Parents of 4 and 5 year olds....new law goes into effect

[SnipsNSnails]

My 5 yo is still in a 5 pt car seat and my 8 yo is in a booster and we only just moved him to that from a 5 pt. after he turned 8. The MI legislature is halfway to passing a new law here too, rear facing to 2 years or 30 lb, 5 pt to 5 years or 50 lb, and booster to 10 years or 80 lbs or 4'9". Our current law is rear facing to 1 year, 5 pt to 4 years, and booster to 8 years or 4'9". I didn't realize that other states were so far behind the recommendations!

 

[leahlefler]

Our law (NY state) is booster to 8 years/80 pounds, too. My 9 y.o. is no longer in a booster (he's over 4'9" - tall kid) but my 7 y.o. is still in a booster.

We are taking the Magical Express when we go to Disney so we won't need his booster seat, but if we were renting a car we'd obviously bring it. I can't imagine a 4 or 5 y.o. NOT being in a booster!

 

[EveDallas]

My 4 YO is still in a 5-point harness and my 7YO is still in a high-back booster, barely 40 lbs and 44".

That is law in Texas anyway, they have to be in a booster until 54" and/or 50lbs.

If they are over 8, they can be out of a car seat even if neither of these apply.

 

[Muskrat191]

I'm a CRST (AKA car seat tech) in Canada. From my training, we recommend the following best practice for a child's safety, regardless of the varying laws:

Rear facing car seat until at least 2 years of age, and up to the height and weight limits of the car seat. There are car seats available at many price points that will rear face a 3 year old.

Harnessed, forward facing seat until at least 5.5-6 years of age. This is due to a combination of skeletal development and the maturity to sit in the correct position in a booster without putting the shoulder belt behind them or wiggling around.

A child should be in a booster until they pass the 5 step test. This is often around age 10-11, and can be different in each car.

http://carseatblog.com/3966/the-5-step-test/

 

[jlwhitney]

I'm totally judging, but geez Florida. How is this now just becoming law? Wowza

Because it won't change much. Its not easy to enforce at all and it won't change what people will do. Those that are worried will use car seats/boosters no matter the law and those that don't care/worried will do what they want.

The news article I read said that last year there was 5 deaths and 100 something injuries from improper use/no use and in all reality that is very low for the number of accidents a day. I highly doubt those numbers will go down next year with new law.

 

[goofy4tink]

Parents have always been able to use booster seats for their older kids. If there was a suitable booster seat model, then parents were free to buy one. Making it a law isn't going to change much. You would have to make a traffic stop for something else in order to notice that a child wasn't in a suitable booster seat.

The majority of cars today have adjustable seat belts.....the part that goes across you. You can raise, or lower, it to properly fit the particular passenger.
While I understand the whole 'child development' issue, there are people driving cars that are the same size as some of these older kids that are supposed to be using booster seats.

My dd was very tall for her age. I'm not sure there are any booster seats she would have fit in at the age of 7! But then again, she was of a height that would have allowed her to go booster seat free. She would have passed the 5 step test at a very early age...probably by age 8.

 

[SuzanneSLO]

I know that this is a serious consideration, but, I can't help but think back to the days when I was a kid. Car seats, like we know them now, did not exist. In fact, seat belts didn't exist. I remember the car seat that my sister sat in as a child. It had hook style back brackets that draped over the FRONT seat back and that was the only method of securing them. It faced forward and had a plastic steering wheel right in front of your face so you could pretend to be steering the car. I used to love that feature.

It was bad enough with a four door, but, imagine that with a two door car with seats that folded forward. They didn't have any latch on them to stop them from doing just that if you had to stop fast.

Once you grew out of the car seat (about age 2) you were then made like the rest of the passengers and just sat on the seat. (remember no seat belts) If the child was normal sized (small) they would usually just fold their legs under them to lift them up a few inches so they could see out the window or lay across the shelf behind the back seat just in front of the rear window. Yet, I know of no one ever injured by that little situation. I know that there must have been but I never knew any personally.

The only real constraint that you had was your parents arm that was placed in front of you during a fast stop to prevent you from flying through the front windshield. Ah, the good old days.

As with many things, the so-called "good old days" we're not really that good.

One report in 2004 noted that 115 lives were saved as early as 1960 due to safety belts. By 2002, that number was over 20,000 as safety belt use rose to almost 75%.
-- Suzanne

 

[jlwhitney]

As with many things, the so-called "good old days" we're not really that good.

One report in 2004 noted that 115 lives were saved as early as 1960 due to safety belts. By 2002, that number was over 20,000 as safety belt use rose to almost 75%.
-- Suzanne

Yes safety belts make a difference but its not the law that does so. Its people choosing to use them.

The laws for seatbelts/car seats are almost impossible to enforce that much. Unless something else gets a person pulled over.

Making it a law does not change what people that don't really care do, which is evident by how many adults I know that don't wear seat belts regulary.

 

[MommyMK]

I know that this is a serious consideration, but, I can't help but think back to the days when I was a kid. Car seats, like we know them now, did not exist. In fact, seat belts didn't exist. I remember the car seat that my sister sat in as a child. It had hook style back brackets that draped over the FRONT seat back and that was the only method of securing them. It faced forward and had a plastic steering wheel right in front of your face so you could pretend to be steering the car. I used to love that feature. It was bad enough with a four door, but, imagine that with a two door car with seats that folded forward. They didn't have any latch on them to stop them from doing just that if you had to stop fast. Once you grew out of the car seat (about age 2) you were then made like the rest of the passengers and just sat on the seat. (remember no seat belts) If the child was normal sized (small) they would usually just fold their legs under them to lift them up a few inches so they could see out the window or lay across the shelf behind the back seat just in front of the rear window. Yet, I know of no one ever injured by that little situation. I know that there must have been but I never knew any personally. The only real constraint that you had was your parents arm that was placed in front of you during a fast stop to prevent you from flying through the front windshield. Ah, the good old days.

This is called "survivor bias" http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias

The folks who had the opposite experiences are dead! They cannot share their stories. Kids are much safer in cars today.

 

[SuzanneSLO]

Yes safety belts make a difference but its not the law that does so. Its people choosing to use them.

The laws for seatbelts/car seats are almost impossible to enforce that much. Unless something else gets a person pulled over.

Making it a law does not change what people that don't really care do, which is evident by how many adults I know that don't wear seat belts regulary.

So your theory is that the increase in using safety belts in cars from less than 11% in 1960 to about 75% in 2002 had nothing to do with the massive public health initiative to require safety belts during this period?

-- Suzanne

 

[Karlzmom]

I am glad to hear this change….we are much stricter up here on our carseat guidelines and it always made me nervous that 4./5 year olds in florida didn't need seats

Why nervous? If you want to use a booster or car seat while at the World you can choose one whether or not there is a law.

 

[jlwhitney]

So your theory is that the increase in using safety belts in cars from less than 11% in 1960 to about 75% in 2002 had nothing to do with the massive public health initiative to require safety belts during this period?

-- Suzanne

Public health initiative has nothing to do with making a law.

 

[hedgehog2owl]

I know that this is a serious consideration, but, I can't help but think back to the days when I was a kid. Car seats, like we know them now, did not exist. In fact, seat belts didn't exist. I remember the car seat that my sister sat in as a child. It had hook style back brackets that draped over the FRONT seat back and that was the only method of securing them. It faced forward and had a plastic steering wheel right in front of your face so you could pretend to be steering the car. I used to love that feature.

It was bad enough with a four door, but, imagine that with a two door car with seats that folded forward. They didn't have any latch on them to stop them from doing just that if you had to stop fast.

Once you grew out of the car seat (about age 2) you were then made like the rest of the passengers and just sat on the seat. (remember no seat belts) If the child was normal sized (small) they would usually just fold their legs under them to lift them up a few inches so they could see out the window or lay across the shelf behind the back seat just in front of the rear window. Yet, I know of no one ever injured by that little situation. I know that there must have been but I never knew any personally.

The only real constraint that you had was your parents arm that was placed in front of you during a fast stop to prevent you from flying through the front windshield. Ah, the good old days.

I see this exact response ALL THE TIME and I used to think nothing of it. Until we were in a car accident. A large pickup with jacked up wheels, lost control and crashed into us. We were at a stoplight, and my vehicle was thrown forward in the car in front of us.

My son was 18 months. Onlookers had phoned in there was a toddler in one of the cars. The look of pure relief on the face of the police officer when he looked in and saw him in his car seat, rear-faced was enough to cement my support for carseats. What that officer left unsaid....

 

[ArwenMarie]

I'm a CRST (AKA car seat tech) in Canada. From my training, we recommend the following best practice for a child's safety, regardless of the varying laws:

Rear facing car seat until at least 2 years of age, and up to the height and weight limits of the car seat. There are car seats available at many price points that will rear face a 3 year old.

Harnessed, forward facing seat until at least 5.5-6 years of age. This is due to a combination of skeletal development and the maturity to sit in the correct position in a booster without putting the shoulder belt behind them or wiggling around.

A child should be in a booster until they pass the 5 step test. This is often around age 10-11, and can be different in each car.

http://carseatblog.com/3966/the-5-step-test/

I still have our 8 yo in a booster. She just didn't look right in the seat without it. Thanks for that link, now I know why.

 

[SuzanneSLO]

Public health initiative has nothing to do with making a law.

Once again, I am confused by your comment.

Sure, there can be a public health initiative that involves only regulations, not laws, but even then, there would have been legislation that created the public health agency and authorized it to make the regulations.

And, as I'm sure you are aware, in addition to the law at issue in this thread, there are literally hundreds of federal and state laws requiring cars to have safety restraints and occupants to use them. And, in all but 18 states, failure to use the required restraint is a primary offense, allowing a vehicle to be stopped based on that failure alone.

If your point is that correlation is not the same as causation, I don't buy it. I think the patchwork of laws and regulations enacted over the last 50+ years IS precisely why more people use safety restraints more of the time. -- Suzanne

 

[OrangeCountyCommuter]

Yeah, cars went a lot slower back then and the only reason we all survived was probably because we didn't crash.

I'm shocked this is only now just a law. Motor Vehicle accidents are the number 1 cause of death for children.

You are talking about a state where helmets are optional for motorcycle riders. Nothing much shocks me after that

(But of course insurance isn't mandatory so when they guy on the motorcycle without a helmet has a crash the hospital has to treat his head injury for free! )