Question for DVC owners regarding renting points

[MinnieLovesMickey12]

I have read the FAQ on David's DVC rental site and realize it says once you rent from someone you can't cancel. You lose that money.

My question is WHY? Why can't you cancel? Does the DVC owner lose those points if the reservation is changed or canceled?

Once you rent the points and make the reservation can any date changes be made or are the dates set in stone once the reservation is made?

I'm just mainly curious why there is no cancellation allowed. If the owner is able to cancel it and get those points back, why would they keep the money the person paid for the reservation?

If there is a different board this should have been posted on please move it. I thought this was the appropriate board for random general questions.

 

[Missyrose]

I have read the FAQ on David's DVC rental site and realize it says once you rent from someone you can't cancel. You lose that money.

My question is WHY? Why can't you cancel? Does the DVC owner lose those points if the reservation is changed or canceled?

Once you rent the points and make the reservation can any date changes be made or are the dates set in stone once the reservation is made?

I'm just mainly curious why there is no cancellation allowed. If the owner is able to cancel it and get those points back, why would they keep the money the person paid for the reservation?

If there is a different board this should have been posted on please move it. I thought this was the appropriate board for random general questions.

The thing you have to realize about DVC vs. booking through Disney on a cash reservation, is the DVC system is set up to keep almost 100 percent occupancy in its resorts 365 days a year. The 11 and 7 month booking windows means people book DVC villas earlier and the closer you get to a check-in date, the less inventory there is.

So let's say you rent points to book a 2-bedroom villa at Beach Club for late June at 10 1/2 months out, and four months later you need to cancel. If that owner canceled your villa and tried to re-rent those points, there likely wouldn't be any availability at any of the most-requested resorts, so there's the chance that owner could end up without someone to rent those points.

When you rent points, you need to go in thinking it is like Priceline. You're getting a much better price than going through Disney, but you won't get your money back and there's little chance to change your dates.

 

[Chuck S]

There are many things that can effect this. For instance, the owners "use year", exactly when a renter cancels, and so on.

For instance, I have a June use year. If I were to rent to someone for a March reservation, and they were to cancel in February, I'd receive the points back, BUT in all likelihood, they would be useless. They'd have to be used by May 31, I could not bank them to the following use year, plus I'd be out my time in booking the first reservation.

There is just too much potential to lose the use of the points in canceling a reservation, most owners will work with someone to reschedule, based upon availability and their use year, but the payments are generally considered final in a rental transaction. If you need the flexibility to cancel, you need to pay full price through Disney.

 

[wdrl]

DVC members can cancel a reservation and cancellations made more than 31 days prior to check-in incur no penalties or restrictions.

The "no cancellation" policy is part of David's way of doing business. It keeps the transaction simple and straightforward. When renting out points, there are more variables that come into play. The owner may have banked or borrowed points to make the reservation, and some of those points have to be used by a certain date or they expire. If the renter wants to cancel, the owner may be able to get all of they points back. However, the owner may not be able to find another renter to use those points before the points expire.

 

[DMKEDM]

First, there is no hard-and-fast rule that one cannot cancel (and get a refund) when renting--each owner operates under his/her own rules. But it does seem to be the "usual" practice...

I can't speak for anyone else, and I don't often rent points--but I can tell you some of the thinking that I went through, and some of the thoughts expressed here over the years--

First: there are time sensitivities--points become "distressed" when they get close to their expiration date--and there is no one single expiration date for all points (it all depends on the owner's use year).

Second, cancellations within a month of travel become difficult to use (they go into "holding" and are subject to some significant restrictions).

Third (and most important to me), it is a leap of faith/trust, and considerable time/effort, to rent points. Once it's done, I don't want to have to redo it. A cancellation-with-refund means I've wasted all that time/effort/trust on the first transaction. It's particularly daunting when one is trying to establish a level of trust with an "internet stranger."

Finally, if I'm renting, presumably I need/want the money for a purpose of my own. Once the reservation is made, I feel entitled to the money. I am not willing to "sit on it" until after the person's vacation ends. And once I've spent it, it's a financial issue to be at risk for returning it.

Having said all that, while I do have a "no cancellations" rule for myself, I am not totally inflexible. I am willing to try to change a vacation's dates--availability can be an issue, but I'm willing to try. Or, if the person who rents my points is willing to go to the effort of finding someone else who will use my points, I'm willing to make the necessary changes, accept new payment from the new renter, and return the first renter's money. But that's a lot of "if's"--too many to put in a "for rent" post (I think)--it's something I'd work out with the renter at the time we were discussing whether he/she wants to rent from me and whether I want to rent to him/her.

As noted, each person willing to rent his/her points will have different priorities, different levels of willingness to tolerate change and/or different comfort levels in dealing with strangers.

But as far as I can tell, most people who are willing to rent out their points have either a "no cancellation" policy, or say they do but will then try to be accommodating, if it's possible to be, if something comes up. But for me--and I am very clear about this before agreeing to rent--the risk of needing to cancel is on the person doing the renting.

Hope this helps clear up some of your questions.

 

[MinnieLovesMickey12]

Thank you for all your answers. That helps make more sense of it to me.

 

[mikron]

We alow guest to cancel with the understanding we re rent the points for them and get their money back to them. If they cancel toward the arrival date we might have to rent at a low price per point and that is all we return to them.

 

[hoffmann2828]

When I rent out, I rent the person the POINTS. So if they rent 50 points, they have until the end of the use year to use them if they cancel a reservation. The money stays with me. If they cannot reschedule during the use year, they forfeit. That is being more flexible than most!

 

[JimMIA]

You should address your question to David directly. I am not familiar with his policies, but whatever they are, they govern any rental through his site.

David is a BROKER, arranging rentals between owners and people wanting reservations. The policies of other individual DVC owners who rent points are irrelevant -- except as they help you understand some of the risks.

Cancellation -- and just about ANY change of dates or accommodations requires a cancellation and rebooking -- has significant downside risks for the owner renting the points, and policies reflect the understanding (or cluelessness) of the owner regarding the real risks involved.

 

[JimMIA]

When I rent out, I rent the person the POINTS. So if they rent 50 points, they have until the end of the use year to use them if they cancel a reservation. The money stays with me. If they cannot reschedule during the use year, they forfeit. That is being more flexible than most!

Just a technicality for newbies starting to evaluate renting from a DVC owner:

There is actually no such thing as "renting POINTS." What you are renting is a reservation made with points belonging to the owner.

The renter has no control over the points -- or the reservation -- at any point prior to checkin. Both the points and reservation always belong to the owner and only the owner can make, modify, or "reschedule." DVC Member Services will not even speak to a person renting a reservation.

The only situation where someone actually gets control of points is in a transfer from one DVC owner to another. In that situation, the points are actually withdrawn from one account and deposited into another. The owner of the receiving account actually becomes the full owner of those points.

But the typical renter never has any control over any DVC points at any time during the transaction. That is an important distinction for renters to understand, because that's what creates much of the renter's risk in this type of transaction.

 

[crisi]

An example to spell this out.

DVC owners have different use years, mine is April. I have to "use or loose" my points by April. I can bank my points if I do so before the end of December.

I make a reservation for you in November for March. If you cancel in December, I can probably still bank my points (assuming they aren't previous year points - it gets complicated fast), but if you cancel in January, I can't do that any more. If you cancel less than 31 days out, my points are in holding - I can only use them for a reservation within 60 days, but because you are traveling at the end of my use year, I really only have until April 1 to use them. You can see where if you cancel in January or February, I may end up with completely wasted and valueless points.

Some people who rent will refund depending on when you travel during their use year. For instance, if I'm making reservations for you in May, I have a lot of flexibility to rebook or find another renter when you cancel - as long as you do so more than 31 days out.

David is a broker. To maximize his ability to match owners with renters, he is working with every use year available for every vacation. Throwing cancellation into the mix would be very limiting, making it hard for you to get reservations and for the owners he works with to make a match.

Renting a DVC reservation can be a great deal, but its a great deal in part because its going to be less flexible than getting a CRO reservation. You get to decide whether that trade is worth the deal.

 

[lawrenceFletcher]

I currently am renting points through a broker. It is a family looking for a June res. I received the majority of the money upfront. The rest will come to me around a month before the check in date. I could have rented the points by myself but am too lazy. The deal is " no cancel". If the rentor needs to make a change or has an emergency, I will do my best to help. If they are not happy because signed up for BLT and end up within 60 days at SSR becase nothing else was open I wont loose any sleep. That is what travel insurance is for. I may even take an extra vacation this year!

 

[CarolAnnC]

If someone is concerned about wanting a cancellation with refund policy, they really need to stick to renting directly through Disney...

 

[ssawka]

Whenever I rent points (i usually prefer to do a transfer for this very reason) it is because I want to take a different type of vacation that year and use the proceeds from the rental to pay for it. I am not willing to make plans for another vacation unless the money is mine. It is for that reason that I have a "no refund" policy.

However, like PPs have stated, I am willing to make changes if available, however the change has to either require the same or fewer points, or I have to decide whether or not I am willing to part with more points. If I am willing to part with more points, I will make the change, but will expect payment for the additional points.

Renting can save the renter quite a bit of money, but the renter has to realize they they are renting from an individual and not from a company. Even with services like David's, the transaction is still will the individual owner. The service is just a brokerage.

 

[dsanner106]

There are a number of problems this causes for the owner renting their points. If you get them to book something for you at the 11 month window in their home resort and cancel later, the window for banking points and saving them for later use may have passed so instead of being able to hold over their extra points for next year, they will expire, and booking in the extended window, and then cancelling means they come back as limited use points. Either way, they will not be as valuable to another renter and potentially can be lost forever. The other thing is, they rented these points because they had a need for the money and have spent it, more than likely. The idea that they should take the money and save it for 11 months to make sure you will follow through is not reasonable.

D

I have read the FAQ on David's DVC rental site and realize it says once you rent from someone you can't cancel. You lose that money.

My question is WHY? Why can't you cancel? Does the DVC owner lose those points if the reservation is changed or canceled?

Once you rent the points and make the reservation can any date changes be made or are the dates set in stone once the reservation is made?

I'm just mainly curious why there is no cancellation allowed. If the owner is able to cancel it and get those points back, why would they keep the money the person paid for the reservation?

If there is a different board this should have been posted on please move it. I thought this was the appropriate board for random general questions.