RFID wristbands for resort guests will we get DVC ones

[paulh]

in the evening like to get dressed up last thing i want is a day glow wristband on my wrist
Paul

 

[OrangeCountyCommuter]

Please NO!

I don't want a special wrist band that says I am DVC.

I try very hard at Disney not to let CMs know that I am either DVC or an AP holder.

Sorry, but I am tired of "guilt by association" and some of my fellow members think that owning DVC means they can "abuse" cast members. If you have ever SCREAMED at a CM "I OWN PART OF THIS PLACE" hang your head in shame. You own part of timeshare. You do NOT own Epcot, MK, AK, etc.. You were not granted "lifetime fast passes" etc.. (I once saw a man just breate a CM because "My DVC card is the same a s a lifetime fast pass" He made a BIG SHOW out of writing down her name, the time etc "so I can report you to management" and stormed off. The girl did look terririfed until I said "I am an DVC member and he's lying" I think he had this act down and it probably works a lot!)

 

[Sammie]

Please NO!

I don't want a special wrist band that says I am DVC.

I try very hard at Disney not to let CMs know that I am either DVC or an AP holder.

Sorry, but I am tired of "guilt by association" and some of my fellow members think that owning DVC means they can "abuse" cast members. If you have ever SCREAMED at a CM "I OWN PART OF THIS PLACE" hang your head in shame. You own part of timeshare. You do NOT own Epcot, MK, AK, etc.. You were not granted "lifetime fast passes" etc.. (I once saw a man just breate a CM because "My DVC card is the same a s a lifetime fast pass" He made a BIG SHOW out of writing down her name, the time etc "so I can report you to management" and stormed off. The girl did look terririfed until I said "I am an DVC member and he's lying" I think he had this act down and it probably works a lot!)

I am sure you could get a generic one. This guy would be a jerk regardless of whether he owned DVC or not.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Eh. I don't use the dining plan and I would carry a credit card (a regular one, no RFID, although eventually it will probably come to all credit cards) rather than have a bunch of money in an account accessible through a RFID bracelet.

Don't want videos of myself either.

So it'll be something to use to get into the room and the park...will they put my annual pass on a wristband and i will just have to keep it all year?

Eventually they are just going to implant a chip in everybody's head.

I had my credit card "stolen" at Disney. Of course, my card was still in my possession....just lifted my number and damaged the strip.

No CC going on my room..no way to protect the chip in the bracelet.

 

[honeymo78]

You actual credit card number doesn't get put on your kttw or the chip. It works kind of like a tab, that Disney only charges to the cc when you hit a certain amount or the night before you check out. Anyone lifting that number/code/strip etc would have a very limited use of that info. If they managed to put that info on another kttw or Disney chip, disputing the charges at the front desk would be pretty easy. We had an erroneous room charge in the past and it was zero problem to have it removed. We also lost a kttw once and the Cm assured us we would not be responsible if someone had used it for charging or park entry. Most recently we've been asked for ID when we charge something to our room key. It surprised me because no one ever checked in the past.

 

[Alexander]

Another few years down the road and we'll all have chips in our heads, so you won't have to worry about wearing wrist bands or having them stolen.

 

[dianeschlicht]

If it can be programmed it can be hacked.

Exactly, and we all know about Disney's lack of good IT. Frankly, this idea scares me.

 

[dmoore22]

Exactly, and we all know about Disney's lack of good IT. Frankly, this idea scares me.

There are 99 opensource programs available for free download at sourceforge.net for programming and reading/programming various RFID formats.

"In an effort to make passports more secure, several countries have implemented RFID in passports. However, the encryption on UK chips was broken in under 48 hours. Since that incident, further efforts have allowed researchers to clone passport data while the passport is being mailed to its owner. Where a criminal used to need to secretly open and then reseal the envelope, now it can be done without detection, adding some degree of insecurity to the passport system."

 

[rock_doctor]

If it can be programmed it can be hacked.

BINGO! Can you imagine how much you could do with a simple scanner and an iPhone. Walk though a line waiting to get into a park. You could walk away with a hundred or more numbers. What is the chance you won't get each one with charging privileges... Then add to that if it is somebody who works at Disney they now can get your room number and pay it a visit when you are in the park. Just watch your charges and they know where you are at all times... It is just not a safe technology. At least with the mag strip cards they need to have the physical card for a split second to make a copy... I know for us, while they are super cool (sort of) we will demand ours do not have charging privileges, tickets to anything nor can open our room. How long would it take you to walk though a hotel transmitting the door key code before you found the door it opened? Just think what you have in your room when you are staying at Disney...money, computer, phone, electronic games, medicine etc.... In another thread i added links to 11 articles that talked about how easily it was to skim and then clone an RFID.

 

[Goofypop]

BINGO! Can you imagine how much you could do with a simple scanner and an iPhone.

You do realize that the RFID tech doesn't put off a signal that far right? I mean you have to almost be touching the scanner to be able to activate it. And even then, it takes more than a couple of seconds to do so. I don't know about you, but someone trying to hold my hand tends to get my attention. If you are that unaware at the parks then up your medication or snap out of it. And the RFID replicator would be kind of noticeable in someones hands.

"Pay no attention to me while I stand up against you touching your armband for 3 or 4 seconds while holding this black box to it."

One one-thousand, two one-thousand, three one-thousand, four one-thousand. Yes it took you 4 seconds to read that. If someone can hold the black box to your armband for that long without you noticing then you need help.

And you're forgetting something.... who cares enough to even do this? I have worked in the criminal justice field my entire working life and I can tell you that it is a very small percentage of people that would even bother with doing something like this. Really. And the charges could be disputed if it were EVER to occur. The same people that would do this would be the people that are pickpockets and how many times have you heard of someone getting their Disney KttW card stolen and charges jacked up on it? Don't lie. We already know.

People will find anything about anything to gripe about and freak out over. "OMG! That biometric scanner is communist! It is Big Brother keeping tabs on me!" What if someone got my biometric readings? They could steal my identity!"

 

[honeymo78]

You do realize that the RFID tech doesn't put off a signal that far right? I mean you have to almost be touching the scanner to be able to activate it. And even then, it takes more than a couple of seconds to do so. I don't know about you, but someone trying to hold my hand tends to get my attention. If you are that unaware at the parks then up your medication or snap out of it. And the RFID replicator would be kind of noticeable in someones hands.

"Pay no attention to me while I stand up against you touching your armband for 3 or 4 seconds while holding this black box to it."

One one-thousand, two one-thousand, three one-thousand, four one-thousand. Yes it took you 4 seconds to read that. If someone can hold the black box to your armband for that long without you noticing then you need help.

And you're forgetting something.... who the ---- cares enough to even do this? I have worked in the criminal justice field my entire working life and I can tell you that it is a very small percentage of people that would even bother with doing something like this. Really. And the charges could be disputed if it were EVER to occur. The same people that would do this would be the people that are pickpockets and how many times have you heard of someone getting their Disney KttW card stolen and charges jacked up on it? Don't lie. We already know.

And after they have gotten that scan they need to place the info in another band to use.

These aren't credit card numbers they would be skimming. You'd have to hope you scanned someone who wasn't checking out that day as well. There is such a limited market for the information stored on the KTTW cards and these new chips.

If there was money to be made in the information stored on KTTW cards (the same stuff that would be on RFIDs) people would report having KTTW cards cloned. And I totally agree - I can't remember anyone complaining of a stolen KTTW card and unauthorized charges.

You'd still have to get pretty close to a door to unlock it. Someone randomly checking doors will be noticed.

I'd be happy to try out this tech at disney.

 

[Goofypop]

I'm completely psyched about it. I am tech geek (PCs, laptops, tablets are common-place in my house) and this is something I think I can really get into. I was worried that my wrists would not fit in the bracelets but they seem to be pretty adjustable so it shouldn't be an issue.

 

[hollis]

Sounds really cool. Can't wait to see it.

In Europe and Asia, the tab card is very common. About 10 years ago, it was used for train tickets. Now it is used every where. It works pretty much like a prepaid card that you can use it to board the train, board the bus, buy groceries, pay for movies, parking, you name it. I love this feature when I am visiting those cities. Very convenient. And it doesn't seem to be a big security issue.

 

[Bill K]

I would be deeply embarrassed to see a fellow dvc member doing this!!

 

[Lost in Neverland]

The thought of this at first seems like a great idea but then when I think of my kids and their lack of ability to keep up with stuff I do not like it. Even at 14 and 13 DH and I still keep the room keys and park passes. Secondly working in the IT industry I can promise you this is an open path to theft and fraud. The people wearing these IDs would be wide open for the hacking. Regardless of the precieved secuirty placed on it if the information is broadcasted it is available for the taking. Count me out on this one.

 

[Goofypop]

...working in the IT industry I can promise you this is an open path to theft and fraud. The people wearing these IDs would be wide open for the hacking. Regardless of the precieved secuirty placed on it if the information is broadcasted it is available for the taking. Count me out on this one.

I've worked in the IT field myself before (still do on the side) and you should probably actually read up on Passive RFID before you start scaring people.

For those that are seriously worried about this wristband being "hacked" please read about them and see that the tech does not work the way some of the people here have been saying it does. The wristband emits no signal until it gets hit with the frequency from the transmitter/receiver (The device inside the scanner at the turnstiles and such) and even then you have to be practically touching the band to the transmitter/receiver to get it to broadcast its ID. Then it is matched against the resorts database to see who you are. A database that, the bored out of his skull hacker with nothing better to do in his day, wouldn't have. Even if the person were to be able to stand in one spot and some device you were wearing was actively sending out a ID signal for them to capture (which it doesn't btw), they would have nothing to compare it to to see if it had charging privileges. Are you telling me that they would take all of that info in and program bracelet after bracelet trying to get to one that has charging privileges? There is only a single piece of info that the bracelet will have stored, a long number (probably 16 digits or so) that will be sent each time it is scanned to Disney's central database and then translated into your information to compare to your reservation. All done in a few seconds. So I tell you what, they can have my RFID number.

 

[rock_doctor]

For those who are still interested....
http://simplyrfid.typepad.com/simplyrfid1/2008/07/read-range-how-far-can-we-track-you-with-passive-rfid.html

http://news.cnet.com/8301-10789_3-9875961-57.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmajlKJlT3U

The concerns are valid and should be expressed. I am not saying it is a bad thing but we should be informed consumers and nothing says the bracelets that Disney buys will be the same as the one in the article or will use chips more like what is in a credit card...both passive but can be read a varying distances. Lastly you are correct. It is how Disney uses the data and how much use the number will be to a crook. After all the RFID is really nothing more then a bar code. Which is why i said in my original post it may require somebody who works for Disney...

 

[Goofypop]

I guess that 's kind of my whole point. Disney would never put a tech in the field that would leave them and us so open for fraud and theft. We just need to trust them and move on. And honestly, the way this has been put out there it seems that it may be an opt in or opt out situation. If a person wants to continue getting a KttW card because they think their identity will get stolen I think Disney will not make them take off their foil hats and will issue them a card.

 

[Sammie]

I've worked in the IT field myself before (still do on the side) and you should probably actually read up on Passive RFID before you start scaring people.

For those that are seriously worried about this wristband being "hacked" please read about them and see that the tech does not work the way some of the people here have been saying it does. The wristband emits no signal until it gets hit with the frequency from the transmitter/receiver (The device inside the scanner at the turnstiles and such) and even then you have to be practically touching the band to the transmitter/receiver to get it to broadcast its ID. Then it is matched against the resorts database to see who you are. A database that, the bored out of his skull hacker with nothing better to do in his day, wouldn't have. Even if the person were to be able to stand in one spot and some device you were wearing was actively sending out a ID signal for them to capture (which it doesn't btw), they would have nothing to compare it to to see if it had charging privileges. Are you telling me that they would take all of that info in and program bracelet after bracelet trying to get to one that has charging privileges? There is only a single piece of info that the bracelet will have stored, a long number (probably 16 digits or so) that will be sent each time it is scanned to Disney's central database and then translated into your information to compare to your reservation. All done in a few seconds. So I tell you what, they can have my RFID number.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Lost in Neverland]

I've worked in the IT field myself before (still do on the side) and you should probably actually read up on Passive RFID before you start scaring people.

First and foremost it is my opinion and I am not trying to scare anyone. If you work in the IT field you also know that even though a scenario is unlikely that it can still happen. And just as I give you the right to have your opinion I also have the same right to mine. If you do not like my opinion it still does not give you the right to attack what I think in the manner you did.