The REAL religion?....

[freckles and boo]

I think all religion is equally fascinating. I also believe all religions are products of the human condition, so they are all equally "REAL".

 

[jimmiej]

That's why I said Some.

Not all of the Southern Baptist are that way. But there are some out there that I have tell met who say only they (S. Baptist) will see heaven.

Ask them what Scripture passage tells them that & watch them stammer.

 

[troobabiee7]

Ask them what Scripture passage tells them that & watch them stammer.

I'm still curious as to what you believe happens to Jews, since they don't believe in Jesus?

 

[PaulusDev]

I personally feel that (most) religions generally provide comforting answers to questions that our brain finds difficult to deal with otherwise. What happens when we die? How did we/the universe get here? What is the right thing to do with life?

We will never know the full answers to these questions and I think most religions just give us comfort. But believing these ever so simple answers may stop us from progressing to understand more about ourselves, the world and the rest of the universe :-(

 

[Amlee]

I'm still curious as to what you believe happens to Jews, since they don't believe in Jesus?

I can't speak for jimmiej, but those that I know(both those that believe only they will go to heaven and those who believe all who believe in Jesus will go) believe just that. If you don't believe in Jesus as your savior then you go to hell. Yes, that includes Jews also.

At least that was how I was raised. Like I said in my orginial post. One of these days there will be many shocked people at the Pearly Gates.

 

[rie'smom]

I think that if you believe and put into action, Love God with all your heart,all your mind and all your soul, then it doesn't matter what faith you follow, you're going to Heaven because you lived a good life.

 

[jimmiej]

Isn't religion supposed to be about love and acceptance? So if a group of people are good people and don't hurt anyone, how could they be "going to hell" simply for not believing in certain aspects of another religion?

Here's what the Bible teaches. No one is "good". All are sinners. The only way to be re-united to God the Father is through a blood sacrifice, i.e. a life for a life. Before Jesus, that was accomplished through the blood of animals (Leviticus 17). Jesus was the final & perfect blood sacrifice (Hebrews 9). One most only accept & believe that to gain eternal life.

At that point, that person's name is written in the Lamb's Book of Life (Revelation 21). When a believer stands before God's judgement seat, God CANNOT see their sin. He will not remember it (Isaiah 43). That person will appear righteous before God.

By contrast, a good person (by human standards) who rejects Jesus, when standing before God on the day of judgement, will appear sinful. God cannot tolerate sin in His presence (Isaiah 59). That person will be sent to Hell (Matthew 25).

So what happens to Jews?

There are some that believe that Jews will still be under the old covenant, given through Moses. Personally, I believe Jesus brought a new covenant (Hebrews 8). Like everyone else, Jews must accept or reject Jesus.

 

[Buckalew11]

It's my understanding that the creed means "catholic" (small "c") as in:

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) –adjective

1. broad or wide-ranging in tastes, interests, or the like; having sympathies with all; broad-minded; liberal.
2. universal in extent; involving all; of interest to all.
3. pertaining to the whole Christian body or church.

From a Christian standpoint, the roadmap, provided in the New Testament, is clear. In order to be a Christian (i.e. spend eternity in heaven), one must 1) acknowledge that all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God; 2) acknowledge and believe that Jesus died to redeem us from those sins; 3) confess Christ as Lord of your life (behaviors change because of #3).

That's it, boiled down. IMO (and only my opinion...), everything else is just "religion" and gingerbread. If you're Catholic, Methodist, Episcopalian, Baptist, etc. etc. ad nauseum, it all boils down to those three steps. The interpretation of #3 is what makes organized religion (and it's what ticked Jesus off about the Sadduccees and Pharisees).

According to the Bible, Jesus is the only path to salvation. In John 14:6, Jesus says, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." In other verses Jesus discusses the need for salvation from sin, and the Bible also says that everyone has sinned and is in need of salvation (Romans 3:23). In Romans 10:9-10, the Bible says, "That if you confess with your mouth, 'Jesus is Lord,' and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved." Thus, I believe that Jesus is the only hope for salvation, and that it's a free gift from God that I can't earn by doing good things (see Ephesians 2:8-9). So I believe that a person must choose to follow Christ in order to have eternal life.

That being said, I don't think that any one denomination is the key. Jesus didn't come to save only Baptists or only Catholics or only Methodists--He came for everyone. So while I believe that one must be a Christian, I don't think the denomation matters in the slightest.

As always, .

I don't know if their is one true religion. I can tell you that I am Jewish, and over the years, I have had Christians tell me that me and my family were going to HELL because we didn't believe in the whole Jesus thing

Acutally I should clarify that, the people who have told me I was going to HELL were Baptists/born again Christians. I have had people tell me when I was a teenager, and then different people tell me when I was an adult with kids, that we were all going to HELL...nice huh? Can't imagine any religion that is an OK practice to tell people

I think their may possibly be some Southern Baptists that would say flat out the Jews will not go to Heaven because they do not accept Christ as messiah.
I am not one of them. I believe the Jews are God's Chosen people and while I believe any denomination that believes the things stated above from ead's post will go to heaven, I also believe there is a covenant/relationship between God and the Jews and I think He has plans for them. While this is only my opinion and I would never, ever want to give anyone a false misunderstanding of scripture, it is what I believe to be true. I certainly would not want a Jew to say (at Judgement) that Brenda said I'd be OK because I am Jewish even though I did not accept Christ as Messiah. It is my belief that while Jesus was sent and was rejected that will not be an automatic door "shutter" for the Jews. I am talking about Jews who practice and not about Jews who were born Jewish.

I'm half Muslim and half Catholic (if you believe that religion is inherited rather than chosen). I was baptised as a baby, but my younger brother wasn't. For junior high, my parents sent me to a Catholic school to avoid some bad things at the public one. On the first day of religion class, the nun announced that everyone who wasn't baptised was going to H***. I was so shocked that this woman who didn't know my father or brother was telling me what was going to happen to them in the afterlife, no matter how good they were in this life! Strangely, this nun had a sign hanging in her classroom that read, "Religion is what we do with the presence of God." That always sounded very accepting of different faiths to me .

Anyway, I am related to Jews, Muslims, Catholics, possible a Buddhist, and some Athiests. There's no way that I could choose the "real" religion among them because they are all my family.

I disagree that only baptized poeple go to heaven so, so much for that part for me and your school teacher. I don't think you "inherit" religion though. I think every person chooses for themselves what they will believe. It does not matter is all your kinfolk were Christians. Or Muslims. Or Buddists. I think, like manna, we all have to get our own portion and make up our own mind. Just because granny was a christian doesn't mean "you" are. And yes, I think (JMHO) that God expects us to each choose--so really you can.

I've been told, by a southern baptist coworker, that I was going to Hell because I wasn't saved, because Catholics don't believe in being saved. He would argue with me that his religion was the one TRUE way to salvation. I have to say, it shocked me, I've never had anyone tell me the way I prayed or my religion was wrong.

Whatever dude.

I'm Southern Baptist and I believe that even though Catholics do not have a specific time of salvation like we have, I do believe that when they are brought up in the belief of Jesus Christ as the Catholic beliefs holds, I think they do tend to 'choose" for themselves what to believe. They may not pinpoint the exact moment they believe in Christ's gift of salvation on the cross but they choose whether to accept it as truth or believe something different. There are many Catholics who say they were brought up in the church/school etc. but do not accept it now. I think those people have made their choice. But the faithful to me as Christians. This type things happens to anyone who is raised in church. There comes a point that you decide for yourself (confirmation and even after that) and it is my belief that everyone has to choose. Now we do differ in thinking one could be baptized as a baby by faith catholic parents and then choose to go astray from the belief. That choice is against God and, to me, whatever happend as a baby does not mean a thing. Your head and your heart must choice God/Jesus/Holy Spirit--not granny. JMHO.

Nope there are others. Some S. Baptist believe it. Most Church of Christ believe it.

There is one local Non-Demonational church that the followers believe only THEY are going to heaven. Just their church, no others. The preacher had all the women in the church remove their wedding rings and "gift" them to the church. He said they didn't need proof of a marrige as their only true relationship is their relationship with God. The offering plate was passed around and the women placed their rings in the plate. The church has just built a newer and bigger church with a lot of land, for the followers to build. The preacher has told all the followers to give their homes to the church and the church will build them a home on the land.

Let's just say we are all watching this with interest!

As a Southen Baptist. I can tell you my church does not subscribe to that type thinking. Also, communion is open to all believers (no matter what denomination).

The church you describe scares me and I automatically think "cult". I am sure it will be interesting to watch it unfold.

 

[Amlee]

As a Southen Baptist. I can tell you my church does not subscribe to that type thinking. Also, communion is open to all believers (no matter what denomination).

The church you describe scares me and I automatically think "cult". I am sure it will be interesting to watch it unfold.

Do you have to be a member of your church to have communion? The church I grew up in (S. Baptist) only members of that church could take part. Non-members were asked not to take part.


Yes, it scares us also. Because their membership has grown by the 100s and there truly isn't a local family who isn't touched by it. My own aunt(who is a member) and uncle(who is not) just about divorced over some of the things that have gone on there.

 

[ZephyrHawk]

I have always said that a god that gave me free will and a thousand potential religions to choose from, and would then condemn me to some form of torment for choosing wrong was not a deity I would follow anyways.

 

[Buckalew11]

Do you have to be a member of your church to have communion? The church I grew up in (S. Baptist) only members of that church could take part. Non-members were asked not to take part.


Yes, it scares us also. Because their membership has grown by the 100s and there truly isn't a local family who isn't touched by it. My own aunt(who is a member) and uncle(who is not) just about divorced over some of the things that have gone on there.

No, you do not have to be a member. If that was said, I can tell you right now, I'd get up and walk out. Then, I'd be in that preacher's office so fast his head would swim. He might kick me out but, by golly, I'd be heard on that one!
I have real problems with people deciding who can and who cannot take communion. It is between them and God. If someone takes it just because everyone else is taking it, shame on them but they'll answer to God for it. If someone takes it because they believe all the things that biblically one must believe to be a Christian but they have not walked up an aisle or done whatever "officially" needs to be but they believe in their heart, I have a problem with someone say, "no, you can't take it." It is between that person and God. I also have problems with other denominations saying I can't take part in communion in their church but that is another can of worms and I'm not going there. I'll just say how dare anyone dare judge my choice (or anyone's) of partaking in communion. I think it is a very intimiate time within the church with God.
More than you asked/wanted. A hot button for me, sorry!

About that church...wow, just wow.

 

[jimmiej]

No, you do not have to be a member. If that was said, I can tell you right now, I'd get up and walk out. Then, I'd be in that preacher's office so fast his head would swim. He might kick me out but, by golly, I'd be heard on that one!
I have real problems with people deciding who can and who cannot take communion. It is between them and God. If someone takes it just because everyone else is taking it, shame on them but they'll answer to God for it. If someone takes it because they believe all the things that biblically one must believe to be a Christian but they have not walked up an aisle or done whatever "officially" needs to be but they believe in their heart, I have a problem with someone say, "no, you can't take it." It is between that person and God. I also have problems with other denominations saying I can't take part in communion in their church but that is another can of worms and I'm not going there. I'll just say how dare anyone dare judge my choice (or anyone's) of partaking in communion. I think it is a very intimiate time within the church with God.
More than you asked/wanted. A hot button for me, sorry!

About that church...wow, just wow.

IA. Our pastor says, if you are a guest & a believer, you are invited to partake in communion with us.

 

[Amlee]

No, you do not have to be a member. If that was said, I can tell you right now, I'd get up and walk out. Then, I'd be in that preacher's office so fast his head would swim. He might kick me out but, by golly, I'd be heard on that one!
I have real problems with people deciding who can and who cannot take communion. It is between them and God. If someone takes it just because everyone else is taking it, shame on them but they'll answer to God for it. If someone takes it because they believe all the things that biblically one must believe to be a Christian but they have not walked up an aisle or done whatever "officially" needs to be but they believe in their heart, I have a problem with someone say, "no, you can't take it." It is between that person and God. I also have problems with other denominations saying I can't take part in communion in their church but that is another can of worms and I'm not going there. I'll just say how dare anyone dare judge my choice (or anyone's) of partaking in communion. I think it is a very intimiate time within the church with God.
More than you asked/wanted. A hot button for me, sorry!

About that church...wow, just wow.

Oh no, I'm always interested in people's beliefs. I am always interested in the why of it all. Some are more open with their replies others are not and don't think they should be questioned at all.

Just last week waiting for my plane there was a group of girls in long black velvet robes. I would have loved to have asked them what it was all about. But I have got my head bit off more than onces. So I rarely ask anymore.

 

[Buckalew11]

No Amlee, I did not mean anything about you--you are just like me, curious about it all. I like to talk about it and I have read you before and enjoy talking with you.
I'm just saying how dare members of a church or a minister question who can or cannot take the Holy Communion. That is my beef. If someone takes it and they should not be taking it, that is strictly between them and God IMHO.

 

[troobabiee7]

One of these days there will be many shocked people at the Pearly Gates.

I agree

There are some that believe that Jews will still be under the old covenant, given through Moses. Personally, I believe Jesus brought a new covenant (Hebrews 8). Like everyone else, Jews must accept or reject Jesus.

That's something I'll never understand I'm not questioning your beliefs and this is a general statement, not specifically to you. I just personally will never understand the point of view that if you feed all the starving children in the world and shelter the homeless, yet don't believe in a certain aspect of a specific religion, you're believed to be going to hell. It all seems very hypocritical. That's why religion is so subjective. There are SO many religions out there and while many of them agree on several levels, a lot of them don't. Everyone has their own beliefs and faith so there's no such thing as a "TRUE" religion. It's really interesting.

 

[heimlichfan]

I'm fascinated and interested in this conversation...

First, kudos to all of you for being so respectful. This thread could have gotten nasty but it appears to be a frank and positive conversation about religion...

Second, please continue! I was raised without religion (not baptized, not atheist, nuttin') and have been on a spiritual quest for most of my life to better understand religious teachings.

I don't believe in one true religion - I have a hard time believing any one group is right when dealing with something as personal as a relationship with God.

 

[jimmiej]

That's something I'll never understand I'm not questioning your beliefs and this is a general statement, not specifically to you. I just personally will never understand the point of view that if you feed all the starving children in the world and shelter the homeless, yet don't believe in a certain aspect of a specific religion, you're believed to be going to hell. It all seems very hypocritical. That's why religion is so subjective. There are SO many religions out there and while many of them agree on several levels, a lot of them don't. Everyone has their own beliefs and faith so there's no such thing as a "TRUE" religion. It's really interesting.

I addressed that in post #67. There are those like Brenda that believe the Jews will be held to the original covenant. However, Jesus (and Paul) were both Jews & spoke of a new covenant. That issue is still debated today among Christians.

As far as the bolded above, the Bible is very clear salvation is by grace through faith, not by works.

 

[Buckalew11]

For me, it is the difference between NOT what I do for God but what He did for me.

My outlook on "being good": How good? Say you feed all the starving children and I do not but I am a still "good". Why would I be rewarded as you are? (with heaven) Was I "good enough"?
Sure, God knows hearts and knows we were both good and could judge accordingly but would it be fair to say, 'good enough, not good enough, good enough, not good enough"? I think we are all capable of the same amount of goodness. So, if you set the standard, your standard would be set very high. Could I reach that standard? You betcha--if I tried and gave it my all. And so could everyone else who tried hard enough. If my "good" was the set standard, then mine would be much easier to reach than yours.I don;t think it'd be fair to give everyone their own standard. We could all be better.

And if people REALLY believed that being good could earn your way into Heaven, the world would not be as it is today. People would really try much harder than we as a whole do, don't you think? The pixie dust on this board would be floating everywhere in our real lives because we would be judged on our goodness. I cannot believe that people really think they're being good enough in this life to be judged by God for it. JMHO, of course.

 

[troobabiee7]

As far as the bolded above, the Bible is very clear salvation is by grace through faith, not by works.

That's exactly what I'll never understand. My grandparents are pretty religious Roman Catholics and believe the same, but it's not something I'd ever be able to believe. I'm in the "faith without the Bible" category. I truly believe that all good people will go somewhere good, regardless of their religious beliefs - I'm more of a believer in "salvation through works." I've taken several World Religions classes and its fascinating to learn about the different beliefs, because essentially everyone just wants to feel happy, loved and safe, just in their own ways. And to think how much less violence there would be in the world if everyone could just respect each others beliefs, which I'll admit is hard when someone's beliefs directly target random others just for being who they are or believing something different. I'll say it again, it's all pretty interesting!

 

[Buckalew11]

I addressed that in post #67. There are those like Brenda that believe the Jews will be held to the original covenant. However, Jesus (and Paul) were both Jews & spoke of a new covenant. That issue is still debated today among Christians.

As far as the bolded above, the Bible is very clear salvation is by grace through faith, not by works.

jimmie, I am not sure that I believe the Jews will be saved totally through the old covenant. I do believe that because the Jews did not accept Jesus as Messiah thatHe opened it for all people. Now, to me, that will only last for a time (the last days--which began after Jesus died and will end when we are taken and the Holy Spirit is no longer here). I believe that during this time, in which we now live, that God has put the Jews ''on hold" and that He will "get back to them" at an appointed time. Then I think God will continue His intial dealings with them. I have no idea what he has in store for them at that time. Again, this is just me and there may be no one else here who will agree with this thought on the topic. I would not advise anyone to "hang their hat" on my beliefs about this topic.I think this is Biblical, from daniel and is more complicated than I can type out.