So where exactly is my census info? - Update

So how are you going to verify that the person giving the information is the person at that residence?

There is currently no way of assuring that. I could go take the census out of my neighbors mailbox, fill it out with anything I want, and mail it back.

There are a lot of ways the system could be set up. It is impossible to give a detailed plan for a project of this magnitude on a message board posting. How exactly it would be implemented would require some research, which I am not going to do.

Once all the details are worked out for single sign on and persistent online identity this problem will take care of itself. It will be done by 2020 so perhaps that will be used. It is also too late to do anything about 2010 and no one knows what technology will be available by the next census so everything is moot for now. It is too early to start working on a finalize system for ten years down the road but at least the ground work could be done.

If I had to go and back engineer a solution for 2010 off the top of my head:

Create an account and if a phone number is registered to the same address send a call to that phone number and give them a pin. This can be all automated and require no person to sit there and make a call.

I would hate to do this but after the account is created a postcard with a pin could be sent to the address for verification. While not ideal it would still cut out on mailing since one postcard can be mailed much more cheaply then multiple reminders and the actual census.

The database for the census could link with publicly filed property information and generate a challenge question based on that. While the information would be available to other parties it would not be readily known and when people are setting up fraudulent accounts they attempt to automate and wouldn't go through the trouble of manually referencing those records. Something as simple as a captcha cuts down automated account creation by nearly 100%. I would have to see what information is available for this method of course.

Cross referencing DMV information instead of property information can be done. For example, enter the drivers license number of someone with the address listed on their license.

Another option would be to cross reference the address with the water or another utility bill. Upon account creation ask a challenge question like the account number for the address's water bill or the amount of the electric bill from last month.

We use variations of these exact methods right now for things like online loan applications or home banking and bill payment.

It isn't hard to cross reference databases or create database views that contain only information needed for specific purposes. It could be part of a larger initiative to have different government agencies actually share information.

If there is no one at the house on the title, no one there with a land line phone (and even unlisted numbers can be referenced to an address), no one there with access to a utility bill or account, and no one there with a driver's license perhaps they would not have the online option.

Every single thing mentioned above is something we can do right now with existing technology. All of the data sharing would have required pre-planning and had then started, say, 3 years ago that portion could have been handled.

No matter what method is used there is always a chance for fraud. There is no greater chance for it doing it online then via the current system. A mistake that is often made in online projects is waiting until they are impossible to beat before rolling them out, because that is never going to happen. The idea is to get the chance for fraud, whether it is online banking or the census, down to a reasonable level of risk. When a new threat is encountered you close that loop hole. It is an arms race.

In 2010 doing almost anything paper only is a waste of resources. I would gladly sign up to do the census online even knowing that there is a chance of fraud knowing that the chance already exists anyway.
 
With the amount of people, just on this board that won't even share their children's birthdates, I cannot see them wanting to log into a system that uses their license numbers or other personal information. Lots of people do not have a driver's license, lots of people do not have the internet. Some people in apartments do not pay utilities. There is no data out there that is consistent for every U.S. citizen -- not even everybody files taxes.
 
With the amount of people, just on this board that won't even share their children's birthdates, I cannot see them wanting to log into a system that uses their license numbers or other personal information. Lots of people do not have a driver's license, lots of people do not have the internet. Some people in apartments do not pay utilities. There is no data out there that is consistent for every U.S. citizen -- not even everybody files taxes.

I agree. For example, I bought my home under my maiden name before I got married and changed it. All the utilities, the mortgage, the title, and my property taxes are all under my maiden name. The utilities I can update, but the mortgage/title/taxes can't be changed until I sell the house or refinance it, as far as I know. My husband has NOTHING under his own name other than a credit card and his paid off vehical, he's not even on our bank accounts due to some credit issues he's had in the past.

I'm not saying doing it online is impossible, but finding data you can use to verify that who is responding is the correct person may be more tricky than one thinks.
 

In addition, Census workers spend several days visiting soup kitchens, homeless shelters and even searching known outdoor locations for people to count.

Also, foreign residents living in this county on census day (not people on holiday) but students and those working in the U.S. are counted -- as are illegal aliens.

The Census is a picture of America on Census Day -- not just Americans.
 
In addition, Census workers spend several days visiting soup kitchens, homeless shelters and even searching known outdoor locations for people to count.

Also, foreign residents living in this county on census day (not people on holiday) but students and those working in the U.S. are counted -- as are illegal aliens.

The Census is a picture of America on Census Day -- not just Americans.

In years past the census would even ask about citizenship and alien status.
 
There is currently no way of assuring that. I could go take the census out of my neighbors mailbox, fill it out with anything I want, and mail it back.

There are a lot of ways the system could be set up. It is impossible to give a detailed plan for a project of this magnitude on a message board posting. How exactly it would be implemented would require some research, which I am not going to do.

Once all the details are worked out for single sign on and persistent online identity this problem will take care of itself. It will be done by 2020 so perhaps that will be used. It is also too late to do anything about 2010 and no one knows what technology will be available by the next census so everything is moot for now. It is too early to start working on a finalize system for ten years down the road but at least the ground work could be done.

If I had to go and back engineer a solution for 2010 off the top of my head:

Create an account and if a phone number is registered to the same address send a call to that phone number and give them a pin. This can be all automated and require no person to sit there and make a call.

I would hate to do this but after the account is created a postcard with a pin could be sent to the address for verification. While not ideal it would still cut out on mailing since one postcard can be mailed much more cheaply then multiple reminders and the actual census.

The database for the census could link with publicly filed property information and generate a challenge question based on that. While the information would be available to other parties it would not be readily known and when people are setting up fraudulent accounts they attempt to automate and wouldn't go through the trouble of manually referencing those records. Something as simple as a captcha cuts down automated account creation by nearly 100%. I would have to see what information is available for this method of course.

Cross referencing DMV information instead of property information can be done. For example, enter the drivers license number of someone with the address listed on their license.

Another option would be to cross reference the address with the water or another utility bill. Upon account creation ask a challenge question like the account number for the address's water bill or the amount of the electric bill from last month.

We use variations of these exact methods right now for things like online loan applications or home banking and bill payment.

It isn't hard to cross reference databases or create database views that contain only information needed for specific purposes. It could be part of a larger initiative to have different government agencies actually share information.

If there is no one at the house on the title, no one there with a land line phone (and even unlisted numbers can be referenced to an address), no one there with access to a utility bill or account, and no one there with a driver's license perhaps they would not have the online option.

Every single thing mentioned above is something we can do right now with existing technology. All of the data sharing would have required pre-planning and had then started, say, 3 years ago that portion could have been handled.

No matter what method is used there is always a chance for fraud. There is no greater chance for it doing it online then via the current system. A mistake that is often made in online projects is waiting until they are impossible to beat before rolling them out, because that is never going to happen. The idea is to get the chance for fraud, whether it is online banking or the census, down to a reasonable level of risk. When a new threat is encountered you close that loop hole. It is an arms race.

In 2010 doing almost anything paper only is a waste of resources. I would gladly sign up to do the census online even knowing that there is a chance of fraud knowing that the chance already exists anyway.

That system will be nice, but it would miss a TON of people...

People such as yourself might be mad about the "wasted" postage and advertising, but thats actually SAVED money as the response is quite high this year...

Rather funny listening to a guy sitting on the internet, complaining about the census, but then offers up no alternative...
 
Sometimes I think people argue for the sake of arguing. It's the Census and it is required by law. I have nothing more to say.
 


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