New credit card guarantees. Restaurant list, policy & common questions in 1st post

[Marshay]

Character meals are now buffet or all you care to eat.

yep and when I look at the list of restaurants, it really isn't that many we'd take our kids too, just the character meals which of course I may just end up sending my DH alone if kids are sick or something since you can't just get soup there.

BUT

the problem I foresee is that Disney will decide to apply this to ALL restaurants. I fear that this is just a test on the high-end ones and then they'll apply to everything by saying that this is what "the guests want".

 

[tarheelmjfan]

So, you're willing to go with a minor illness? I'll have to look again at the CM responses, but it seems that only major (read: requiring at least a doctor visit) illnesses will be waived. So if you come down with the blahs from a random bug around Disney, you'd likely be out at least 2 days worth of fees if you don't go. I know I'd be dragging my not feeling so well self to them, I guess it's good for others that I tend not to do buffets.
Totally agree. If I'm not feeling well, or some other life reason gets in the way, I have 0 incentive to cancel a reservation if I'm within the window. Especially with the word on the street that the policy is unlikely to be waived except for extreme illness or injury.

If I felt up to going to the parks, DTD, etc., I would go to the ADR. Only if I didn't feel up to leaving the room at all would I not show up or cancel last minute. That said, if this were all about people getting sick, I probably wouldn't be in favor of this policy. This thread is a prime example of that not being the case. People (most, not all) originally started posting the real reasons they blow off ADRs or cancel last minute. When they realized everyone wasn't buying their excuses, they switched to the sickness argument. We're not really just talking about people being sick. We're talking about people using that excuse, so they can continue cancelling last minute or not showing at all.

Actually, when I first clicked on this thread, I was just curious about the change. I didn't really have an opinion. After reading all the lame excuses for people to cancel last minute or not show, I realized why the ADR system doesn't work in many cases. I honestly didn't realize so many people made ADRs feeling no real obligation to show up. I do have sympathy with anyone who deals with illness on vacation or anytime. It's all the other excuses I have no sympathy for, & the reason I started posting on this thread. I don't blame WDW. I blame the people who cancel because, they're tired, they're hungover, they want to swim, they want to ride another ride, they're not hungry, they decided they'd rather go to a different park, the kids are cranky after they've been pushed to go all day, the weather isn't perfect, etc.

We'll see, but I don't hold much hope. Disney is not known for making good decisions lately (see Monorail clusterbadword).

They've never been known to change a policy, after it's announced. The original DDP changes, & the demise of Pleasure Island (esp. Adventurer's Club) are just two examples. If the petitions, emails, videos, etc. that WDW received over closing AC didn't get them to change their minds, I doubt anything ever will. The effort put into saving it was quite impressive.

Correct. After giving it thought the only thing we know for sure is Disney will now be getting $$$ from guests who through no fault of theirs are unable to make their ADR. The only thing we know for sure is Disney has found a new revenue source.

Those who are seriously ill or have arrival day transportation issues aren't at fault. For them, WDW seems to be making considerations. Other things, can be prevented, if a guest makes keeping the ADR a priority.

Maybe because Southwest has a reputation for putting the customer first. Maybe because Disney goal used to be offer the best experience. Southwest, like most airlines, overbooks. No reason why a restaurant can't overbook. Certainly no reason why Disney couldn't have a system to accommodate walk ups.

I would think many more people show up for the flight they have booked, than those who were showing for their ADRs at WDW. SW & WDW aren't really an accurate comparison on any level.

I've been in the kind of rain that would have caused by to skip an ADR. It was so bad CMs opened the exit doors and both Hydrolator doors so guests could rapidly re-enter the Living Seas. It's one thing to know the hydorlators don't go between floors. It's another thing to see both doors open so you can walk through.

I live in FL. I get caught in those type of storms going to the grocery store. I know they can happen. They rarely last more than 30 to 45 min. When making ADRs, you're asked to show up early. You're also given a little leeway to be late. If there's a torrential storm, they're going to realize it. I seriously doubt anyone will be charged for showing up a few minutes late, due to a torrential rain w/lightening.

Disney is now telling guests to allow 90 minutes to get to their restaurant. That's crazy. Transferring the consequences of bad transportation from Disney to the guest.

They've always told guests to allow that much travel time. Now, they're telling them to actually heed the warning or be charged a fee. It's not their fault people need to get in just one more ride, or need to spend a few extra minutes swimming or shopping.

Call most doctors with a no-show policy with an excuse and it the fee will be waived. A little harder with a doctor who blocked specific time for you such as a dentist or therapist.

Comparing the need for a doctor to charge for no-shows with a restaurant is crazy.

I didn't make any comparisons. I was simply stating she was replying to a post.

JMO but what's needed is a way to stop guests from making reservations on "spec".

And a way to get people to only book ADRs, if they're going to make keeping them a priority.

Barring not showing up, it could be take up a table, for less than $10 per person (I'll have a Sprite please... yes, just a Sprite) and being sick to boot. Good call on this one Disney!

Wonder if Disney's next 'smart' move will be to have a minimum dining charge instead of just revamping this policy to just "cancel prior" not 24-48 hrs prior?

If people start doing stuff like this, they will. The 'smart' thing to do is not push the envelope to the point they feel they need to respond. I seriously doubt they'd change the policy. They haven't been know to do that.

Like you, we'll just order soup which we enjoy but never order when we eat a regular entree. Then we'll leave. It's the servers, the restaurants and Disney that will lose b/c they could have had a table with apps, entree, dessert, drinks ... instead they got a $10 bill for 2 soups ... oh, and I still want my bread and rolls with that!

They probably wouldn't have a problem with you just ordering appetizers & drinks, if you want to take the time out of your vacation to do that. If enough people only order drinks, they'll probably respond with a policy change.

I can not find the post where the poster diminshed a record low in FL as "just a bit chilly". She claimed this was not a good reason to cancel...well what about just your average thunder/lightning storm. Do they really want guests venturing out in that weather....that doesnt seem safe!

I wasn't the one who said that, because other people's chilly is frigid to me. That said, we in FL do have to deal with thunderstorms on a daily basis. We live our lives around them. I realize everyone doesn't & could want to stay in & hide from them. WDW is in FL though, & I'd be surprised if they saw that as a reason to miss an ADR. They don't last that long. I would think they'd understand if you were a little late. Lightening is dangerous, so everyone should take caution. The good thing is it may delay you, but not interrupt a whole day.

I agree. I wouldn't call it a gloomy outlook - I'm generally an optimist by nature but all it takes is one or two illnesses when vacationing to impress that "what if" firmly on your travel planning - but I do believe that most people (uber-planners and DISers excluded) won't give much thought to this policy prior to booking, particularly with the vague wording on the Disney site that gives the impression that calling today to cancel tomorrow's dinner is fine. They'll only take issue with it if something does arise to get them penalized. It is the people who have already had "life happen" that are going to think about the problem.

I agree many probably won't give it much thought. Fortunately, it seems they will be alerting people prior to the cancellation window to remind them they need to cancel, if they're not going to the ADR. I'm bad to not read the fine print, when I book things too. If I miss something that affects us negatively, I get mad at myself. I don't blame the company, because I didn't read the info provided to me.

 

[SmallWorld71]

I agree many probably won't give it much thought. Fortunately, it seems they will be alerting people prior to the cancellation window to remind them they need to cancel, if they're not going to the ADR. I'm bad to not read the fine print, when I book things too. If I miss something that affects us negatively, I get mad at myself. I don't blame the company, because I didn't read the info provided to me.

One big question I have right now, is where is that info provided? As I said, I pretended to book an ADR to see what happened and got as far as entering my credit card info. Nowhere before you do that, does it explain what the day before actually means. There was no fine print to read so to speak. Now, what I don't know is if Disney provides you with that info. AFTER you book, since I didn't actually type in my credit card info. I'm all for reading the fine print, but so far I haven't seen any and the info. provided is very misleading on Disney's part. I will be watching and waiting to see if those who actually book are provided with clearer info. than what is currently on Disney's website.

 

[poohbear8]

I have not read all of the posts, but just made an ADR and gave my CC. My confirmation says, " Payment and Cancellation Policies
Payment or credit card guarantee is required at the time of booking.
There is a one-day cancellation policy and a $10 per-person fee will be charged if you cancel within one day of the reservation or are a "no show" for the reservation."

I called to modify the reservation and asked the CM about the cancel policy, and she told me it is 24 hours from when you are to eat is the 24 hour mark. (so, if you are eating at 10:30am on Tuesday, cancel by 10:30am on Monday) I don't know if all CM's will answer the same, but that is the answer I got when I asked.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

One big question I have right now, is where is that info provided? As I said, I pretended to book an ADR to see what happened and got as far as entering my credit card info. Nowhere before you do that, does it explain what the day before actually means. There was no fine print to read so to speak. Now, what I don't know is if Disney provides you with that info. AFTER you book, since I didn't actually type in my credit card info. I'm all for reading the fine print, but so far I haven't seen any and the info. provided is very misleading on Disney's part. I will be watching and waiting to see if those who actually book are provided with clearer info. than what is currently on Disney's website.

CandleontheWater posted that they'll be sending email reminders 3 days prior to the ADR with info on when the cancellation deadline is. It's possible those who don't book an ADR for the beginning of their trip wouldn't see the reminder though. Everyone doesn't keep up with emails on vacation. I agree that they need to be more clear with the policy, when booking. Unfortunately, it's not uncommon for one of their new policies to be as clear as mud.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

I have not read all of the posts, but just made an ADR and gave my CC. My confirmation says, " Payment and Cancellation Policies
Payment or credit card guarantee is required at the time of booking.
There is a one-day cancellation policy and a $10 per-person fee will be charged if you cancel within one day of the reservation or are a "no show" for the reservation."

I called to modify the reservation and asked the CM about the cancel policy, and she told me it is 24 hours from when you are to eat is the 24 hour mark. (so, if you are eating at 10:30am on Tuesday, cancel by 10:30am on Monday) I don't know if all CM's will answer the same, but that is the answer I got when I asked.

A true 24 hrs. would make the most sense. The other explanation is much more confusing. The website really needs to specify what their interpretation of "one-day" is.

 

[CandleontheWater]

Actually, when I first clicked on this thread, I was just curious about the change. I didn't really have an opinion. After reading all the lame excuses for people to cancel last minute or not show, I realized why the ADR system doesn't work in many cases. I honestly didn't realize so many people made ADRs feeling no real obligation to show up. I do have sympathy with anyone who deals with illness on vacation or anytime. It's all the other excuses I have no sympathy for, & the reason I started posting on this thread. I don't blame WDW. I blame the people who cancel because, they're tired, they're hungover, they want to swim, they want to ride another ride, they're not hungry, they decided they'd rather go to a different park, the kids are cranky after they've been pushed to go all day, the weather isn't perfect, etc.

You are absolutely right! The ADR system DOES NOT work.

There are policies that companies adopt that occasionally do not work. Smart companies learn from those mistakes and amend those policies. They do not attempt to shoehorn their customers into bad policies.

A valid conclusion based on a substantial number of no shows, would be that making dining reservation is incompatible with the realities of a Disney vacation.

If they are indeed having record numbers of no shows, than the problem lies with the ADR policy, not with the guests.

Instead of making the prudent choice, and amending the policy to accommodate the actual vacation habits of guests and realities of a resort vacation, they are choosing to "stay the course".

If Disney wants to ignore the realities on the ground, then that is their choice (I personally think it is a bad one), but what really gets me is that if they insist on running into the iceberg, I don't want to be charged $10 a head for lifeboat access.

Who wants to take bets on how long until the first post complaining about no-show fees! anyone, anyone!

 

[Lewisc]

They've never been known to change a policy, after it's announced. The original DDP changes, & the demise of Pleasure Island (esp. Adventurer's Club) are just two examples. If the petitions, emails, videos, etc. that WDW received over closing AC didn't get them to change their minds, I doubt anything ever will. The effort put into saving it was quite impressive.

EMH was brought back as a result of guest reaction. Disney added the deluxe dining plan and quick service dining plan as a result of guests wishes. OK also served Disney's interests Monorail service was restored for after hours "parties". The window for making ADRs has changed several times. Disney removed fast pass from some attractions.

Do I think Disney will reverse itself, in the near future? Probably not. Changing dining policy isn't the same as deciding to keep PI open. I don't think it's a fair comparison. Changing ADR procedures is done periodically. Opening an attraction after it was already closed. Not generally done.

Those who are seriously ill or have arrival day transportation issues aren't at fault. For them, WDW seems to be making considerations. Other things, can be prevented, if a guest makes keeping the ADR a priority.

How much time after landing should a guest make an ADR. People with an afternoon flight, who make a dinner ADR anyplace other then their resort, might be blamed. Serious illness. JMO but any illness which will detract from your dining experience is fine with me. Could be a simple as very bad sunburn at BB.

I would think many more people show up for the flight they have booked, than those who were showing for their ADRs at WDW. SW & WDW aren't really an accurate comparison on any level.

Yest but SW doesn't have an almost unlimited number of standby passengers waiting for the flight. Existing penalties at restaurants like the Lua and CRT took care of those restaurants that are less likely to have significant number of walk up diners.

I live in FL. I get caught in those type of storms going to the grocery store. I know they can happen. They rarely last more than 30 to 45 min. When making ADRs, you're asked to show up early. You're also given a little leeway to be late. If there's a torrential storm, they're going to realize it. I seriously doubt anyone will be charged for showing up a few minutes late, due to a torrential rain w/lightening.

Then you should understand why some families would rather go to their resort and get dry clothing and dry shoes rather then go to a restaurant. Some families with young, hungry kids, may need to eat something (quick service) rather then calling and asking to move their ADR 2 hours or more. Wait for storm to pass. Go to resort. Change. Go to restaurant. Allow 1.5 hours from your resort to your restaurant. Advancing your dinner time by 3 hours might not work for a family, even if allowed by Disney.

A true 24 hrs. would make the most sense. The other explanation is much more confusing. The website really needs to specify what their interpretation of "one-day" is.

Having the computer system deny the request because you missed your 24 hours by 10 minutes will result in "issues"

Despite what some people think this change was made to benefit Disney. It's in Disney's interest, under this policy, to have a full calendar day to rebook the ADR. A person cancels their 1p lunch reservation at 12:59 the previous day. Disney doesn't have a full calendar day to rebook the ADR. Assume Disney wants an accurate head count by the end of the day. Disney only has 5 hours.

My opinion. Disney should be able to come up with a system to use walk ups to fill empty tables. Accept cancellations 1-3 hours in advance

BUT

Disney prefers to have a system which gives it more then enough time to rebook the ADRs the day before. A guest wakes up in the morning. All the cancelled ADRs for the following day will be available to book. Do we want a system which suggests we use a web enabled cell phone (or keep calling dining) to see what's available tomorrow?

 

[mcd2745]

You are absolutely right! The ADR system DOES NOT work.

There are policies that companies adopt that occasionally do not work. Smart companies learn from those mistakes and amend those policies. They do not attempt to shoehorn their customers into bad policies.

A valid conclusion based on a substantial number of no shows, would be that making dining reservation is incompatible with the realities of a Disney vacation.

If they are indeed having record numbers of no shows, than the problem lies with the ADR policy, not with the guests.

Instead of making the prudent choice, and amending the policy to accommodate the actual vacation habits of guests and realities of a resort vacation, they are choosing to "stay the course".

If Disney wants to ignore the realities on the ground, then that is their choice (I personally think it is a bad one), but what really gets me is that if they insist on running into the iceberg, I don't want to be charged $10 a head for lifeboat access.

Who wants to take bets on how long until the first post complaining about no-show fees! anyone, anyone!

I thought we had 72 pages of that already!


Anyway, I agree the overall ADR system as currently constructed is far from ideal. I always go back to the 180 days as problem #1 (2, 3, and 4). While I don't have a problem with the new policy, it isn't exactly how I would have tackled the no-show problem - which I don't think anyone can deny is a huge problem for Disney. And I completely agree that they need to much clearer with how the policy works.

 

[twinklebug]

I'm positive Disney will also erroneously charge a few folk who do show up or who cancel within proper time.

That will spur a number of complaints too.

 

[Lewisc]

Anyway, I agree the overall ADR system as currently constructed is far from ideal. I always go back to the 180 days as problem #1 (2, 3, and 4). While I don't have a problem with the new policy, it isn't exactly how I would have tackled the no-show problem - which I don't think anyone can deny is a huge problem for Disney. And I completely agree that they need to much clearer with how the policy works.

We have no idea if no shows is a huge problem. It's only a huge problem if Disney can't predict the number of "no shows" so they can overbook OR if Disney is unable to fill the tables with walk ups.

I wonder how many of the no shows booked at 180 days and never even made it to WDW. I wonder how many of the no shows booked multiple reservations for the same meal. More meals in a day then they would ever keep.

We have no idea how many of the no-shows are because the guest has a reason (without debating if you consider the reason legit) and how many no shows are because the guest can't be in two places at once and/or won't be eating 3 TS meals every day.

One poster suggested opening up ADRs at 45 days (paid in full date for packages). Makes some sense. I'd limit the 180 (90 makes more sense to me) day window for ADRS to guests staying at a WDW resort. Link it to their reservation number. Limit the number of ADRs to meals person is likely to keep. One, maybe 2 per day. Allow 3 if a guest has Dlx Dining or is staying in a deluxe.

Other guests 30 days. Hold back some tables for walk ups.

 

[SmallWorld71]

CandleontheWater posted that they'll be sending email reminders 3 days prior to the ADR with info on when the cancellation deadline is. It's possible those who don't book an ADR for the beginning of their trip wouldn't see the reminder though. Everyone doesn't keep up with emails on vacation. I agree that they need to be more clear with the policy, when booking. Unfortunately, it's not uncommon for one of their new policies to be as clear as mud.

LOL I agree. I am one of those people who don't check e-mails on vacation, but I'm not worried about that as I am one of those who has their ADRs neatly printed out in triplicate. I am also unlikely to cancel an ADR as I seldom change my mind. But, like many of us obsessive DISers, I like to have my ducks in a row, and I wish they would just be clear and consistent for a change. We've had 3 DISers on this thread get 3 different answers about what a day before means.

 

[waynesgirl]

This is a highly-charged subject, even more than the FP threads. I am also very surprised at the tones of some of the comments. As a mom, a career woman whose job it is to make money for my ownership, and a foodie, I see it from all sides of the pyramid.

Of course, there are those who plan to get the most out of your vacation. I applaud you. There are those who wing it. There are those, like me, who get a few ADRs of places we know we want and we pretty much just go on about our merry way.

What I find upsetting is that everyone has their own style but nobody even remotely knows what is behind the thought process for making these changes. Only the Disney higher-ups do and it strikes me that they ain't telling the little people, AKA, us. We are all snapping at one another on a thread about the changes...

I really don't have an issue with the new policy. If I try to get a res and I can't, oh well. I don't eat there. I have cancelled resies before, usually about a day out, if I just am not feeling it anymore. But I DO cancel. It is rude to not show or to cancel, especially at the places at which it is so hard to get reservations.

I have to say, quite frankly, I have more to gain from this policy than a lot. My DH and I, and my kids, like to stroll and when we get hungry, eat. I like to walk up to get seated or make a last-minute reservation. This will make it easier on me- I am a BIG planner on vacation, except for Disney. I like to let my kids choose and have fun and being spontaneous is a lot more fun than getting FPs and ADRs and timing the bus service and getting in line for a parade and all that stuff. When it is me and DH, same thing. "Whatcha feeling tonight honey?" "I don't know. Biergarten?" "Ok."

Disney is trying to please most. It might not be you or me but most.

I hope that it is resolved to everyone's compatability soon.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

You are absolutely right! The ADR system DOES NOT work.

There are policies that companies adopt that occasionally do not work. Smart companies learn from those mistakes and amend those policies. They do not attempt to shoehorn their customers into bad policies.

A valid conclusion based on a substantial number of no shows, would be that making dining reservation is incompatible with the realities of a Disney vacation.

If they are indeed having record numbers of no shows, than the problem lies with the ADR policy, not with the guests.

Instead of making the prudent choice, and amending the policy to accommodate the actual vacation habits of guests and realities of a resort vacation, they are choosing to "stay the course".

If Disney wants to ignore the realities on the ground, then that is their choice (I personally think it is a bad one), but what really gets me is that if they insist on running into the iceberg, I don't want to be charged $10 a head for lifeboat access.

Who wants to take bets on how long until the first post complaining about no-show fees! anyone, anyone!

Well, we both agree that the system doesn't work we just don't agree on the reason. Too many people make ADRs they don't feel obligated to keep. It's too easy to click a key on a computer or make a call, if there's no monetary repercussions involved. They had to do something to make people take them more seriously. It's better for the entire system for those who want spontaneity to not make ADRs. No one is forced to do so. I can't believe anyone blames a restaurant for expecting them to show up for a date & time they committed too. Whose fault is it really? It's called personal responsibility.

Of course, people will complain about the fee. People seldom want to accept the blame falls on their shoulders. It's easier to blame someone else.

EMH was brought back as a result of guest reaction. Disney added the deluxe dining plan and quick service dining plan as a result of guests wishes. OK also served Disney's interests Monorail service was restored for after hours "parties". The window for making ADRs has changed several times. Disney removed fast pass from some attractions.

Do I think Disney will reverse itself, in the near future? Probably not. Changing dining policy isn't the same as deciding to keep PI open. I don't think it's a fair comparison. Changing ADR procedures is done periodically. Opening an attraction after it was already closed. Not generally done.
How much time after landing should a guest make an ADR. People with an afternoon flight, who make a dinner ADR anyplace other then their resort, might be blamed. Serious illness. JMO but any illness which will detract from your dining experience is fine with me. Could be a simple as very bad sunburn at BB.

You're right. They have reversed some changes in the past. They seem to be doing that less & less these day. FWIW, Adventurer's Club was still open, when people were petitioning WDW to keep it open. They chose to close it & leave the building empty, rather than keep it open for guests enjoyment.

As has been mentioned previously, it has always been recommended that people not make ADRs on arrival day. If guests choose to do so, they have to realize they're taking a chance. Now, no one could be expected to anticipate a flight being cancelled & rescheduled for the next day. In that case, they couldn't possibly be to blame.

Can we really hold Disney responsible for us getting a sunburn?

Yes but SW doesn't have an almost unlimited number of standby passengers waiting for the flight. Existing penalties at restaurants like the Lua and CRT took care of those restaurants that are less likely to have significant number of walk up diners.

Yet another reason SW can't be compared to WDW. They're two totally different businesses.

CRT always had a lot of walk ups attempting to get in.

Then you should understand why some families would rather go to their resort and get dry clothing and dry shoes rather then go to a restaurant. Some families with young, hungry kids, may need to eat something (quick service) rather then calling and asking to move their ADR 2 hours or more. Wait for storm to pass. Go to resort. Change. Go to restaurant. Allow 1.5 hours from your resort to your restaurant. Advancing your dinner time by 3 hours might not work for a family, even if allowed by Disney.

I understand that we don't let the storms interfere with our life. Do you think we run home to change clothes every time we get rained on? This is FL. If you make a reservation of any type, you have to accept the fact that you may have to deal with rain. Families such as you described would be better off trying for a last minute ADR, when they're ready to eat. It's totally understandable if some people don't want to get out in the rain, cold, etc. That's certainly their prerogative. They just shouldn't make ADRs. To me, it's that simple. If you make ADRs, show up (no excuses). If you're not willing to do that, don't make them. No one is forced to, so how can they really complain? If one family can get out in the elements, they all could.

Having the computer system deny the request because you missed your 24 hours by 10 minutes will result in "issues"

Despite what some people think this change was made to benefit Disney. It's in Disney's interest, under this policy, to have a full calendar day to rebook the ADR. A person cancels their 1p lunch reservation at 12:59 the previous day. Disney doesn't have a full calendar day to rebook the ADR. Assume Disney wants an accurate head count by the end of the day. Disney only has 5 hours.

Any system will cause issues, with some people looking to get out of a commitment. There's no excuse for being 10 minutes late to cancel. If you know then, you knew 10 minutes earlier.

I doubt anyone thinks Disney is introducing a policy that doesn't benefit them. Some of us think it will also benefit a lot of guests. I'm totally fine with them benefiting, as long as guests are also benefiting.

My opinion. Disney should be able to come up with a system to use walk ups to fill empty tables. Accept cancellations 1-3 hours in advance

We've discussed this many times. That doesn't help at all with those calling early in the morning for same day ADRs. It also wouldn't make people think twice, before booking so many ADRs, just in case they want to go.

Disney prefers to have a system which gives it more then enough time to rebook the ADRs the day before. A guest wakes up in the morning. All the cancelled ADRs for the following day will be available to book. Do we want a system which suggests we use a web enabled cell phone (or keep calling dining) to see what's available tomorrow?

Those who are hoping to get into a restaurant that had no availability leading up to their trips absolutely want a system that gives them a chance to book that restaurant that morning.

This is a highly-charged subject, even more than the FP threads. I am also very surprised at the tones of some of the comments. As a mom, a career woman whose job it is to make money for my ownership, and a foodie, I see it from all sides of the pyramid.

Of course, there are those who plan to get the most out of your vacation. I applaud you. There are those who wing it. There are those, like me, who get a few ADRs of places we know we want and we pretty much just go on about our merry way.

What I find upsetting is that everyone has their own style but nobody even remotely knows what is behind the thought process for making these changes. Only the Disney higher-ups do and it strikes me that they ain't telling the little people, AKA, us. We are all snapping at one another on a thread about the changes...

I really don't have an issue with the new policy. If I try to get a res and I can't, oh well. I don't eat there. I have cancelled resies before, usually about a day out, if I just am not feeling it anymore. But I DO cancel. It is rude to not show or to cancel, especially at the places at which it is so hard to get reservations.

I have to say, quite frankly, I have more to gain from this policy than a lot. My DH and I, and my kids, like to stroll and when we get hungry, eat. I like to walk up to get seated or make a last-minute reservation. This will make it easier on me- I am a BIG planner on vacation, except for Disney. I like to let my kids choose and have fun and being spontaneous is a lot more fun than getting FPs and ADRs and timing the bus service and getting in line for a parade and all that stuff. When it is me and DH, same thing. "Whatcha feeling tonight honey?" "I don't know. Biergarten?" "Ok."

Disney is trying to please most. It might not be you or me but most.

I hope that it is resolved to everyone's compatability soon.

If all families were like yours & realized a spontaneous vacation & a lot of ADRs aren't compatible, we wouldn't be having this discussion. I commend you for knowing your family's vacation style & planning appropriately to meet your needs.

 

[SLJ6974]

I do think that this is a money making scheme on Disneys part. If ot were not they would allow for a much shorter cancellation time.

 

[Cafeen]

If I felt up to going to the parks, DTD, etc., I would go to the ADR. Only if I didn't feel up to leaving the room at all would I not show up or cancel last minute. That said, if this were all about people getting sick, I probably wouldn't be in favor of this policy. This thread is a prime example of that not being the case. People (most, not all) originally started posting the real reasons they blow off ADRs or cancel last minute. When they realized everyone wasn't buying their excuses, they switched to the sickness argument. We're not really just talking about people being sick. We're talking about people using that excuse, so they can continue cancelling last minute or not showing at all.

The use of the "sick excuse" is because it's one of the more obvious ones. And the one that will actually negatively affect others at the restaurant.

Not feeling up to it is just as valid an excuse, as is not knowing how your family will react to their first or second trip. Of course, since no one's dead, we best be darn sure to get to that ADR! (In the eyes of Disney and others).

You, yourself, have stated that you don't know what you want tonight, much less 180 days out. Since the system is geared toward the 180 days out, is it really a surprise when someone ends up not hungry enough for a 3 course meal?

The major illness is one thing, and likely a fee-waiving experience, minor illnesses, not so much. If I have the sniffles and my appetite is shot, I'll have to suck it up and go, or waste the money. I may not be sick enough to skip the parks, but may not be feeling up to a 90 minute meal.

It's the extreme black and white that sours me on the policy. And it, coupled with several other decisions lately, is turning me off of going for as long or spending as much. It is what it is. It's not a threat or anything, I just don't feel like putting forth the effort if I'm going to be treated like someone cheating the system if I happen to lose my appetite for a day.

And besides, it's not going to hit me that hard. I travel solo, at most I'm out $10. I'll even go when I'm sick with the sniffles and don't feel like it. It's just yet another company first decision without any guest relations thought that turns me off.

Actually, when I first clicked on this thread, I was just curious about the change. I didn't really have an opinion. After reading all the lame excuses for people to cancel last minute or not show, I realized why the ADR system doesn't work in many cases. I honestly didn't realize so many people made ADRs feeling no real obligation to show up. I do have sympathy with anyone who deals with illness on vacation or anytime. It's all the other excuses I have no sympathy for, & the reason I started posting on this thread. I don't blame WDW. I blame the people who cancel because, they're tired, they're hungover, they want to swim, they want to ride another ride, they're not hungry, they decided they'd rather go to a different park, the kids are cranky after they've been pushed to go all day, the weather isn't perfect, etc.

And I guess this is a big part of the divide. Other than the ride and park ones, these are ALL valid excuses in my book. Most of those who travel to Disney have no idea how their family will react once they get there. Only those that go very often do. The newbie who won't know how their children will react is going to get charged, while the hoarder who cancels in time, blocking many people who were planning ahead from getting ADRs (which, they have now replaced) will be completely unscathed.

It's a policy which misses its target and hits the school next door. None of the targetted people get hit, just all collateral damage.

They've never been known to change a policy, after it's announced. The original DDP changes, & the demise of Pleasure Island (esp. Adventurer's Club) are just two examples. If the petitions, emails, videos, etc. that WDW received over closing AC didn't get them to change their minds, I doubt anything ever will. The effort put into saving it was quite impressive.

Those are more examples of letting the bean counters have control. Though, I will admit that the original DDP was likely too good of a deal, it's now swinging too far the other way, and these policies go with it. Heck, I count "Avatarland" in with those poor money-grubbing decisions.

Those who are seriously ill or have arrival day transportation issues aren't at fault. For them, WDW seems to be making considerations. Other things, can be prevented, if a guest makes keeping the ADR a priority.

If Disney can make keeping my ADR time a priority, maybe I'll consider making keeping the ADR a priority . It's a two-way street, at least it should be. Lately it's not seeming that way.

CandleontheWater posted that they'll be sending email reminders 3 days prior to the ADR with info on when the cancellation deadline is. It's possible those who don't book an ADR for the beginning of their trip wouldn't see the reminder though. Everyone doesn't keep up with emails on vacation. I agree that they need to be more clear with the policy, when booking. Unfortunately, it's not uncommon for one of their new policies to be as clear as mud.

The email thing is good, for the couple days before the trip. Once there, internet access is costly and can be difficult if you don't bring your own computer. (Even with free wifi, without bringing your own laptop, you have to spend ~$10 for 30 minutes, and then only at a few resorts with business centers).

If they would call you, or call the room those same 3 days ahead of time, that may be an improvement.

This is a highly-charged subject, even more than the FP threads. I am also very surprised at the tones of some of the comments. As a mom, a career woman whose job it is to make money for my ownership, and a foodie, I see it from all sides of the pyramid.

Of course, there are those who plan to get the most out of your vacation. I applaud you. There are those who wing it. There are those, like me, who get a few ADRs of places we know we want and we pretty much just go on about our merry way.

What I find upsetting is that everyone has their own style but nobody even remotely knows what is behind the thought process for making these changes. Only the Disney higher-ups do and it strikes me that they ain't telling the little people, AKA, us. We are all snapping at one another on a thread about the changes...

I have no issue with those with other styles than me. I have an issue when I'm told that my style is wrong. Same deal with the FP debate. Basically, same deal with everything .

I have to say, quite frankly, I have more to gain from this policy than a lot. My DH and I, and my kids, like to stroll and when we get hungry, eat. I like to walk up to get seated or make a last-minute reservation. This will make it easier on me- I am a BIG planner on vacation, except for Disney. I like to let my kids choose and have fun and being spontaneous is a lot more fun than getting FPs and ADRs and timing the bus service and getting in line for a parade and all that stuff. When it is me and DH, same thing. "Whatcha feeling tonight honey?" "I don't know. Biergarten?" "Ok."

Disney is trying to please most. It might not be you or me but most.

I hope that it is resolved to everyone's compatability soon.

This is yet to be seen though. If they're going to be reducing the no shows with this, it will be harder to get walk-ins and potentially harder to get last minute ADRs.

This result is yet to be seen though, and likely won't happen until at least April or May when all the ADRs booked (at the character meals and signatures) are under this policy.

For now, we can only speculate and relate it to our own personal trends.

 

[ConnieB]

This had occured to me as well. I have NEVER double booked -I know what I want! LOL But, I am now in charge of a trip for next summer that includes 6 definites and 8 probably's. It seems like my best course of action will be to double book - have ADR's for the whole group and then those for just the 6 in case the rest of the group isn't able to come. We will know for sure a few months out, but not 180 days.

I think people are overly optimistic that the restaurant will be able to just pull together a couple of tables and magically make their party of 4 and party of 3 into a table of 7.....or perhaps even more difficult, a party of 8 and a party of 6 into a single party of 14?

I'm going to gently say that this is probably thought "easy" by those who have never worked in a restaurant. Most of Disney's tables are what are referred to as a 4 topper....meaning that it seats 4 people. Yes, they have a handful of 2 toppers and 6 or 8, but the VAST majority are 4s. What happens is that the CM in charge of seating knows that she's going to need a table of 8 in about half an hour....she starts planning that this 4 topper and that 4 topper are near each other and were seated about the same time (ever notice that they call you up and then tap tap tap something into the computer....it's putting in the table number where they're sending you, plus the number in the party, plus the time). So if they think they have a party of 8 and a separate party of 6, they're planning accordingly.....suddenly needing a table for 14.....ummmm, that takes a lot of coordination ahead of time. It's not like they can drag this table from the corner over to the other corner and that table from the middle to both of those (and THAT is only 12 seats by the way, lol). There isn't room to move tables from different areas of the room together. In fact, for really large parties like 14, you'll usually see those tables sitting together empty for a large amount of time because they were planning ahead. Ever wonder why almost ALL restaurants charge a forced gratuity for parties larger than X (usually it's 6, some restaurants it's 8). There are many reasons, including being sure that the fact that that large of a party will require more work by extra staff so that they're all served hot food at the same time, but also because most restaurants have to hold those tables extra long so they are available.

That is also part of the reason why it's sometimes easier to get a table for 3 even if you only need 2 seats....because there are a limited number of 2 toppers but all of those 4 toppers will accomodate the party of 3. It's probably also the reason Disney wants to charge for individual people not showing up.....if your party of 2 is taking up a 4 topper that's 2 meals that Disney isn't selling.

For those that say no-shows aren't a problem because someone will come along walkup and take it at the popular places.....that's also not taking into consideration turn over time. While your ADR isn't a guaranteed seating time, the fact is that they need to be sure they have tables available soon for those that have ADRs....so they typically will tell you they hold the table 15 minutes (not sure Disney's time rules, so please understand I'm talking the traditional restaurant policy here)....and in reality they will likely hold it for 20-30 minutes. Since a typical table turn over is 50-60 minutes, depending on the type of restaurant of course (again, NOT using Disney numbers, but traditional restaurant)....that means that now that they've waited those 20 minutes for you, they go ahead and seat another party, now they're 1 hour 20 minutes into turnover......still doesn't seem much for just YOUR party not showing up....but multiply that by just 1 no-show an hour and you have lost about 4 to 6 ENTIRE tables worth of meals in a day. That's a lot of revenue lost for the restaurant, a lot of perishables bought that don't get used but may not be as fresh the next day (a BIG deal for Signatures that pride themselves on fresh), and let's not forget the poor server who is paid about $3 an hour PLUS TIPS....they just lost 4-6 tables worth of tips in a shift. Saying $100 per 4 topper is probably a low estimate at a typical Disney TS, but that could be $15-$20 x 6 tables or $120 a night lost by the servers. But remember too, my example was only 1 no show an hour and includes a walkup actually there ready to take the table. I believe the noshows are much higher and the walkups not always there.

No shows are an industry wide problem and why many restaurants no longer take reservations, and the good ones don't need them, because they'll have a line out the door on a Friday night.

That would be Disney's other end of the sphere....no reservations....get in line, no fast pass, and no pretty que line to keep you occupied. Talk about your cranky little ones, forget them, I'll be cranky if I have to stand in line for an hour or two just to be seated for dinner. We eat off times just to avoid even a small line or wait to find a table CS.

 

[Colleen27]

Those who are seriously ill or have arrival day transportation issues aren't at fault. For them, WDW seems to be making considerations. Other things, can be prevented, if a guest makes keeping the ADR a priority.

But defining "seriously ill" is a big issue. We're not a family that runs to the doctor at the first sign of fever or vomiting at home and for the most part we are healthy overall, so we're extremely unlikely to have a medically-verifiable illness at Disney. But if I've got a kid throwing up in my resort room, I'm going to be mad as a hornet at being told that's a minor illness and not good enough reason to skip dinner. I wonder if they'd consider housekeeping as verification enough? Our poor housekeeper got quite a workout (and an extra-good tip) on our trip of the creeping crud.

 

[waynesgirl]

If Disney can make keeping my ADR time a priority, maybe I'll consider making keeping the ADR a priority . It's a two-way street, at least it should be. Lately it's not seeming that way.


This result is yet to be seen though, and likely won't happen until at least April or May when all the ADRs booked (at the character meals and signatures) are under this policy.

For now, we can only speculate and relate it to our own personal trends.

I do agree with you as far as that goes...I don't mind a few minutes, but if I had to wait more than 10 minutes or so with an ADR, I would be upset. I must say...I have never had to wait for my ADR so I can't really determine how upset I would be. I have been told several times there is no availability but many times, even in peak times, I have been seated due to a no-show.

If all families were like yours & realized a spontaneous vacation & a lot of ADRs aren't compatible, we wouldn't be having this discussion. I commend you for knowing your family's vacation style & planning appropriately to meet your needs.

Thank you...I wish I could plan it down to the wire but I can't do it. I tried the first few vacations and it doesn't work. I get too stressed, they get irritable (when they are normally fabulous kids, at least at the parks), I tend to get migraines in stressful situations and I never have my medicine at Disney, so it is no big deal. I hate to say it but I seen a lot of my parent friends try to stuff so much into a vacation that it is overload for the kids. I learned, after all the kids and vacations we have had, that if they are happy and stress-free, then my vacation will be better. I might not get the meal I want, or to ride all the rides I want, but my kids are happy. They tend to enjoy riding the rides and eating at CS anyway. No character dinners for us, which probably makes it easier in the long run as well.

I'm going to gently say that this is probably thought "easy" by those who have never worked in a restaurant.

I worked in restaurants. I have been in customer service for years as far as rental cars and hotels as well. It is not easy in any business but hospitality in general tends to be harder than other things, IMHO. People do not understand that things don't always happen the way the workers want them to either.
The dream is to have all tables full, all the time (at a casual TS restaurant), with a minimum of 3.5 turnovers in a 6 hour period. Not at WDW. That ain't happening, at least I don't think it is.

 

[tarheelmjfan]

The use of the "sick excuse" is because it's one of the more obvious ones. And the one that will actually negatively affect others at the restaurant.

It is the most obvious. It doesn't seem to be the most prevalent though. Most people who are now complaining that they may get sick were giving other reasons for canceling last minute or not showing at all earlier in the thread. I just find that humorous & transparent.

Not feeling up to it is just as valid an excuse, as is not knowing how your family will react to their first or second trip. Of course, since no one's dead, we best be darn sure to get to that ADR! (In the eyes of Disney and others).

I'd be surprised, if too many first timers make that many ADRs. Those who do probably frequent a message board & should have an idea what to expect. I seriously doubt first timers are the problem.

You, yourself, have stated that you don't know what you want tonight, much less 180 days out. Since the system is geared toward the 180 days out, is it really a surprise when someone ends up not hungry enough for a 3 course meal?

I don't remember saying that, but I have been known to forget things. It's not at all surprising that someone can't eat 3 large meals a day, or eat a 3 course meal, after having a big breakfast, then snacking all day leading up to dinner. One can only consume so much food. Since I know I can't eat that much food, I plan to eat 2 meals a day & don't snack before dinner. It sounds like some people are making more ADRs than they will be hungry for. That's easily remedied.

The major illness is one thing, and likely a fee-waiving experience, minor illnesses, not so much. If I have the sniffles and my appetite is shot, I'll have to suck it up and go, or waste the money. I may not be sick enough to skip the parks, but may not be feeling up to a 90 minute meal.

I always thought it was easier to sit than walk around. How could I possibly walk around the parks all day, if I wasn't up to sitting for a meal? If I'm not that hungry, due to feeling bad, I have to eat something anyway. That could be soup & a drink, but I will have to eat that day.

And I guess this is a big part of the divide. Other than the ride and park ones, these are ALL valid excuses in my book. Most of those who travel to Disney have no idea how their family will react once they get there. Only those that go very often do. The newbie who won't know how their children will react is going to get charged, while the hoarder who cancels in time, blocking many people who were planning ahead from getting ADRs (which, they have now replaced) will be completely unscathed.

It's a policy which misses its target and hits the school next door. None of the targetted people get hit, just all collateral damage.

As I've said before, all that really matters is what WDW thinks is a valid excuse. If it were my business, I wouldn't see them as valid either.

To me, this isn't just about hoarders. It's about everyone who blows off an ADR. I think it hits the target dead on. People just don't want to admit they're part of the problem & are being targeted.

If Disney can make keeping my ADR time a priority, maybe I'll consider making keeping the ADR a priority. It's a two-way street, at least it should be. Lately it's not seeming that way.

That's the thing. It doesn't have to be a two way street. Too many people felt it wasn't a priority now Disney is saying that way of thinking doesn't work for them. It's their business. Either a guest goes or they don't. I learned to accept this a long time ago.

The email thing is good, for the couple days before the trip. Once there, internet access is costly and can be difficult if you don't bring your own computer. (Even with free wifi, without bringing your own laptop, you have to spend ~$10 for 30 minutes, and then only at a few resorts with business centers).

All you need is one email, then you know the policy. There's no need for multiple emails. Surely, people know what ADRs they've made. Otherwise, why did they bother making them? They wouldn't be showing up for any of them. In that case, they would deserve to be assessed the fee on every ADR. As I said before, those who don't book an ADR for the beginning of their trip would be affected. They need a better explanation of their interpretation of "one day" on the website.

For those that say no-shows aren't a problem because someone will come along walkup and take it at the popular places.....that's also not taking into consideration turn over time. While your ADR isn't a guaranteed seating time, the fact is that they need to be sure they have tables available soon for those that have ADRs....so they typically will tell you they hold the table 15 minutes (not sure Disney's time rules, so please understand I'm talking the traditional restaurant policy here)....and in reality they will likely hold it for 20-30 minutes. Since a typical table turn over is 50-60 minutes, depending on the type of restaurant of course (again, NOT using Disney numbers, but traditional restaurant)....that means that now that they've waited those 20 minutes for you, they go ahead and seat another party, now they're 1 hour 20 minutes into turnover......still doesn't seem much for just YOUR party not showing up....but multiply that by just 1 no-show an hour and you have lost about 4 to 6 ENTIRE meals in a day. That's a lot of revenue lost for the restaurant, a lot of perishables bought that don't get used but may not be as fresh the next day (a BIG deal for Signatures that pride themselves on fresh), and let's not forget the poor server who is paid about $3 an hour PLUS TIPS....they just lost 4-6 tables worth of tips in a shift. I this saying that $100 per 4 topper is probably a low estimate at a typical Disney TS, that could be $15-$20 x 6 tables or $120 a night lost by the servers. But remember too, my example was only 1 no show an hour and includes a walkup actually there ready to take the table. I believe the noshows are much higher and the walkups not always there.

This seems fairly obvious to me too. I don't understand why it's so hard for some people to understand.

No shows are an industry wide problem and why many restaurants no longer take reservations, and the good ones don't need them, because they'll have a line out the door on a Friday night.

That would be Disney's other end of the sphere....no reservations....get in line, no fast pass, and no pretty que line to keep you occupied. Talk about your cranky little ones, forget them, I'll be cranky if I have to stand in line for an hour or two just to be seated for dinner. We eat off times just to avoid even a small line or wait to find a table CS.

I'm with you! I don't like to eat out at home w/o reservations. The last thing I want to do on vacation is spend an hour + waiting to get into a restaurant. If we had to do that, we'd definitely be looking off property for a place to eat that took reservations.