Things not going well with the DDP changes

[familyS]

Well, we booked the package as soon as it became available. I was told at the time that all details weren't final yet.

Have we received a brochure yet? Nope!

I thought they were waiting until the details were final before sending a copy. Now that Teppan Edo and Tokyo Dining are added, maybe they'll finally send me one??

I know there were multiple versions of the brochure on the Disney website all available at the same time. If I remember correctly, two of them were dated on the bottom of the last page. I think it was the undated version that indicated tip and appetizers still included. I save the latest dated version to my hard drive and overwrite previous versions... now I wish I had saved them all to compare them

For us, we did find the correct information and through boards like this and others, knew what changes to expect and verified them in current brochures. If anyone is waiting for an official, final copy at home, they may be SOL


Edited to add:

I did just find a copy of an older version of the brochure (dated 080307). On the first page it has bold print in the third mickey head bullet under redeeming meals: Gratuities are not inlcuded unless otherwise indicated.

The same bold statement is in the current brochure, dated 010208.

I suspect that the undated brochure that did not include the statement was really an unapproved draft. The brochure did have 2008 on the cover with the purple theme (not the blue 2007 theme), but I bet it was not supposed to be posted on the website.

 

[annie1995]

Guest complaints alone won't change anything on the plan in the future. What will help make changes is a drop in the DP purchase, or a decline in resturant attendance. Actions speak louder then words my friends

 

[VacationDad]

What's with the hostility there VD? Surely you don't believe that all the information on Disney's website is 100% accurate? I understand that you believe the patrons are apparently lazy and uninformed, but don't you think Disney is partially to blame?

I don't know what the 3 links are, but there have been posts on this board, as recently as today, showing incorrect information on the Disney website. Do you need a link to that?

What a ridiculous and pathetic attack LexPlayer. I was just curious to see these three versions and what the differences were. Wake up on the wrong side of the bed?

 

[mermaid&cinderella]

What is the best email and phone number to speak to a responsible Disney person????

 

[JenSop]

Well, I can only speak for my own experience, but i only found out about the changes by chance.

We are new DVC members and are planning a visit for July 2008. Back in the fall when we were doing our early planning, we were all about the DDP, having used it in 2006. I didn't know about the Disboards, so I had no info from a special source.

And since I wasn't booking a package through Disney, I wasn't looking at anything that had anything to do with Disney packages (we would be booking through MS.)

It was only because a girl at work was starting to put together a Disney wedding for fall '08 that I found out. She asked me about the DDP and I was raving about it about how everything was included, etc. Then she said that she got a brochure about the '08 plan and that it was different. I must admit that I actually didn't believe her. I went onto Disney's website and just went to the Dining Plan page. I DID NOT click on a "package" again because I had not need to book a package as a DVC member. To find out about the change you literally had to go into the section where they talked about the 2008 "Packages." So, yes, I eventually found out, but NOT easily. Shortly after all this, I found the Disboards because the girl at work had a friend who mentioned it on her MySpace page.

It's NEVER okay to explode like that in public, BUT I can see how people might not know. If the girl at work wasn't getting married in Disney, I'd have been totally clueless up until making my ADR's. (and even then, maybe not. WHen I made my ADR's this morning, the CM made NO MENTION of the changes to the DDP.) So not knowing is not always based on stupidity - I almost didn't know - as someone with a very advanced degree, a high IQ, and quite a bit of internet savvy. My point is that it's not always stupid people who are uninformed - some blame has to go with the party that is very bad at doing the informing.

 

[imthegoose]

Tempers Tempers my friends.

Anyway.... I was curious if anyone has recieved the 2008 Vacation planning DVD yet?

My previous comment was never really commented on. The DVD that Disney has been sending out (and has been sending out recently) specifically states that tips are included in the plan. I find it hard to blame a patron if they ordered the DVD 3 months ago, recieved it 2 months ago, heard that tipping is included on the plan, and then booked for 2008. They would call up a CM and book their stay and say they want the dining plan. A plan which in their minds, they did research. Why would they think the Disney video sent out last month would be wrong? If the CM doesn't tell them that the plan has changed, why would the customer think twice about it?

I am planning my first real trip to WDW. The only reason I know about any of this stuff is b/c I'm ridiculously anal and have been researching this trip for over a year. If I based this trip colely on ordering the DVD and booking, I would be one of those angry guests that didn't realize I had to tip. I would feel cheated.

Has anyone booked the DDP based on what they heard in the video? Has a new video been sent out showing what the vacation packages for 2008 really are? I ordered a new video a few days ago but who knows when I'll get it.

Now, everybody be happy. Regardless of who is to blame in this whole fiasco, it's still Disney and it's supposed to make me happy.

 

[hematite153]

Could you please provide the three links to the three different versions of the 2008 Basic Dining Plan? Thanks!

Sorry. I don't sit at my computer with a notebook taking notes about what links I am following.

I know there were multiple versions of the brochure on the Disney website all available at the same time. If I remember correctly, two of them were dated on the bottom of the last page. I think it was the undated version that indicated tip and appetizers still included. I save the latest dated version to my hard drive and overwrite previous versions... now I wish I had saved them all to compare them

I did just find a copy of an older version of the brochure (dated 080307). On the first page it has bold print in the third mickey head bullet under redeeming meals: Gratuities are not inlcuded unless otherwise indicated.

The same bold statement is in the current brochure, dated 010208.

I suspect that the undated brochure that did not include the statement was really an unapproved draft. The brochure did have 2008 on the cover with the purple theme (not the blue 2007 theme), but I bet it was not supposed to be posted on the website.

Thank you, familyS, for the confirmation that others have found these inconsistencies.

Yes, I also delete the old brochures once I have a new one.

You are correct that one of the ones I got rid of had a purple theme.

I know that the one I have (now anyway) says "gratuities not included", but, I didn't read the others closely enough to tell you all of the details--I read them long enough to determine that they weren't what I was looking for.

However, the point I was trying to make does not require me to have keep the old "misinformation" that I found. It is quite simply true that there is conflicting information on disney's website. And, since it is not an easily navigated website, people are likely to just breathe a sigh of relief when they find information and then not question it any further.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

Anyway.... I was curious if anyone has recieved the 2008 Vacation planning DVD yet?

I ordered it, but it hasn't come yet.

 

[hematite153]

Anyway.... I was curious if anyone has recieved the 2008 Vacation planning DVD yet?

My previous comment was never really commented on. The DVD that Disney has been sending out (and has been sending out recently) specifically states that tips are included in the plan. I find it hard to blame a patron if they ordered the DVD 3 months ago, recieved it 2 months ago, heard that tipping is included on the plan, and then booked for 2008. They would call up a CM and book their stay and say they want the dining plan. A plan which in their minds, they did research. Why would they think the Disney video sent out last month would be wrong? If the CM doesn't tell them that the plan has changed, why would the customer think twice about it?

Yikes! I haven't watched a video since 2005, since, when I tried to order the 2006 one I ended up with a very weird voicemail message about the DVDs being unavailable to Canada. (I know that this isn't true, but, decided it wasn't worth arguing about.)

But, seriously, if they were sending out DVDs that indicated gratuities included only a couple of months ago, they are likely to end up with these current problems continuing for a long time to come!

I am sure that lots of people booked their vacations that way, but, that most of these people won't be seen here.

 

[niclodn]

Yikes! I haven't watched a video since 2005, since, when I tried to order the 2006 one I ended up with a very weird voicemail message about the DVDs being unavailable to Canada. (I know that this isn't true, but, decided it wasn't worth arguing about.)

But, seriously, if they were sending out DVDs that indicated gratuities included only a couple of months ago, they are likely to end up with these current problems continuing for a long time to come!

I am sure that lots of people booked their vacations that way, but, that most of these people won't be seen here.

I can confirm that the 2007 DVD was still being sent out in early to mid-December and that yes, it does say appy & tip are included on the DDP. I have been to Disney several times, but am going with my mom for her first visit in January. I ordered the DVD around the first week of December because I thought it would be fun for her to see before we leave. It arrived just before Christmas and I was very disappointed to see it was the 2007 version. Being so close to 2008, I would've thought that the new version would've been out already. I did receive a email last week from Disney saying the 2008 DVD was now available. I have ordered it, but seeing how it takes 2-3 weeks to arrive and we leave in 16 days, I don't expect to receive before our trip.

 

[Kitka]

Anyone with experience in restaurant management knows that the servers had little to no input on this - it was absolutely a management decision. And it is not the servers fault if CRO didn't tell someone about the changes. Anyone that would fail to tip their server out of spite is classless.

When I called in December to book my January 08 trip, I was told multiple times that the Dining Plan had changes and what they were.

 

[disneyfav4ever]

Anyone with experience in restaurant management knows that the servers had little to no input on this - it was absolutely a management decision. And it is not the servers fault if CRO didn't tell someone about the changes. Anyone that would fail to tip their server out of spite is classless.

When I called in December to book my January 08 trip, I was told multiple times that the Dining Plan had changes and what they were.

I agree.

 

[AJackson]

Just my 2 cents - whenever I called to book my trip for October '08 this past October, the CM on the phone reminded me several times that gratuity was not included on the dining plan. One time she even said, "now you're sure you know that gratuity is not included..." lol.
But thanks to the boards and info from Disney's Site, I already knew

 

[reeeoga]

I go in Early FEb.

I booked through AAA.

I have not received any brocures about the changes.
I was not told about the changes when I did ADRs.
My AAA agent did tell me about the changes.
The disney website for dining packages is currently "Sorry, the page you are trying to access is currently not available. "

http://disneyworld.disney.go.com/wdw/tickets/packageDetail?id=PackageDetailMYWDiningPkg07Page

that is the link I get when searching the disney site, notice the "07" in the link.

I have switched $300 of my spending money to cover the tip for the trip.

 

[irene_dsc]

My $.02...

I booked my trip through a TA, after doing a bit of research on the WDW site. (I think I first called her before I found the DIS, when this was "where should we go during ds' winter break" rather than "how to plan WDW") This is the same TA who has booked many, many trips for my MIL, all over the world, and a couple for dh and me. She doesn't specialize in WDW, but books some. Back in late October/early November, she didn't know about the changes to the DDP, until I mentioned it to her. And believe me, wading through the WDW website is a pretty confusing experience, especially when the entire thing is all new to you. Heck, I don't know how anyone expects every CM to know every single detail about how WDW does things, when you consider just how huge the operation is, and the huge volume of different policies to know! But all that to say, if you booked through a TA, I wouldn't be at all surprised if you got out of date information. And I'm fairly certain I didn't get a DDP brochure until check-in, besides what I printed off the website.

BUT - someone definitely should have updated the FAQ by now, and one of the pp's idea of adding a section on the differences between the 07 & 08 plans would be a great idea.

I will say, on my stay (1/2-1/8), I didn't witness a single incident. That may have been partly because I didn't dine at very many places where you order off a menu - only Marrakesh and Wolfgang Puck Cafe. And we did pay OOP for an app at WPC, but at least we knew about it ahead of time. I know I would've been pretty upset if I showed up assuming app's and tips were included, and found out they weren't once I got the bill, however. That's only human nature.

 

[Disneysnel]

You know, I agree with some posters that changing this is all about money.

I think they knew what they were doing when they started the free dining and now I think Disney just wants to make a lot more money and here is why I think this way:

It is a common thing for retailers to take a loss on items to get you in the store and that is what they did with the dining plan. With the hurricanes and 9/11 they had to do something.

They may have a lost a little money on the plan but just think of what they made on fuller hotels, tickets, souveniers, etc. Not to mention having vacationers stay on property longer.

So, in my opinion, the plan was SO successful they felt comfortable in changing it to where they wouldn't lose money on the plan AND get all the perks that come with offering it.

Another word on the servers, don't they also have to pay taxes on what they sell? So, wouldn't a stiff actually COST them money?

Just another of my 2 cents.

 

[SpaceRangerEric]

The disney website for dining packages is currently "Sorry, the page you are trying to access is currently not available. "

QUOTE]

What did you search for? If you put 'Dining Plan' in the search engine, the first choice brings you right to the plan details.

 

[Pumbaa_]

Ok folks time out. Please refer to the guidelines for posting on the boards.

3. NO FIGHTING/SARCASM: While we'd like to think that a Disney fan site is always lighthearted, there are times when there are disagreements. Let's face it, there are certain topics that can transform any of us into a raging "Donald Duck." When you sense this is happening, we ask that you step away from the discussion before it escalates into a fight. Just like Mom always said about fighting, we don't care who started the argument and we don't want it on the DIS. (Okay, she didn't say the part about the DIS, but you know what we mean.) No attacking others and no sarcasm please. Either will result in an infraction.

Keep to the topic, do not attack other posters, respect the fact that other people are allowed to have different opinions and you don't have to agree with their opinions, but you can't attack others.

This is a valuable thread and we don't want to close it

Thanks

 

[trekkie2]

this is more an observation than anything else, I am not talking about the servers or decisions by disney, but all this discussion makes me wonder when tipping became such a set in stone fixed amount? I have always taken "gratuity" to mean the money I am leaving the server because I want to show them I am "grateful" for the good service they have provided me during my meal and appreciate the extra effort to make my dinning nice. I do try to tip well for good service. I know that servers make terrible money and depend on tipping to make a living wage, however I want to be the one to decide what that tip will be. If a restaurant is asking me to pay a manditory % of my check to the server, then I am essentually paying a portion of that persons wage and that is the employers responsibility not mine. Somehow the trend of tipping a certain amount has morphed into you HAVE to tip 10/18/20% not just as Disney ( they are just the ones to list it on paper) I know this is disney policy now and they have the right to make company decisons as they please. I have just noticed that many people posting have spoken of tipping elsewhere in the same terms and wondered what others thought about it.

 

[mermaid&cinderella]

this is more an observation than anything else, I am not talking about the servers or decisions by disney, but all this discussion makes me wonder when tipping became such a set in stone fixed amount? I have always taken "gratuity" to mean the money I am leaving the server because I want to show them I am "grateful" for the good service they have provided me during my meal and appreciate the extra effort to make my dinning nice. I do try to tip well for good service. I know that servers make terrible money and depend on tipping to make a living wage, however I want to be the one to decide what that tip will be. If a restaurant is asking me to pay a manditory % of my check to the server, then I am essentually paying a portion of that persons wage and that is the employers responsibility not mine. Somehow the trend of tipping a certain amount has morphed into you HAVE to tip 10/18/20% not just as Disney ( they are just the ones to list it on paper) I know this is disney policy now and they have the right to make company decisons as they please. I have just noticed that many people posting have spoken of tipping elsewhere in the same terms and wondered what others thought about it.

I completely agree, well put!!!!
I don't know when tipping became mandatory. Here is what "tip" means: "a small present of money given directly to someone for performing a service or menial task; gratuity"
I should not be told by Disney or anyone what I should tip. If I want to tip 0 b/c the service was terrible, I should be able to tip 0 without anyone questioning it. Personally I think 20% tip is extreme for Disney to expect everyone to pay. I will only tip 20% if I get extremely good service which unfortuantely doesn't happen very often (especially at Disney).