The Genie Usage, Tips and Strategy ONLY Thread

[rmclain73]

My immediate reaction to this is “It’s early”.

GLL+ is definitely more available now because (1) the parks haven’t been that crowded, and (2) Genie + is brand new and I would guess that a lower percentage of park guests aren’t using it, either because they don’t know about it, don’t know it works, aren’t willing or able to pay extra, or don’t think it’s necessary because standby lines haven’t been that long.

As crowds and standby lines grow, and more people decide there is value in Genie+, we might find that it will be difficult to get as much mileage out of Genie+ as we can today. Those “free” 3 scheduled FPs for headliner attractions at times we chose might look pretty good.

But, in the meantime, I intend to take full advantage of it.

The other thing to consider is that Disney may have a threshold of people who use it before they decide to increase they daily fee to keep LL's available and the lines moving.

 

[snikki]

One pro to the stacking aspect of Genie+ being difficult to wrap your head around at first is that your average park visitor will have no idea whats going on. Everyone on this forum will have a much greater advantage and get the most out of the $15.98 charge.

Yup. 98% of park goers will start booking G+ around 9-10 am (or whatever time they arrive to the park) and book them as they go. One at a time. They’ll get 5-6 a day and be happy with it. They won’t be trying to strategize or finding the ins and outs. It’s only a college level course for people on these boards (including myself).

 

[DisneyKidds]

Question: After booking the 2nd ride, could I cancel the JC and rebook it for later? Or will I lose it since I now have PP booked? It's a different slot, so I'm hopeful it could work, just can't remember if this has been tested.

I think that may be covered in Stacking 450: Advanced Stacking Steategies.

 

[wisblue]

So with stacking is the rules always to book a LL then use the existing LL?

Not necessarily. If your first LL is far enough out, you might end up booking and rebooking a second one multiple times before you use the first one.

For example, if at 7 AM you book Slinky for 2 PM, you could make a second selection at 11 AM. If that one has a return time of say 12:30 PM, you could use that one and book another before using the one for Slinky.

 

[Orsino]

I see multiple strategies developing in this thread, which is great. What is less great is overlapping terms and discussions can get a bit confusing.

Here is what I've gleaned from this thread, with some made-up terms I'm using to try and keep the strategies distinct.

- "stacking" refers to the Genie+ implementation where a user becomes eligible for a new LL reservation 120 minutes after having not been eligible for some other reason. 'stacking' refers to the fact that this process will lead to holding more than one LL at the same time.

- "hop stacking" refers to the strategy of collecting LL reservations at a park other than your initial park reservation park. The system will automatically offer LL times after the 2PM park hop restriction to facilitate collection of useful LL.

- "double stacking" refers to the strategy of getting the initial LL reservation for a return time around 2 hours after park open so that the 120 minute "stacking" strategy comes into play (LL#2), followed shortly by redemption of the first LL and booking LL#3.

- "minimum cycle time" (jargony, sorry: maybe there is a better term. I wanted to avoid the term 'greedy' which is also jargony) refers to the strategy of getting as many LL as possible as quickly as possible to maximize the use of LL. Stacking is unlikely to come into play with this strategy as the user is trying to get their next LL quickly by using the previous one asap. The key to this strategy is to get the popular LL that winds up with late return times quickly for early in the day. A 7AM start with Genie+ is a must.

My view is that 'minimum cycle time' makes the most sense for users who are not interested in re-riding any attractions. If you aren't going to re-ride something, then using LL to skip a 'short wait' 15 minute line is perfectly reasonable since you aren't coming back anyway. However, for users interested in re-riding attractions, when to use LL for a particular ride becomes part of the strategy. In other words, re-rides means you have to use standby at some point, so that standby wait will want to be during the short wait opportunity.

I think 'double stacking' makes the most sense for users interested in riding the same ride multiple times. Ride standby at rope drop when standby lines are most reasonable, then use the double stack after the first 120 minutes of the day.

The final strategy I'm trying to formulate is 'late arrival stacking.' (No hopping) On arrival day, I'm getting to MCO around 3PM. This is too late to make use of 'hop stacking.' I'm eyeing rides that get pushed to late return times early in the day (e.g. Jungle Cruise). I don't think I'd be able to get a 4PM or 5PM return time at 8:55AM so this strategy is one I'll be watching for feasibility.

 

[DavidNYC]

My immediate reaction to this is “It’s early”.

GLL+ is definitely more available now because (1) the parks haven’t been that crowded, and (2) Genie + is brand new and I would guess that a lower percentage of park guests aren’t using it, either because they don’t know about it, don’t know it works, aren’t willing or able to pay extra, or don’t think it’s necessary because standby lines haven’t been that long.

As crowds and standby lines grow, and more people decide there is value in Genie+, we might find that it will be difficult to get as much mileage out of Genie+ as we can today. Those “free” 3 scheduled FPs for headliner attractions at times we chose might look pretty good.

But, in the meantime, I intend to take full advantage of it.

That's my impression as well. Where this is making the most difference is that for those who wish to get up at 7am, it is much easier to at least get a couple LL in the morning day of. As for availability when you hit midday? I noticing some adjustments to how it works moreso than availability. I could easily get a FP for most rides with some light refreshing previously. There are very few rides that aren't ILL where I'm noticing any signficantly increased availability compared to what you could do before.

If you had no idea what FP+ was and showed up at the park without anything booked, you'll find more availability and be better off. If you knew what you were doing with FP+, I think you'll find your availability about the same or a little worse since you'll have less ability to choose time slots for yourself.

 

[leeniewdw]

All looks good to me and I understood your explanations!

The final strategy I'm trying to formulate is 'late arrival stacking.' (No hopping) On arrival day, I'm getting to MCO around 3PM. This is too late to make use of 'hop stacking.' I'm eyeing rides that get pushed to late return times early in the day (e.g. Jungle Cruise). I don't think I'd be able to get a 4PM or 5PM return time at 8:55AM so this strategy is one I'll be watching for feasibility.

Yes, we'll need to use this as well. We'll buy ILL$ on our arrival day at 7am and book them for pretty late (to account for travel delays), then try to monitor regular LL slots as they move into the timeframe we might be able to use them. For one of our trips, it's EPCOT as arrival day park, and I'm not even sure it makes sense for G+ since it'll be evening on a day that's expected to be lower crowds. But we may try it anyway just to see how it goes.

 

[Disturbia]

That's my impression as well. Where this is making the most difference is that for those who wish to get up at 7am, it is much easier to at least get a couple LL in the morning day of. As for availability when you hit midday? I noticing some adjustments to how it works moreso than availability. I could easily get a FP for most rides with some light refreshing previously. There are very few rides that aren't ILL where I'm noticing any signficantly increased availability compared to what you could do before.

If you had no idea what FP+ was and showed up at the park without anything booked, you'll find more availability and be better off. If you knew what you were doing with FP+, I think you'll find your availability about the same or a little worse since you'll have less ability to choose time slots for yourself.

Maybe add multiple stacking (more than 2)-we can call it the cliff hanger strategy

and also ‘in window strategy’

 

[thanxfornoticin]

The other thing to consider is that Disney may have a threshold of people who use it before they decide to increase they daily fee to keep LL's available and the lines moving.

Agreed. We equate G+ mostly with MaxPass at DL. We loved using MaxPass and have hopes G+ will be a positive. But MaxPass started at $10 (I believe), and then went to $15 and eventually $20. This fee will likely climb at both parks.

 

[Disturbia]

Also, is it verified that for 11 am stacking I don’t need to be in the park? Epcot on travel checkin day

 

[badinnplaid]

Yeah, this still works as long as the time's work I think. DISCLAIMER, I don't know any more than anyone else who hasn't been. But these exercises actually help me!

7am	grab a 10:45+ LL for MFSR	Stack = 1LL
8:30am	RD either SDD or TT/RRC
9-11am	Standby Rides
11:00am	Book HS LL2 for 1:15	Stack = 2LL
11:10am	Tap into MFSR	Stack = 1LL
11:11am	Book MK LL1 for post 2:30	Stack = 2LL
11:12-1:00	Standby Rides/Lunch
1:00pm	Book MK LL2 for post 2:30	Stack = 3LL
1:15pm	Tap into HS LL2 ride selected at 11am	Stack = 2LL
1:16pm	Book MK LL3 for 3:00+	Stack = 3LL
1:30pm	Depart HS for MK
2:00pm	Arrive at MK with 3 LLs	Stack = 3LL
2:00pm on	cycle the stack ride by ride always booking another LL before you tap into the next ride

And actually this is what post #257 is all about, IIRC they talked about maybe grabbing another HS ride but opted not to.

This is super helpful (as is post 257)! So I think I definitely get how to build our stack early in the day. What I'm a little unsure of is if I understand the order of operations required to maintain that stack of 3 if we want to do like was done in post 257. Like am I basically doing the exact same thing at 3:00, 5:00, and 7:00 as I did earlier or are those times now irrelevant? Why is this so hard for my brain?

 

[ruthies12]

I want to know if it is possible to purchase an ILL for 7D between 7:00 and 8:00 on a night when you only have a Very Merry After Hours ticket?

I'm attending the after hours party but mine train always has a longer wait even in after hours parties and it's our only visit to the park that trip. I'm staying offsite so I'm wondering if the morning of our party ticket at park opening can I purchase a ILL for mine train do you think? I don't want regular G+ obviously since I can't enter the park until 7:00 pm, just want to do the one ILL during the regular park hours before the party starts...........

 

[leeniewdw]

Also, is it verified that for 11 am stacking I don’t need to be in the park? Epcot on travel checkin day

Correct as far as what has been reported. That's my plan as well.

This is super helpful (as is post 257)! So I think I definitely get how to build our stack early in the day. What I'm a little unsure of is if I understand the order of operations required to maintain that stack of 3 if we want to do like was done in post 257. Like am I basically doing the exact same thing at 3:00, 5:00, and 7:00 as I did earlier or are those times now irrelevant? Why is this so hard for my brain?

Again, standard discalimer! But I think once you got to MK in this hypothetical day, you'd probably just be cycling the LLs as you use them. So if your first 3 rides at MK were this:

2:15 JC (MK LL1)
2:45 Pirates (MK LL2)
3:30 HM (MK LL3)

Your plan could be:
2:15 Tap into JC
2:16 Grab MK LL4 (replaces LL1)
2: 45 Tap into Pirates
2:46 Grab MK LL5 (replaces LL2)
3:30 Tap into HM
3:31 Grab MK LL6 (replaces LL3)

So basically you've kept 3 LLs except the moment between tapping in (drop down to 2) and then grabbing another. However, on this mythical timeline what about:

2:15 JC (MK LL1)
2:45 Pirates (MK LL2)
3:30 HM (MK LL3)

Your plan could be:
2:15 Tap into JC
2:16 Grab MK LL4 (replaces LL1)
2: 45 Tab into Pirates
2:46 Grab MK LL5 (replaces LL2)
3:00 Grab MK LL6 (new to the stack, now you have LL3, LL4, LL5, and LL6 in hand!!!)
3:30 Tap into HM
3:31 Grab MK LL7 (replaces LL3) (still have LLs 4-7, stack of 4)

LOL, no clue if this would work. It would greatly depend on the return times available. I believe post 257 said that they had to work to find a good time for one of their returns.

I think the post using Ax, Bx, Cx might be more helpful because it's shows how you are cycling the same slot in the stack, but you get it.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

One pro to the stacking aspect of Genie+ being difficult to wrap your head around at first is that your average park visitor will have no idea whats going on. Everyone on this forum will have a much greater advantage and get the most out of the $15.98 charge.

Yes, it's this exactly. Stacking lets you effectively pull twice as many to three times as many LL's in a day as an average user. Regular users aren't going to know about stacking, heck, Disney doesn't even publish the 120 minute "cooldown" anywhere (does it?) Anyone who reads this thread has a massive advantage.

Also, is it verified that for 11 am stacking I don’t need to be in the park? Epcot on travel checkin day

Yes. You do not need to be in the park to make LL's. You could, if you want, with a valid ticket and park pass, purchase G+ and make LL selections all day long without ever entering the park.

 

[badinnplaid]

Correct as far as what has been reported. That's my plan as well.



Again, standard discalimer! But I think once you got to MK in this hypothetical day, you'd probably just be cycling the LLs as you use them. So if your first 3 rides at MK were this:

2:15 JC (MK LL1)
2:45 Pirates (MK LL2)
3:30 HM (MK LL3)

Your plan could be:
2:15 Tap into JC
2:16 Grab MK LL4 (replaces LL1)
2: 45 Tap into Pirates
2:46 Grab MK LL5 (replaces LL2)
3:30 Tap into HM
3:31 Grab MK LL6 (replaces LL3)

So basically you've kept 3 LLs except the moment between tapping in (drop down to 2) and then grabbing another. However, on this mythical timeline what about:

2:15 JC (MK LL1)
2:45 Pirates (MK LL2)
3:30 HM (MK LL3)

Your plan could be:
2:15 Tap into JC
2:16 Grab MK LL4 (replaces LL1)
2: 45 Tab into Pirates
2:46 Grab MK LL5 (replaces LL2)
3:00 Grab MK LL6 (new to the stack, now you have LL3, LL4, LL5, and LL6 in hand!!!)
3:30 Tap into HM
3:31 Grab MK LL7 (replaces LL3) (still have LLs 4-7, stack of 4)

LOL, no clue if this would work. It would greatly depend on the return times available. I believe post 257 said that they had to work to find a good time for one of their returns.

I think the post using Ax, Bx, Cx might be more helpful because it's shows how you are cycling the same slot in the stack, but you get it.

Okay--this is all great news (assuming it works this way)! That was my hope was that once you have the three, you're just replacing as you use and not really worrying about times anymore. I still think I'm gonna have to write down a flow chart or something to carry around with me to keep track of it all!

 

[DsnyDreaminDad]

You're definitely at the mercy of what the park goers are doing that day, it drives me nuts how this works over the previous iteration of line skipping. The planning is gone and to maximize G+ you have to keep crossing the park all day - not the way we tour the parks.

A mix of low wait headliners and reaching ahead for hopping seems to be the most logical use of G+ right now - as long as they keep allowing the ride stacking for the later park.

I find the lack of planning capable with Genie+ to be frustrating also. I like to go through the parks systematically and enjoy each area. We typically do Magic Kingdom in 2 days and we might not even go into Tomorrowland on the same day that we focus on Frontier land and Adventure land. Genie+ (if I choose to use it) will have me crisscrossing each park all day long. That just sounds stressful and exhausting.

 

[DisneyKidds]

I see multiple strategies developing in this thread, which is great.

Yes. Honestly, with every fiber of my Disney being I want to not like G+, nor to give Cheapek more of my hard earned $$$. However…if I can master the double (aka: cliff hanger) hop stack then maybe, just maybe, I can get something more useful out of G+ than FP+ used to get us for “free”.

What we used effectively with FP+ was doing one park rope drop and booking FP+ for late day in a hop to park, like Epcot. I can envision a double/cliff hanger hop stack whereby we book a 1:00ish return window in the morning RD park, then at 11am book LL2 for after 2pm in the hop park, then at 1:00 book LL3 in the hop park before tapping into LL1. For instance, RD HS with a 1:00 G+LL for RnR. Hopefully knock a bunch out standby in HS (don’t care about wasting G+ on Slinky, or ILL$ on RotR or MMRR, they aren’t that great for us) while securing LL2 and LL3, then use LL1 before we get out of HS. Take a break back at the hotel (we are big fans of that). Then hop to Epcot with Soarin and Test Track secured via LL2 and LL3, with another ride (say Spaceship Earth) booked via LL1 after we tap into RnR. That would theoretically allow us to hop to Epcot with 3 rides secured (including both Soarin and TT, which you couldn’t do with tiering under FP+), and the potential to additionally work the stacks for more at Epcot (if anything is available). That would be getting something more for my $15.98pp than we could achieve under FP+. That’s all dependent upon what available return time are, but it’s got potential!

Any flaws in that cliff hanger hop stack??

 

[PaladinButters]

Yup. 98% of park goers will start booking G+ around 9-10 am (or whatever time they arrive to the park) and book them as they go. One at a time. They’ll get 5-6 a day and be happy with it. They won’t be trying to strategize or finding the ins and outs. It’s only a college level course for people on these boards (including myself).

Even though I'm here taking that advanced course with everybody else, if my $15 gets me on the rides I *need* them for (so yes to the Jungle Cruise but I can wait a few minutes for the Mad Tea Party) I'm good. I am very prepared for the return times to not work out in my favor for everything when I get there.

BUT -

Question - do we know how long the line for LL is aka how much time it saves to use? The line for Slinky is at 100 minutes (so lets say the real line is 75?) - LL is sold out, so a bunch of people must have them for each hour - if I enter the LL line at my time slot how long am I waiting? Almost walk-on? 20 minutes? 40?

 

[leeniewdw]

Any flaws in that cliff hanger hop stack??

I think that works. I think (depending on crowd levels and capacity) hopping to a 2nd park with 3 LLs in your pocket is pretty doable as things stand right now. As has been said in a general sense, HS and MK seem like the best parks to use G+LL due to the # of rides available, but your example should work (depending on crowd levels and capacity).

We're doing an afternoon/evening at EPCOT on arrival day (no hopping) and I'll probably use G+ anyway because...I want to see how it works!

I just took a look at times in EPCOT and AK and there's not really anything that's a long SB. This might not be the week to figure out how this will go if when you're traveling it'll be a much bigger crowd.

 

[wisblue]

Also, is it verified that for 11 am stacking I don’t need to be in the park? Epcot on travel checkin day

So far at Epcot the only attraction that has been having a LL return time more than 2 hours out is Test Track. You could book that at 11 and then do a second one at 1 PM even if you aren’t in the park.