Non Ticket holder at MNSSHP

[ssleblanc]

Well, there's a WORLD of difference between your analogy and what's really happening. If I buy cake mix at the store with a coupon, and the lady next to me pays full price, that's her loss--but I haven't done anything wrong. If I STEAL the cake and she has to pay full price, then I have definitely done something very wrong, and it DOES cheat her. See the difference?

I see your difference, and that isn't what I said. I said that I won't let the fact that someone else is cheating/stealing ruin it for me. YES - the person who stole the cake eis VERY wrong ... and it cheats her. But I won't throw out my paid for cake or find it's taste just horrible and ruined because someone else stole their cake mix, tainting my paid for cake experience with their stolen cake experience.

My point was NOT that it is OK for someone else to cheat. I thought that I had made myself clear - I find cheating and stealing just horrid. And I think it would horribly wrong for people to participate in MNSSHP by cheating while I'm in there having spent good money. My point was that unless I'm being crowded and my experience truly deminished by crowds of non-paying people (parades/trick-or-treat lines crowded with non-paying guests so that my kidis can't enjoy it/etc), I won't let the fact that others are cheating and stealing the experience ruin my own experience. I'm going to choose to have fun and not let them get me down. Getting myself too worked up about that and making my experience an unhappy one would be like throwing out my cake because someone else stole their cake mix.

And yes, I have an interest in this to the tune of $145 for my advanced purchased tickets. I have paid good money to be there on the first night.

And as I said in my first post, I DID email Disney about this, because I understand the concern. YOU CAN ADD ME TO YOUR LIST OF PEOPLE WHO EMAILED. All I was saying was that I was not going to let get me so upset (which it seems to have done to some here) that I can no longer enjoy the party that I paid $145 to enjoy.

 

[goofy4tink]

While *you* don't want those extra hours, lots of other people do want them. While they shouldn't feel entitled to them, they are a nice perk. Taking away that perk turns an 8 hour day into a 5 hour day. That's a big deal. And for people with kids who can't make it to midnight, it might turn a 7 hour day into a 4 hour day, or a 6 hour day into a 3 hour day. That's a really big deal to some people.

There is a big cost to taking away this perk. Maybe it's a good idea; maybe it's a bad idea. But let's base that decision on facts. The reason most people are asking for this perk to be taken away is their fear the park will be flooded with non-ticket holders. I think that fear is way overblown. People talk how hard it will be for the CM's to shoo people out - even though the CM's have had no trouble doing it in the past. People talk about how confusing it will be with the party starting at the same time the park is closing. But they don't start and end at the same time. In the past, the party has started at 4 with the shooing beginning at 6 - this year the party will start at 4 with the shooing beginning at 7. Just not that big a difference. People talk about the closing of lands and herding from 6-7, and feel the park can't be cleared without that herding time. I just haven't seen that much herding at the parties I've been to, and don't feel the herding is the big clearing asset as long as at least one land and MSUSA are open.

None of us are sure what will happen. We do know there is potential for a some more non-ticket holding guests to be in the park with the shift. If you think that potential is enough to demand Disney take away the 4:00 perk, fine.

But if you read through posts, people aren't talking about potential. They are talking as if we know for a fact that Disney is allowing anybody who wants to stay. They are talking as if it is a fact that it will be impossible for the CM's to get anyone out of the park. Heck, we've got people in this thread stressed about attraction lines being extra long due to the change (something that is impossible). What I don't want to see is people asking Disney talking away the 4:00 perk based on misinformation, or accepting the worst case scenario as fact.
Well said - I couldn't agree more.

While I understand what you are saying, I have to disagree with a few things. One, the 'party' does not start at 4. Yes, people have been allowed in early, with only party tickets in the past, in order to alleviate entrance crowding at the official party start time. If people are making their MK plans based on being able to get into MK 'free' at 4:00, with just their party tickets, then perhaps they should rethink their plans. Disney has changed, and still reserves the right to change yet again, their policy on this. First, you could do it, then you couldn't. Now, you can. I'm sorry, but that party ticket entitles you to party admission....that's all. If Disney chooses to make a 'perk' out of allowing party goers to enter at 4, so be it. But, it's nothing I would make definate plans around. It would be so much easier to allow the party people in at say, 5ish, close the park to day guests at 6, herd the party goers to TomoorowLand and reopen at 7. In essence, the party goers are getting two extra hours, the day people lose only an hour, and the folks worrying about too many naked wrists at the party should be happy!
Again, I think this is going to turn out to be a tempest in a teapot....it will all be fine.

So, for those of you who have been before (this is my first time), do you have to show your wristband/party ticket in order to get a trick or treat bag? That's one of the things that would frost me....standing behind a bunch of non-payers trying to get 'free' candy. No, I don't begrudge some poor kid getting a Tootsie Midget. However, that's one of the perks of going to MNSSHP that I am looking forward to. I can work around the crowded parade/fireworks viewing.

 

[Robo]

I trust... Disney...

Now, if they let me down, so be it. I have a 1997 ASMu mug in my suitcase already and I will spend the hours from 7 - midnight pool hopping and drinking unlimited refills until I feel I have recouped my money and exacted my revenge. Once they read that, they will quickly fall in line.

The PASSIVE-AGGRESSIVES' MOTTO:

"I don't get MAD... I get EVEN!"

 

[beattyfamily]

So, for those of you who have been before (this is my first time), do you have to show your wristband/party ticket in order to get a trick or treat bag? That's one of the things that would frost me....standing behind a bunch of non-payers trying to get 'free' candy. No, I don't begrudge some poor kid getting a Tootsie Midget. However, that's one of the perks of going to MNSSHP that I am looking forward to. I can work around the crowded parade/fireworks viewing.

They hand out the trick or treat bags at the entrance when you get your wristband so I don't see anyone who doesn't have a party ticket/wristband getting a trick or treat bag...BUT you can easliy bring your own and many people do.

 

[jramsey392001]

Well, I emailed Disney (WDW.Guest.Communications@disneyworld.com), asking what was going on, and got a response from April McKenzie. I guess she works in the executive offices at WDW. She asked me to call her and and leave my phone #. She said she would phone me back as soon as she has thoroughly researched the situation. We'll see what happens.

Honestly, I can't believe that Disney wouldn't try to remove non-paying guests. It would be a really stupid move on their part. Everyone who paid for their tickets would never come back.

I'm really worried about the crowds. My DH told me that if the crowds were bad again for this visit, then he probably wouldn't go back. Thats why I bought tickets to the MNNSHP...hoping for less people.

Oh well...if he won't go back, then I can take the kids by myself! Cheaper airfare and ticket prices!

 

[kaytieeldr]

If the party starts at 7:00, why is everybody in such an uproar about regular folk actually being able to stay until then? If they paid for a park admission they should be able to stay until the regular park closes! They should not be allowed to stay AFTER without a bracelet, but they should be entitled to what they paid for, same as you!

Well, the first problem IS the park staying open until 7. Previously, prior to hard-ticketed events, Magic Kingdom closed at 5 or 6 specifically to allow time for non-event-ticketed Guests to finish their day at the park and leave before the event started. They're STILL doing this for Night(s) of Joy - closing at 6 to the public and reopening at 7.
It's NOT reasonable to expect day Guests to ALL exit precisely at 7 PM. Close to the public at 6 - as most prospective MNSSHP attendees expect - and this wouldn't be an issue.

Can you imagine how much flack they get from families that go to MK completely uninformed (yes...they're out there!) and want to know why they only get to stay until 6pm but the ticket price is the same for the nights the park is open until 9pm (or later)?

Well, Magic Kingdom's standard operating hours are 9 AM to 6 PM, with some earlier openings at peak periods and many later closings depending on anticipated crowds/business. So, really, there shouldn't BE any such flak. Pretty much ANY visitor would likely know the park hours on a given day before arriving; even those who don't would be informed before or upon entering (or could always just ask )

Not trying to start any debates, but I really think MNSSHP should just be considered special entertainment to draw people during non-peak times and not be a separate ticket.

Not agreeing or disagreeing - but for now, it IS a separately-ticketed event.

I'm glad you're not stressed about it. But $40 per person isn't taken lightly by many of us,

Not that I take it lightly, but it's less of a burden on the solo traveler than on a family - and even this solo traveler is rethinking the entire party...

Do you know what you are talking about, or do you just like laying alot of bull out there..

MKing624's post that you quoted is extremely clear, lucid and non-accusatory. It summarizes what's been discussed in the last ten pages.

While *you* don't want those extra hours, lots of other people do want them. While they shouldn't feel entitled to them, they are a nice perk. Taking away that perk turns an 8 hour day into a 5 hour day. That's a big deal.

But those people are only PAYING for the five-hour "day".

People talk about how confusing it will be with the party starting at the same time the park is closing. But they don't start and end at the same time. In the past, the party has started at 4 with the shooing beginning at 6 - this year the party will start at 4 with the shooing beginning at 7.

Both parties - MNSSHP and MVMCP - begin at 7 PM each night they're held. Yes, Guests with tickets to these parties are allowed into the Magic Kingdom with only the event ticket in an attempt to reduce bottlenecks at the entrance (e.g. I understand not being able to enter the park until 7 because that's what my ticket entitles me to, but I do mind not getting into the park until 7:45 or 8 because ALL the attendees had to wait until 7 to be admitted), but the party STARTS at 7 PM, not at 4 or 5. Prior to 2006, 'shooing' worked because the park closed for that hour. It's far less likely to work if the park closes and the party - complete with decorations, characters, candy, parade, etc - starts at the same time. Day Guests will see all the changes and many will do their darnedest to remain in the park. On the other hand, MK closes at 6 PM on the Night of Joy nights and reopens at 7 PM for ONLY those Guests holding tickets to that event.

I have MNSSHP tickets for 9/23

Oh boy, I hope that was a typo - otherwise you're going to get to the Magic Kingdom that night and find no party!

 

[emnrich]

They are holding a private party just for me. They read about my plan to have a resort mug revolt and decided it was easier to just give me my own party.

Now, had you been nice, I might would have invited you!

 

[Zippa D Doodah]

Both parties - MNSSHP and MVMCP - begin at 7 PM each night they're held. Yes, Guests with tickets to these parties are allowed into the Magic Kingdom with only the event ticket in an attempt to reduce bottlenecks at the entrance (e.g. I understand not being able to enter the park until 7 because that's what my ticket entitles me to, but I do mind not getting into the park until 7:45 or 8 because ALL the attendees had to wait until 7 to be admitted), but the party STARTS at 7 PM, not at 4 or 5. Prior to 2006, 'shooing' worked because the park closed for that hour. It's far less likely to work if the park closes and the party - complete with decorations, characters, candy, parade, etc - starts at the same time. Day Guests will see all the changes and many will do their darnedest to remain in the park. On the other hand, MK closes at 6 PM on the Night of Joy nights and reopens at 7 PM for ONLY those Guests holding tickets to that event.

Now that right there is what would steam my vegetables maybe even more than non-paying day guests attending MNSSHP... waiting at the gate until 7:30 trying to get in after the party has started because Disney can't process the bottleneck of MNSSHP ticket-holders trying to get in. I bought a ticket (4 of 'em as a matter of fact) to attend a party that goes from 7PM until midnight. That is when I want to attend. I do not expect to be let in before 7PM, although I do understand why WDW would need to get me thru the gates before 7PM for crowd control purposes. Not that I'm losing sleep over it, but if there is a crowd -especially of non paying lingerers -inside while I'm standing outside as of 7:01 with my $160 worth of tix in hand, I sure do hope there is a Guest Relations CM on duty who is a good listener.

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

It will certainly be interesting to get first-hand reports from the DISers that have attended the first few nights of the event. I honestly feel this whole thing is getting blown out of proportion (or hope so anyway--in support of the people that have already purchased their tickets). If all the speculation turns out to be true, then it really appears to me that Disney is trying to phase out MNSSHP...no one that paid for a ticket this year that has to push their way through a crowd of non-ticket holders to view the parade or fireworks will purchase a ticket in the future. Perhaps it is the beginning of the end.

 

[shannon1219]

I feel like Disney will do there best to keep all parties invilved happy, but we all know that is not an easy task. The daytime customers want to get their monies worth as do the MNSSHPers so Disney has to figure out a way to acheive the impossible.

 

[TinkerbellMama]

My point was NOT that it is OK for someone else to cheat. I thought that I had made myself clear - I find cheating and stealing just horrid. And I think it would horribly wrong for people to participate in MNSSHP by cheating while I'm in there having spent good money. My point was that unless I'm being crowded and my experience truly deminished by crowds of non-paying people (parades/trick-or-treat lines crowded with non-paying guests so that my kidis can't enjoy it/etc), I won't let the fact that others are cheating and stealing the experience ruin my own experience.

Oh, well then we agree completely. I won't let the mere fact that people are stealing/cheating ruin my good time. But what I AM concerned about is that the result of their stealing/cheating (overcrowding) MAY ruin my good time! That's why *I wrote in...not to protest in general that "it's not fair"...but to make it clear that if overcrowding HAD resulted (and I think they have changed the policy back, at this point, no?), I would have been ticked.

 

[princesspwrhr]

Just an fyi...in the past they stopped handing out wristbands after 7:00p for those entering; I guess they felt by then they weren't necessary so some of those people you saw still could have been party guests.

I think they need to re-work their system!!!

We paid for and attended an *extremely* crowded MVMCP in 2000. We arrived about 645 stood outside the gates and were entertained by characters and cast members singing carols, seeing which line could sing the loudest, most off key, whatever, just things to keep people entertained. At 7pm the turnstiles opened and we went in, scanned our ticket and enjoyed ourselves. We were never issued a wrist band, in fact I still have the paper tickets from that event in dd's scrapbook. I always wondered about it when people said they had to get wristbands for 2000, so I guess they were just there before the park officially closed.

 

[beattyfamily]

We paid for and attended an *extremely* crowded MVMCP in 2000. We arrived about 645 stood outside the gates and were entertained by characters and cast members singing carols, seeing which line could sing the loudest, most off key, whatever, just things to keep people entertained. At 7pm the turnstiles opened and we went in, scanned our ticket and enjoyed ourselves. We were never issued a wrist band, in fact I still have the paper tickets from that event in dd's scrapbook. I always wondered about it when people said they had to get wristbands for 2000, so I guess they were just there before the park officially closed.

Hey, 2000 was the year of our first MVMCP too! That is the year I was talking about too; the year I did come to the party after 7:00p and didn't get a wristband but since then I have always come in before 7:00p and gotten a wristband.

So hopefully, IF they do not change the hours and they do not have a hour to clear the park that they will issue wristbands to EVERYONE who enters for the party all night long.

 

[ssleblanc]

Oh, well then we agree completely. I won't let the mere fact that people are stealing/cheating ruin my good time. But what I AM concerned about is that the result of their stealing/cheating (overcrowding) MAY ruin my good time! That's why *I wrote in...not to protest in general that "it's not fair"...but to make it clear that if overcrowding HAD resulted (and I think they have changed the policy back, at this point, no?), I would have been ticked.

I agree, the overcrowding had me concerned, which is why I did send off an email (and like so many others, I haven't had a response yet).

I expect there to be crowds at anything Disney, but expect them to be much lower than *normal* for this paid event. I don't expect to have a single file line throughout the parade route with no one blocking my kid's view. But if the parade route is 15 people thick and we can't see a darn thing, and it is caused more by excessive abuse of the Disney kindness (people who won't leave when asked because they are cheating the system, combined with CM's who won't get aggressive with the rule breakers), I'll be pretty upset.

Sooo.......back to the fun .... Less than a month to go for us!! I've already started with "I'm too excited to sleep" (me - not the kids). And I think I've changed my mind and decided to wear a costume. Guess I should tell my sister (who wanted to wear one but wasn't if I didn't).

 

[Dizneydaz]

Wow-this sure has added more excitement to our upcoming trip! This year will be our first MNSSHP and we are going on the first night so I guess we'll be the first to find out if any of this info is true.

Hopefully, they will still let us in early as I used that info to book my ADR (back in June) at LTT at 5:50. I'm sure others did the same thing. In fact, when I first tried to book LTT the latest I could get was 4:05. I was worried about being able to make it there in 5 min. I posted this on these boards and someone else posted that not all the cast members working the phones know to check to "special event" schedule and she was able to book (after I did) a better time. So, I called back, mention the "special event" and changed my time to 5:50 (or is it 5:55?) Anyway, point being, that if they weren't going to open early for MNSSHP guest, why would they have a "special events" calendar? I guess we'll have to wait 'til the 15th to find out. Either way, I won't let it ruin our experience, however, if Disney does let non-ticketed guest stay and experience MNSSHP, then this will be the one and only time I'll pay extra for it.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see!

 

[jcemom]

They are holding a private party just for me. They read about my plan to have a resort mug revolt and decided it was easier to just give me my own party.

Now, had you been nice, I might would have invited you!