the why behind fastpass+

[Arsenal1982]

What makes me chuckle is many on this board who are hard core Disney people can't keep up with the plethora of changes or possible changes to the fast pass plus system. How do you think newbies are gonna do it? Bottom line is this was a pure money move by Disney( yes I know Disney is a business,please don't tell me this) they are just trying to PR the thing as something wonderful for the guests. The old system and a butt load of rides(same cost) would have been so much better and easier for guests to understand and enjoy.

Disney is a business! They are trying to make money.

 

[flicx]

Disney is a business! They are trying to make money.

Why thank you for that! I knew it would come eventually. Better sooner than later.

 

[Vincent405]

Quote:
Originally Posted by flicx
Bottom line is this was a pure money move by Disney( yes I know Disney is a business,please don't tell me this) they are just trying to PR the thing as something wonderful for the guests.

Disney is a business! They are trying to make money.

HA, that didn't take long.

 

[Arsenal1982]

Quote:
Originally Posted by flicx
Bottom line is this was a pure money move by Disney( yes I know Disney is a business,please don't tell me this) they are just trying to PR the thing as something wonderful for the guests.




HA, that didn't take long.

 

[amie416]

I'm actually looking forward to using FP+ for my first visit to WDW since I was a child. Granted, there are issues with the system, but that is to be expected. I started planning this trip before FP+ was announced, read guidebooks and forums, scoured through FAQs and 100s of touring tips... but my stress level has dropped significantly knowing that we have passes for a few key headliners and we can go with the flow for the rest of the day and I don't have to get the rest of my party to wake up early for RD in order to get the best experience from the parks.

I have a few theories as to why the FastPass system was changed... first and foremost, I think FP+ is a carrot offered to entice guests to wear magic bands around the park. I think Magic Bands are the key to Disney's plan to evolve and "plus" the theme park experience, but a bunch of imagineers sat around and asked themselves - how on Earth are we going to get people to wear these things?!? Integrating them in to the FastPass program was a pretty obvious answer because just about every park visitor has at least one ride or attraction that they want to see and will have to wait in line for.

Disney has always been the quintessential American luxury entertainment brand and their position in the market depends on being able to continue to stay plussed above the rest. Disney has to stay ahead of the game in a huge way if it wants to remain the premier name in theme parks. Magic bands are a move towards providing a customized or integrated theme park experience, that could not otherwise be offered without the ability to "know" your customers in the same way that, for example, a DCL stateroom host or waiter can know their guests (or, if you're a cynic, how a casino pit boss can know his clientele.) There is simply too much anonymity in a theme park to be able to plus the service in this way.

Enter: Magic Bands. We know fthat there are two transmitters embedded in a Magic Band. One is a very short-range RFID transmitter that allows you to complete secure-ish transactions like FP+, purchases and opening resort room doors. The other is a medium-range (2.4GHz, I think?) transmitter that can communicate information to the park's Wi-Fi network. (Yeah, free Wi-Fi in the parks? There's a reason for that...)

Exactly how this medium-range transmitter technology will be used is yet to be seen. They need to ensure guest buy-in before they roll out anything else. There's the obvious applications that have been mentioned like data mining, efficient allocation of resources, encouraging increased spending through instant transactions... but there are some more interesting possibilities with this technology...

Imagine: Disney knows which magic bands belong to adults and which belong to children. Through MDX, they also know which MBs are linked. They can locate the MB of a lost child in the park, or the MB of a lost child's guardian. The MB of a young child is exiting the park without the MB of an adult in that party -- instant child abduction red flag that a trained CM can investigate. Maybe someone in your party has a severe food allergy and that information will trigger a pop-up warning on the CM's terminal when you're ordering CS so you can be informed if something is cooked in peanut oil or whatever. The takeaway here would be something to the effect of "When you stay with Disney, Disney looks after your family." That's a much bigger sell for some families than simply "stay with us and we'll let you cut in line" but they need to make sure guests have a reason to wear the band all day.

That's just one theory of the direction they could head in with MB technology... but being able to provide individualized service in the vast sea of people that is a theme park is a definite possibility.

 

[disney1990]

about half way into our second FP+ window I realized that the only thing you have enough time to do between rides on busier days is shopping. With one hour windows, unless you go at the end of one and the beginning of the next you really are doing a lot of waiting around. It's too much time to get from one ride to another, yet not enough time to fit in another ride or a meal. So I think it's mostly about the money.

But I think once the offsite guests are allowed to book in advance it's going to give them a lot more information about when people will be using their tickets and in which parks. Hopefully this will mean they're more prepared when people show up to ride.

But can't you spread out your FP+ times more. Say one at 11 and one at 3 and one at 7? Thus leaving time to do some waiting in other lines? They don't have to be times right next to each other, do they? 11, 12, 1?

 

[Laz]

It bears noting, (and this ties in to the earlier discussion about this Board not being representative of the public at large), that a high percentage of people who are now being "educated" about FP+ for the first time are coming away very disgruntled. This "non-representative" Board is often accused of hating FP+ too much because it sucks the life out of the commando touring style, with the implication that the rest of the public will love it. Well, consider that this Board is far more tailored to people who stay on site, pay attention and know how to use the system before their 60 day window opens up. Given that this Board is a small minority, that means that the majority of guests are either offsite guests, guests who do not learn how to use the system in advance, or some combination of both. I can tell you first hand that from:

• speaking with the CMs,
• speaking with people who stood in long lines for their "day of" FPs,
• being in line with people getting their "same day" FPs,
• listening to people grumble about the length of the FP return lines, and
• seeing peoples' reactions when they eventually found the end point of the FP return lines

that there were very few pixie dust spreading, Zip-A-Dee-Doo-Dah singing, Cheshire Cat grinning guests in those lines. People were livid. They were frustrated. They were ornery, and they were missing the old system very badly. So if Disney is trying to make people happy with this system, it had better learn something from all this testing. I am sure that on site guests were having a grand time. But the people in hour+ long queues just to get their FPs, only to find out an hour later that they weren't going to get what they wanted, were not singing a happy tune. While it is true that this Board is not "representative", we have to realize that this Board is seeing FP+ at its best, because the people here stay on site more, and know how to use the system. Many people now being educated about FP+ are seeing it at its worst. The looks, comments and facial expressions of the CMs betray a system that is giving them headaches, so all cannot be right in the kingdom. Not yet, anyway.

I am usually an on site guest who will stay a minimum of 6 nights with park hopper passes for each day. I would not be having a grand time with only 3 FP+s in one park per day along with the amount of pre planning I would have to do just to eat a meal.

 

[redrosesix]

But can't you spread out your FP+ times more. Say one at 11 and one at 3 and one at 7? Thus leaving time to do some waiting in other lines? They don't have to be times right next to each other, do they? 11, 12, 1?

They don't but we were using hoppers and booking our FP's for the second park. Once you add in a meal or two and fireworks, it's inevitable that you get two windows back to back at times, unless you really want to criss cross the parks. You have to do some strategic planning to not end up with wasted time ie. show up near the end of one window and near the beginning of the next one. You really have to know what you're doing and where you're going to make that work though.

But... apparently they're now allowing people to book in half hour windows, so that will leave even less time to do additional rides unless you space them out as you suggested.

 

[redrosesix]

It is possible that this is by design. Disney has no problem filling parks or selling DVC properties. Disney's only struggle is in filling resort rooms.

It is possible that Disney is finally creating a perk for on-site guests that patrons really value - something short of free dining that will fill their hotel rooms.

I read this earlier and then I thought about it. Then I read it again and I think... you're absolutely right!

If they can use FP+ to entice guests to book resort rooms then they make more money because guests will have to pay for their own food.

But what about those off-site guests that insist they will be able to book in adv because they have an ADR?

 

[mcd2745]

What makes me chuckle is many on this board who are hard core Disney people can't keep up with the plethora of changes or possible changes to the fast pass plus system.

They can keep up with the changes. It's more like they just don't want to and so they are throwing a tantrum.

 

[flicx]

They can keep up with the changes. It's more like they just don't want to and so they are throwing a tantrum.

The changes have come so quick it is mind boggling. Tiers, no tiers one day, glitches. Offsite guests may book ahead , off site guests may not book ahead. If you have an ADR you might be able to book. Apps that work sometimes , some phones apps don't work on. So on and so on. Very confusing even if you are in the know.

 

[JimmyV]

I read this earlier and then I thought about it. Then I read it again and I think... you're absolutely right!

If they can use FP+ to entice guests to book resort rooms then they make more money because guests will have to pay for their own food.

Think about the folks at the back of that FP kiosk line and how frustrated they were. There's a fine line between enticing them to return as future on site guests and ticking them off to the point where they don't want to return at all. If this was intentional, it was a heck of a risk.

 

[PoshMom]

Think about the folks at the back of that FP kiosk line and how frustrated they were. There's a fine line between enticing them to return as future on site guests and ticking them off to the point where they don't want to return at all. If this was intentional, it was a heck of a risk.

All so interesting. Im still reading. Learning more all the time. Wonder if any of the top people read any of these boards.

 

[redrosesix]

Think about the folks at the back of that FP kiosk line and how frustrated they were. There's a fine line between enticing them to return as future on site guests and ticking them off to the point where they don't want to return at all. If this was intentional, it was a heck of a risk.

And this is right too. Although the resort guests I met on my trip weren't too happy about how it is working right now either.

IF the system was working properly and IF it made getting into attractions easier and IF it didn't cause issues with SB lines, it might have been an enticement. My guess is that they didn't plan for it to be working this badly. I have to say that when CMs are making jokes about how the FP+ system is working, things are just not going as planned.

About that Pandora's Box... flicx is right -- too many changes, too much tweaking. They're having problems.

 

[tazadd0420]

I wonder if this is partially in response to us/ioa use of free express pass for on-site guests that book at their top resorts? Seems to be working for us/ioa as I see how many people love the express pass when stay at their resorts.

 

[redrosesix]

All so interesting. Im still reading. Learning more all the time. Wonder if any of the top people read any of these boards.

I wonder that too. What I also wonder is whether they send any of their staff in as mystery shoppers to see how the system is working irl. We were stopped a few times by CMs and asked to participate in surveys on the system -- but we were disqualified from the research because we're not Americans. But IMO you only really know how well it works when you try to use it on a busy park day as regular user. And even more so, as a regular user whose kids have to eat and want to do two different headliners.

 

[jamoka]

First let me say that I am very interested in discussing WHY this change was made... it fascinates me from a business decision (and annoys me from a traveler perspective ha)..So here is my thought (right now)...

I have a hard time believing they are doing this so that the average person has a better experience. I have heard very few people say... I'm never going back to Disney because I had to wait 120 minutes to ride Soarin!... The only times I have heard people say they are not going back is because they can't afford it (which this change doesn't help), or because their kids are too old... which this doesn't help either. Disney wants to make money... so it seems more plausible to me that they are trying to encourage people to stay onsite, or to take the wasted time in between fp's to shop or eat... Or maybe to return to a park for another day due to tiered fp's. It just seems like they could have reached these objectives in other ways... Just thinking...

 

[Angel Ariel]

I don't mean to start more drama. But I'm just wondering what the why is behind fastpass+. Why if the other system was working would they change it? I'm wondering could it be bc some got paper fastpasses and then didn't return with them. Therefore many were wasted when others could have used them. I don't know. I'm just speculating. What would be the cause for this if most were pleased with the old system?

Disney wants more data. MM+ gives them data. The new FP+ system is their way to get consumers to buy in (not monetarily, but to accept) to MM+ and the MBs. It had nothing to do with guest satisfaction wrt legacy FP, IMO, and everything to do with wanting more data from more guests.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I actually don't think data mining has much to do with it at all. The data that they want is the "where are you now, where have you been, what do you like to do, where are you going, what do you spend money on", etc. That can be collected via Magic Bands. And it isn't collected from offsite guests who still use plastic admission cards. The only data that they are mining from FP usage is what rides you FP'ed. That could just as easily be derived from the old system. Each KTTK card was unique and once it was slipped into the old FP machines, they would have gotten the same data that they are getting now. I agree 100% that the NextGen system is geared toward data mining. But I don't think that things like "no hopping" and "no second FPs for the same attraction" have anything to do with data mining. I think the new FP rules are designed to make you spend more time at WDW. Period.

Disney has said that MBs will be sold to offsite guests. What incentive do offsite guests have to buy MBs other than using with the FP+ system?

 

[Angel Ariel]

It is possible that this is by design. Disney has no problem filling parks or selling DVC properties. Disney's only struggle is in filling resort rooms.

It is possible that Disney is finally creating a perk for on-site guests that patrons really value - something short of free dining that will fill their hotel rooms.

I was under the impression that a 79% occupancy rate was pretty dang good in the hotel world...room for growth, yes, but not something I'd call a "struggle" either..