Student Loan Debt

[mhfrau]

Because it infantilizes the person the term is directed at.

OK, since my statement about "big girl" panties is considered offensive and degrading, I will officially change my advice to the OP to... it's time to quit making excuses, make a plan, and follow through.

But, if me saying "put your big girl panties on" infantilizes the OP, then I find it pretty ironic that borrowing a boatload of money to go to school with apparently no firm direction, is considered a fine display of maturity by some people

 

[sonofanarchy]

The person's behavior is what does or does not make them seem like a child. If someone calls a spade a spade, that's not being degrading.

Which is why I no longer post any personal information on message boards. Sadly, we live in a world where most people can't seem to get their point across without being nasty.

 

[mhfrau]

The person's behavior is what does or does not make them seem like a child. If someone calls a spade a spade, that's not being degrading.

This.

 

[sonofanarchy]

But, if me saying "put your big girl panties on" infantilizes the OP, then I find it pretty ironic that borrowing a boatload of money to go to school with apparently no firm direction, is considered a fine display of maturity by some people

Who said it was?

 

[robinb]

The person's behavior is what does or does not make them seem like a child. If someone calls a spade a spade, that's not being degrading.

No one is expecting people to blow pixie dust up the OP's butt, however if your intention is to actually help the OP then calling a "spade and spade" in an insulting way is not the best way to do it.

 

[FairestOfThemAll37]

The person's behavior is what does or does not make them seem like a child. If someone calls a spade a spade, that's not being degrading.

I don't particularly have a problem with the phrase. But your argument is like saying that it's not degrading to call an overweight person a land whale or a skinny person skeletor, I mean a spade's a spade, right?

Frankly, that just seems like an excuse to to be nasty to a person under the guise of "reality"

As a side note, I see a lot of comments about how immature, irresponsible, etc. it was to go to school for something without a plan. I'm sorry, but this is true for a huge percentage of college grads. Not to mention that it's not uncommon in this crazy job market to start a degree in a booming field and by the time you've finished it's over saturated.

 

[sonofanarchy]

Frankly, that just seems like an excuse to to be nasty to a person under the guise of "reality"

As a side note, I see a lot of comments about how immature, irresponsible, etc. it was to go to school for something without a plan. I'm sorry, but this is true for a huge percentage of college grads. Not to mention that it's not uncommon in this crazy job market to start a degree in a booming field and by the time you've finished it's over saturated.

Agree 100%.

In fact, the majority of people I know are not working in the field they went to college for.

 

[mrsklamc]

Yes, many people have run up lots of debt. Everyone's made a stupid mistake of one kind or another. I don't think most have a problem with that. When you know better, though, you are expected to do better.When someone wants to run and hide, doesn't want to do what needs to be done to deal with their actions, makes excuses, and doesn't want to quit having fun and be responsible...is 'childish' less offensive to you?

 

[McDISer]

OP-The government has your loans so attached to you-and there is no easy road to get rid of them. I know you came on the boards wondering if there was a way out or to get rid of them. You have been given tons of great advice. If you know how much you owe, it means you have been looking at them. Take the step and do something now. A lot of us have been in your shoes and took the message that college is going to be the answer to the American Dream, sadly it hasn't.

I don't particularly have a problem with the phrase. But your argument is like saying that it's not degrading to call an overweight person a land whale or a skinny person skeletor, I mean a spade's a spade, right?

Frankly, that just seems like an excuse to to be nasty to a person under the guise of "reality"

As a side note, I see a lot of comments about how immature, irresponsible, etc. it was to go to school for something without a plan. I'm sorry, but this is true for a huge percentage of college grads. Not to mention that it's not uncommon in this crazy job market to start a degree in a booming field and by the time you've finished it's over saturated.

You know what? The last 10-20 years, highs school's have geared kids toward 4 year colleges. They were told if they didn't go, they would be flipping hamburgers. No one ever told them, to go to technical schools, they were told to go college and jobs would be falling in their laps. Parents went to Financial Aid meetings, filling out the FAFSA's and saw that 60% of their income was suppose to be given to their kids so they could attend college. Parents were, really? how the heck is that going to happen.

Has anyone ever attended college Orientation with their kids- They get your FAFSA and show you the amount of loans you are qualified for. Sure my kids received scholarships and some Grants-but those dwindled greatly too.

LOANS- Sign here on the dotted line, make sure you click on the link of 50 pages that will outline your loan and since you clicked on the link, you and your child will understand what it means to borrow money for the next 4-6 years. Now that your graduated college-6 months later, all these letters are coming in the mail and your kid is freaking out, because he is now in debt $60,000.

Honestly-do you think your kids or half the parents read the 50 pages that went with the loan application? Heck no, they knew they qualified, and they were going to college. The loans paid for the schooling and it was out of sight out of mind. If you went and polled people right now if they understand how school loans work, they have no idea.

 

[ReneeA]

I think it's really difficult to come up with a plan when you are home with your kids. It's hard to depend on others, and to visualize what life will be like after you make a change. Once it's done, you'll come up with a new normal...there will be new stressors, but the financial stress will lessen.

One of my best friend has always stayed home with her kids. They're now 13 & 11 - smart, responsible boys. Her husband is feeling very stressed about being the only paycheck, and wants her to find at least a part time job in the fall when kids go back to school. She is fighting it tooth and nail. Who will do the laundry? When will she do the grocery shopping? How will the house get clean? When we were having this discussion, I just grinned at her. My DH works at least 50 hours a week, I work nights as a RN. We manage. Is my house spotless? No. There are some days that I've worked my 13 hours at night and stopped at the grocery store on my way home in the am to grab bread, milk, cereal, and other quick stuff. You make do, and things won't be perfect. She's having a really difficult time with the thought of adding work to her already busy schedule, but most other families manage doing just that.

It can stink, but we no longer have the pressure that we did when I was a SAHM and we were over our heads in debt and all of it fell on my DH's shoulders. It can be scary, but you may be pleasantly surprised after you get used to the new schedule.

 

[lost*in*cyberspace]

No one is expecting people to blow pixie dust up the OP's butt, however if your intention is to actually help the OP then calling a "spade and spade" in an insulting way is not the best way to do it.

Wait, telling someone to "put on big girl panties" is degrading and insulting, but talking about "blowing pixie dust up the OP's butt" is okay!? Seriously?

 

[Darcy03231]

OP, another thing you should keep in mind is that if you still have outstanding student loans that you haven't paid on when it comes time for your child(ren) to go on to school you will have a difficult, if not impossible time, either getting loans or co-signing loans.

This happened to a relative of ours. She actually deferred and/or defaulted her loans and then when it came time for her children to go to school she and her husband were unable to get parent PLUS loans or co-sign any loans for their children.

 

[Colleen27]

You know what? The last 10-20 years, highs school's have geared kids toward 4 year colleges. They were told if they didn't go, they would be flipping hamburgers. No one ever told them, to go to technical schools, they were told to go college and jobs would be falling in their laps. Parents went to Financial Aid meetings, filling out the FAFSA's and saw that 60% of their income was suppose to be given to their kids so they could attend college. Parents were, really? how the heck is that going to happen.

Exactly. We have been sold the idea that college is the only way to make a living, and therefore the ends justify any means necessary to earn a degree. It is a relatively recent development that there's been any real discussion about what a burden those loans can be, or that there are many degrees that just plain aren't worth borrowing for. And there's still not nearly enough discussion about the ways to make a good living without a four year degree. It is no wonder that people get in over their head with student loans and then feel backed into a corner when it comes time to repay an unthinkably large sum.

 

[mhfrau]

Wait, telling someone to "put on big girl panties" is degrading and insulting, but talking about "blowing pixie dust up the OP's butt" is okay!? Seriously?

Exactly. But since this is the DIS, when you use certain words like "pixie dust" in the sentence, it makes everything OK

 

[keri125]

OP-The government has your loans so attached to you-and there is no easy road to get rid of them. I know you came on the boards wondering if there was a way out or to get rid of them. You have been given tons of great advice. If you know how much you owe, it means you have been looking at them. Take the step and do something now. A lot of us have been in your shoes and took the message that college is going to be the answer to the American Dream, sadly it hasn't.



You know what? The last 10-20 years, highs school's have geared kids toward 4 year colleges. They were told if they didn't go, they would be flipping hamburgers. No one ever told them, to go to technical schools, they were told to go college and jobs would be falling in their laps. Parents went to Financial Aid meetings, filling out the FAFSA's and saw that 60% of their income was suppose to be given to their kids so they could attend college. Parents were, really? how the heck is that going to happen.

Has anyone ever attended college Orientation with their kids- They get your FAFSA and show you the amount of loans you are qualified for. Sure my kids received scholarships and some Grants-but those dwindled greatly too.

LOANS- Sign here on the dotted line, make sure you click on the link of 50 pages that will outline your loan and since you clicked on the link, you and your child will understand what it means to borrow money for the next 4-6 years. Now that your graduated college-6 months later, all these letters are coming in the mail and your kid is freaking out, because he is now in debt $60,000.

Honestly-do you think your kids or half the parents read the 50 pages that went with the loan application? Heck no, they knew they qualified, and they were going to college. The loans paid for the schooling and it was out of sight out of mind. If you went and polled people right now if they understand how school loans work, they have no idea.

I'm sure this is true, and it is really scary. I had loans when I went through college 20 years ago, co-signed by my parents, and you can bet we read every single line of that contract. We knew exactly what we were getting into. Now I'm the age where my friends' children are graduating high school and preparing for college, and I see them reviewing different contracts, different types of loans, researching options, etc before sitting down to sign anything. And when they do sign, they are definitely reading every line. I had one friend bring a loan contract back to work to sign so she could review it more closely. I guess I just don't get this mentality of signing contracts before examining it closely and then complaining about it when the contract happens like it is supposed to. : My clients do this as well; they have to sign a work plan when they sign up for state benefits. We read over it line by line and then I give it to them to review further while I complete other paperwork, ask them if they have any questions, and then have them sign it. They walk out with a copy in their hands. It's amazing how many times I will call and ask them for something that is due or inquire into why something wasn't done, and they act like they had no clue. When I refer to their contract, they generally say something like "Oh, I had no idea." Really? We spent a ton of time reviewing it, but more than that, YOU SIGNED IT!!! Anyhow, this is off topic, so I apologize. It just irks me to no end to hear try to use the excuse that they hadn't read the contract they signed, so they shouldn't be responsible for the outcome.

 

[ellie05]

I'm sure this is true, and it is really scary. I had loans when I went through college 20 years ago, co-signed by my parents, and you can bet we read every single line of that contract. We knew exactly what we were getting into. Now I'm the age where my friends' children are graduating high school and preparing for college, and I see them reviewing different contracts, different types of loans, researching options, etc before sitting down to sign anything. And when they do sign, they are definitely reading every line. I had one friend bring a loan contract back to work to sign so she could review it more closely. I guess I just don't get this mentality of signing contracts before examining it closely and then complaining about it when the contract happens like it is supposed to. : My clients do this as well; they have to sign a work plan when they sign up for state benefits. We read over it line by line and then I give it to them to review further while I complete other paperwork, ask them if they have any questions, and then have them sign it. They walk out with a copy in their hands. It's amazing how many times I will call and ask them for something that is due or inquire into why something wasn't done, and they act like they had no clue. When I refer to their contract, they generally say something like "Oh, I had no idea." Really? We spent a ton of time reviewing it, but more than that, YOU SIGNED IT!!! Anyhow, this is off topic, so I apologize. It just irks me to no end to hear try to use the excuse that they hadn't read the contract they signed, so they shouldn't be responsible for the outcome.

Exactly! It is the same as if you stole something and you tell them you didn't know it was illegal to steal. It is not their responsibility to make sure you read the contract. They provided with the material that is were their responsibility ends, if you choose to sign it or not is up to you. Honestly the word loan alone should be enough to know you are going to have to pay it back. Everyone seems to have the right, but no one wants the responsibility.

 

[eliza61]

The person's behavior is what does or does not make them seem like a child. If someone calls a spade a spade, that's not being degrading.

Sure it is. If someone was obese, would you call them a "fat cow" and then claim a "spade is a spade"?
I've found that rarely does insulting someone give positive results. 99% of the time it simply makes the person tune out

 

[mrsklamc]

Sure it is. If someone was obese, would you call them a "fat cow" and then claim a "spade is a spade"?
I've found that rarely does insulting someone give positive results. 99% of the time it simply makes the person tune out

No, but I wouldn't shy away from using the term 'overweight' if we were discussing how to resolve the problem.

 

[eliza61]

No, but I wouldn't shy away from using the term 'overweight' if we were discussing how to resolve the problem.

That's my point, I think when we're on the web, we forget that language is powerful. Even though the meaning is the same the tone is different. One conveys helpfulness, the other belittles. One could possibly resolve the problem, the other will immediately shut a person down. I had a friend who had 3 kids back to back and frankly they were out of control. They actually got put off an air plane one year because they were so out of control. Telling her, her kids were brats, even if there was some truth to it didn't "resolve" the issue. All it did was belittle her, make her defensive and angry. Other language did get her to accept advice. I'm very guilty of this too, I try now to ask myself, "would I use this language speaking to some one face to face"?

 

[robinb]

Exactly. But since this is the DIS, when you use certain words like "pixie dust" in the sentence, it makes everything OK

Naturally makes everything better ... . However, if your and lost*in*cyberspace's sensibilities were indeed offended then please accept my sincere apology .

Sure it is. If someone was obese, would you call them a "fat cow" and then claim a "spade is a spade"?
I've found that rarely does insulting someone give positive results. 99% of the time it simply makes the person tune out

Here's a 2-4-1 ...

FWIW, I really don't care if someone uses the term "big girl panties" but I don't anymore. I was called out for it once (with much the same arguments used here today) and it made me rethink using it again.