The answer to $15.00 Hour fast food restaurant wages

[Bianca and Bernard]

So, if fast food workers are worth $15 an hour, what are these Disney workers worth?

http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Employer=The_Walt_Disney_Company/Hourly_Rate#by_Job

Employer: The Walt Disney Company Median Hourly Rate by Job
Job
National Hourly Rate Data PayScale survey.

Bus Driver

$12.79
Concierge

$10.34


Project Coordinator, (Unknown Type / General)

$23.34


Guest Services Agent

$12.74


Reservations Sales Agent

$12.34


Secretary

$17.01


Production Assistant

$17.60


How much more are YOU willing to pay at Disney for those people to make more money?

 

[Happyinwonerland]

I have a better job. I have a bachelor's degree. Not everyone has had my advantages. Someone must do these jobs and these people must be able to eat and pay rent while they do them. As another poster pointed out, everyone cannot be in management, someone must be a laborer. As decent human beings, we cannot deny them the necessities of life.

Nobody is denying them the necessities of life. There are ways to get by when you are low income. Shared housing, working multiple jobs, government assistance. There is no reason anyone should go without basic food shelter and healthcare.

 

[MagicaDeSpell]

You are also forgetting that the vast majority of businesses are small business and can not simply lower their profit margin or eat all the costs. For them to do that they would have to change something and that would most likely be reduce their labour force.

I'm not forgetting, I thought we were a capitalist country (speaking of the US). If a business cannot keep up with the cost of doing business, it is not entitled to survive. Right now, in the US, minimum wage workers only survive because they are receiving government assistance, which means those *companies* are being subsidized by our tax dollars creating a situation where they don't have to pay a living wage, we make up the difference.

The problem is an artificial one.

 

[Goofy_Disney_Dad]

So, if fast food workers are worth $15 an hour, what are these Disney workers worth?

http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Employer=The_Walt_Disney_Company/Hourly_Rate#by_Job

Employer: The Walt Disney Company Median Hourly Rate by Job
Job
National Hourly Rate Data PayScale survey.

Bus Driver

$12.79
Concierge

$10.34


Project Coordinator, (Unknown Type / General)

$23.34


Guest Services Agent

$12.74


Reservations Sales Agent

$12.34


Secretary

$17.01


Production Assistant

$17.60


How much more are YOU willing to pay at Disney for those people to make more money?

I'd pay between .01% and 54.3% more for my Disney Vacations.

 

[declansdad]

You may have missed it, but earlier I posted the statistic that 44% of minimum wage workers already have more than a high school education. There are more unskilled labor jobs in the country than there are unskilled laborers. I remember in 2009 when college graduates, even MBAs, were swamping McDonalds franchises across the country with applications whenever they said there were openings.

Having over-qualified employees doesn't change the fact that the jobs are still unskilled jobs. You can't confuse the person with the job.

 

[Happyinwonerland]

You may have missed it, but earlier I posted the statistic that 44% of minimum wage workers already have more than a high school education. There are more unskilled labor jobs in the country than there are unskilled laborers. I remember in 2009 when college graduates, even MBAs, were swamping McDonalds franchises across the country with applications whenever they said there were openings.

I think when people go to college, they should be very judicious in choosing a career path. MBAs, Lawyers, teachers- those markets have been flooded since before the recession. When looking at educational options, people should do some research and go toward a field that has job growth potential and stability.

The same thing is happening right now with nurse practitioners. There has been a big rush among many RNs to go back to school and become NPs. Now the market is saturated with NP grads who have $60k-$100k in student loans and can't find jobs paying more than about $60k a year. Meanwhile bedside nurses and nurse educators are being offered way more than those with the higher degrees, because those jobs are heavy workload careers that most people do to want to deal with for very long.

We do a poor job in this country of helping people select college majors. 18 year old kids choosing $80k degrees in English or Psych, colleges and parents should be ashamed.

 

[declansdad]

I'm not forgetting, I thought we were a capitalist country (speaking of the US). If a business cannot keep up with the cost of doing business, it is not entitled to survive. Right now, in the US, minimum wage workers only survive because they are receiving government assistance, which means those *companies* are being subsidized by our tax dollars creating a situation where they don't have to pay a living wage, we make up the difference.

The problem is an artificial one.

The minimum wage is an artificial wage, one that wouldn't exist in completely capitalist society. If a worker cannot survive on the market price for labour they need to so something to improve their skills so that they can earn more money. If they don't, they won't survive.

So by definition, you are not a truly capitalist country.

 

[MagicaDeSpell]

Having over-qualified employees doesn't change the fact that the jobs are still unskilled jobs. You can't confuse the person with the job.

I think when people go to college, they should be very judicious in choosing a career path. MBAs, Lawyers, teachers- those markets have been flooded since before the recession. When looking at educational options, people should do some research and go toward a field that has job growth potential and stability.

I brought up the fact that so many minimum wage workers already are college educated to some degree in response to the many people calling for them to get off their butts and get educated to improve their lives. A college degree or other credential does a lot of good for an individual, but it doesn't guarantee a good paying job. There are more minimum wage jobs available than well paying jobs, and society actually depends on a lot of the minimum wage labor for maintenance, so that kind of work is never going away even if everyone went out and got a useful degree.

 

[Mom of a great kid]

You are also forgetting that the vast majority of businesses are small business and can not simply lower their profit margin or eat all the costs. For them to do that they would have to change something and that would most likely be reduce their labour force.

And go out of business? Or do the work themselves without compensation? No, the employer would cut his other costs. There was a time when a person could indeed support a family on a minimum wage job. Minimum wage has not kept up with inflation. People making minimum wage often qualify for government benefits, paid for by you, me and the other taxpayers. We don't benefit from the employee's work, the employer does, and he should pay for it. Also, most minimum wage earners do not work for small businesses.

 

[MagicaDeSpell]

The minimum wage is an artificial wage, one that wouldn't exist in completely capitalist society. If a worker cannot survive on the market price for labour they need to so something to improve their skills so that they can earn more money. If they don't, they won't survive.

So by definition, you are not a truly capitalist country.

Of course, the market price for labor would have to go up if we were no longer depressing the market price by paying much of the cost of living for these people, because survival is an inelastic demand and industry's need for labor is also pretty inelastic.

 

[declansdad]

I brought up the fact that so many minimum wage workers already are college educated to some degree in response to the many people calling for them to get off their butts and get educated to improve their lives. A college degree or other credential does a lot of good for an individual, but it doesn't guarantee a good paying job. There are more minimum wage jobs available than well paying jobs, and society actually depends on a lot of the minimum wage labor for maintenance, so that kind of work is never going away even if everyone went out and got a useful degree.

I never said it would go away but that doesn't change the fact that the value of unskilled jobs is not $15 per hour.

 

[MagicaDeSpell]

PS During the period of American history where industry got away with paying less than the cost of living, they used violence to keep workers working and prevent organizing. They also used to lock people into sweatshops, which caused the Shirtwaist Factory tragedy when it burned down. Otherwise there has never been a period when industry could afford to pay labor less than it needed to survive because then there would be no labor as the workforce died off. Not even slavery could get away from that law of nature and economics, even though they didn't actually pay the workforce, they still had to keep them alive to work them.

 

[MagicaDeSpell]

I never said it would go away but that doesn't change the fact that the value of unskilled jobs is not $15 per hour.

I'm willing to debate the $15/hour part, but not the living wage part. The worker is worth his bread.

 

[Happyinwonerland]

I brought up the fact that so many minimum wage workers already are college educated to some degree in response to the many people calling for them to get off their butts and get educated to improve their lives. A college degree or other credential does a lot of good for an individual, but it doesn't guarantee a good paying job. There are more minimum wage jobs available than well paying jobs, and society actually depends on a lot of the minimum wage labor for maintenance, so that kind of work is never going away even if everyone went out and got a useful degree.

I think the idea is that the uneducated/less experienced do those lower wage jobs while working their way up. Teenager works McDonald's in high school to save for college; in college, same teenager maybe works part time as a CNA or in a factory part time to help with bills. Maybe they do an Amazon warehouse or UPS type deal where they work 24 hours on the weekends. They earn the bachelor's degree and move onto either grad school or entry level their career field. After a few years of work, they get that promotion to manager, and so on and so on. Meanwhile, the next generation is working their way up, starting with the mcdonalds job in high school.

I don't think it was ever meant for people to stay in the entry level job, but for there to always be new people to train for the low wage job while starting the path to work up.

 

[longboard55]

Decisions have consequences, a certain group rejected $10.10 and the backlash was $15.

 

[declansdad]

And go out of business? Or do the work themselves without compensation? No, the employer would cut his other costs. There was a time when a person could indeed support a family on a minimum wage job. Minimum wage has not kept up with inflation. People making minimum wage often qualify for government benefits, paid for by you, me and the other taxpayers. We don't benefit from the employee's work, the employer does, and he should pay for it. Also, most minimum wage earners do not work for small businesses.

The cost of labour is typically the largest cost an employer has. If a small business is forced to increase the hourly wage it pays its employees it will look cut costs and most small businesses have stated that means hiring fewer employees or laying off existing employees. How does that help?

If the employer was able to absorb the cost of increasing its lowest jobs to $15 per hour, it would then need to look for ways to increase the wages it pays to its skilled employees. If they couldn't increase the cost of their goods again they would need to look to savings in other areas, like labour. Looks like more people out of work.

 

[FairestOfThemAll37]

I think the idea is that the uneducated/less experienced do those lower wage jobs while working their way up. Teenager works McDonald's in high school to save for college; in college, same teenager maybe works part time as a CNA or in a factory part time to help with bills. Maybe they do an Amazon warehouse or UPS type deal where they work 24 hours on the weekends. They earn the bachelor's degree and move onto either grad school or entry level their career field. After a few years of work, they get that promotion to manager, and so on and so on. Meanwhile, the next generation is working their way up, starting with the mcdonalds job in high school.

I don't think it was ever meant for people to stay in the entry level job, but for there to always be new people to train for the low wage job while starting the path to work up.

But it's not a 1:1 like that. There's not a manager position available for every college graduate trying to support a family trying to work their way up to a living wage. There isn't even close to a 1:1 for leaving and entering the workforce as those graduating now are painfully aware of.

Your ideal leaves a whole lot of people stuck in the lower level jobs. It's simply not possible for everybody to get the better paying jobs.

Working your way up is only a reality for a very few. Hence why this is a systemic issue and not an individual one. It is a complex problem and quite difficult to solve as everything has ripples.

 

[declansdad]

I'm willing to debate the $15/hour part, but not the living wage part. The worker is worth his bread.

The argument to raise the minimum wage to $15 is so that it is a living wage.

 

[Mom of a great kid]

I think the idea is that the uneducated/less experienced do those lower wage jobs while working their way up. Teenager works McDonald's in high school to save for college; in college, same teenager maybe works part time as a CNA or in a factory part time to help with bills. Maybe they do an Amazon warehouse or UPS type deal where they work 24 hours on the weekends. They earn the bachelor's degree and move onto either grad school or entry level their career field. After a few years of work, they get that promotion to manager, and so on and so on. Meanwhile, the next generation is working their way up, starting with the mcdonalds job in high school.

I don't think it was ever meant for people to stay in the entry level job, but for there to always be new people to train for the low wage job while starting the path to work up.

It used to ne that way . Today they get that promotion to manager, then get downsized and are back in a minimum wage job. Which is why so many fast food workers have college degrees.

 

[longboard55]

all the talk about fast food, what about retail, 40 years ago you could work in retail and survive like a job at macys or sears, now they are all minimum wage. We knew a kid who worked at office depot, 32 3/4 hours a week so they could call it part time, no raises, no vacartion no sick time, no nothing, minum wage. The only one who made more was a single manager. This has to end, this country can not survive on that attitude towards employees