NEW VGF Building

[Sandisw]

I don't think they posted a picture of the master in the 1BR....I think that's a deluxe studio (queen, murphy, flip down).

That is the new VGF1 studio.

Thanks! I think the one site I looked at had it labeled wrong!

 

[BWV Dreamin]

So, now that we have an idea of what they will be, what are thoughts on initial price per point?

I think I’m sticking with my initial prediction…$220 to $230/pt.

I’m sticking with intro price near $255/pt. with an increase after a month or so.

 

[Nabas]

But, my unpopular opinion (apparently), if I were planning on staying in studios for all stays, I would prefer two real beds and a 'regular hotel room' than a 1 bed and pull down.

Possibly this depends on the makeup of the person wanting the room.

For example, a couple might prefer 1 bed with a regular sofa, while 2 adults traveling together might prefer 2 beds.

 

[sethschroeder]

My guess is the people that buy when these points go on sale will be ones who like the idea of what is being offered. Maybe they will be fewer points than the deluxe studios.

I will be shocked if Disney doesn't have rooms to tour in VGF1 though. They will absolutely push those rooms as a perk of buying.

 

[jbreen2010]

I liked the look of the new studio rooms. I just closed on a resale contract to own VGF. To me, the location and amenities at the resort are great and worth it. I prefer 1-2brs so a bit disappointing that the new building will not have any new 1-2brs but I could see myself renting a studio. The views will likely be cool on the lake…and I normally do split stays anyway.

my guess is these start pricing at $240-250 with very light incentives for current owners and not many incentives for new owners.

 

[havoc315]

I do not like they took the easy way and simply made resort (hotel) rooms. Rooms with 2 beds do not interest us as a couple. Some Resort Kings or even Queens with a pulldown would've been better for us. Personally, if they gave us a king bed, no kitchenette & for less points and we would've been happy.

VGF2 is a no go for us. Though all the recent WDW changes already cured us of addonitis. Overall I like the looks of the refurbishment (esp the resort room aesthetics).

I am really afraid deluxe studios (& even 2 bedrooms) will be even harder to book. We may sell and take on more AKL or nothing at all depending how this shakes out with availability.

When DVC started, it wasn’t about hotel rooms. It was about true timeshare resorts — more akin to condo timeshares, homes away from home. Large units with kitchens, amenities that were unique and different from regular hotels.

Over time, we’ve seen DVC buyers and DVC marketing treating it more like “40% off your future hotel stays”— now the transformation is complete. GFV2 are not villas in any sense. It’s just a building of hotel rooms now being sold as DVC. There is NOTHING “DVC” about GFV2. They are just nice hotel rooms.

Maybe this is what DVC buyers actually want, maybe they will be super popular. But it’s a long way from the original DVC concept.

 

[brazzledazzler]

When DVC started, it wasn’t about hotel rooms. It was about true timeshare resorts — more akin to condo timeshares, homes away from home. Large units with kitchens, amenities that were unique and different from regular hotels.

Over time, we’ve seen DVC buyers and DVC marketing treating it more like “40% off your future hotel stays”— now the transformation is complete. GFV2 are not villas in any sense. It’s just a building of hotel rooms now being sold as DVC. There is NOTHING “DVC” about GFV2. They are just nice hotel rooms.

Maybe this is what DVC buyers actually want, maybe they will be super popular. But it’s a long way from the original DVC concept.

We bought DVC for “home” at Disney. A place to relax, make meals, and have extra amenities…near the parks.

This is not that. This is not an extension of my home, but a subsidized deluxe hotel room. I am sad, but I am sure a certain buyer wants that.

I guess I am just disappointed to see that DVC members are simply valued as cash cows to support hotels. Give less, charge more.

 

[DonMacGregor]

Maybe this is what DVC buyers actually want, maybe they will be super popular. But it’s a long way from the original DVC concept.

This right here. This forum is littered with hundreds of threads/posts regarding the lack of availability of studios at 11 months and how AKL is so much more desirable due to the emphasis on studios over 1 and 2BR, as well as Poly with the almost exclusive studio offerings (setting aside the bungalows). I always feel like I'm in a very small minority when I say I can't stand studios and won't stay in anything smaller than a 1BR.

If you are to believe the posts, the goal of the majority of DVC owners is to wring the absolute maximum number of nights out their contracts, while cramming as many bodies as possible into their room. The only way to do that is by booking studios, of which there are a finite (and apparently inadequate) number. I don't see too many posts complaining that there aren't enough dedicated (or lock-off) 2BR or 3BR villas, and there's plenty of evidence that even the ones that exist currently are still available at many resorts well inside the 7 month booking window. The added irony is that those few members who have complaints about two bedrooms are critical not of their number or lack of availability, but of having a preference for dedicated 2BR units rather than lock-offs (which further reduces the possible number of studios and futher increases their demand).

If I were Disney, reading these and other forums, the message to me would be loud and clear: give us more studios. Disney can either build new resorts/buildings, or convert existing hotel rooms into studios. The conversions don't address the latter demand by owners (maximum occupancy capacity within the studio) as they likely would only sleep 4 people, but it does solve the more specific demand for more studios. It's lazy and cheap, but there is little doubt that there is a very vocal demand for more studio units.

While I don't disagree that if you're going to convert a hotel room into a studio, you'd better make sure it's actually a studio villa and not just lipstick on a pig, and I'm absolutely certain Disney isn't going all-in on studios out of the kindness of their hearts and great concern over member needs, but however we got here, the apparent "demand" for more studios is clearly being addressed.

 

[Paul Stupin]

So, now that we have an idea of what they will be, what are thoughts on initial price per point?

I think I’m sticking with my initial prediction…$220 to $230/pt.

Me too! And I’m still in, but mostly for more direct points to book one bedrooms. I don‘t see availability issues at 11 months.

 

[The Jackal]

This right here. This forum is littered with hundreds of threads/posts regarding the lack of availability of studios at 11 months and how AKL is so much more desirable due to the emphasis on studios over 1 and 2BR, as well as Poly with the almost exclusive studio offerings (setting aside the bungalows). I always feel like I'm in a very small minority when I say I can't stand studios and won't stay in anything smaller than a 1BR.

If you are to believe the posts, the goal of the majority of DVC owners is to wring the absolute maximum number of nights out their contracts, while cramming as many bodies as possible into their room. The only way to do that is by booking studios, of which there are a finite (and apparently inadequate) number. I don't see too many posts complaining that there aren't enough dedicated (or lock-off) 2BR or 3BR villas, and there's plenty of evidence that even the ones that exist currently are still available at many resorts well inside the 7 month booking window. The added irony is that those few members who have complaints about two bedrooms are critical not of their number or lack of availability, but of having a preference for dedicated 2BR units rather than lock-offs (which further reduces the possible number of studios and futher increases their demand.

If I were Disney, reading these and other forums, the message to me would be loud and clear: give us more studios. Disney can either build new resorts/buildings, or convert existing hotel rooms into studios. The conversions don't address the latter demand by owners (maximum occupancy capacity within the studio) as they likely would only sleep 4 people, but it does solve the more specific demand for more studios. It's lazy and cheap, but there is little doubt that there is a very vocal demand for more studio units.

While I don't disagree that if you're going to convert a hotel room into a studio, you'd better make sure it's actually a studio villa and not just lipstick on a pig, and I'm absolutely certain Disney isn't going all-in on studios out of the kindness of their hearts and great concern over member needs, but however we got here, the apparent "demand" for more studios is clearly being addressed.

I agree that there is more demand for studios than any other room type in DVC. It seems that even after doing this for 30 years, DVC should have an idea on what the proper ratio of room types a resort should have. It appears that they still have no idea of the ratio and now for the second time are building a resort with only studios to make up for their lack of planning. I could not even imagine what PVB would be like if it had 1,2 and 3 bedrooms units. If you wanted a studio there it would be worse than CCV is. RIV studio’s, both standard view and tower (closet) studios are in short supply at 10 months most of the year. So they designed a new resort and failed again. I feel so bad for folks who cancel less than 30 days out and points go into holding, because the chance of getting a week in a studio 60 days out appears to be very slim except for a week or two in the hot, rainy, hurricane season.

 

[DVCsloth]

There probably is some sort of legal mumbo jumbo that allows DVC to do this but I do have an issue with it being the same condo association. Now they are adding 200 studios with 11 month booking but the same amount of 1,2 and 3br. The only way I think it would be fair for current owners who bought in expecting the ratio to be one thing but now it is totally skewed would be that the new Studios need to be lees points than the Villa Studios. Seems like they changed the rules after the game started.

 

[Ruttangel]

There probably is some sort of legal mumbo jumbo that allows DVC to do this but I do have an issue with it being the same condo association. Now they are adding 200 studios with 11 month booking but the same amount of 1,2 and 3br. The only way I think it would be fair for current owners who bought in expecting the ratio to be one thing but now it is totally skewed would be that the new Studios need to be lees points than the Villa Studios. Seems like they changed the rules after the game started.

Could be that your dues are spread across more owners and people buying in based on these studios won’t have enough points for 1BR+, so it might all work in your favor

 

[havoc315]

This right here. This forum is littered with hundreds of threads/posts regarding the lack of availability of studios at 11 months and how AKL is so much more desirable due to the emphasis on studios over 1 and 2BR, as well as Poly with the almost exclusive studio offerings (setting aside the bungalows). I always feel like I'm in a very small minority when I say I can't stand studios and won't stay in anything smaller than a 1BR.

If you are to believe the posts, the goal of the majority of DVC owners is to wring the absolute maximum number of nights out their contracts, while cramming as many bodies as possible into their room. The only way to do that is by booking studios, of which there are a finite (and apparently inadequate) number. I don't see too many posts complaining that there aren't enough dedicated (or lock-off) 2BR or 3BR villas, and there's plenty of evidence that even the ones that exist currently are still available at many resorts well inside the 7 month booking window. The added irony is that those few members who have complaints about two bedrooms are critical not of their number or lack of availability, but of having a preference for dedicated 2BR units rather than lock-offs (which further reduces the possible number of studios and futher increases their demand).

If I were Disney, reading these and other forums, the message to me would be loud and clear: give us more studios. Disney can either build new resorts/buildings, or convert existing hotel rooms into studios. The conversions don't address the latter demand by owners (maximum occupancy capacity within the studio) as they likely would only sleep 4 people, but it does solve the more specific demand for more studios. It's lazy and cheap, but there is little doubt that there is a very vocal demand for more studio units.

While I don't disagree that if you're going to convert a hotel room into a studio, you'd better make sure it's actually a studio villa and not just lipstick on a pig, and I'm absolutely certain Disney isn't going all-in on studios out of the kindness of their hearts and great concern over member needs, but however we got here, the apparent "demand" for more studios is clearly being addressed.

Even a true studio is still different than a hotel room. 2 queen beds and lack of a kitchenette really just makes a bedroom. Just a place to sleep and nap.
Whereas a queen + sofa/Murphy and kitchenette somewhat transforms the area into multipurpose. A more comfortable “home.”

But yes— DVC buyers and marketing have been more interested in the “discounted hotel room” concept.

Riviera, for all its critics, was more a step towards the original concept.

But most recent steps have been towards pure Disney hotel room substitute. In some ways, this is good: older DVC had pros and cons against deluxe resorts.
The earliest DVCs weren’t park-adjacent. It was a long time before there was any DVC on the monorail. Then the first monorail DVC — BLT — had pros and cons vs The Contemporary. The studios were significantly smaller and lower quality than rooms at The Contemporary.
By the time we got to Poly— which was mostly a room conversion, the studios kept the large size of Poly rooms, but became true studios.
Now with GFV2, the transformation to hotel room equivalence is complete. Like the Poly, it’s pure room conversion — but without the trouble of turning them into true studios. Just refurnished Hotel rooms.

 

[Matty B13]

Yep, VGF 2.0 just made VGF 1.0 worse..... can't wait to see what the 11 month bookings for 1 & 2 bedrooms turns into.

 

[Nabas]

Yep, VGF 2.0 just made VGF 1.0 worse..... can't wait to see what the 11 month bookings for 1 & 2 bedrooms turns into.

I suspect it will be a while before we see much impact at VGF1.

First, it will take time for VGF2 to sell out.

Second, I think there’s a bias towards booking “my” resort for a new DVC member’s first stay.

So perhaps we’ll start to see an impact in 2023 or 2024.

 

[Airb330]

I suspect it will be a while before we see much impact at VGF1.

So perhaps we’ll start to see an impact in 2023 or 2024.

Agreed. We'll give it time, but if deluxe studios and the 1-2 bedrooms become even harder to book we'll sell. We got in at $145 so we'll be fine. I'll be really annoyed with Disney but can't be mad that we'd likely sell at a profit meaning we got so many stays from 2012-20XX on maintenance fees only.

 

[CWTC]

Could be that your dues are spread across more owners and people buying in based on these studios won’t have enough points for 1BR+, so it might all work in your favor

This has been our assumption. We always book 1 br and generally near 11 months. We assume most people are going to buy enough points to stay at studios, not 1 brs. I hope we are correct but right now we are not overly concerned about being able to book a 1 BR at VGF around month 11.

 

[Brian Noble]

Maybe this is what DVC buyers actually want, maybe they will be super popular. But it’s a long way from the original DVC concept.

This was my reaction too.

I often say that I didn't get into timeshare to stay in a glorified hotel room in the form of a studio---and these aren't even glorified.

However, I am sure they will be amazingly popular based on current booking patterns, and a non-trivial fraction of people who begrudgingly book studios now will be happy to have another option with a second real bed. I suspect that's one of the motivations behind the sofa bed->murphy bed conversions that have been happening system-wide.

Some of that popularity is because the studio/1BR splits are still unbalanced. Studios are too low and 1BRs are too high---and the booking patterns make that clear. But they've had ample opportunity to change that, and it seems clear that they aren't going to.

So, probably the right move by DVD generally, but meh.

 

[Sparky984]

Second, I think there’s a bias towards booking “my” resort for a new DVC member’s first stay.

FWIW, we bought as new members in 2020 and were told “by policy”, there is no pixie dust for a welcome home stay at VGF.

 

[havoc315]

This was my reaction too.

I often say that I didn't get into timeshare to stay in a glorified hotel room in the form of a studio---and these aren't even glorified.

However, I am sure they will be amazingly popular based on current booking patterns, and a non-trivial fraction of people who begrudgingly book studios now will be happy to have another option with a second real bed. I suspect that's one of the motivations behind the sofa bed->murphy bed conversions that have been happening system-wide.

Some of that popularity is because the studio/1BR splits are still unbalanced. Studios are too low and 1BRs are too high---and the booking patterns make that clear. But they've had ample opportunity to change that, and it seems clear that they aren't going to.

So, probably the right move by DVD generally, but meh.

I don’t think the issue is too many 1-bedrooms and too few studios: the problem is they don’t properly price the units. In most cases, 1-bedrooms are more than double the point price of a studio. At that price difference, for a room that sleeps the same number of people, it’s not surprising that many families would choose studios.

Note for cash rooms, where prices are set truer to supply and demand, 1 BRs are often priced only about 50% higher than studios. But in points, they are often priced 125% higher.

The supply/demand issue would be solved by changing the point charts.

But by perpetuating this issue even in new resorts, Disney is making the choice to promote “cheap studios.” By keeping studio point charts low, it lets them market DVC as a significant discount against hotel rooms. Let’s them sell lots of 150 point contracts, instead of a smaller number of 250-300 point contracts.