ROFR Riviera Should Carry Restrictions

[Dis_Ron]

I wonder if there are any lawyers out there with interest in DVC and time share experience that have thoughts on the Riviera ROFR. It seems really unfair if Disney can buy back Riviera contracts resale and not have to keep the resale restrictions. Might be a case there to force Disney to either accept the same resale restrictions or change the contracts to remove the resale restrictions for everybody.

 

[Sandisw]

The RIV contract is very clear that the resale restrictions do not apply to DVD in anyway.

So, it’s been built into the contract already to exempt them.

There are things in all the resort contracts that exempt DVD or DVC that owners can’t do.

 

[Tumnus]

Disney built the thing, they can absolutely have different rules than me, I'm 100% on board with that.

 

[Dis_Ron]

It just seems like market manipulation to me. They can drive down the resale price and then resale it higher because the restrictions don’t apply to them. It’s taking money from people who need to sell their contracts.

It is analogous to Apple only allowing the apps that come with the iPhone if you resell it, but if they resell it, it can have all the apps again.

 

[Dis_Ron]

The RIV contract is very clear that the resale restrictions do not apply to DVD in anyway.

So, it’s been built into the contract already to exempt them.

There are things in all the resort contracts that exempt DVD or DVC that owners can’t do.

Newbie here, what are some other examples of this (that add restrictions on resale)?

 

[Herding_Cats]

Newbie here, what are some other examples of this (that add restrictions on resale)?

DVC/DVD can ROFR any contract and sell those points and the buyer can get the direct-purchase benefits (with whatever the minimum number of points to get said benefits are)

They can buy back OKW 2042 and sell them as 2057 (OKW-extended)

 

[stat]

DVC/DVD can ROFR any contract and sell those points and the buyer can get the direct-purchase benefits (with whatever the minimum number of points to get said benefits are)

They can buy back OKW 2042 and sell them as 2057 (OKW-extended)

I've read they can also change the use year.

 

[Tumnus]

It just seems like market manipulation to me. They can drive down the resale price and then resale it higher because the restrictions don’t apply to them. It’s taking money from people who need to sell their contracts.

It is analogous to Apple only allowing the apps that come with the iPhone if you resell it, but if they resell it, it can have all the apps again.

It's their market, they can do whatever they want. They can claim every single one and resale at 500 a point only with no exceptions if they want.

 

[AstroBlasters]

I wonder if there are any lawyers out there with interest in DVC and time share experience that have thoughts on the Riviera ROFR. It seems really unfair if Disney can buy back Riviera contracts resale and not have to keep the resale restrictions. Might be a case there to force Disney to either accept the same resale restrictions or change the contracts to remove the resale restrictions for everybody.

They set the rules before it went on sale and everyone who purchased direct and resale signed a document stating that they understood and agree to the terms and conditions.

 

[Sandisw]

Newbie here, what are some other examples of this (that add restrictions on resale)?

Some of the different rules for DVD, aside from resale restrictions, is no rule against commerical use of units like owners. They can transfer their own points to owners via OTU points as much as they want, where owners are restricted to one transfer in/out per UY.

As mentiioned, though, this was set up in the POS before anyone even bought, so we all bought knowing that ROFR doesn't force DVD to keep restrictions.

When they take back a contract, it gets dissolved, and the points simply go back into the bucket of points available for sale for that specfic unit.

 

[davper]

Just out of curiosity, How does DVD handle contracts with stripped points that the take during ROFR?

 

[Sandisw]

Just out of curiosity, How does DVD handle contracts with stripped points that the take during ROFR?

The contract is dissolved and those points..that still existed go back into the unit for future sales.

So, if there are no 2025 points when the contract is bought make, no 2025 points are added…and this DVDs would only be able to sell with 2025 based on what they already had.

This is also why changing UY can’t always happen because it depends what points are still in the units “bucket” for what is needed.

 

[Dis_Ron]

DVC/DVD can ROFR any contract and sell those points and the buyer can get the direct-purchase benefits (with whatever the minimum number of points to get said benefits are)

They can buy back OKW 2042 and sell them as 2057 (OKW-extended)

Okay thank you. I was familiar with the benefits but those some unrelated to the actual using of the resort properties.

The OKW extension sounds fishy unless they are somehow paying what the members would have paid to get the original extension. In form of a discount on the price or something.

 

[Dis_Ron]

To those using the argument it’s in the contract and say it’s fine, just because something is in a contract doesn’t mean it would hold up if challenged in court.

This could result in a large class action lawsuit in favor of all the owners at Riviera and other resort that have this.

 

[TDK44]

To those using the argument it’s in the contract and say it’s fine, just because something is in a contract doesn’t mean it would hold up if challenged in court.

This could result in a large class action lawsuit in favor of all the owners at Riviera and other resort that have this.

I'm no lawyer, but I'm pretty positive this wouldn't even make it to court...

 

[CarolynFH]

The OKW extension sounds fishy unless they are somehow paying what the members would have paid to get the original extension. In form of a discount on the price or something.

Who is “they”? DVC? For the record, owners paid $15 or $25 pp to extend.

When DVC takes back an OKW contract via ROFR, whether extended or not, DVC pays whatever price the seller and buyer had agreed on, and the points go into the OKW pot. When DVC sells them, they come out as extended, no matter how they went in.

BTW when the RIV resale restrictions were announced, the legality of them were discussed ad infinitum (ad nauseum, some would say) on these boards. So you might want to search for some of those threads - they’d have been posted in 2019, maybe 2018.

 

[Sandisw]

To those using the argument it’s in the contract and say it’s fine, just because something is in a contract doesn’t mean it would hold up if challenged in court.

This could result in a large class action lawsuit in favor of all the owners at Riviera and other resort that have this.

The flip side is just because owners decide after the fact that they don’t like the terms they agreed to when they bought doesn’t mean the terms all of a sudden become illegal.

But, as I said, developers have abilities under the law that don’t apply to other owners.

Now, DVD gave themselves the right to amend the restrictions for owners if they so choose…

But the restrictions are built into the contract as part of the DVC resort agreement

 

[airjay75]

It just seems like market manipulation to me.

It is! And that is pretty much the entire point of the resale restrictions. DVD wants more control over the DVC market. DVD makes money when they sell direct points, not resale points. They simply do not care about the resale market UNLESS it affects direct sales. And, so far, there really is no evidence that the resale restrictions are significantly affecting direct sales, if they're even affecting them at all.

We all wish the resale restrictions didn't exist. But they do, and I don't think they're going away. I don't see any legal theory that could invalidate them. You either make peace with them and buy your direct or resale contract accordingly, or I guess you pass on DVC as a product that simply isn't worth it to you anymore.

FWIW, I think there is a lot of uncertainly how all of this will play out over the long-term, particularly as we approach 2042 and thereafter. How many new resorts with resale restrictions will be built? How will the resale market pricing evolve?
Will DVD exercise ROFR much more regularly on restricted resorts and flip to direct? What will RIV look like once it is "sold out"? A lot can change.