repeated BUS ABUSE ON OUR TRIP THIS PAST WEEK

[cruise-o-matic]

Put aside the issues of who is legitimately able to ride the transportation, people parking at DTD to avoid the $8 parking fee are cheapskates and that only SSR resort guest should have 1st dibs on the SSR bus.

The real and only issue is this: According to "Official" Disney transportation guidelines, to get to DTD from a park, you need to take a bus to a resort, then a DTD from that resort. What has happened with the opening of SSR and its proximity to DTD is that the bus transfer piece has been taken out of the equation. So now the SSR bus has become the not so unofficial mode of transportation to DTD. And really, this is probably only a headache at park closing, when weary SSR guests are competing for seats against people wanting to go to DTD to party on or the cheapskates returning to their cars.

If I wanted to go to DTD after MK closing, knowing what I know now, I'd do the following: 1) Check the SSR queue. Too full? If so 2) Look for a resort bus queue where I can load immediately. If it is AKL, so be it. If the bus queues are too full, then 3) Walk to the CR and catch the DTD bus from there.

So what should be done? Well Disney Transportation is all about convenience. The quicker Disney can transport you, the faster you will spend your $ at the parks, resorts or DTD. So don't expect Disney to slow things down by checking resort ID's (unless security, or the appearance thereof dictates it). My guess is that at some point an equilibrium will be found, whether Disney adds more SSR busses or maybe they'll start bussing guest from the parks to DTD (so guest can get to DTD quicker and spend more $).



And one other thing, Can't we all get along?

 

[Capn Dave]

Well unfortunately what others have worried about I have seen 4 times this past week and we were only at SSR for 6 days. The bus hoppers are being told to take the SSR buses as an easy way to get to DTD. These are not even WDW resort guests!

The first instance was an elderly couple I overheard talking about not wanting to pay the $8 parking fee...Another SSr resort guest was giving them directions to get back to the west side where they were parked. It wound up to be a huge hassle for this couple late at night and I am sure this discouraged them from trying to save the $8 next time.

Second was a family who were talking about staying at the Wydham. They were coming back from Blizzard Beach.

Third was a family again coming back from Magic Kingdom. They were walking around the bus stop in a daze after exiting the bus mumbling to each other if this was the right stop. They were not sure of where to go to get to DTD. Call me evil but there was no way in heck I was going to make their lives (being they are abusing the bus system) easier so we walked right by them. They were also trying to get back the Hilton.

Last was family from hell. They had a ton of junk with them and the mother was loud and obnoxious. This was the most blatant abuse of the bus yet. When the bus stopped to unload she was yelling at the bus driver about going to the Hilton. He told her to get off there. She was saying something about a shuttle but either the bus driver did not understand her or just wanted her off the bus. We were not even on that bus but waiting at the stop to go to Epcot. She was yelling so loudly at the bus driver it carried out of the bus into the air to everyone waiting. She proceeds to get off with her family of 6 and they walk to the water from the Congress park bus stop. About 5 minutes later we hear her yelling at her husband about not being able to find the shuttle (((???))) She then comes over to another guest waiting for the bus (God I wish she came up to me) and starts asking how to get to DTD or the shuttle to the Hilton? Well the person explains that DTD is a five minute walk and she would have to go that way. There are no shuttles to the Hilton. She is now screaming at her husband about how the bus driver gave them the wrong information. She also was yelling that she couldn't walk since she has a bad back. She was complaining and moaning the entire time she was there and it was getting really grating especially since she did not belong there. She was blatantly abusing the bus system and felt entitled to complain about it too no less! So she was then yelling to her husband to call a cab! Then another guest tells her a DTD bus will be there within 20 minutes since she just missed it (I was screaming in my head 'no don't encourage her!!")

Fortunately for us the Epcot bus came and spared us from the misery of her (so I don't have a conclusion) but I am now extremely worried about 3 things.
#1 are Disney Cast members telling people to use the SSR bus as an easy way to DTD
#2 Do you think the DTD area resorts are telling their guests to do that (it would save them on their transportation costs for people to abuse the WDW transportation.
#3 My dues are paying for people like this to travel for free!!!!


I want to write a letter and explain my concerns and also report this. I mean if I saw it 4 times in 6 days how many other times has it happened where the people are just being quiet?
Who can I write to or call about this?

I remember quite a few years ago that you had to stay at a Disney resort to ride the buses to the hotels or parks. I notice now that anyone can ride the buses anywhere. You could be a person with a day ticket to disney and ride the bus to SSR and DTD. In fact you wouldn't even need a park ticket.
Maybe Disney needs to start checking ID's when you board the bus to cut down on people using transportation intended for guests.

 

[jarestel]

If Disney decided to close the free parking loophole at DTD and started charging the same amount to park there as at the parks, the SSR bus debate would probably be settled. Of course a new "I don't want to give up my free parking at DTD" debate would begin. I guess it all depends on how it affects each one personally as to how vehemently we would support/oppose such a plan. But it would eliminate any incentive for people to park at DTD and use the SSR busses to get out of paying the parking fee.

 

[sjdisneywedding]

I remember quite a few years ago that you had to stay at a Disney resort to ride the buses to the hotels or parks. I notice now that anyone can ride the buses anywhere. You could be a person with a day ticket to disney and ride the bus to SSR and DTD. In fact you wouldn't even need a park ticket.
Maybe Disney needs to start checking ID's when you board the bus to cut down on people using transportation intended for guests.

why? I believe its already been pointed out that Disney wants everyone using the busses to go to as many places as possible. The issue isnt whos riding the busses, its more whos paying for the busses

 

[ColoradoBelle1]

Good Morning!
I haven't read all 11 pages, so this may be a repetitive brainstorming but here goes:
The problem is : people parking at DTD TO SAVE THE $8.00 parking fee and subsequently using/crowding SS buses which are subsidized by DVC owners?

First: how many people are we talking about here? While I am sure that there are some people who travel from DTD to the parks, I do not think it is for the purpose of saving parking fees at the parks.
The reason: if you are a local or savvy out of town visitor, you know lots of easier/ quicker ways to avoid paying parking fees and get in closer to the park of choice. Certainly you could just park at SS to use SS transport, but we all know there is closer parking than that depending on what park you are trying to get to.

I think that there are people who are shopping at DTD but then who want to meet up with family maybe at one of the parks. These people might be directed by CMS to use the SS buses if they are asked...but savvy shoppers would more likely take a bus from DTD to say, the Contemporary and then walk to the MK, or to Poly or GF and then monorail, or to BC and walk or boat to Epcot.

As to illegality: if having a park ticket allows you to use ALL transportation and if shopping at DTD is the only requirement for free parking (you could buy a cup of coffee to qualify)...then anyone parking at DTD and shopping there is allowed to hop any bus to anywhere legally, no?

I imagine that the bean counters like the idea of peple spending money at DTD. They may even like the idea of people walking over to SS while it is still not sold out...to check it out.

It seems from the posts here that once there were buses directly to the parks from DTD, but that they stopped running...I guess from lack of biz?
IF that is true, then perhaps the bus drivers and CMS are telling people to use the SS bus and therin lies the solution: the SS owners should tell DISney they are concerned about the problem and they would like Disney to change the policy of telling people to use SS bus transport to the parks. Instead, guests could be offered transportation on any unfilled bus from DTD to another resort with a courtesy dropoff at the park nearest the resort bus itself. ( So, a bus to YC could drop off the YC people, pick up YC people headed to DTD and then make a quick stop at EPcot or MGM. DTD people wanting to go to MK could get on an unfilled bus to Contemporary and walk to MK from there. This would be more efficient and fairer to SS owners because it would be using Disney buses to Disney nonDVC resorts to transport shoppers to the parks of choice.

It seems that the complaints about SS bus use by DTD parkers stemmed from people coming FROM the parks and going TO DTC as opposed to the other way around. (Forgive me if I am wrong about that.) It might be that the CMS aren't telling people at DTD to use SS transport to go TO the parks, but only to get them FROM the parks to DTD. I guess the problem could be elimated if they just made a sign and transport 'line' from the park bus stop TO DTD...and then when people were standing IN that line, buses going to the 'DTD" onsite Disney quasi hotels would pick them up.

Finally: in this day and age of security, I imagine that at buildout, SS will have either a walking path gate that needs a SS resort key to open at the walkways from/to SS to DTD...In the scheme of things this wouldn't be too costly a prevention..sort of like what many beach resorts use to prevent beach walkers from coming onto the resort.

Hope this brainstorming helps a little insofar as solutions to the problem.
have a great day!
colorado belle






So the option of pay parking at DTD, which would discourage shoppers, or even having park tickets that must be stamped in one of the shops (creating $$ costs for Disney to pay for parking attendants etc) isn't 'win' enough for Disney.

 

[jarestel]

It seems from the posts here that once there were buses directly to the parks from DTD, but that they stopped running...I guess from lack of biz?

That's one way of looking at it...
Another is that Disney realized people were parking at DTD and hopping busses to the parks to save on parking fees.

So the option of pay parking at DTD, which would discourage shoppers, or even having park tickets that must be stamped in one of the shops (creating $$ costs for Disney to pay for parking attendants etc) isn't 'win' enough for Disney.

It's not likely that too many local people go to DTD in order to pay 3 times as much for Disney souveniers as they can pay at other local outlets. Most of the DTD shoppers, are in all likelihood, Disney resort visitors who don't need to drive to DTD unless they want to.

If Disney charged for parking at DTD, they could still honor AP's, PI ticket media, and Disney Quest tickets for free parking. Granted, the shoppers would have to pay, but as I said if they're Disney guests anyway, they only pay once for parking per day regardless of whether they go to parks and/or DTD.

If DTD is the only "free" parking place left in WDW ( not counting sneaking into resort parking lots to park ), then maybe it's time to close that door.

 

[lllovell]

It is my understanding that the reason there are no buses directly from DTD to the parks is to avoid the parking lot at DTD being full of park guests all day thus keeping people like me (an AP holder with free parking) that drive around Disney from being able to find a parking space at DTD becaues it is full of people avoiding the $8 fee at the parks. I am sure you are correct, that some of the people parking at DTD were shopping first and went to meet up with others at the parks. I also think that most of the people we dvcers come across on the buses have already asked at the far end how to get to the parks from DTD. They figured it out somehow and I am sure they are told just as simply as they are told how to get to DTD at night. No one is arguing that people with tickets should not be allowed to use WDW transportation. People here are just concerned that as DVC members that pay a fair share (probably not all as TJKRAZ pointed out) of the price of the SSR bus lines, we want to be able to get on the bus the same as all the other resorts and not have to wait 2-3 times as long because of people using the SSR bus to get to DTD.

Either run more buses (at WDW's expense) or run buses straight to DTD and charge for parking (which seems more complicated to me) with a validation system. Either seem like quick fixes to me and they might as well install a DTD drop off OUTSIDE the SSR gates if there are truly that many people getting out there. That way you keep people that are not SSR vacationers from having complete and open access to SSR (which probably will become an issue as it fills/is completed) yet if you don't pick up from that same "outside" location, you will discourage people from parking at DTD for a "free pass" on the $8 parking fee.


There are a gazillion hotels outside the premises. I am guessing, but I would bet that most people use MYW type tickets which don't include free parking at the parks. Therefor, there is a problem with people that don't want to pay the $8 a day using other facilities to try to get free parking.

Security is another issue really. It is lacking. It provides you a sense of safety, but we all probably agree that it doesn't go far towards providing any true exclusion to different resorts.

 

[doubletrouble_vb]

Finished reading the thread after my other posts.

It's pretty clear there will be transportation problems at SSR...apparently more so than may have been occuring in the past when people may have used the Contemporary bus or the OKW bus to get to DTD. So I have two suggestions...

1. In the short run suggest to as many people as possible that they use AKL or CR to get to DTD. This might encourage Disney to find a viable resolution when their deluxe hotels are impacted by the problem.

2. Ask Disney to gate the walkway in the same manner pools can be gated. The technology for key access exists. Alternatively Disney could go low tech and add a gate that is manually locked and only open from 2:30PM until 6:00AM (for the hard partiers). Yes you would still get a few people using the bus as an alternate shuttle to DTD hotels...but remember these people have a bus shuttle and would rather catch their own bus than yours...if they are on your bus it was probably a mistake. This would discourage all but the most serious skinflints from using DTD for parking. SSR patrons could use the waterpark busses to get to DTD during the periods the gate is locked and when the ferry isn't running.

 

[Greysword]

Onto the solution portion of our discussion

After reading all of the arguments, the best solution appears to be to contact WDW transportation.

We need to inform them, as dutiful Disney citizens, that there has been a large influx of people moving through SSR for DTD and that the bus driving CMs have been encouraging it.

We should also state that the numbers and time of day seem to indicate that the majority of these people are using the WDW transporation system and DTD to by-pass the regular automobile fees at the parks, which was the reason for discontinuing the bus service from DTD to the theme parks in the first place. We may want to point out in the email/letter that Disney is loosing transportation (in gas and vehicle maintenance) and parking revenue due to this.

Near the end we can put in a small section about our specific grievances. That is, although fellow Disney citizens are more than welcome at our lovely resort to shop, play, and dine, we would prefer those just using the SSR bus stop as a transfer point to save a few dollars or to get to an non-sanctioned DTD hotel find some other mode of transportation and pay the parking fees at one of the theme parks.

This should inform them of the number of individual complaints, the concern we have that Disney is loosing revenue, our concerns for the increasing number of herds passing through, and then let the wonderful imagineers take over from there. I would be willing to bet they could think of a fine way to handle the problem, shopuld they choose to do so.

Thank you for listening! What are some other solutions you have to the issue?

 

[Sherri]

I'm not sure i'm understanding something. We go to Disney about twice a year, staying on Disney property one out of the two times. We NEVER thought about parking at a resort and taking their transportation over to the parks. Isn't that against the rules? Or technically are you able to?
I always figured that resrot transportation is for those staying at the resort. Am I wrong?

 

[sjdisneywedding]

I'm not sure i'm understanding something. We go to Disney about twice a year, staying on Disney property one out of the two times. We NEVER thought about parking at a resort and taking their transportation over to the parks. Isn't that against the rules? Or technically are you able to?
I always figured that resrot transportation is for those staying at the resort. Am I wrong?

actually these people are parking at Downtown Disney for free then walking to SSR via the walkway and using the busses that run back and forth to the parks from SSR

also no technically you are not allowed to park at resort in order to use that resorts transportation to get to the parks, but some still try to do that as well

 

[lllovell]

You are right, Sherri. But we are talking about the open access area of DTD. You can certainly bend the rules and find a way into resort areas and park, but it is against the rules (since there is limited parking). Some days you will be allowed in if there are few people staying at the resort and others you will be turned away if you are a resort guest, but off property, you are supposed to always be turned away unless you have a PS or are visiting then you are directed to a "short term" lot.

The folks that have started this debate are using the open area of Downtown Disney to park, walking to SSR and then grabbing a bus (or leaving the parks and going to SSR and walking to DTD in the evenings). Technically they have the right if they are ticket holders, but they are bending the spirit of the free DTD parking.

 

[sjdisneywedding]

G
First: how many people are we talking about here? While I am sure that there are some people who travel from DTD to the parks, I do not think it is for the purpose of saving parking fees at the parks. .

well i guess its enough to warrant this post from the OP. Personally I disagree I think itsmostly entirely to avoid the parking fee. Who is going to drive to DTD, walk to SSr, take a bus to the park, and do it all again in reverse when they can simply drive to the park and pay $8?

Certainly you could just park at SS to use SS transport, but we all know there is closer parking than that depending on what park you are trying to get to..

umm actually no you cant do this, at all! This is breaking the rules, at least those parking at DTD are not breaking rules

It seems from the posts here that once there were buses directly to the parks from DTD, but that they stopped running...I guess from lack of biz?

hugh? I hope thats supposed to be a joke. they stopped it because too many people where trying to avoid the parking fee.



[/QUOTE]

 

[Sherri]

If technically it is permitted, and large amounts of people do this, and Disney knows of this, then why don't they just wave the parking fee?
I like a good deal as much as the next guy, but i've got to tell you, that seems like a lot of work in order to get out of parking.
In order to take the resort busses, shouldn't they require you to show your room key, or something else stating you are staying at that specific resort?

 

[sjdisneywedding]

Onto the solution portion of our discussion

After reading all of the arguments, the best solution appears to be to contact WDW transportation.

We need to inform them, as dutiful Disney citizens, that there has been a large influx of people moving through SSR for DTD and that the bus driving CMs have been encouraging it.

We should also state that the numbers and time of day seem to indicate that the majority of these people are using the WDW transporation system and DTD to by-pass the regular automobile fees at the parks, which was the reason for discontinuing the bus service from DTD to the theme parks in the first place. We may want to point out in the email/letter that Disney is loosing transportation (in gas and vehicle maintenance) and parking revenue due to this.

Near the end we can put in a small section about our specific grievances. That is, although fellow Disney citizens are more than welcome at our lovely resort to shop, play, and dine, we would prefer those just using the SSR bus stop as a transfer point to save a few dollars or to get to an non-sanctioned DTD hotel find some other mode of transportation and pay the parking fees at one of the theme parks.

This should inform them of the number of individual complaints, the concern we have that Disney is loosing revenue, our concerns for the increasing number of herds passing through, and then let the wonderful imagineers take over from there. I would be willing to bet they could think of a fine way to handle the problem, shopuld they choose to do so.

Thank you for listening! What are some other solutions you have to the issue?

great idea, anybody know where exactly to sending these?

 

[RobDoc]

great idea, anybody know where exactly to sending these?

We can't use the DIS to organize any letter writing campaign - email or otherwise. This has been a long standing policy of the site.

This issue is more likely an individual problem than a WDW policy problem anyway. In their zeal to assist guests, WDW bus drivers may suggest taking the SSR bus (knowing that it is rarely filled at this point in time) when asked "What is the easiest way to get to DD from here" - regardless where "here" may be.

Some guests staying on Hotel Plaza Blvd do walk to DD and take a bus to a resort in order to get to one of the parks, rather than wait for their own shuttle. Some offsite guests may park at DD and do the same thing to save the parking fee, but many are also going to DD to go to PI, shop or dine at one of the restaurants.

The monorail resorts used to share their bus with TTC to get to DD - not sure if the route is still the same or not- but, either way, until it is perceived as a problem by Disney, it's unlikely to be modified. While email complaints may eventually contribute to a modification of the current situation, it will likely need to come from complaints of guests currently staying onsite rather than from relatively anonymous emails from people who have experienced the issue only thru the internet.

My personal experience has been that better response is usually gained from addressing the situation while onsite by asking to speak to a manager or from letters sent by snail mail to appropriate parties. Email campaigns tend to look like organized attempts to overrun systems with hearsay complaints.

 

[MiaSRN62]

CapnDave states :

I remember quite a few years ago that you had to stay at a Disney resort to ride the buses to the hotels or parks. I notice now that anyone can ride the buses anywhere.

Huh ? How far back are you going Dave (or anyone else who has said this) ? I'm just real curious about this one. We've been using disney busses to get to and from resorts from parks and back "legally" and "legitimately" for 11 years now ? We (for the record) never used a hotel parking lot to gain access to a park. Personally, I don't consider that a legit reason.
When we first brought our kids to WDW in '94, it was disney CM's themselves (CRO, bus drivers etc) who explained to us which busses we could take to get wherever. We were never asked for resort ID's in the numerous times we used the busses to get (mostly) to restaurants. We stayed offsite almost exclusively until '98-'99 when we started adding nights on at disney resorts and then '00 when we became DVC Members. So just wondering how far back this so-called policy goes where you had to be staying at a disney hotel in order to utilize the busses ?

 

[Disneyaholic]

Who is going to drive to DTD, walk to SSr, take a bus to the park, and do it all again in reverse when they can simply drive to the park and pay $8?

The people who are staying at the Holiday Inn, Days Inn, etc. 7 or 8 miles away from WDW. Unless things have changed, those motels don't even offer transportation to the parks -- or if they do, they charge for it and it runs on a set schedule (unlike the Disney transportation which [supposedly, anyhow] runs continuously. So, if you miss the 3:30 bus back to the motel, you have to sit in the parking lot (and yes, those buses wait way out in the parking lot, not close to the park gates like WDW buses) till maybe 5:00 or so to wait for the next one.

If they have figured out that they can park for free at DTD and use the Disney transportation system for free and not have to be stuck to a bus schedule, why wouldn't they? Especially if the lots have no controls or time limits.

Remember, most of us are not the "average" WDW guest -- for a lot of people it is truly a "once-in-a-lifetime" vacation that they have saved up for for years. Saving $8 may mean more to a lot of people than saving an hour or so in transportation time.

That still doesn't make it "right" and when I'm driving up and down the aisles of DTD at 10:30 am, unable to find a decent parking space, it REALLY makes me nuts...but that does answer the question posed by sjdisneywedding.

JMHO.

 

[sjdisneywedding]

The people who are staying at the Holiday Inn, Days Inn, etc. 7 or 8 miles away from WDW. Unless things have changed, those motels don't even offer transportation to the parks -- or if they do, they charge for it and it runs on a set schedule (unlike the Disney transportation which [supposedly, anyhow] runs continuously. So, if you miss the 3:30 bus back to the motel, you have to sit in the parking lot (and yes, those buses wait way out in the parking lot, not close to the park gates like WDW buses) till maybe 5:00 or so to wait for the next one.

If they have figured out that they can park for free at DTD and use the Disney transportation system for free and not have to be stuck to a bus schedule, why wouldn't they? Especially if the lots have no controls or time limits.

Remember, most of us are not the "average" WDW guest -- for a lot of people it is truly a "once-in-a-lifetime" vacation that they have saved up for for years. Saving $8 may mean more to a lot of people than saving an hour or so in transportation time.

That still doesn't make it "right" and when I'm driving up and down the aisles of DTD at 10:30 am, unable to find a decent parking space, it REALLY makes me nuts...but that does answer the question posed by sjdisneywedding.

JMHO.

sorry you misunsderstood me, my comment was in response to many earlier posts where people commented that maybe the cars where there because the people wnated to go to DTD before going to a park. I was being sarcastic, I meant of course the ones doing this are looking to by pass the $8 fee. Otherwise you are not going through all this trouble when you could drive straight into the park and just pay the $8 and then drive straight to DTD to shop.

sorry I should of typed it all out

 

[snyderla]

You're right
It's stated and accepted everywhere that offsite guests can use wdw transportation......some folks just don't like it & wish they could change the policies that wdw set forth (such as snyderla).
It's ridiculous imho...............

NO, I don't care about changing any policies, I don't even care if people take the busses it they have tickets or a legitimate right to use them. I do not, however, agree with people parking at DTD to avoid paying to park at MK, AK, DMGMS or EPCOT. That is what I would like to change. I own DVC at SSR and I don't care if people use the transportation to get to DTD, but not to avoid paying parking fees. I guess perhaps I didn't make myself clear to you. I'm not interested in changing Disney policies, just enforcing them

Lori
aka snyderla