Teachers Trashing Students

[Jupiter&Wolfe]

My little cousin came to see me today. She's 15 and a freshman in high school, she attends the same high school I did.

Just a quick background: My cousin started off the year with Mono, then got H1N1, and our grandmother passed, so she missed a LOT of school. She was excused for everything of course, but she got pretty behind on her schoolwork.

Anyway, she went to make up an English test during her lunch period today. She went to the English department where all the English teachers' cubicles are, so any English teacher who doesn't have a class during a period is typically in that center. She was placed in the room in the back where English make up tests are held. She was the only one in there. As she started her test, she heard the teachers out there talking about her (and they didn't even make an attempt to whisper!).
The other teachers apparently said something along the lines of, "That girl is in here ALL the time, what's up with her?" And her teacher said, "I don't know, it's totally frustrating. Her mom is excusing her saying she's sick all the time, but that's total...(well she said a swear here). I know she probably just goes off to do whatever the other druggies do. I just wish she wouldn't waste my time. " Apparently the other teachers started trashing their students after that. I was shocked that they would make up things like that, and my cousin was horribly embarrassed. She had NO reason or evidence to show that this child could have POSSIBLY been on drugs.

But I later remembered that when I attended that school(and I just graduated last year) I had a similar encounter. When I was making up a Psychology test in the history apartment my Psych teacher started trashing me. She was saying that I totally didn't care and was lazy about my homework. I remember her saying I was one of those kids who was doomed to be a failure. She concluded by saying, "I know MY Kate will NEVER end up like that." All the other teachers got into it as well! They mentioned many people I knew who were "stupid" or "doomed" or what have you. I was an average student, granted. But I was NEVER a lazy person who just goofed off all the time. I just tended to focus my energies on creative projects I had going on otherwise, and still never did too bad in school. And I'm doing very well for myself now, and am moving out to California at the end of the year. This teacher had no right to say the things she did, she didn't say them out of concern either, it was purely nasty things. I recall her giggling as well. These teachers could AT LEAST consider the fact that the students they're talking about could be within earshot, like my cousin and myself. I remember how bad it made me feel. And this was at one of the top rated Public High Schools in Massachusetts.

Have any of you encountered or have kids who have encountered a situation like this? Frankly I'm appalled, I would think as adults they would be past this by now. Not only is it hurtful, I think it's very detrimental to the learning environment. I have a lot of respect for those teachers who truly care about their students and want the best for them, but her English teacher wanting her to just "not waste her time" told me that she didn't care and was writing her off.

My cousin wants to write an article for the school newspaper. We'll see how THAT goes.

Sorry for the rant.

 

[akhenaten]

That stinks.... Teaching is not easy and can be frustrating I am sure... but to say that ...especially where the student can hear is just wrong...

My Ds is 15 and has mono right now... i hate to think about how far behind he is falling...

 

[olena]

My little cousin came to see me today. She's 15 and a freshman in high school, she attends the same high school I did.

Just a quick background: My cousin started off the year with Mono, then got H1N1, and our grandmother passed, so she missed a LOT of school. She was excused for everything of course, but she got pretty behind on her schoolwork.

Anyway, she went to make up an English test during her lunch period today. She went to the English department where all the English teachers' cubicles are, so any English teacher who doesn't have a class during a period is typically in that center. She was placed in the room in the back where English make up tests are held. She was the only one in there. As she started her test, she heard the teachers out there talking about her (and they didn't even make an attempt to whisper!).
The other teachers apparently said something along the lines of, "That girl is in here ALL the time, what's up with her?" And her teacher said, "I don't know, it's totally frustrating. Her mom is excusing her saying she's sick all the time, but that's total...(well she said a swear here). I know she probably just goes off to do whatever the other druggies do. I just wish she wouldn't waste my time. " Apparently the other teachers started trashing their students after that. I was shocked that they would make up things like that, and my cousin was horribly embarrassed. She had NO reason or evidence to show that this child could have POSSIBLY been on drugs.

But I later remembered that when I attended that school(and I just graduated last year) I had a similar encounter. When I was making up a Psychology test in the history apartment my Psych teacher started trashing me. She was saying that I totally didn't care and was lazy about my homework. I remember her saying I was one of those kids who was doomed to be a failure. She concluded by saying, "I know MY Kate will NEVER end up like that." All the other teachers got into it as well! They mentioned many people I knew who were "stupid" or "doomed" or what have you. I was an average student, granted. But I was NEVER a lazy person who just goofed off all the time. I just tended to focus my energies on creative projects I had going on otherwise, and still never did too bad in school. And I'm doing very well for myself now, and am moving out to California at the end of the year. This teacher had no right to say the things she did, she didn't say them out of concern either, it was purely nasty things. I recall her giggling as well. These teachers could AT LEAST consider the fact that the students they're talking about could be within earshot, like my cousin and myself. I remember how bad it made me feel. And this was at one of the top rated Public High Schools in Massachusetts.

Have any of you encountered or have kids who have encountered a situation like this? Frankly I'm appalled, I would think as adults they would be past this by now. Not only is it hurtful, I think it's very detrimental to the learning environment. I have a lot of respect for those teachers who truly care about their students and want the best for them, but her English teacher wanting her to just "not waste her time" told me that she didn't care and was writing her off.

My cousin wants to write an article for the school newspaper. We'll see how THAT goes.

Sorry for the rant.

Oh yes! I was berated by my teacher in front of the whole class because she really resented making accommodations for the "blind girl".

When I returned to the same school years later as a student teacher, I became ill at the things I heard at the lunch room table and in the teacher's lounge. Disabled students were raked over the coals for their needs, girls had "no business in athletics" and all the other nasty gossip. I won't even go into what the principal told me in a one-on-one meeting, which I wish I had recorded. I quit after student teaching as I wanted no part of it.

So no, I'm not surprised one little bit.

 

[RNMOM]

I think I would make an appointment with the English department head and tell them what your niece has said. This kid needs someone to stand up for her and maybe you could be the one. You could also mention your own experience and then I would follow up with a letter to the principle and the superintendent. Don't let this pass, these hens need to realize loose lips can hurt.

 

[clovergirl5]

Unbelievable I would probably do what the previous poster said and have her parents go talk to someone. If it were me, I would head to the principal but that doesn't boad well with many here lol

 

[LBAK]

No teacher should berate a student, ever. Having said that and having a 15 yo DD myself I happen to know that she perceives things quite different from how they actually happen. I'm not saying the teacher didn't make comments but perhaps they weren't said in the context she thought they were.Teachers get frustrated just like any other employee and they tend to speak when they shouldn't. My daughter is very dramatic at times and I know not to take everything to heart. Most times she makes it sound so much worse then it is. If indeed what she is saying is true then it needs to be taken to the dept. chairperson.

As far as what teachers say in the lunchroom and the teachers lounge, it's wrong but they're human. There's frustrations, personality conflicts, low self confidence on the teachers part, especially when it comes to meeting the needs of children with disabilities. They vent. They did it when I worked in the public school but there weren't children near. I have a learning disabled child that drove her teachers crazy and I'm sure they talked plenty about her in the lunchroom. Was it right? No but they're human and the same as the rest of us.

 

[happygirl]

I would let your cousinparents handle it

 

[tinkerfan1]

I am appalled. That is sickening. What a horrible example they are setting. I don't know what to recommend doing. I do know what my DH would do and it would not be pretty. I always say that arrogance and meanness are two things I can not stand. Well, that is mean. Hateful, more like it, and for teachers to be like that is downright disgusting. You never know why a person is the way they are or why they do the things they do unless you are that person so to go around judging them or talking about them is just something that should not be done. People who do it need to take a good look at their own imperfect selves. Ugh.

 

[maelstrom]

If I had been in your cousin's shoes, I would've gotten up and confronted the teachers right then and there, and then marched myself to the principal's office to bring up the matter with him. It's bad enough for teachers to talk like that about students, but to do it when they know the student is in earshot... very unprofessional. Something tells me that if your niece was a druggie who skipped school all the time, she wouldn't be making up tests during her lunch period.

 

[Schmeck]

She should not write about it in the school paper - she'd be suspended, sued for libel, and the paper would most likely take a hit for publishing it.

She should talk to her parents about it, and see if a meeting could be scheduled with administration to get things discussed. She needs to be able to repeat exactly what the teachers said, and which teachers were involved. Time and date should be noted, as well.

 

[merryweather20]

No teacher should berate a student, ever. Having said that and having a 15 yo DD myself I happen to know that she perceives things quite different from how they actually happen. I'm not saying the teacher didn't make comments but perhaps they weren't said in the context she thought they were.Teachers get frustrated just like any other employee and they tend to speak when they shouldn't. My daughter is very dramatic at times and I know not to take everything to heart. Most times she makes it sound so much worse then it is. If indeed what she is saying is true then it needs to be taken to the dept. chairperson.

As far as what teachers say in the lunchroom and the teachers lounge, it's wrong but they're human. There's frustrations, personality conflicts, low self confidence on the teachers part, especially when it comes to meeting the needs of children with disabilities. They vent. They did it when I worked in the public school but there weren't children near. I have a learning disabled child that drove her teachers crazy and I'm sure they talked plenty about her in the lunchroom. Was it right? No but they're human and the same as the rest of us.

Wow! I'd be pretty bummed out if my Mom said something like that about me

I'm certainly not allowed to vent like that, about clients. I'd expect substantially more out of someone dealing with children. I'm not sure how you can sugar coat calling someone a druggie. I used to teach children swimming lessons and we talked about the students during our off hours as well: what techniques were working. how they were prgressing.. you know useful appropriate conversations.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

There are great teachers out there and crappy ones. I would tell her that is the reality of the world and to try and do her best to make up the work.

I would esp. make sure I made up every detail of English and bugged the crap out her every class for answers to questions. (J/K on the last part since a HSer could not properly pull that off.)

 

[Jupiter&Wolfe]

I've already talked to my aunt(my cousin's mom) and we agreed that she should call the administration office and leave a formal complaint. She's going to try to set up a direct meeting with either the principal or the superintendent.

LBAK: I actually did consider all of what you said. While I know my cousin typically isn't one to be too dramatic, I did have her tell me EXACTLY what happened and told her this was a serious thing. And she was pretty upset, and she doesn't get upset too easily.

I also respect that people make mistakes. And I never really had a doubt that teachers talked about their students outside of class. I was more bothered by the fact that they were trashing her while she was testing in the other room. She said she felt like a "total loser" when she walked into the room full of teachers when her test was finished. And her being so quick to judge just doesn't fly with me.

It bothers me that the school has JUST adopted a new logo "Promoting Respect for Self and Others" that all the teachers voted on and now can't follow themselves.

It bothers me that when a student is demonstrating sincere care and effort to get caught up after missing school that the teacher cant respect that. She only sees the negative and assumes she's doing drugs.

It bothers me that the other teachers joined in.

It bothers me that these teachers don't seem to care that if these children are struggling in school that there maybe something they could do to help.

It bothers me that perhaps the school environment has gotten to the point that teachers feel too frustrated to do their jobs.

It bothers me that students are labeled as "stupid" or "lazy" just because they can't follow the exact curriculum and schedule that the school has laid out for these 800+ students.

I guess I just feel like this one situation is speaking for a much larger problem with our school systems.

 

[LOVESHiNE5]

Sorry about you lil cuz. I was bullied by one of my teachers as well... and one of the school counsulers. Here's what happened. I put my car project where the teacher told me to put it. Apparently, it got destroyed somehow. The other teacher in the room brought me to the counsuler and this is how the conversation went:

Them: Why did you put your project there?

Me: Because the teacher told me to.

Them: No excuses! Now, why did you put your project there?

Me: ...Because the teacher told me to...

Them: No excuses! You were the only kid in the state of New Jersey not to hand in your project! Now, why did you put it there?

Me: ...

That conversation continued into the next period. Needless to say my parents weren't too thrilled with the teachers. Just to be fair, I don't think the teacher who told me to put my project where I did knew about this.

 

[Inigo]

I'd talk to the principal about these teachers.


When I did my student teaching, I was in the teacher workroom eating lunch with several other teachers. One of the 5th grade teachers began to go on and on (and on and on...) about a student he had taught about 10 years earlier. This was the worst student he ever had. He was surprised the student ever made it out of the fifth grade. This student was so stupid. He just kept laughing and talking bad about the child.

He used the child's name several times in his description of the student. The student was a handful, diagnosed with emotional disabilities. I know that since the student is my cousin's son.

As I stood up to take my tray to the cafeteria, I looked him in the eye, and told him how I was related. The man went ash-white pale, and started apologizing. I told him he didn't need to apologize to me. He needed to apologize to my cousin.

 

[Mrs. Chamberlain]

I have a friend who does colorguard for band. The colorguard instructor openly told him that he needed to lose weight. He's not a large guy either. He's a little chubby, but not very much. It really bugs me that these teachers can talk to or about students like this.

 

[Sparx]

sometimes, the students are dramatically more mature than the teachers.

when i was in high school, i was the editor of the school paper. i made the other ten or so students work hard, and we never missed deadline under me, and the paper never went out with errors.

well, the teacher didn't like how i took it "seriously" and actually created work (like she would have to, oh i don't know, not sleep on her desk when we were in class)

she would create bs errands and send me on them, then stand up in front of the class and talk about how mean and hard to work with i am, and how she doesn't like me.

well, her mistake was she was doing this during the days of cell phones, and i had friends in that class. i got recorded messages of it, and a play by play text conversation about what was going on. (i know, i know, cell phones in class )

well, i told my mom. and on parent teacher conference night, my mom confronted her about it. she started stuttering and trying to lie her way out of it. (i was in sped in high school for gifted services) and my aide knew all about all of this, as it happened.

the behavior continued, and i quit the class half way through. the next paper that came out had the wrong date (a different one on each page actually. ), errors in every story, and came out two weeks after deadline.

i was bullied out of a class i loved because a teacher wouldn't do her job, she just wanted a relaxing 8th period class, and she couldn't have that with me in the room.

i'm sorry about your cousin, it hurts when the teacher is acting like a child.

 

[jazzielady]

Not only is this wrong on many levels, it is also illegal.

This kind of discussion falls under the FERPA law of privacy, I believe. In PA it is required that we have an updated inservice on this every year before the school year begins. We have been told in no uncertain terms to never discuss a student with any other teacher who has no reason to know information about said student, even if the child's name is not used. This includes in faculty rooms, or any casual converstion, such as a random meeting with another teacher at the grocery store, etc. As told by our superintendant, you never know who is around listening and may put 2 & 2 together to know who is the subject of the conversation.

Here is what I recommend:

1. by all means, write the newspaper article, but do not publish. She should write down in non-emotional terms exactly what happened. Time, place, persons involved, word-for-word repetition of what was said. Then add a paragraph about how it made her feel.

2. Parents should request a conference with the main teacher involved. Read the letter word for word. Expect at least an apology. If your cousin did not do well on the make-up b/c of the circumstances, request a retake.

3. If no satisfaction is provided at this meeting, go to the principal for resolution. The key here is to go up the chain of command. If you go right to the superintendant, their first question will be whether you spoke to the teacher and principal about it. If the answer is no, s/he will kick it right back there.

My husband and I are fortunate enough to both teach in the same school and often, due to our subject matter, have many of the same students. We talk about the students in our car or our home, where it is guaranteed that no one is around who will know the student. One year not too long ago, we found a girl who had become anorexic and cut herself, based on behavior changes that we had noted from the previous year. Her other teachers had only known her for a couple of months and did not realize the difference in her from the year before. We discussed the situation at length in our home (outside the district), then referred her to the proper counselors for help. Today she is a much happier, healthier student/

but again, the conversation was private, with no chance of it being overheard by the wrong persons.

If you get no resolution by the time you get to the super level, then let them know that your lawyer will be in touch. Nothing makes a district scramble to resolve a situation faster than threat of a lawsuit. Bear in mind that this could get the teacher fired. This may or may not be the right thing to happen to the teacher, but my guess is that the situation will be resolved before this point.

Good luck and keep up posted!

 

[golfgal]

There is no chance she misinterpreted what the teacher meant, right. Maybe they were asking out of concern that it was obvious that she has missed a lot of school and they wanted to know why. The horrors of a teacher actually showing concern for a child.

I challenge each and every one of you that automatically jumps on these types of posts to go spend a week observing in a classroom and see what REALLY goes on. It is AMAZING how kids will twist a story to their own benefit.

Prime example--I was helping out at the kids' school one day a few years ago. In the 6th grade math class there were 2 separate periods for the class--1st hour kids listened to the lesson and got right to work with every single kid in the class finishing the assignment before the bell rang. 2nd period class the kids were rambunctious and didn't work efficiently so most of them had homework that night. That evening we had a parent/teacher association meeting and a few of the parents were complaining about "all the homework" their kids had and how the kids told them they "never got time in school to work on it". I told them what REALLY happened that day.

It really makes me sad that parents will take the word of a 1st grader or a 15 year old over the word of an adult without checking out both sides of the story or digging deeper with their own child to find out what really happened. Little Johnny comes home from school and "the teacher yelled at me all day" so mommy calls the superintendent because all that teacher does is yell at her kid. The real story is that Little Johnny wasn't listening all day and the teacher had to raise her voice to talk over the kids to get Little Johnny to stop rubbing finger paint into some little girls' hair.

 

[agnes!]

One of my DD's teachers talked disparagingly at length about her to other students, not realizing she was in the room.

Yeah, a real class-A #1.......... oh, just fill-in-the-blank with whatever is appropriate.

And, *no*, there is NO chance she misinterpreted the remarks, this is the same teacher who called DD a liar in a phone conversation with *me*. There was nothing to be done about what was said to me, it wasn't worth it. DD did stick it out with the class for a second year, but she dropped it this year. I resent the fact that this teacher made it so unpleasant for her that she had to walk away from a subject she truly loves but I have to say our lives are a lot less stressful this year without this particular teacher in our lives.

Sometimes kids misinterpret things, sure, but sometimes they see things the way they really are.

agnes!