Nikon D80

[ukcatfan]

For most users, the big question is if you are going to need the 50mm f/1.8 or not. It is a very popular and very cheap lens to get such good results. It will not AF on the D40.

Don't worry about the D50 being discontinued. It has no effect on warranty status or supplies of repair parts. Every camera is discontinued after 12-24 months.

Kevin

 

[MarkBarbieri]

Every camera is discontinued after 12-24 months.

Scary, isn't it? The Pentax K1000 was around for something like 20 years and they sold millions of them.

 

[Master Mason]

Scary, isn't it? The Pentax K1000 was around for something like 20 years and they sold millions of them.

yep they sold one to my dad for me.... many many years ago. My oldest has it now and still uses it occasionally

 

[Groucho]

I think the K1000 was the top-selling 35mm SLR ever. Of course, it helps when they just keep churning them out year after year.

As for discontinued... hey, look at the car in your driveway. Unless it's a 2008 model (or in some cases, a 2007 model) - it's been discontinued! Chances are that your house is full of discontinued items, both electronic and otherwise - in fact, I bet that there's little in the house that hasn't been discontinued and replaced with a newer model (or is not replaceable at all.)

The 50mm (and probably some other primes?) would be a big reason for me to not consider the D40. I'm also a big fan of older lenses, and you'll probably find many that are optically superb but won't AF with the D40.

I understand the Nikon idea of "moving forward" with the new setup - but hey, they're the only ones who have made a move like this, and I kind of doubt that we'll see the D80 replacement (or any other higher-end Nikon) losing the focus motor any time soon. I think it's a case of "cutting costs" rather than attempting to move technology forward.

 

[Master Mason]

I think the K1000 was the top-selling 35mm SLR ever. Of course, it helps when they just keep churning them out year after year.

As for discontinued... hey, look at the car in your driveway. Unless it's a 2008 model (or in some cases, a 2007 model) - it's been discontinued! Chances are that your house is full of discontinued items, both electronic and otherwise - in fact, I bet that there's little in the house that hasn't been discontinued and replaced with a newer model (or is not replaceable at all.)

The 50mm (and probably some other primes?) would be a big reason for me to not consider the D40. I'm also a big fan of older lenses, and you'll probably find many that are optically superb but won't AF with the D40.

I understand the Nikon idea of "moving forward" with the new setup - but hey, they're the only ones who have made a move like this, and I kind of doubt that we'll see the D80 replacement (or any other higher-end Nikon) losing the focus motor any time soon. I think it's a case of "cutting costs" rather than attempting to move technology forward.

That's not exactly true, Canon did this many years ago, when they changed the mount, nikon is just trying to do it without compleately abandoning everything.

Its a tough choice if the new technology makes it better to make a corporate decision to dump the old tech and P...s everyone off, or to try and transition it slowly.

 

[MarkBarbieri]

I understand the Nikon idea of "moving forward" with the new setup - but hey, they're the only ones who have made a move like this, and I kind of doubt that we'll see the D80 replacement (or any other higher-end Nikon) losing the focus motor any time soon. I think it's a case of "cutting costs" rather than attempting to move technology forward.

If they introduce any significant non AF-S lenses in the next few years, I'll agree. If they continue their recent trend of making all lenses AF-S, I think it's a clear sign that they are finally making the transition rather than straddling the fence.

 

[Groucho]

That's not exactly true, Canon did this many years ago, when they changed the mount, nikon is just trying to do it without compleately abandoning everything.

Its a tough choice if the new technology makes it better to make a corporate decision to dump the old tech and P...s everyone off, or to try and transition it slowly.

Well, I still think it's a "cheap" thing since there's no penalty (apart from a minor weight one) in having a focus motor in the body. It's not like getting rid of it will give room for some new feature, it's just something taken away. There's no benefit to the buyer to not have it. And again, if it were a technology-driven move, I'd think that we'd see on a high-end model as well.

I don't see Canon getting rid of the focus motor and they've been doing motor-focus lenses for a long time. Pentax is starting to release lenses like this and I'm quite sure that they'll keep the motor (especially since they put a high value on using legacy lenses.) I doubt we'll see Sony or Olympus get rid of it, either.

 

[Master Mason]

Well, I still think it's a "cheap" thing since there's no penalty (apart from a minor weight one) in having a focus motor in the body. It's not like getting rid of it will give room for some new feature, it's just something taken away. There's no benefit to the buyer to not have it. And again, if it were a technology-driven move, I'd think that we'd see on a high-end model as well.

I don't see Canon getting rid of the focus motor and they've been doing motor-focus lenses for a long time. Pentax is starting to release lenses like this and I'm quite sure that they'll keep the motor (especially since they put a high value on using legacy lenses.) I doubt we'll see Sony or Olympus get rid of it, either.

Ok, I might be showing my ignorance, but don't canon lenses have the moter in the lens. Thats what the USM and stuff is about??

And my point was that nikon wants to make the move, but because they don't want to leave everyone at the alter that already has stuff, they leave the motor in the body of the higher end cameras, in the mean time they develope in lens motors on all new lenses, then 5-10 years from now, they can drop it, with very little feedback from their customers as all the currently offered lenses have motors in the bodies.

That is pure speculation on my part, but I think it makes sense.

 

[MarkBarbieri]

Well, I still think it's a "cheap" thing since there's no penalty (apart from a minor weight one) in having a focus motor in the body. It's not like getting rid of it will give room for some new feature, it's just something taken away. There's no benefit to the buyer to not have it. And again, if it were a technology-driven move, I'd think that we'd see on a high-end model as well.

Ever look inside a DSLR? Real estate is at quite a premium. Anything that isn't needed get's scrapped. Their is more room in larger SLRs, like the pro-sized models, but then they have more features to add. The other problem with a focus motor in the body is that it is one more eletrical device that generates heat and eletrical noise, neither of which is desirable.

It may be my Canon background leading me to the bias, but I really think Nikon plans to drop body motors. I think the question is "when", not "if".

I don't see Canon getting rid of the focus motor

Canon has never had a focus motor in the camera, at least not with the EOS mount.

In the olden days of the 80's, it used to cost about $20 more for a third party lens for a Canon compared with the N/P/M because they had to build in a motor.

 

[fitzperry]

For most users, the big question is if you are going to need the 50mm f/1.8 or not. It is a very popular and very cheap lens to get such good results. It will not AF on the D40.

Don't worry about the D50 being discontinued. It has no effect on warranty status or supplies of repair parts. Every camera is discontinued after 12-24 months.

Kevin

I was thinking exactly the same thing. Also, the op mentioned that one of her priorities was getting great pictures of her family with or without a flash. The fast primes are a great way to go about the "without a flash" part of it (and in the case of the 50mm f/1.8, a very economical way). As I understand it those won't autofocus on the D40/D40X. If she's willing to do without those lenses, the the D40 sounds like it would be a good choice. If not, then tracking down a D50 or stepping up to the D80 would be worthwhile.

Also, I noticed that the op commented that she had not had the desire to add to her lens collection after using a film slr. Now I never had a film slr, but I suspect that lens envy is somewhat more difficult to avoid in the digital realm. The ability to shoot as many pictures as you want at virtually no cost is maddeningly addictive and causes one to examine every image in precise detail and to yearn for more and more lenses that will surely improve the quality of said images. This also means that buying a camera that seems like more camera than you need at the moment isn't necessarily a bad idea.

 

[Groucho]

I thought that only some Canon lenses have focus motors in the lens?

I know where are different variations of their USM and that some lenses don't have USM, I assumed that those were still focused by a motor in the body. Guess I was wrong?

 

[Groucho]

Also, I noticed that the op commented that she had not had the desire to add to her lens collection after using a film slr. Now I never had a film slr, but I suspect that lens envy is somewhat more difficult to avoid in the digital realm.

I think lens envy grows significantly in the internet world... I survived just fine with three lenses on my film SLR without having big cravings for more, but this was back in the days of BBSs, and I didn't start reading photography stuff on the net until I got serious in the digital realm, and now I have quite a few lenses that I'd very much like to add to my collection. Ignorance (of other lenses and of seeing pictures others have taken with those lenses) is bliss!

 

[handicap18]

I think lens envy grows significantly in the internet world... I survived just fine with three lenses on my film SLR without having big cravings for more, but this was back in the days of BBSs, and I didn't start reading photography stuff on the net until I got serious in the digital realm, and now I have quite a few lenses that I'd very much like to add to my collection. Ignorance (of other lenses and of seeing pictures others have taken with those lenses) is bliss!

I survivied for 15+ years with just 2 lenses for my film slr, but I think that has more to do with not being educated enough to know better. I would read the occassional Shutterbug Mag or Popular Photography Mag, but that was about it. I didn't really know as much about the primes. When I took photo classes it was in high school and when your 16, 17, 18 years old that kind of stuff doesn't necessarily set in unless your doing it all the time which I wasn't. Had I known enough about the 50mm f/1.8 back in the early 90's when I started up again with an slr I would have gotten one then. In fact at one time one of the places I work had an incentive going on that you could earn what was called "Hunt Dollars". There is a huge local photo place called Hunts Photo & Video. I did pretty well and earned around $100 or so. I went and inquired about a zoom which was priced around $300 and passed. Not wanting to spend $200 at that time. Instead I bought a few photo albums, refills, film and other little stuff. Back then (early/mid 90's) I probably could have gotten an 85mm f/1.8 for $100 of my own money and combined it with the store money I earned. Or even gotten the 50mm f/1.8 without spending any of my own money. But I didn't even know about those lenses then.

Your right about it being an internet thing, but its more of an opportunity to be educated now and research is so much easier. That in turn leads to more lens envy along with other accessories.

While boards like this one have been a blessing to my photography progress, at the same time it has also been a nightmare for my wallet. 15 years ago there was nothing like this.

 

[Groucho]

While boards like this one have been a blessing to my photography progress, at the same time it has also been a nightmare for my wallet. 15 years ago there was nothing like this.

Well, there was CompuServe, GEnie, etc... I'm sure they had photography sections but I was more likely to be hanging out in the cars sections back then.

In a pile of old Disney park stuff that I recently discovered, I found some WDW trip info printed out from CompuServe, it was back in 1989 or so, printed with a dot matrix on tractor-feed paper. Ahh, those were the days... or maybe not...!

 

[fitzperry]

I think lens envy grows significantly in the internet world... I survived just fine with three lenses on my film SLR without having big cravings for more, but this was back in the days of BBSs, and I didn't start reading photography stuff on the net until I got serious in the digital realm, and now I have quite a few lenses that I'd very much like to add to my collection. Ignorance (of other lenses and of seeing pictures others have taken with those lenses) is bliss!

Well said. And the op has already found this board so she's in for it.

 

[ranthony]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho
I think lens envy grows significantly in the internet world... I survived just fine with three lenses on my film SLR without having big cravings for more, but this was back in the days of BBSs, and I didn't start reading photography stuff on the net until I got serious in the digital realm, and now I have quite a few lenses that I'd very much like to add to my collection. Ignorance (of other lenses and of seeing pictures others have taken with those lenses) is bliss!

Well said. And the op has already found this board so she's in for it.

I was at Wal-Mart today using the electronics department as a 'short-cut' to aviod the toy department. Well, I'm sure I looked like my head was on a swivel when I noticed the D40 on display. Of course I had to stop and pick it up and then I asked the clerk to show me the lens from the box under the counter (the camera was on display w/o lens). Is it just me, or is the lens really light? My other stuff seems so much heavier and I don't think the lenses themselves are that much different in size. I then began to think...hmmmm, I wonder what this would feel like with the 18-200 on it. I politely thanked the clerk and high tailed it outta-there!

 

[woodlandsparty]

I'm horrible....I have been looking at these cameras forever now. And....I just can't seem to make up my mind. So...I'm hoping some of you can give me the pro's and cons of each....maybe something that I'm not catching that will help sway my decision. I want to stay with either Canon or Nikon...and these 2 models are the ones within my price range....though I am somewhat considering the D200 as well but I'm not sure the added price is worth the few enhancements over the D80.

I don't have any lenses or anything, so I'm not yet loyal to one brand or the other. And, I have small hands, so the ergonomics of both feel fine to me. I've played with both, and I didn't really seem to lean towards one more than the other except that the Nikon felt more 'sturdy' to me....maybe just because it was a little heavier though.

XTi......battery life is about 1/2 of what the D80 is, it's lower cost than the D80 so that's a plus, and ughh....just the camera being a 'Rebel'....it seems SO *consumer* to me...kind of like buying a silver camera (sorry to those that own them!)...it just seems not cool. Which shouldn't be a big deal to me, but for some reason it is.

D80...the main drawback for me here is the added cost over the XTi and it seems like you don't get much more bang for your buck over the XTi.

So....please help sway me in one direction or the other!!!!

 

[ukcatfan]

If you are throwing a possible D200 in, then why not the 30D? It will not give you the same "feel" as the XTi that you do not like.

Any reason you are considering only the two brands when your budget is as high as it is? The Pentax K10D, Sony Alpha, Sigma whatever, and whatever comparable Olympus could end up being a better fit for you. I think I also heard something about Panasonic releasing something based on the D80, but I do not remember too much and it might be expensive and/or a while until it is out. I am pretty sure that the Fuji models are at the pro level only, so they would likely be too much.

Kevin

 

[YEKCIM]

Both are excellent cameras, from everything I have read here and elsewhere, so whichever you choose, you'll make a good decison: win-win!

That said, I would encourage you to look beyond the camera body to the available lenses and other accessories. A dSLR is a *system*, not just a camera and the lenses in particular are as important as the camera body, if not more so.

Depending on what kinds of photography you do, you might find that one brand's lens lineup suits you better than the other.

~YEKCIM

 

[jann1033]

I'm horrible....I have been looking at these cameras forever now. And....I just can't seem to make up my mind. So...I'm hoping some of you can give me the pro's and cons of each....maybe something that I'm not catching that will help sway my decision. I want to stay with either Canon or Nikon...and these 2 models are the ones within my price range....though I am somewhat considering the D200 as well but I'm not sure the added price is worth the few enhancements over the D80.

I don't have any lenses or anything, so I'm not yet loyal to one brand or the other. And, I have small hands, so the ergonomics of both feel fine to me. I've played with both, and I didn't really seem to lean towards one more than the other except that the Nikon felt more 'sturdy' to me....maybe just because it was a little heavier though.

XTi......battery life is about 1/2 of what the D80 is, it's lower cost than the D80 so that's a plus, and ughh....just the camera being a 'Rebel'....it seems SO *consumer* to me...kind of like buying a silver camera (sorry to those that own them!)...it just seems not cool. Which shouldn't be a big deal to me, but for some reason it is.

D80...the main drawback for me here is the added cost over the XTi and it seems like you don't get much more bang for your buck over the XTi.

So....please help sway me in one direction or the other!!!!

can't really help you out since i think either are good choices. but to ease your mind the canon slr has been called rebel since i think the 90s or so in other words over 20 yrs, so i don't think most people would think of it as anything but a slr. ( dslr) i got a canon since i had some lenses and never really considered anything else due to that and have liked it fine...for me the nikon was too big for my hands anyway...i'd also look into the next model for each brand and see if either has something you'd really want over the other one or how the price is as you upgrade bodies.. it used to be nikons were a couple hundred more across the board but not sure if that holds true still. also maybe check out the lenses and see prices and how they are reviewed.