Rant about pay

[Pea-n-Me]

As far as travel nurses vs regular staff, we've had to hire outside travel/contract nurses here too and our regular nurses are mad bc of how much more they are making and how much less they are doing. Same goes for direct care staff. The PRN rate is about $10/hr more than the regular staff rate. We've had several staff who have quit and just work PRN about 30/hrs a week making more than they were full time and get to set their schedule instead of being forced OT.

That’s how it always was pre-pandemic. And no one really minded much because everyone knew the agency was getting most of the money. But today it’s different. Travel nurses are making WAY MORE than regular staff (like, insane amounts; sometimes $8-10K weekly), while staff who have been there throughout the pandemic, and in many cases much, much longer, have barely seen COL increases. It’s gotten crazy.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Sorry to be that person but 2.2% isn't a raise, it's a cost of living adjustment. If you have years of 2-3% pay increases you likely will not be making much more than the new hires.

You're not being that person at all. But they did just receive a raise now they want another one just because someone else got one below them it makes the conversation about the other people when if your stance is 2% ain't nothing it's really that being your issue. I've never made any sort of argument against small raises being crappy but that would be the issue for the OP, that they feel their raise was not in line with their performance and effort.

I have never taken a decrease in vacation time switching employers.

It happens. Much depends on your seniority and what position you'll be at with the new company and their vacation policies.

My husband switched companies the very beginning of Feb. His prior company gave 6 weeks of vacation for him at his level (15 years of employment) per year and 6 weeks was the max per year you could earn however you could bank up to twice your yearly amount and he frequently did; you just stopped accruing when you reached your max of banking. When he left that company he had probably 10 1/2-11 weeks of vacation his prior company paid out to him in 1 large check (minus stupid taxes) because he hardly took vacation.

His new company started with 3 weeks for him as a new hire with 5 weeks being the max they would ever give. He did ask to see if they would go to 5 weeks but they just couldn't do it with a new hire, he's not on the Board or anything lol. They did however give him 1 additional week (so 4 weeks total) to make acknowledgement of his seniority with his prior company and in what is common if he stays 5 years he'll get that last week.

Out of 5 companies that gave him job offers none could match 6 weeks of vacation.

However other things are different. For example his prior company only the very very very high ups could own stock and when they did own stock they gave up their vacation time basically. But with his new company (and another one he had gotten an offer from) there's stock that comes into play. I forget how it all works but yeah just different opportunities.

 

[dez1978]

Fwiw that is likely negotiable and the likelihood has increased due to worker shortages. I have never taken a decrease in vacation time switching employers.

Sorry to be that person but 2.2% isn't a raise, it's a cost of living adjustment. If you have years of 2-3% pay increases you likely will not be making much more than the new hires.


Most employers expect employees to keep their wages confidential so these discussions don't happen. This is, of course, to benefit the employer's bottom line.

To be honest though, if you are making close to starting salaries after 10 years in a company you are either highly undervalued, in a organization with zero upward movement, or have not developed yourself. First 2 should have had the person hitting the exit as soon as they could find something better and the third is a personal issue.

All of that is true in the private sector. Not so much in the non-union public sector. The upward movement is somewhat limited. Take clerical jobs. There are 4 levels of clerical jobs. Admin asst, senior admin asst, lead and special. Only the special admin asst job really gets anything other than the base pay for that job. A senior admin asst that starts tomorrow will get paid the same as the one whose been there 20 years 99% of the time, regardless of how hard the one who’s been there a long time has worked. When they got rid of the merit system a few years ago they also combined a bunch of jobs so there were less pay classes. Even with outstanding appraisals, they still can’t give you a pay raise. But you can move across classes. So I started out a very long time ago in dietary, which is the “bottom”. Went from a 1 to a 2. Moved to clerical, have moved up job classes over the years. But there is no movement within the class. I’m now pretty much at the top (there are very few of the special admin jobs) in clerical. I could change jobs and be a warehouse clerk, or something but I’d have to go a step below where I am now, and wait for a higher Position to open up to promote to.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

All of that is true in the private sector. Not so much in the non-union public sector. The upward movement is somewhat limited. Take clerical jobs. There are 4 levels of clerical jobs. Admin asst, senior admin asst, lead and special. Only the special admin asst job really gets anything other than the base pay for that job. A senior admin asst that starts tomorrow will get paid the same as the one whose been there 20 years 99% of the time, regardless of how hard the one who’s been there a long time has worked. When they got rid of the merit system a few years ago they also combined a bunch of jobs so there were less pay classes. Even with outstanding appraisals, they still can’t give you a pay raise. But you can move across classes. So I started out a very long time ago in dietary, which is the “bottom”. Went from a 1 to a 2. Moved to clerical, have moved up job classes over the years. But there is no movement within the class. I’m now pretty much at the top (there are very few of the special admin jobs) in clerical. I could change jobs and be a warehouse clerk, or something but I’d have to go a step below where I am now, and wait for a higher Position to open up to promote to.

FWIW that happens in corporate world too.

In 1 1/2 years at the insurance company I had plateaued with my salary. So other than raises that was the only way I would earn any additional salary. It's one of the reasons I left. And when I started it was what they called Salary Grade 28, within 6 months I went to Salary Grade 29, then a year later Salary Grade 30. 30 was all I could get realistically because 31 was special projects that never got handed out, it was like a myth lol and 32 was supervisor role (which had a high turn over towards the end of my 4 1/2 years there) and 33 was Account Underwriting (true licensed underwriters) and the joke was somebody had to die to open that up. There were like 6 maybe 7 people across 3 sites in the U.S.

Lateral moves may or may not get you the ability to move up. My mom worked for the same company I did and after 39 years there she was def. not making as much as she should have but that was after several lateral moves just to get places. She had started in the mail room sorting people's checks they sent in and made a lateral move later on, then rose into accounting where she stayed for a long time only slightly moving up from there.

It sucks when that's the culture at places

 

[RamblingMad]

I'm all for minimums going up. They have lagged behind inflation for decades. It's ridiculous what employers can get away paying people.

Given the demand for workers, if you're really that close to minimum, I'd look for another job with a union.

 

[LYSE]

Sounds like it's time to move on, apply away it won't cost you anything to reject an offer.

 

[sasywtch]

Retired State of CA employee here. I think the bottom line is, if the cost of living has risen $3 for minimum wage, then the cost of living for other seasoned/trained employees increased also. While someone may not agree, it is a fact that the more you make, your lifestyle changes. Not to say the $20 a hour is living beyond their means but probably more job stable so bought a home, had some kids whereas the $13 hr may be fresh out of mom/dad's house or renting an apartment. Taxes have gone up, feeding, clothing and medical for the kids have gone up. Yet, because the state isn't mandated to raise their pay, they don't. I know other people have said previously that state workers cannot negotiate their pay. In CA it's in the State Administration Manual our pay scales. Those only change when our union negotiates a raise (or you get your merit raise which mine ended in 1 year) or if you promote to a higher class. When I left in 1990 and returned in 2004, my pay had only gone up $100. That's how poorly the raises are. The good thing about working for the state (at least in CA), we have a excellent retirement and medical. I make more now retired (with pension and ss) and I pay zero for medical deductions out of my check (I do have to pay $15 co pay at dr and $5 pharmacy).

 

[kymom99]

Retired State of CA employee here. I think the bottom line is, if the cost of living has risen $3 for minimum wage, then the cost of living for other seasoned/trained employees increased also. While someone may not agree, it is a fact that the more you make, your lifestyle changes. Not to say the $20 a hour is living beyond their means but probably more job stable so bought a home, had some kids whereas the $13 hr may be fresh out of mom/dad's house or renting an apartment. Taxes have gone up, feeding, clothing and medical for the kids have gone up. Yet, because the state isn't mandated to raise their pay, they don't. I know other people have said previously that state workers cannot negotiate their pay. In CA it's in the State Administration Manual our pay scales. Those only change when our union negotiates a raise (or you get your merit raise which mine ended in 1 year) or if you promote to a higher class. When I left in 1990 and returned in 2004, my pay had only gone up $100. That's how poorly the raises are. The good thing about working for the state (at least in CA), we have a excellent retirement and medical. I make more now retired (with pension and ss) and I pay zero for medical deductions out of my check (I do have to pay $15 co pay at dr and $5 pharmacy).

State of Kentucky here. Insurance used to be great but no more. We have a high deductible plan. When I was still full time, my friend and I decided to give ourselves a raise since the district wasn’t helping us. I got a rank change through graduate work and she got national board certification. It’s awful that all the education we are required to have doesn’t pay better. Now that I’m retired I actually feel like I’m making decent money. We have a defined retirement benefit and I can earn extra by subbing. But there are always people making snide remarks about double dipping.
In our state, retired public school teachers cannot get full SS, even if they paid enough into the system. We get an amount that is greatly reduced. And if my spouse predeceases me, I can’t get any of his SS. It’s the windfall elimination provision that the state agreed to decades ago.

 

[Cheburashka]

This is toxic, why would you work in that kind of environment?

Plenty of people can't afford to walk away from their jobs.

 

[Cheburashka]

Given the demand for workers, if you're really that close to minimum, I'd look for another job with a union.

Assuming that unions are legal in your state. They're banned in many places.

 

[yeahdisney]

I was told by a MA with a degree.

The office MAs that have worked in the office for over 10 years were at the top of their pay scale. So no raise for a few years for them.

Then new pay rate puts new any hires in at their pay scale, doesn’t need to be a person with a degree, can be a receptionist. So yes, it has caused hard feelings.

 

[mylilnikita]

It’s a crazy time.

The company I work for is offering a $1,000 sign on bonus even for several positions even the one i do.
We after a few years got a performance raise(the last 2 increased were the company doing comparison of other companies near by and increase our pay .

So not only does a new employee get a 1000 bonus but they will start at pretty much how much I make after almost 3 years

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Plenty of people can't afford to walk away from their jobs.

Being exceptional is a choice.

 

[Cheburashka]

Being exceptional is a choice.

We're talking about fair pay for work on this thread. Not certain people's delusions of grandeur.

 

[Orion Nebula]

Being exceptional is a choice.

Sadly it's not always enough.

 

[footballmouse]

It's not just state jobs that are doing this. The hospital I work at did this last year, bumped the lower grades to $15/hour however nobody else's pay was increased. I was pretty mad like you are. I also thought about my job class, qualifications and education. They claimed that $12/hour wasn't enough to support a family, which I agree.

 

[Sinder]

I was really hoping they didn't mean that by what they said. If so the person is completely disconnected from reality and it's depressing. And due to cost of living, inflation, etc even with the minimum wage increases a lot of people are still struggling to put food on their tables. It blows my mind when people point and say "well it's their fault" like everyone has the same opportunities in life. And somehow the people struggling "decided" to.... well struggle. And the entire "we gotta take up the slack" mindset... ya we do. It's our responsibility as kind and empathetic people to help others in need. And to make things worse some like to "victim blame", which is just kicking people when they are already down.

It's really sad.

You say fault, but it’s responsibility.
Why are other people like your employer responsible for making sure you can survive on your salary?
And please save the their so out of touch stuff, you don’t know me or know where I came from.
I think the problem is people don’t like to hear the truth from those who have been there and fixed it because then they don’t have to face the reality that it can be done.
And that’s what is really sad.

 

[RamblingMad]

Assuming that unions are legal in your state. They're banned in many places.

That's the voters fault. Best to move then to a place, where you can get a good wage. Starbucks is even starting to unionize.

 

[RamblingMad]

You say fault, but it’s responsibility.
Why are other people like your employer responsible for making sure you can survive on your salary?
And please save the their so out of touch stuff, you don’t know me or know where I came from.
I think the problem is people don’t like to hear the truth from those who have been there and fixed it because then they don’t have to face the reality that it can be done.
And that’s what is really sad.

This is an American problem. Other countries provide much better rights to their workers.

 

[RamblingMad]

Being exceptional is a choice.

Not even required. What is required is knowing the right people or starting your own business.