OK, I'll say it... we are too sensitive

[LSUmiss]

Yes, these campuses were not able to prohibit the groups from gathering as they are open campuses.

But it did cause the campus and town police to decide that classes needed to be cancelled for student safety after seeing Facebook videos from the groups coming on campus in the days ahead of them coming.

That is ridiculous. That grown middle aged plus adults can't behave themselves.

The protesters then marched to the center of town to make their display again. My kids work feet from where they protested, as do a lot of the school's students. So it disrupted classes and normal campus activities and then businesses in town.

The town has now implemented ordinances to curtail some of this activity in the future.

This is not new. The kkk staged a march through LSU’s campus in the 80s to oppose a MLK holiday. Just lovely.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Yes, these campuses were not able to prohibit the groups from gathering as they are open campuses.

But it did cause the campus and town police to decide that classes needed to be cancelled for student safety after seeing Facebook videos from the groups coming on campus in the days ahead of them coming.

That is ridiculous. That grown middle aged plus adults can't behave themselves.

The protesters then marched to the center of town to make their display again. My kids work feet from where they protested, as do a lot of the school's students. So it disrupted classes and normal campus activities and then businesses in town.

The town has now implemented ordinances to curtail some of this activity in the future.

That is quite unfortunate.

To be fair I've seen students in other colleges incite violence and straight up lie about things that are extremely serious in nature taking advantage of situations. I've seen ramifications from students at other colleges who have caused chaos at the detriiment of other students.

Unfortunately I think some people don't stop to take a moment to review their actions at least in terms of how they go about getting their message across.

 

[Southernmiss]

This is not new. The kkk staged a march through LSU’s campus in the 80s to oppose a MLK holiday. Just lovely.

Oh I know it's not new.

It is a shame it continues.

The young adult kids I've known over the last 25 years are so open to different cultures, creeds and races that it is frustrating that others (in my experience-older generations) can't move past their biases.

 

[Southernmiss]

That is quite unfortunate.

To be fair I've seen students in other colleges incite violence and straight up lie about things that are extremely serious in nature taking advantage of situations. I've seen ramifications from students at other colleges who have caused chaos at the detriiment of other students.

Unfortunately I think some people don't stop to take a moment to review their actions at least in terms of how they go about getting their message across.

I know it has happened by college kids, too. But so far, not recently on my kid's campuses.

And I completely agree with your last paragraph.

 

[DeniseJH]

She sang a song and used terms that were acceptable to use in her day.

Were they? As I said before, there were people who knew, and did, better. To me that means those words were not acceptable.


People are complex. [/QUOTE]

Absolutely!

 

[DeniseJH]

Then are you also of the opinion that EVERY church and religious monument be removed as well? For churches/religions are equally if not more guilty in racism ,abuse and mass murder the world over. A few songs pales in comparison.

In a perfect world? Absolutely!

 

[DeniseJH]

That is exactly what it is, we are talking about a feeling they have when they see something they deem offensive.
It hurts them, their feelings.
Your post is a perfect example of the OP- when you are offended by that truth it means you are being too sensitive.
We aren't talking about doing and saying whatever we want, we are talking about statues, monuments to people in our history who actually accomplished some good in their life. In a civilized society we should be able to understand that they can be honored for that.

I think the difference here, again, is that to you the good outweighs the bad. To many others the bad outweighs the good. No one is saying that Jefferson, for example, didn't do any good for this country, but in light of the fact that he kept and raped slaves, to honor him with a statue is repulsive. If someone enslaved and raped your ancestors would you like to see a statue celebrating them? I would hope not.

 

[DeniseJH]

You realize that because another change doesn’t come the next day doesn’t mean it won’t. It’s been less than 2 years.

Edited/Removed because I realized I had made this same point to you before, and you weren't talking to me this time anyway!

 

[NotUrsula]

I always thought it would be kind of fun to re-dress Lee's statue and transform it into a statue of "Light-horse Harry" Lee -- his father. THAT Lee was dead by the time of the Civil War, but lived a very colorful life. He was much more the sort of character that New Orleanians appreciate than his son was.

Lee the younger was rather a stick-in-the-mud, if his letters are anything to go by. (And the letters reveal something that modern readers will find bizarre about Robert E. Lee's racial opinions: the phrasing has to be read to be believed, but it includes religious sentiments, so I'll just link a transcript for the interested: https://www.encyclopediavirginia.or..._to_Mary_Randolph_Custis_Lee_December_27_1856)

New Orleans is kind of a special case in the anthropology of the South, because it is not only historically Catholic, but FRENCH Catholic, and we all know what kinds of depraved open-minded shenanigans the French get up to, LOL.

Racism actually became much more virulent in New Orleans after the Civil War than before it, not so much because the Confederacy lost, as so much in reaction to the depredations of the Union troops commanded by Benjamin Butler during Reconstruction. (Many of those troopers were black, and because Butler was more interested in lining his own pockets than in just about anything else, he and his troopers were regarded as looters by the locals. It left a bitter taste that was still a very fresh memory when the modern Klan rose to prominence in the 1920's, and the Klan made sure to fan those flames of residual resentment.)

 

[LovesTimone]

No it would be more like if he had oppressed & abused me 5 years ago & still continues to do so but in maybe less egregious ways, but just wants me to get over it & move on & act like it didn’t or isn’t happening. AND all the while making me feel like this my fault that we can’t move on b/c I’m still stuck in the past.

I agree the way to change it is to learn from the past. But the first step to truly learning from it is to actually really acknowledge it & not minimize it...or ignore that it still exists.

I really don't believe that anyone is ignoring the past, or minimizing it....and with all the movements change can happen... I truly believe it...

Wishing you peace, love and pixie dust...

 

[luvsJack]

So how long do we wait on the edge of our seats?

That is something we will have to wait and see. You realize that this very thread is about an organization taking away something that wasn’t racist because of something in the distant past? Perhaps we are already seeing “what’s next”.

I mean for the largest part of any of it, it’s rarely something that affects most people’s day to day life. And hopefully it will never be.

 

[luvsJack]

Oh I know it's not new.

It is a shame it continues.

The young adult kids I've known over the last 25 years are so open to different cultures, creeds and races that it is frustrating that others (in my experience-older generations) can't move past their biases.

I didn’t know about anything happening at our other state schools but at USM, they took down the state flag at the front of the university. No one even noticed until of course the news got wind of it and did a big story on it. So one sad little group of “protesters” spent weeks sitting out by the flagpole, holding signs and yelling something every once in awhile. I think they finally gave up. Honestly, I haven’t noticed if the flag is back or not or if they are still there. They just became part of the landscape.

I wish they would just go ahead and let us vote on the dang flag and be down with it. There have been some really nice alternatives presented. Some that will still honor the past while looking to the future.

 

[Planogirl]

Are we banning Thomas Jefferson and anything associated with him too? So who gets to rewrite the Declaration of Independence? I'm not in favor of banning anything because I do believe in slippery slopes. Hopefully we never become THAT zealous.

 

[DeniseJH]

Are we banning Thomas Jefferson and anything associated with him too? So who gets to rewrite the Declaration of Independence? I'm not in favor of banning anything because I do believe in slippery slopes. Hopefully we never become THAT zealous.

There has been quite a bit of discussion on this already here, and no one is talking of "banning" Thomas Jefferson.

 

[DeniseJH]

That is something we will have to wait and see. You realize that this very thread is about an organization taking away something that wasn’t racist because of something in the distant past? Perhaps we are already seeing “what’s next”.

I mean for the largest part of any of it, it’s rarely something that affects most people’s day to day life. And hopefully it will never be.

I have to ask: If the point of possibly removing a statue of Thomas Jefferson is so that he is no longer portrayed as an icon, what are you afraid might happen next? He certainly wouldn't be removed from the history books. I believe they facts, not plaudits. Is there some other way in which he is portrayed as an icon that you'd hate to see disappear? That is the only logical answer when you stop and think about the actual reason behind the possible removal.


Also, I'd like to ask you as well: If a man enslaved and raped your ancestors, would you be fine with having that person celebrated with a statue?

 

[Klayfish]

 

[DeniseJH]

I don't understand, others are allowed to continue posting on this thread, but I am not because I have a differing viewpoint? There are a couple of people here that I have been having actual conversations with, should I stop because you don't like what I'm saying?

 

[luvsJack]

I have to ask: If the point of possibly removing a statue of Thomas Jefferson is so that he is no longer portrayed as an icon, what are you afraid might happen next? He certainly wouldn't be removed from the history books. I believe they facts, not plaudits. Is there some other way in which he is portrayed as an icon that you'd hate to see disappear? That is the only logical answer when you stop and think about the actual reason behind the possible removal.


Also, I'd like to ask you as well: If a man enslaved and raped your ancestors, would you be fine with having that person celebrated with a statue?

You keep going back to history books. History is so much more. Every country in the world has things from their history--monuments, buildings, etc. Do you think the US is the only nation in the world with a dark past? Seeing the monuments, homes, churches etc. from the time of George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and others brings the country's history alive unlike any book can possibly do. He isn't "celebrated" because he was a salve owner. He is "celebrated" because he is a founder of our country and wrote the Declaration of Independence. How do we not recognize the man who wrote the document our country is based on?

Both Dh and I have a great x? grandmother who was Native American--you really want to ask me that?

 

[DeniseJH]

You keep going back to history books. History is so much more. Every country in the world has things from their history--monuments, buildings, etc. Do you think the US is the only nation in the world with a dark past? Seeing the monuments, homes, churches etc. from the time of George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and others brings the country's history alive unlike any book can possibly do. He isn't "celebrated" because he was a salve owner. He is "celebrated" because he is a founder of our country and wrote the Declaration of Independence. How do we not recognize the man who wrote the document our country is based on?

Both Dh and I have a great x? grandmother who was Native American--you really want to ask me that?

My grandfather (my mother's father) was 100% Seneca. Yes, I am comfortable asking you that.

 

[dadtoagirl03]

You beat me to it!