No availability in a Copper Creek studio at 11 months

[Dean Marino]

So - while dear wife & I are homed at BRV - and not affected by the CCV mess....

A Modest proposal?

Move the entire WEST wing of WL into the CCV Contract. Eliminate WL general Rental rooms. Transform the entire Resort to DVC. Yup, probably going to require a CCV Members vote.

 

[Sandisw]

So - while dear wife & I are homed at BRV - and not affected by the CCV mess....

A Modest proposal?

Move the entire WEST wing of WL into the CCV Contract. Eliminate WL general Rental rooms. Transform the entire Resort to DVC. Yup, probably going to require a CCV Members vote.

It actually wouldn’t require a vote, DVD could convert the hotel and add it to CCV without a worry!

Just like they did when they added treehouses to SSR!

 

[heapmaster]

So - while dear wife & I are homed at BRV - and not affected by the CCV mess....

A Modest proposal?

Move the entire WEST wing of WL into the CCV Contract. Eliminate WL general Rental rooms. Transform the entire Resort to DVC. Yup, probably going to require a CCV Members vote.

You have my vote, I was just thinking about this today while reading this thread. I dont know the amount of occupancy on the hotel side, but I bet they would have no problem filling in up to almost 100% if they converted the whole thing. I'm sure the bit that do cash could just buy it from the DVC owned points. And while they are at it make some rooms CL as well like AKV.

 

[Lorana]

So - while dear wife & I are homed at BRV - and not affected by the CCV mess....

A Modest proposal?

Move the entire WEST wing of WL into the CCV Contract. Eliminate WL general Rental rooms. Transform the entire Resort to DVC. Yup, probably going to require a CCV Members vote.

Given that there is no reopening date on the hotel side, they could do it now without impacting reservations/capacity...

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The POS statements allow additions to be made so as already mentioned there wouldn't even be a vote required. I really wouldn't be terribly surprised if that idea hadn't been floated and probably will be talked about again as I think conversions are most likely the option back on the table for new DVC.

 

[heapmaster]

The POS statements allow additions to be made so as already mentioned there wouldn't even be a vote required. I really wouldn't be terribly surprised if that idea hadn't been floated and probably will be talked about again as I think conversions are most likely the option back on the table for new DVC.

If they convert the hotel side do they add more points to sell into CCV or is it fixed? If its fixed, they wouldn't be able to make any more money on the conversion besides having to spend money to convert and please the DVC folks for more availability.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

If they convert the hotel side do they add more points to sell into CCV or is it fixed? If its fixed, they wouldn't be able to make any more money on the conversion besides having to spend money to convert and please the DVC folks for more availability.

They add more points.

 

[M:SpilotISTC12]

As a 50 point owner at CCV, the availability of the studios is a little alarming for me. When we bought we figured there would be pretty open availability at 11 months but if you’re not on at 8 am, you’re SOL. Been wondering if we should sell CCV if it means we can’t really stay there since the amount of rooms doesn’t meet the demand. Am I just overreacting?

 

[iheartglaciers]

As a 50 point owner at CCV, the availability of the studios is a little alarming for me. When we bought we figured there would be pretty open availability at 11 months but if you’re not on at 8 am, you’re SOL. Been wondering if we should sell CCV if it means we can’t really stay there since the amount of rooms doesn’t meet the demand. Am I just overreacting?

What's crazy is even if you're on at 8am at 11 months you could be SOL. If you wanted to use the 50pt contract to stay at CCV from Sept through Dec I don't think that you're overreacting.

 

[Pyotr]

As a 50 point owner at CCV, the availability of the studios is a little alarming for me. When we bought we figured there would be pretty open availability at 11 months but if you’re not on at 8 am, you’re SOL. Been wondering if we should sell CCV if it means we can’t really stay there since the amount of rooms doesn’t meet the demand. Am I just overreacting?

That’s a difficult decision. Next year‘s availability is likely much worse than normal due to all the people putting off their vacations. If you were planning on getting studios in December, I’d sell because that’s next to impossible. If you travel in June or July, I’d keep because it’s not that difficult then.

 

[M:SpilotISTC12]

What's crazy is even if you're on at 8am at 11 months you could be SOL. If you wanted to use the 50pt contract to stay at CCV from Sept through Dec I don't think that you're overreacting.

We like going in September or October for Halloween. Obviously 2021 is going to not be a normal year due to COVID and WDW’s 50th. I just hope that we don’t get screwed out of staying at our home resort!

 

[_auroraborealis_]

We like going in September or October for Halloween. Obviously 2021 is going to not be a normal year due to COVID and WDW’s 50th. I just hope that we don’t get screwed out of staying at our home resort!

It's not really "screwed" in September and October. Those are very hard months to get studios at CCV.

 

[drusba]

As a 50 point owner at CCV, the availability of the studios is a little alarming for me. When we bought we figured there would be pretty open availability at 11 months but if you’re not on at 8 am, you’re SOL. Been wondering if we should sell CCV if it means we can’t really stay there since the amount of rooms doesn’t meet the demand. Am I just overreacting?

You are not overreacting. As CCV went from early sales in spring 2017 to now almost selling out, it continuously went through stages of difficulty getting studios at 11-months out. In earlier times, it became, for reservations in 2018, mainly an issue during parts of the fall high demand season. It then became, for reservations in 2019, a very often problem during that season. It then moved, for reservations in 2020 ((made before Covid) as a problem throughout the fall season and to a number of times during the rest the year, and it is now reached an 11-month problem for all of the fall season and a large portion fo the rest of the year. It has become at least as bad if not worse than BWV standard studios. Likely it is now near its peak.

Possibly it will get a little better as times progresses but it will likely not get much better unless DVC does a major point shift, significantly raising the points needed for studios year round while significantly lowering them for cabins (and possibly GVs). The legality of such a move could be challenged, as a number of us pointed out when DVC tried to raise studios at all WDW resorts year round when it issued, in late 2018, the initial 2020 point charts, that were then withdrawn. But if that happens and DVC gets away with it, the value of your 50 points will be even less than they are now, because they will both still likely have an 11-month issue for many parts of the year and will get fewer nights than they do now. Another possible solution, that would not raise any legal problems, is one already mentioned in this thread, in that DVD could add more of the WL resort to CCV and that addition would consist of all or mostly of studios.

Poly, with the bungalows, mainly avoided an 11-month problem because 95% of all rooms (360 of the 380 total) are studios. For CCV, the percentage is only 32% (counting lock-offs as two rooms).

You also have to consider a new legal issue that may actually be facing those selling low-point CCV contracts now. There is a lurking issue in the law called "fraudulent concealment." If you sell property knowing there is significant problem affecting use or value of the property that is not known to the buyer, the buyer may be able to later void the sale and get his money back or seek damages because of your failure to reveal the problem during the process of doing the sale. There are defenses, including that the buyer, by minimal investigation, may have discovered the problem, but that is not a certain defense particularly if the buyer is told anything like the points being transferred can easily get studios at 11-months out. But an existing owner (and any broker acting as the sales agent), to assure in the sale that he avoids a future lawsuit seeking to void the sale, needs to consider taking the safe course of telling a potential buyer that there is an 11-month issue with CCV studios.

 

[Sandisw]

We like going in September or October for Halloween. Obviously 2021 is going to not be a normal year due to COVID and WDW’s 50th. I just hope that we don’t get screwed out of staying at our home resort!

Not so much September, but October is a very busy time at all the near park resorts, So, no only could you be locked out of a studio at CCV, by the time 7 months comes around, you may have difficult getting what you want anywhere.

Its why we didn’t buy at CCV...didn’t want a fixed week and didn’t want the headache of being forced into a 1 bedroom if we couldn’t get the studios.

 

[BWV Dreamin]

As a 50 point owner at CCV, the availability of the studios is a little alarming for me. When we bought we figured there would be pretty open availability at 11 months but if you’re not on at 8 am, you’re SOL. Been wondering if we should sell CCV if it means we can’t really stay there since the amount of rooms doesn’t meet the demand. Am I just overreacting?

With 50 points, its hard to even walk a resrrvation at 11 months out. Need to have seven days worth of points to effectively walk. Also, points chart changes may also change your vacation plans, and 50 points leaves no buffer for that. Is something to think about.

 

[drusba]

With 50 points, its hard to even walk a resrrvation at 11 months out. Need to have seven days worth of points to effectively walk. Also, points chart changes may also change your vacation plans, and 50 points leaves no buffer for that. Is something to think about.

To successfully walk you only need enough points to cover the two highest point-cost nights that will exist during your walk, i.e., typically two weekend nights.

What walking does at 11-months out is prevent anyone from reserving the room you have for the nights you already have and any future nights. Thus with enough points for two nights, you can begin a walk and succeed as long as you modify your reservation daily to drop a night and add a night. The only thing that having enough points for 7 nights adds to the equation is that the owner with that many points needs to modify only every 6 days.

In other words, if for example, I started a walk today, Sep 25, 2020, by reserving both Aug 25 and 26, 2021, I could successfully complete a walk to any period just as well as someone with enough points for 7 nights who started a walk today reserving Aug 25-Sep 2, 2021.

 

[CastAStone]

Poly, with the bungalows, mainly avoided an 11-month problem because 95% of all rooms (360 of the 380 total) are studios. For CCV, the percentage is only 32% (counting lock-offs as two rooms).

I think it’s more about the sheer volume of points in the cabins, after all, BRV has roughly the same % of rooms as studios as CCV but none of the issues.

 

[heapmaster]

I think it’s more about the sheer volume of points in the cabins, after all, BRV has roughly the same % of rooms as studios as CCV but none of the issues.

I agree with this. Its not the amount of owners or small contracts, its just so many points against the cabins that are sold to people looking for studios. Them moving the whole resort to a DVC property would help this a bit, as long as they didn't try to add a huge amount of points to the amount they have already.

 

[M:SpilotISTC12]

You all are making great points that I had not even thought of let alone when I purchasing 2 years ago. I love WL and the point chart allowed me to get the 3 nights in September and October with the smallest points necessary. If I had known that this was going to be an issue I wouldn’t have bought there. Also I had no idea about walking before buying. I figured that September was somewhat of a slow season and figured it wouldn’t be an issue but here we are. As much as I enjoy the other resorts WL is my favorite and bought CCV to stay there.

I wish they would make the whole resort DVC but I can’t see them doing it. It would be nice.

 

[SL6827]

Not so much September, but October is a very busy time at all the near park resorts, So, no only could you be locked out of a studio at CCV, by the time 7 months comes around, you may have difficult getting what you want anywhere.

Its why we didn’t buy at CCV...didn’t want a fixed week and didn’t want the headache of being forced into a 1 bedroom if we couldn’t get the studios.

That is an excellent point there that I really hadn't thought about with owners not being able to get a studio from October say through December and then not be able to get a studio anywhere, wow! If Disney did convert the rest of the WL to DVC, would that be a part of DVC-1 or DVC-2 or what?