until recently. Yes we need to pretect the most vulnerable, but we ALSO need to attack the areas with the most significan spread too. And at least it looks like they're starting to do this (as we get more supply) by zeroing in on hotspot areas to vaccinate more heavily in those areas.

In hindsight, once they felt they got all of the Long Term Care and Health Care workers in good enough shape they should have spread out to the high population workplace settings (the ones that you mention PLUS teachers IMO). Crush the heavy spread at the source. They should have also expanded paid sick leave so that people who work in those settings could stay home if they feel ill instead of going in and spreading infection becasue they can't afford to not work.

Vaccine supply continues to further increase so hopefully they can attack those areas more agressively moving forward.

 

[damo]

This has been a key part of the problem with how the vaccine has been distributed with it being primarily age based only up until recently. Yes we need to pretect the most vulnerable, but we ALSO need to attack the areas with the most significan spread too. And at least it looks like they're starting to do this (as we get more supply) by zeroing in on hotspot areas to vaccinate more heavily in those areas.

In hindsight, once they felt they got all of the Long Term Care and Health Care workers in good enough shape they should have spread out to the high population workplace settings (the ones that you mention PLUS teachers IMO). Crush the heavy spread at the source. They should have also expanded paid sick leave so that people who work in those settings could stay home if they feel ill instead of going in and spreading infection becasue they can't afford to not work.

Vaccine supply continues to further increase so hopefully they can attack those areas more agressively moving forward.

Exactly. Instead we just shut the same things down instead of cutting things off at the source. It's no wonder that people get frustrated.

 

[OnceUponATime15]

Dr Michael Warner who is the ICU chief of medicine at Michael Garron hospital in Toronto has become an amazingly outspoken advocate for change in the way things are being done here in Ontario. He was instrumental in getting hot spot vaccines by postal code launched this week.

I listened to him this week talk about distribution of the vaccine from the federal level.

He spoke to the need to supply vaccinations where the need is greatest. He feels it makes no sense to be vaccinating the segment of the population who have little or no exposure to the virus countrywide when those in the truly hot spots could become sick and even die while they wait for the vaccine supply to be restocked where they live.
He said where a fire is burning is where the water hoses should be directed.

Makes sense.

 

[OnceUponATime15]

The Hospital for Sick Children in Toronto (Sick Kids) will start to receive Adult covid 19 patients for ICU care within the next 24 hours. #systemunderstress

 

[bankr63]

He said where a fire is burning is where the water hoses should be directed.

Makes sense.

Just playing devil's advocate here, but that is often not true. For forest fires, it is often better to build a fire break around the burning area than to try putting it out by dumping water on it. And for building fires they will often abandon a burning building and save the neighboring buildings by pouring the water on them instead.

Not to say I wholly disagree with giving more vaccines to hot spot areas, more to say that often a balanced multi-prong approach is best. Dr. Warner has an iron in the fire as the chief at a hospital in the hot zone. I have an iron in the fire as the husband of a teacher who must spend 7 hours a day locked in a room with a bunch of kids who refuse to comply with guidance and with no vaccine apparent yet. With three cases in the school in the past week, it is 'uncomfortable' at best.

Ottawa teachers 'might' get vaccinated once Toronto and Peel are done, but I hated DoFo's comment at the news conference about every jab in a teacher's arm is a jab not in someone else's arm, he really seems to hate teachers and views them as expendable. We'll take what we can get when we can get it (hopefully she gets it long before me); I understand how hard it is to get the response right.

 

[OnceUponATime15]

Just playing devil's advocate here, but that is often not true. For forest fires, it is often better to build a fire break around the burning area than to try putting it out by dumping water on it. And for building fires they will often abandon a burning building and save the neighboring buildings by pouring the water on them instead.

Not to say I wholly disagree with giving more vaccines to hot spot areas, more to say that often a balanced multi-prong approach is best. Dr. Warner has an iron in the fire as the chief at a hospital in the hot zone. I have an iron in the fire as the husband of a teacher who must spend 7 hours a day locked in a room with a bunch of kids who refuse to comply with guidance and with no vaccine apparent yet. With three cases in the school in the past week, it is 'uncomfortable' at best.

Ottawa teachers 'might' get vaccinated once Toronto and Peel are done, but I hated DoFo's comment at the news conference about every jab in a teacher's arm is a jab not in someone else's arm, he really seems to hate teachers and views them as expendable.

Always the devil’s advocate lol. That iron you have in the fire.. well me too.
I am an ECE who works in Regional government childcare and have been frontline since day one of the pandemic, including providing 24/7 emergency childcare for other essential workers when we were still learning as we worked about covid19. We went above and beyond often at risk until the return to “regular” childcare... all while praying that the families of the these children world stay safe, healthy and their children not be asymptomatic carriers spreading covid unknowingly. We continue to worry as things get worse.

Your wife very likely has the option to teach online and mitigate her risk.. therefore she has a choice.
Yes schools remain open & yes it’s been a fight to get teachers, Special needs support staff, EAs, custodians, lunchroom monitors and.. ECEs vaccinated but many on that list simply can not work from home.

So while I get what you are saying... you’re preaching to the church.

 

[mshanson3121]

He spoke to the need to supply vaccinations where the need is greatest. He feels it makes no sense to be vaccinating the segment of the population who have little or no exposure to the virus countrywide when those in the truly hot spots could become sick and even die while they wait for the vaccine supply to be restocked where they live.
He said where a fire is burning is where the water hoses should be directed.

Makes sense.

But as a province who is small and has small case load compared to other places, who has an elderly population, a population with one of the highest per capita rates of disease (risk) and who has one of the worst healthcare systems in Canada, who will have their supply taken away... Tell that to the families of the patients dying in ICU here and all the at risk people desperately waiting for a vaccine...