Sports: Deflate-Gate

[undertheradar]

More smoke and mirrors from the Patriots. I guess when Kraft stated he would accept whatever the findings and punishment would be, he meant only if it went his way.

The website and "supporting" report have to result in further penalties.

 

[undertheradar]

He's a lawyer, not associated with any club.

So he did this without Patriot authorization?

 

[pat fan]

So he did this without Patriot authorization?

Not sure I know who you are referring to? I was referring to Wells not being affiliated with club, so why would the Pats be in trouble for commenting on the report? The rule stated a couple posts back is for knocking the refs, the owners and so on.

 

[pat fan]

More smoke and mirrors from the Patriots. I guess when Kraft stated he would accept whatever the findings and punishment would be, he meant only if it went his way.

Doubtful. Kraft accepted the punishment back in '07 no problem. I think if it had been a Brady 4 gamer only, he would never have said a word. The fine and draft picks are ridiculous when they were cleared by the report.

 

[undertheradar]

No more blind than others unwillling to entertain something that says there may be something fishy going on on the OTHER side of the ball. And I never said I was blind. Just that there is a lot of info left OUT that does make it look damning. You need to be honest and present it all for an independent arbitrator, and that can not be Goodell. I have not heard anyone comment on the recollections of the gauges, just call me blind. Cute.

Upon the release of the Wells report, Patriot fans began trying to raise funds to help the Billionaire owner pay a $1 Million Dollar fine. I call that blindly following. Is there anything to the whole issue of deflated balls? Why did the Patriots attempt to steer attention away by providing other "supposed" violations by other teams? Just the perception that Brady didn't cooperate fully gives the impression that there is something there. Had he just provided what was requested and nothing was found, this all would have gone away. The Patriots have muddied this further by releasing their own report and starting the website.

This "report" from the lawyer, the same one who sat in on all of the interviews as a representative for the Patriots? How is he not associated with the Patriots? A simple owning up to being caught would have gone a long way. Too many sketchy details to be able to believe that nothing took place.

 

[undertheradar]

Doubtful. Kraft accepted the punishment back in '07 no problem. I think if it had been a Brady 4 gamer only, he would never have said a word. The fine and draft picks are ridiculous when they were cleared by the report.

So when he stated recently that he would accept whatever the findings and possible punishment would be, he didn't mean it? The team was never cleared, as the integrity of the rules was compromised by team representatives. That would be the basis for the fine and loss of draft picks.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

Hey. He got that nickname of the deflator because he's fat!!! Geez Patriots.. If you're going to hand me bull, make it good bull. Should have claimed it was because of sexual dysfunction. I might have believed that for a split second.

 

[GrnMtnMan]

I was referring to Wells not being affiliated with club, so why would the Pats be in trouble for commenting on the report? The rule stated a couple posts back is for knocking the refs, the owners and so on.

It includes a prohibition on criticizing league employees. Given this is not a criminal or civil legal matter (yet), Wells might be considered an NFL employee once he was engaged to professionally conduct this investigation. But you might be right, and since he's a independent counsel he might not qualify as an employee.

 

[pat fan]

The team was never cleared,

I guess we differ on the definition of "team" when the report states that Kraft, Belichick and everyone else in the organization had zero knowledge of what one of the lowest level part time employees maybe was doing.

 

[pat fan]

The Patriots have muddied this further by releasing their own report and starting the website.

FANS started the website, not the Patriots....and I do think that is silly, but it's a free country!

 

[pat fan]

This "report" from the lawyer, the same one who sat in on all of the interviews as a representative for the Patriots? How is he not associated with the Patriots?

Again, I don't understand WHAT you are talking about

 

[kaytieeldr]

More smoke and mirrors from the Patriots. I guess when Kraft stated he would accept whatever the findings and punishment would be, he meant only if it went his way.

So when he stated recently that he would accept whatever the findings and possible punishment would be, he didn't mean it?

If the punishment had been reasonable in relation to the (supposedly unbiased) findings, yes, Kraft would have accepted it. Milion dollar fine and multi-game suspension and loss of draft picks when the finding was "possible" to "more probable than not" isn't reasonable.

Upon the release of the Wells report, Patriot fans began trying to raise funds to help the Billionaire owner pay a $1 Million Dollar fine.

One. Single. Fan.
This must be the same math the NFL used to justify a possible/probable finding into a severe punishment.

 

[JanaDee]

If the punishment had been reasonable in relation to the (supposedly unbiased) findings, yes, Kraft would have accepted it. Milion dollar fine and multi-game suspension and loss of draft picks when the finding was "possible" to "more probable than not" isn't reasonable.


One. Single. Fan.
This must be the same math the NFL used to justify a possible/probable finding into a severe punishment.

Kraft's net worth is over $4 billion. A million dollar fine is appropriate.

 

[GrnMtnMan]

the finding was "possible" to "more probable than not" isn't reasonable.
....
justify a possible/probable finding into a severe punishment.

You're putting too much emphasis on some sort-of meaningless words.

In the context of this investigation the words "more probable is than not" is equal to "guilty''. This is the standard of proof the players agreed to in their collective bargaining agreement. The investigator couldn't choose to call Tom 'guilty', 'super-guilty', or 'super-guilty-with-a-cherry-on top'. The investigation was charged with finding out if the allegations were deemed to be true based on the 'preponderance of the evidence'. The investigator found enough evidence to declare that the allegations were true, based on this standard. Diminishing this finding because the words used are not sensational is pointless.

 

[SkaGoat]

I don't watch football, but the suspension, and loss of draft picks is heavy handed, and far too steep of a penalty.

Every team does it, the testing of the balls was flawed (used different gauges), it's much harsher of a suspension than any other sports league has for similar infractions and the league has poor management of game balls after being evaluated by officials.

 

[MickeySP]

This is just so ridiculous = it's FOOTBALL, really it's FOOTBALL

Going back to real life now

 

[kaytieeldr]

Diminishing this finding because the words used are not sensational is pointless.

Sensational? Talk about misinterpretation. Probable, possible, likely, etc., simply don't have the same standard-use definition that would be necessary in any other determination.

Ever hopeful that nobody involved in the "investigation" and most people on this thread will never be needed to determine my innocence/guilt...

 

[GrnMtnMan]

This is just so ridiculous = it's FOOTBALL, really it's FOOTBALL

Going back to real life now

We are on a Disney message board after-all, so I think this discussion is fair-game here.

I'm enjoying it for the back and forth entertainment value, more than I care about any specific outcome. Its better than fiction, with crooked ball boys, baby-faced corrupt QBs, and Mr. Moneybags fighting with his former lackey.

 

[kaytieeldr]

It's good that you've chosen to display maturity and a complete lack of bias in your depictions.

 

[GrnMtnMan]

It's good that you've chosen to display maturity and a complete lack of bias in your depictions.

I do have a bias to believe the findings of objective independent investigators. And a bias not to insult others when they disagree with me. Or at least try not to....I can't help it if they dig the hole themselves.