POP = Walmart?

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Without even reading any responses to the OP, my opinion of the Pop pretty much resonates with the OP.

OP: Thanks for having the courage to be honest. Too much of what you read online is "sugar coated" to make people feel better about their choices.

I hate the Values now. When I was a poor college student, I loved them. Now, with two toddlers myself, I would NEVER, EVER go back to one of them (with or without kids). The aggravation is not worth it when I'm supposed to be on vacation.
 
.......Handicap vs. Lazy you decide for yourself. Please wait to see for yourself before you judge the comment. Handicapped individuals deserve all the special treatment they get, lazy people do not. I found it bothersome that a
person on a scooter would drive to the front of the line and take about ten people travel with them all the way to the front. First of all, why cant they wait in line and get the special treatment when it is their turn? Why do all of their party go to the front with them? And them see over half of them get off the scooter and walk on the bus pretty normally. Granted I had been carrying my daughters for about a half hour at least by this point but I still think I could see things pretty rationally........

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Handicap vs. Lazy

If someone is using a ECV at Disney just because they are lazy I think they would find out after the first day the EVC's are very inconvenient especially at Disney.
Those of us using an EVC seem to become "invisible" since able bodied guests are crossing in front of us, stopping in front of us and never seem to see us until it is time for us to load onto a bus. When we are loading onto a bus that is when we become very visible.
It is very hard to drive an EVC in the crowds in the parks.
It is not easy backing up an EVC onto the bus lift and maneuvering the EVC into the tie down is very difficult. I highly doubt "lazy" people would submit themselves to that for long.
Also EVC rental is quite expensive. My EVC cost over $200 to rent for one week. Most "lazy"people would rather spend the money on other things.
The EVC's that are loaded onto the buses are either privately owned or are rented from an offsite company.
I doubt that "lazy" people would think ahead enough to preorder an EVC from an offsite company.


Sure there may be a few people who use EVC's because they are lazy but I am betting they learn quickly it not easy or fun to use an EVC at WDW.
I know I wish I did not need to use one but without an EVC WDW would be inaccessible to me.

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why cant they wait in line and get the special treatment when it is their turn?


WDW loads the WC and EVC at the back of the bus.
The driver needs to see that there is a WC or EVC that needs to board the bus therefore WDW asks that WC's and EVC's wait in a separate line near where the back door of the bus will be when the bus stops.

They can't wait in the stand by line for a couple of reasons.

1. The bus queues are not wide enough for a WC or EVC to make the turns
2. The bus driver needs to know a WC or EVC is waiting.
3. For the safety of others and to aide the bus driver WC and EVC guests are usually loaded first. An EVC needs room to manuver into the tie down space. Also the bus driver needs room to tie down the EVC/ WC. If the asiles are full of standing guests there will no room to get the EVC into the tie down space.

If there is a space for the WC or EVC who is waiting to board but no room for the guest
to get the WC/EVC into the space than WDW will be in violation of the ADA and could be open to a hefty lawsuit.


This was written by SueM in MN and is posted on the disABILITIES board.

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=595713

How do I attract the attention of the bus driver?
You need to be where the driver can see you so that he/she knows you want to board the bus. Some bus stops have a wheelchair/handicapped symbol that you can wait by. For "unmarked" bus stops, have your group out in the open (but off the roadway) near where the back door of the bus will be when it stops. At stops with buses going to multiple destinations from the same stop (like at the resorts), let the driver know whether you want the bus or not by nodding or shaking your head.
Can my whole party board with me?
If the bus has a lift, only the person with a wheelchair and one other member of your party may go on the lift.
As for the other members of your party, please be considerate of other guests who are waiting for the bus. In general, WDW considers a party of 6 (5 plus the person with a wheelchair/ECV) to be party. If there are few people waiting for the bus when you arrive with a party of that size or smaller, the bus driver may invite you to board at the back door after the wheelchair/ECV is loaded.
If your party is larger or you can see a long line of people waiting for the bus when you pull up, it's considerate have the other members wait in line for the bus or to wait for the next bus.
It will be much easier and less stress for everyone if you can avoid taking the buses at the busiest times (like right at park closing). Taking a leisurely stroll out of the park will usually help you avoid a long line at the bus stop.

If you get to the bus stop and see a long line, here are some considerate ways my family (SueM in MN) have used to handle it:
If you have a small party; keep track of the last person in line when you arrive in the area. Wait off to the side until you can see that party would get onto the next bus (you don't have to wait until they get to the door of the bus), then go to the wheelchair boarding area with your party .
If your party is larger, have the other members of your party get into line. When you can see that they would be able to get onto the next bus, then go to the wheelchair boarding area.


-----------------------------------------------------------

I read this on the disABILITIES and I think it explains how some of us with hidden disabilities feel.

I have a trip planned for August. I have been only a partial participant in many family trips and adventures due to stamina and distance issues.
Like you I feared what "others would think", my own expectations and self image as well as my families.

after visiting these boards and pondering it How exactly is my using a wheelchair or scooter bothering or taking away from anyone else??? How am I taking advantage? I still pay the same to get in, I still wait in the same lines, still need to get to fireworks early to find a spot..
maybe I don't know about some hidden "perks" of having a chair or scooter but as I understand thus far the only effect I will have is taking up a bit more space in line.
But I won't need that space on the park bench for 5 hours now so you may have a shady place to sit!!
If you can not participate in your family vacation without a chair,scooter or GAC then GET ONE!
These things are designed not as "extras" but to allow EVERYONE to experience the magic of disney.
It provides equal access and opportunity.
Wee! I am so excited my kids are laughing at me!

Just my 2 cents.
 

wow...I am a little scared now about my upcoming stay at POP. However that being said. I am basically just going to be sleeping there. I wanted to stay on Disney because of the Magical Express Service. I don't drive so I figured it would be cheaper that taking cabs and city buses everywhere. I am a smoker so I can't comment on that issue. I am just looking to have a great time. As long as the bed is clean and the water runs in the shower I will be happy lol. I am basically going for baseball and Disney........
Maybe I will have happier things to report lol

You will have a great time, values are not for some people. The bus lines are long but they move fast, even sending a 2nd bus if needed. (I have waited longer at AKL than Pop for bus service.) To each their own.

And my favorite part, the $$ I save by staying at Pop frees me up to grab a taxi from time to time if we want to a the end of a busy night. (From beach club after Illuminations the ride was $8 for the 3 of us. We did it 2x.)

Have a good trip!
 
I have not read this entire thread...don't have to. I'm sure I know what others have said. So, I will just give my own opinions...I own at BWV, and love it there. But, usually if I'm not at BWV, you can find me at POP. Why? I have had at least 4 great experiences there. No, there are no table service restaurants, no pool slides, no hot tubs. But, I do get a nice clean room, nicely themed. The pools get it done for me, as well as for my 14 y/o dd.
Buses? Have yet to be an issue for me. In fact, I wish all resorts would have those que areas. Sure beats the cattle call at the moderates and deluxes. And believe me, there are ECVs at those resorts as well. Are those guests lazy or in true need? I don't know, don't care. But I have yet to see anyone in an ECV pull up to the front of the line at POP. There is a specific area for those that need to be loaded with their ECV. I do take issue with the extended families that get to board with that person though...although I'm not sure how they would handle it othewise. If the family waited in the line, they may not be able to get on the same bus as their 'challenged' family member. So, I guess it's the best option at the moment.

Yes, the food court gets crazy at the more popular times to eat. But, I really miss the food court when I'm at BW..no option like that there. I love the food courts...but I try to eat at off times or take my food back to my room.

Smokers?? Well, I guess you are always going to run into inconsiderate people no matter where you go. I have the same issue at the mall where I shop...all those employees standing outside the door having their mid-day smoke..yuck.

But to compare POP to Wal-Mart...well, that's just rude. I can afford to stay elsewhere, but I choose to stay at POP. Just because people choose to stay at a value resort does not make them lesser beings. Believe me when I say that I have run into some of the rudest, most unpleasant people while at the deluxe resorts. I have routinely seen better behaviour at the values.
But, to each his, or her, own. Just don't make the mistake of assuming what 'type' guest stays at a value....Wal-Mart it isn't.
 
Handicap vs. Lazy

If someone is using a ECV at Disney just because they are lazy I think they would find out after the first day the EVC's are very inconvenient especially at Disney.
Those of us using an EVC seem to become "invisible" since able bodied guests are crossing in front of us, stopping in front of us and never seem to see us until it is time for us to load onto a bus. When we are loading onto a bus that is when we become very visible.
It is very hard to drive an EVC in the crowds in the parks.
It is not easy backing up an EVC onto the bus lift and maneuvering the EVC into the tie down is very difficult. I highly doubt "lazy" people would submit themselves to that for long.
Also EVC rental is quite expensive. My EVC cost over $200 to rent for one week. Most "lazy"people would rather spend the money on other things.
The EVC's that are loaded onto the buses are either privately owned or are rented from an offsite company.
I doubt that "lazy" people would think ahead enough to preorder an EVC from an offsite company.


Sure there may be a few people who use EVC's because they are lazy but I am betting they learn quickly it not easy or fun to use an EVC at WDW.
I know I wish I did not need to use one but without an EVC WDW would be inaccessible to me.

-----------------------------------------------------

why cant they wait in line and get the special treatment when it is their turn?


WDW loads the WC and EVC at the back of the bus.
The driver needs to see that there is a WC or EVC that needs to board the bus therefore WDW asks that WC's and EVC's wait in a separate line near where the back door of the bus will be when the bus stops.

They can't wait in the stand by line for a couple of reasons.

1. The bus queues are not wide enough for a WC or EVC to make the turns
2. The bus driver needs to know a WC or EVC is waiting.
3. For the safety of others and to aide the bus driver WC and EVC guests are usually loaded first. An EVC needs room to manuver into the tie down space. Also the bus driver needs room to tie down the EVC/ WC. If the asiles are full of standing guests there will no room to get the EVC into the tie down space.

If there is a space for the WC or EVC who is waiting to board but no room for the guest
to get the WC/EVC into the space than WDW will be in violation of the ADA and could be open to a hefty lawsuit.


This was written by SueM in MN and is posted on the disABILITIES board.

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=595713

How do I attract the attention of the bus driver?
You need to be where the driver can see you so that he/she knows you want to board the bus. Some bus stops have a wheelchair/handicapped symbol that you can wait by. For "unmarked" bus stops, have your group out in the open (but off the roadway) near where the back door of the bus will be when it stops. At stops with buses going to multiple destinations from the same stop (like at the resorts), let the driver know whether you want the bus or not by nodding or shaking your head.
Can my whole party board with me?
If the bus has a lift, only the person with a wheelchair and one other member of your party may go on the lift.
As for the other members of your party, please be considerate of other guests who are waiting for the bus. In general, WDW considers a party of 6 (5 plus the person with a wheelchair/ECV) to be party. If there are few people waiting for the bus when you arrive with a party of that size or smaller, the bus driver may invite you to board at the back door after the wheelchair/ECV is loaded.
If your party is larger or you can see a long line of people waiting for the bus when you pull up, it's considerate have the other members wait in line for the bus or to wait for the next bus.
It will be much easier and less stress for everyone if you can avoid taking the buses at the busiest times (like right at park closing). Taking a leisurely stroll out of the park will usually help you avoid a long line at the bus stop.

If you get to the bus stop and see a long line, here are some considerate ways my family (SueM in MN) have used to handle it:
If you have a small party; keep track of the last person in line when you arrive in the area. Wait off to the side until you can see that party would get onto the next bus (you don't have to wait until they get to the door of the bus), then go to the wheelchair boarding area with your party .
If your party is larger, have the other members of your party get into line. When you can see that they would be able to get onto the next bus, then go to the wheelchair boarding area.


-----------------------------------------------------------

I read this on the disABILITIES and I think it explains how some of us with hidden disabilities feel.



Just my 2 cents.

Minnie, you totally rock!
:thanks:

I think the OP is looking for drama, as this post is on the podcast board, and also here on the resort board under the Pop Century thread, and who knows where else.

That's OK, I like POP, Walmart, people in ECV's, people out of ECV's, even the lazy ones with ECV envy. ;)

At least the OP is bringing the subject out into the open and more people can gain some understanding and stop perpetuating the myth that a scooter or wheelchair=Easy Street.
 
Sometimes people judge others and don't know the real story. Even though some people are lazy and ride the scooters or wheelchairs and don't really need them the majority of people do need these modes of transportation. I have always wanted to take my mom, who turns 80 this year, to disney world and she would need a wheelchair or ECV. Then I think of the hassle that this would be with her using one. I wouldn't care what other people think but just her getting used to using this would cause havoc. We are truly blessed because we don't have a disability that some have.
 
Hey, I know! Let's have a forum dedicated to all the ECV debates.

Its so good to know that when I go to the resort boards, I'll be reading about resorts.
 
Dig deeper, you will find lots of comments about everything "bad" in disney including the resorts people stay at, the dining, the dining plan, Disney's Magical Express, aahh the list can go on forever. I take people's complaints with a grain of salt. If I want to try a different restaurant or stay at a different resort then I let my family be the judge.


That I totally agree with!!! One persons pleasure is another persons travesty.
 
To the OP: I'm sorry POP didn't work out for you. There is no resort that will make every single person happy and that's too bad. For example, I couldn't stay at the Polynesian Resort or Grand Floridian because of all the flowers. The scents give me migraines which would lead to a very bad trip for me. I do like POP for the costs. For what I use a hotel for, I don't need anything fancy or expensive. I never spend much time eating at the hotel since I spend a majority of my time in the parks, but I have noticed the length of lines (and on this board have heard many, many people complain about it).

As for the handicap and "lazy" people... there has been so many threads on these boards discussing them. I am never a person who is in a hurry (I am the one going the speed limit preventing you from speeding to get your child to school on time), so for them to "cut" a head of the line, it doesn't bother me. But many, many other things do.

Again, I'm sorry you didn't like POP. Next time spend more $ and stay in a moderate or deluxe resort. Let me know how those work out for you.
 
I don't believe the OP was saying anything negative about those who smoke, but more about how Disney laid out the smoking areas. At some resorts you must go past the smoking area to get to the bus. To me, that is not fair to those who don't smoke, especially to those of us with severe asthma. My parents smoke and try to be as considerate as possible. Even they think the that some of the smoking area are ridiculously placed.

As far as the disabled (I hate the word handicapped as it comes from a negative meaning), I was in a VERY long line one night with my 3 yo dd, 12 dd and husband. The line looped endlessly and the bus was taking forever. I saw one group of at least 12 show up(after we waited for at lest 30min) with a person in a ECV,and go to the front of the line. I understand the disabled person needed to get on first, that doesn't bother me, what bothers me is that all 12 people he was with had to get on with him. Split the party in 2. Does the person with a disability need all 12 people's help? Sure, they may have to split up, but any party of 12 may need to split up if there isn't enough room.

We did have one guest get on line in their wheelchair and wait with everyone else. She commented to us that there was no reason she couldn't wait like the rest of us.

I have also seen a person who had been using a EVC running around in the park, pushing the thing around, playing tag, ect. I think it was someone elses and they must have been using it. Overall, most people who use one, need one. I think it is just the estremely large groups that people get upset about.
 
This year, for the first time, I am dealing with the prospect of having an ECV at WDW - trouble with a knee. It's not something I would ever CHOOSE - the loss of that freedom to walk anywhere is daunting for me.

If someone is traveling in an EVC - I would think there is a good reason and I don't mind giving them the time to board comfortably.

In January I struggled on a cane (the knee) at a trade show in Atlanta. Hotel reservations were made long before the problem became apparent...and the hotel was a walk and subway ride to the tradeshow. There were mornings I cried (pretty serious pain) just walking to the subway - struggled to get on a subway car AND NO ONE GAVE ME A SEAT. I had a cane, I was obviously in pain.....and would have to step off the car and wait for the next train to hope for an empty seat.

I felt invisible.

It gave me an entirely new perspective.

Just wanted to say I understand. Unless it has happened to them, many people just don't seem to have the insight or the ability to act compassionately toward others. They see a small handful of individuals possibly take advantage of a situation and they allow those few to form their opinions and thus dictate their behaviors toward all.
After a severe leg injury and several surgeries that left me handicapped for over a year, I too have a new perspective. I remember struggling on walker, crutches, and finally cane. I also remember getting better and being able to walk across the room without pain, but not being able to make my way back. I'm sometimes still that way after all these months. If you look at me today, you'd never know by the way I'm getting around that I have a steel rod and several plates from knee to hip. But by this evening I may try to walk and fall flat on my face. Often times, I just can't go the distance. In a big place like WDW, I may start out okay in the morning, but I might not be able to make it through the day. I wish others would try harder to understand that. I know that if I see someone in an ECV, I would rather err on the side of compassion than assume they are "lazy." As if handicapped people don't have a big enough struggle, many somehow find it necessary to add to their emotional stress by unfairly placing such harsh labelis on them - being totally ignorant of the individual's unique condition. :sad2:
 
I have a child with a "hidden" condition... I will not offer anyone an explanation and therefor, I will pardon the ignorant.

I have stayed at the Beach Club and the All-Stars. I shop at Macy's and Wal-mart. Depends on what I want and and need.

The OP's comments about the resorts do not offend me.

The comments about disabilities and handicaps, well... see my first sentence.

:thumbsup2 Well said
 
Ignorant, well, Read the entire comment. I can't imagine someone being offended. But some people feel victimized by any comment. Don't jump to conclusions. I have heard people comment on their own abuse of the system. They are the ignorant ones. Nobody wants to address the real issues. Good luck

You are misunderstanding my post.

I am saying... my 6 year old was born with a very rare birth defect, since it is "hidden" no one would ever know. I refuse to discuss it with strangers and will not be informing anyone... he just had his 6th surgery, he has tubes sticking out from here and there, he can't do this or that, or needs such and such, etc.

SO, if I'm NOT willing to explain and you can't see it, I can't expect you to know or understand. SO, I have to be willing to forgive the attitudes, pointing, staring and remarks.

Ignorance = lack of knowledge, not knowing, not aware. I am acknowledging my role in this.
I did read your entire post and the entire thread before posting.
 
wow...I am a little scared now about my upcoming stay at POP. However that being said. I am basically just going to be sleeping there. I wanted to stay on Disney because of the Magical Express Service. I don't drive so I figured it would be cheaper that taking cabs and city buses everywhere. I am a smoker so I can't comment on that issue. I am just looking to have a great time. As long as the bed is clean and the water runs in the shower I will be happy lol. I am basically going for baseball and Disney........
Maybe I will have happier things to report lol


dont be afraid-pop is fine unless you are used to a luxury or a little luxury-If you are comparing it to a deluxe hotel,well,then yes,you wont be happy,if you are comparing it to your average hotel/motel-you will be very happy. .its a great fun place.
It is so much better to stay at pop,then to stay off property.

If you can afford an upgrade then look into it,but if you are looking for a decent room at a reasonable price,than pop or the all stars are for you.Its walt disney world-you will not be disappointed.It is a very large resort with lots of people,but when i was there i had no problems.Clean rooms and beds.food court was fine.i didnt use the buses because we rented a car ,but nobody seemed to mind the buses.
I think like anything else in disney world ,be smart about your timing.If you go to the pop food court for lunch at 12pm-100pm-then,yea,you will find crowds.If you go a little earlier or later,then it should be fine.Same for breakfast and dinner.
 
I don't believe the OP was saying anything negative about those who smoke, but more about how Disney laid out the smoking areas. At some resorts you must go past the smoking area to get to the bus. "

yes,this is true.That would be one of the few problems i had with POP.The location of the smoking area,definitely has to be moved.I can imagine at some point it will be.Too many people are not happy about it.

"But to compare POP to Wal-Mart...well, that's just rude."

that is pretty rude,besides-what is wrong with walmart?does everything have to be top of the line, cost you a fortune?Is there really a big difference between the pants i would buy at walmart as compared to the ones i would spend twice as much on in macys?not really.I still wear then the same and wash them the same and they pretty much last just as long(unless of course,i buy them before disney world,in which case when i get back they may not fit the same(ummmm dole whips......)
 
After reading this thread, I have come to two conclusions:

1. Do your homework before staying at any resort/hotel/motel anywhere, not just WDW. There are websites and guidebooks that show photos of the rooms, diagrams, dimensions, and talk indepth about transportation. The PassPorter even breaks down approximate travel times from each resort to the parks. An informed vacationer is a happy one!

2. It's not my place to judge whether someone needs a wheelchair or ECV. If someone needs one for whatever reason, it isn't my place to question it. Who knows. One day I may need one. Or a member of my family or a friend. I'm really happy that WDW is so accomodating.
 
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