Sad Story

[dianelevene]

We rented points for a stay at Disney in Dec. 2003. I paid the DVC member in August for the entire reservation because he insisted that was how he wanted it. We took our two young kids and flew down to Disney and when we arrived we found that the reservation had been cancelled in October. We were going to Disney because I have cancer and we wanted a break from living through cancer treatment. It had been a hard several months for my two little ones. Instead of getting a nice break, we ended up paying twice for our room, money that we could not really afford to lose. Anyhow we contacted the guy who rented us the points and he swore that it was all a big mistake and he would pay us back. Needless to say, we never saw a dime of that money! The people at Disney were very kind to us and rented us the same room at the best possible price they could find. My kids loved being at Disney but all my husband and I could think of was the extra expense on top of all the money the cancer treatment was costing.

Anyhow, we are thinking of going back to Disney next January to celebrate the end of my cancer treatment. I will have what should be my last surgery in November and we though that we would go to Disney for a few days in early January. Probably January 5 through 8. We would like to stay at the Wilderness Lodge Villas because they are so nice. What I want to know is how I can protect myself if I rent points again? Also, when can I make the reservation if I decide I do want to rent points again. The experience of being ripped off kind of shook my trust in people which makes me very sad. We had actually rented points once before and it worked out great. I don't really know what to do. I would appreciate any advice people can give me. Thanks!

 

[steverog]

Sorry to hear about your bad experience. I am a DVC member but have rented points about 4-5 times and never had this problem. Still I always call the day before we check in just to make sure all is well with our reservation. I have gotten two January reservations on short notice; therefore if I was you I would try and rent points about 55 days before check in, insist on paying with a credit card. then if your reservation is cancelled you could charge it back through your credit card company. This is really a bad deal. In the beginning I had the same fear and even talked to a MS rep. and they had never heard of this happening.

Best Wishes

Steve

 

[mikesmom]

One thing you might do is look at the history of the member renting. If someone here has hundreds of posts and you can get a feel for them as a person they probably have been around a while and are less likely (I would think) to rip you off. I know that's certainly not foolproof, but it sure would make me nervous to get in a transaction with someone who has 8 posts, for instance, and they all are related to renting points.

I would also agree with steverog. If you can find someone who can take a credit card you probably have some protection. Some people can. For instance I own my own business, so the couple of times we have rented I have taken a card. Easier for me and easier on the renters nerves. We don't own at VWL, though, so I can't be of any help to you.

The other option that is the most foolproof is to simply go through Disney. January is pretty slow both for regular parks and for DVC. It' s a pretty good possibility that CRO could have some pretty good discounts. Cash may be close to point costs that time of year if discounts are decent. It may cost more, of course, but the extra may be worth your peace of mind.

 

[wdwstar]

This is very sad that this happened to you or anyone else. Renting points is base on trust from both parties. did you have a contract with the person and did you have all their info.
i would not let this person get away with taking your money.
did you fulfill your end of the bargin, i know sometimes members only ask for a deposit then pay in full 60 days out and i have read some contracts that if not paid in full by 60 days the person looses his/her deposit & ressies, could this have happened in this case. i am surprised 99.99% you can trust these dvc members on the rent/trade board, i have helped people rent points from dvc members. if you need help or would like help please pm i would be more then happy to help you rent points.

 

[dianelevene]

Thanks for the advice. We did try and get the dvc member to take a credit card through paypal. However, he refused so we went ahead and paid him. We eventually sued him in small claims court but because he lived so far away it would have cost us more to appear in court than we could have recovered through the suit. Unfortunately you can not include travel costs as part of your damages when you file suit. I was angry that he was able to get away with stealing from us but at this point there is nothing else we can do. As I mentioned before we rented DVC points once before and the arrangement worked out beautifully. I did try and call to check on my reservations but I was told that since I was not the DVC member I could not get ANY information about the reservation. Anyhow I will have to think about what I want to do when we go to Disney next January. I really love the Wilderness Lodge Villas and we enjoyed staying there. We love how close it is to the Magic Kingdom and my kids love the boat ride to get there.

 

[Tinkerbelloncapecod]

This is definitely a very sad story and I wish you and your family a wonderful Magical time in January.

Perhaps if you do rent again I would suggest asking the DVC'r for references. I would feel more at ease with many e-mails or telephone calls and references and then check them out.

There are many fine DVC'rs who rent their points out...unfortunately this person was not a nice person. He/she should be ashamed of themselves!

Good luck in January and God Bless you and your family!

Rosemary

 

[ceejay13]

A very sad story, indeed. You might also ask for a copy of the reservation as soon as you have paid in full for the rental.

 

[mitcam]

I know that it is a risk on both sides to rent. I have been on both sides of perfectly smooth transactions.

I would love to people who have rented from me to get on and say things went great! I own DVC now but when I was considering buying it was nice to know I could do it for a little less $$.

While I am very sad about what happened to you I would love to know who you rented from. Why can't the DIS ban people who are conning others by way of the DIS!

We all know there is much bad blood on these boards, debates start arguments etc... Maybe we need to be policing who is online with us a little closer.

I am sorry for your loss of $$ and I am sure your feeling of helplessness. There are some great people on the DIS actually they outnumber the bad many times over.

Any veterans have an opinion about posting the names of swindlers? Doc?

Carolyn

 

[CRSNDSNY]

I am so sorry that this happened to you...I can't believe that someone would do this to anyone. How terrible of them!

I am not asking this DVCrs name, nor do I think you should post it, but did you find him through the DIS DVC rental board?

BTW, there are some very reliable renters on the rental board, you just need to do your research to find them. Always get a contract and try to find someone who has past renters to vouch for them. Always get the rental agreement number so you can call DVC yourself to verify the reservation. Be wary of those who only have a few posts and are renting their points. I'm still appalled that someone would do this to you.

I wish you only the best of luck, health & happiness on your future trips.

 

[Dean]

I believe it would be against the DIS rules to post the name but I suspect many of us have an idea of who it is. As for PayPal, that would not help. First, your transaction would actually be with Paypal so unless Paypal didn't do their part, you would have no recourse. PayPal also has it in their contract I'm told that if you do a charge back, they will cancel your account. The bottom line is that for the savings involved in renting, there is a signficant amount of trust involved. That goes both ways. There are ways both the member and rentee can decrease the risk but no way to totally remove it.

Sorry for your bad outcome, I've been wondering when something like that would happen. You may want to consider legal action like small claims court. You could also threaten to contact the IRS since few of us (myself as at least one exception) claim the income on their Taxes. That may get the member going and if not, carry through with the threat.

 

[profdsny]

Wow, two things: First off, since he lives a ways from you, no doubt mail was involved. Contact the postal authorities and file charges. Secondly, tell him that you will post his name. Why should someone else take a hit? Tell him you are going to let everyone know.

 

[Pam&Joe]

This is just the most despicable incident I have heard of.

 

[Desperado]

Terrible story, I'm sorry this happenned to you.

Originally posted by Dean
...I suspect many of us have an idea of who it is...

I haven't a clue who it is.

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by Desperado
Terrible story, I'm sorry this happenned to you.

I haven't a clue who it is.

There were some issues a few months ago about rental points, I was guessing it was the same person. I'm pretty sure at that time the moderators did not let a name be posted as this is between the renter and rentee. Personally I'd like to see a name posted.

 

[BostonDisneyKid]

That is a sad, sad story!!!

I would suggest as others did in that you should contact the IRS and report him for tax fraud as any rental income "should be" reported- hopefully you have a receipt of sorts to prove this. I would also contact your local Post Master if you/he did in fact use US Mail to perform this transaction because if so, he has committed Mail Fraud which is a serious federal offense. If you haven't already, I would call your home town police, his home town police and the Orlando, Fl police (as the property rental in question is in their jurisdiction) and see if they can do anything to assist you. Wouldn't it be nice if the Orlando or Florida State police could pick him up at the airport when he arrives for his next trip?

I would post his information here or an alternative location if it does in fact violate the DIS Board Policy and put the URL in a message here linking to the information to identify this person to prevent it from happening to another trusting person trying to create some "magic" for their family.

 

[mitcam]

I realize it may be against DIS rules - and the internet including the DIS is very difficult to police but I would hope that something can be done here at the DIS so whoever did this can never do it again!

Maybe there could be a feedback thread on the DIS rental/Trade boards? That thread could have its own rules - people who rent through the DIS know that they could be on it not only for the negative but the positive feedback. As I stated earlier, there are many more positive transactions that seem to take place every day.

One bit of suggestion I have is to if possible the original poster should print off all correspondence with the rentee in case this ever gets supported legally you have dates etc...

Carolyn

 

[Duchie]

I'm so sorry to hear about this! I've sent you a quick PM.

 

[JimC]

I am so sorry to hear about your bad experience. Maybe the DIS should have a reference capability. The DizPins site has one where positive references can be posted for both sides of the tranaction.

Doc is that possible?

You have had some good advice regarding potential follow-up to recover (IRS, postal authorities, various law enforcement). There may be others like reporting to credit agencies. You also might want to seek legal advice.

I also would like to know who did this. But the potential harm such postings could create, if misused, is probably why the moderators would not permit it.

Also, best warm wishes to you and your family as you complete your cancer treatments.

 

[TCPluto]

Dean is correct, this same scenario played out just as this one last fall. In that incident, the renter was eventually reimbursed, but only after police intervention.


Depending on the specifics of this transaction, various state and federal violations likely have taken place.

Us of the internet to defraud, use of the US Postal service to defraud, larceny by conversion, larceny by trick, simple larceny.

All of these can have serious consequences, regardless of whether or not restitution is made. The crime has taken place in two venues, the renters and the rentees hometowns, I suspect. This would depend on where the communications took place.

This should definitely be pursued.

 

[snoopyandpooh]

I feel sorry about what happened to you and hope you will get your money back. Also hope you will have a speedy recovery and a much happier trip in January!