New Computer advice

[mikegood2]

I've definitely come across enough articles about photoshop (5 & 6) running quicker on a PC that it sounds like their is something to it, but being a mac user I've never tried ps on a PC to compare. If this is the case, I think it's more of an Adobe issue than a mac issue. Ever since Apple and Adobe had there battles over flash it seems like Adobe has focused much more on the PC than the Mac. It very well could just be because they sell more PC versions of there software than Mac versions, but I think there is more too it than that!

At work I'm currently running CS5 and am happy enough with the speed on my 27" iMac. Other than a number of nice features I'm not in any hurry to upgrade to CS6. I know my boss has had enough problems with photoshop 6 that he has considered going back to 5. I probably catch him swearing about once a week because he closes the grey application frame, dismisses the save pop up window and losses progress on whatever other files he had open. BTW he didn't know how to turn off until this week, so he is happier with it now.

Speaking about CS6 does anyone else think the interface changes make the suite look and feel more like a windows app than a Mac app?

 

[photo_chick]

I agree with you. I use photoshop CS6 on my 2007 iMac with 16gb RAM and it is faster than my windows 7 machine with 16gb ram.

My iMac is going on 6 years old and it is still an excellent machine. I can't tell you how many times I have had PC's during this same time period. They just don't seem to last as long as iMacs do. They might cost a bit more, but you get what you pay for, IMO anyway.

Don't expect that iMac to last forever. The hardware will keep on going but Apple will force you to upgrade eventually. At some point your iMac will be unable to install an OS upgrade and then within a few months you will not be able to run any Apple software. They'll put out updates and your older OS will not be able to use them. At least with Windows you have more time when that happens, I can still use my 15 year old PII with XP on there for streaming music. But Apple just cuts you off in order to force you to upgrade. I've got Mac's here going back to the Performas. Even have a Power Computing Mac in the closet. My favorite is the G4 iMac paperweight that can't even use iTunes or surf the web anymore. But it sure does look cool with it's half sphere shape.

Don't get me wrong, I like my 27" iMac. It's a good computer. But it's not all that and a bag of chips. If my husband hadn't needed it for iPhone/iPad stuff we wouldn't have gotten it.

 

[clarkshel]

Don't expect that iMac to last forever. The hardware will keep on going but Apple will force you to upgrade eventually. At some point your iMac will be unable to install an OS upgrade and then within a few months you will not be able to run any Apple software. They'll put out updates and your older OS will not be able to use them. At least with Windows you have more time when that happens, I can still use my 15 year old PII with XP on there for streaming music. But Apple just cuts you off in order to force you to upgrade. I've got Mac's here going back to the Performas. Even have a Power Computing Mac in the closet. My favorite is the G4 iMac paperweight that can't even use iTunes or surf the web anymore. But it sure does look cool with it's half sphere shape.

Don't get me wrong, I like my 27" iMac. It's a good computer. But it's not all that and a bag of chips. If my husband hadn't needed it for iPhone/iPad stuff we wouldn't have gotten it.

Well iMacs last a LOT longer than PC's do. Well my iMac is 6 years old and I was able to pay a very small fee to upgrade to the latest version of OSX, I think like $29. MS would never sell a new OS version that cheap. Apple never makes your iMac unusable. If it is too old, then you might now be able to upgrade it and it might not be powerful enough o run the latest software versions. But there is NO reason you can't continue to use the software you currently have installed on your iMac. Regardless if apple upgrades it or not.

My wife has an old MacBook clamshell from like 2000. It still works and she is still able to use the current software on it. She can't upgrade or install new software on it, but that makes sense because it is so old and outdated. I hate to break it to you, but the computing technology evolves quick. IMO, if people want the latest upgrades to heir systems (OSX or windows) then they should shell out the money to upgrade their OS's and computers at least every 8 to 10 years. If they don't want to do that, then they shouldn't complain that their machines can't run the latest software or get the latest updates.

 

[photo_chick]

Well iMacs last a LOT longer than PC's do. Well my iMac is 6 years old and I was able to pay a very small fee to upgrade to the latest version of OSX, I think like $29. MS would never sell a new OS version that cheap. Apple never makes your iMac unusable. If it is too old, then you might now be able to upgrade it and it might not be powerful enough o run the latest software versions. But there is NO reason you can't continue to use the software you currently have installed on your iMac. Regardless if apple upgrades it or not.

My wife has an old MacBook clamshell from like 2000. It still works and she is still able to use the current software on it. She can't upgrade or install new software on it, but that makes sense because it is so old and outdated. I hate to break it to you, but the computing technology evolves quick. IMO, if people want the latest upgrades to heir systems (OSX or windows) then they should shell out the money to upgrade their OS's and computers at least every 8 to 10 years. If they don't want to do that, then they shouldn't complain that their machines can't run the latest software or get the latest updates.

I buy or build new a new computer probably every 2 years, if not sooner. And Apple will force you to upgrade much sooner than every 8-10 years if you want that machine to stay useful for anything.

I'm not talking about not upgrading at all. I'm talking about a computer still having some kind of useful purpose after it's no longer current. The fact is a pre-intel Mac is a paperweight. It can't even stream music from another computer because you can't update the software. A Windows machine from the same era does not have the same problems.

And I'm going to disagree that any Mac will last longer than a Windows machine. You get a comparable quality build and they'll both last about the same time. The problem is that people start comparing Macs to cheap, low end Windows machines. And that's not comparing like to like.

 

[mikegood2]

And I'm going to disagree that any Mac will last longer than a Windows machine. You get a comparable quality build and they'll both last about the same time. The problem is that people start comparing Macs to cheap, low end Windows machines. And that's not comparing like to like.

That comparison goes both ways! When most people compare the cost of Macs to PC's they tend to select a cheap low end PC and if they are really trying to show "how much more" macs cost they compare a mid or higher end Mac to a low end PC. As far as how long they will last, I'd agree that a well built PC owned by someone who is comfortable with building fixing machines will last about the same. The problem is that most computers are run by people who have little or no knowledge about how to take care off a computer. In those cases I think macs last longer than PCs. I actually have 2 clients that, at least in the past, buy low end PCs every year to replace the previous years because they don't want to deal with maintenance. As a Mac user I have never had to take a machine into a shop to get if fixed or remove viruses. Sure, in part that is because I have a decent understanding of the machine, but it's also because PCs are more susceptible to viruses or breakdowns IMO.

 

[wbeem]

My oldest Mac is my 15" MacBook Pro from 2009. It's just turning four years old and it still works great. It isn't slowing down as Windows machines do because of the accumulation of crap in the registry, virus, spam or adware. The only upgrade I made was to move from 4 GB RAM to 8 GB RAM, which is the max for that model. I could also replace the 500GB hard drive with a SSD from OWC, but haven't done so yet.

The truth is that it works fine even now. The only reason I would have to upgrade are to get new features that weren't available then, such as a Retina display, bump the RAM to 16 GB, or to add Thunderbolt. To me, those are some enticing features and I may upgrade this year. I just don't feel the need to upgrade due to performance issues, though. It handles Aperture, Lightroom and Photoshop without issue.

 

[photo_chick]

wbeem makes a good point about the Windows registry getting garbled up. It can bog down your machine really fast. You do have to stay on top of that.

But as far as viruses... We've had them on both platforms. There are more in numbers on Windows but the ones that attack Macs seem to be harder to get rid of. We've only had to reformat a hard drive once from a virus and it was on a Mac in the late 90's. There just weren't tools to deal with it at that time.

 

[mikegood2]

wbeem makes a good point about the Windows registry getting garbled up. It can bog down your machine really fast. You do have to stay on top of that.

But as far as viruses... We've had them on both platforms. There are more in numbers on Windows but the ones that attack Macs seem to be harder to get rid of. We've only had to reformat a hard drive once from a virus and it was on a Mac in the late 90's. There just weren't tools to deal with it at that time.

The problem is that the vast majority of people don't stay on top of that, or have IT or a service take care of it.

Yes both systems can get viruses, but it is a much bigger problem on PCs. Pre OSX versions of Mac definitely had a problem with viruses, but OS X has take care of a vast majority of it.

 

[nvtsallo]

Ok I too am in this field. I deal with the IT side and printing side. I will just share a little of my journey.


I had mac and windows. Personally I have never been sold on mac to stay longer than a few months before i found my self wanting a windows machine. Since it cannot be upgraded easily they are not s great value to me. You get more for your money with windows. That being said I have:

15" macbook pro retina (2013 version) loaded with 16gb ram 512gb ssd (samsung screen) calibrated running windows 8 only. I am leveraging the hardware and display with windows software.

Custom built desktop
Ivy bridge i7
Intel 180gb ssd for os
16gb ram
2tb for scratch disk.

DISPLAY: hp 24" ips display calibrated (zr24 series)

Also
Running a full windows server with exchange.

I have onsite and offsite backups.

My point is you mentioned a category I call family pc with photography as the most specific thing. I would think of a budget then invest in a good display and calibrator ( spyder 4 pro). Spend the rest on your desktop. If you get a laptop you can get a macbook with retina but the asus zenbook prime is a great alternative with a 100% srgb ips screen. That will run you around $1200.

You can pm me with your thoughts and I will be happy to make a specific recommendation.

Finally please do not look at mac vs pc. But rather which platform has the hardware and will run your software within your budget.

Ps i am typing this on my ipad and have had every iphone since the razor v3i (yeah look it up) ran itunes on it before they launched the first iphone.

 

[jimim]

Ok I too am in this field. I deal with the IT side and printing side. I will just share a little of my journey.

I had mac and windows. Personally I have never been sold on mac to stay longer than a few months before i found my self wanting a windows machine. Since it cannot be upgraded easily they are not s great value to me. You get more for your money with windows. That being said I have:

15" macbook pro retina (2013 version) loaded with 16gb ram 512gb ssd (samsung screen) calibrated running windows 8 only. I am leveraging the hardware and display with windows software.

Custom built desktop
Ivy bridge i7
Intel 180gb ssd for os
16gb ram
2tb for scratch disk.

DISPLAY: hp 24" ips display calibrated (zr24 series)

Also
Running a full windows server with exchange.

I have onsite and offsite backups.

My point is you mentioned a category I call family pc with photography as the most specific thing. I would think of a budget then invest in a good display and calibrator ( spyder 4 pro). Spend the rest on your desktop. If you get a laptop you can get a macbook with retina but the asus zenbook prime is a great alternative with a 100% srgb ips screen. That will run you around $1200.

You can pm me with your thoughts and I will be happy to make a specific recommendation.

Finally please do not look at mac vs pc. But rather which platform has the hardware and will run your software within your budget.

Ps i am typing this on my ipad and have had every iphone since the razor v3i (yeah look it up) ran itunes on it before they launched the first iphone.

I had the v3i also I loved the razor line when it first came out and the as u bought the first iPhone and all since then.

So u run only windows on a 4 thousand dollar Mac? U don't use os at all? Why not just a windows laptop with the same spects? Also u don't use the retina screen and use a Samsung screen? Why not a non retina model if so then? Was just wondering.

Jimi

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards

 

[nvtsallo]

I had the v3i also I loved the razor line when it first came out and the as u bought the first iPhone and all since then.

So u run only windows on a 4 thousand dollar Mac? U don't use os at all? Why not just a windows laptop with the same spects? Also u don't use the retina screen and use a Samsung screen? Why not a non retina model if so then? Was just wondering.

Jimi

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards

Yeah at the time the phone was great. I use the macbook for the ips screen. I am using the internal display. I was just mentioning that it had the samsung screen init. Some are built with an lg display and have image retention issues. Also i got a crazy good deal on it. For work i have a thinkpad w530 with similar specs. It actually is a 98% of adobe color gamut screen. I just find that the colors are just too saturated even when calibrated. Eitherway that is just for travel. Really a desktop ips display would be preferred. Like the dell u series or hp zr series. Even asus has a pro art series 24" that is not bad. Again these are not professional setups but close enough. I am sure if you are a pro you would not be asking on this thread.

 

[rdunative]

In the market myself for another desktop. I currently have a 3 year old Asus and it has been great. Zero problems but just getting sluggish. Get a copy of Maximum PC. Each month they do 3 categories of desktop builds.

Baseline, Performance and Ultra. They usually change the names from issue to issue but the categories are the same. They break down each part of the desktop in detail along with the retail price. It's extremely useful in keeping up with the latest components.

Also, don't forget a higher end monitor for processing photos. IPS monitors are the best IMO. I have an HP ZR22w and a Dell. I've made a mistake of being cheap and bought one of the $100 monitors and found out fast about the difference between TN (Twisted Nematic) and IPS (In-Plane switching).

You can read more about them here.
http://www.ipsmonitor.com/guides/best-monitor-for-photo-editing-2011-the-top-10/

Right now I have a Macbook Pro hooked up to my HP monitor and it's working out great until I get a new desktop. I'm running Windows 7 on it as I hate Apple's OS. Apple makes solid, beautiful laptops but the way the Mac's operating system behaves with files, file extensions, image viewing programs, minimizing and maximizing programs, photomatix, my FTP programs, etc. drives me bananas, so I installed Windows.

Good luck with your selection and keep us posted on what you get!

 

[mikegood2]

I'm running Windows 7 on it as I hate Apple's OS. Apple makes solid, beautiful laptops but the way the Mac's operating system behaves with files, file extensions, image viewing programs, minimizing and maximizing programs, photomatix, my FTP programs, etc. drives me bananas, so I installed Windows.

Its funny because I'm the exact opposite when it comes to operating systems and can't stand windows. I guess, in part, it depends on what kind of computer you start out learning on. To me OS X is far more intuitive and usable than Windows although it seems like they have improved 7 & 8 considerably. The very little that I have used windows drives me bananas ! I like attaching a drive and having it instantly accessible on the desktop as opposed to selecting the (C,D,F drive?) thru the start menu which never made since to me.

I know more that a few people who have switched or added a Mac over the years and I think the majority of them felt the same way you did about the OS X at first, but after a short time that changed for them. A few of them actually prefer OS X now.

 

[jimim]

Yeah at the time the phone was great. I use the macbook for the ips screen. I am using the internal display. I was just mentioning that it had the samsung screen init. Some are built with an lg display and have image retention issues. Also i got a crazy good deal on it. For work i have a thinkpad w530 with similar specs. It actually is a 98% of adobe color gamut screen. I just find that the colors are just too saturated even when calibrated. Eitherway that is just for travel. Really a desktop ips display would be preferred. Like the dell u series or hp zr series. Even asus has a pro art series 24" that is not bad. Again these are not professional setups but close enough. I am sure if you are a pro you would not be asking on this thread.

Thanks for the response appreciate it.

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards

 

[jimim]

Its funny because I'm the exact opposite when it comes to operating systems and can't stand windows. I guess, in part, it depends on what kind of computer you start out learning on. To me OS X is far more intuitive and usable than Windows although it seems like they have improved 7 & 8 considerably. The very little that I have used windows drives me bananas ! I like attaching a drive and having it instantly accessible on the desktop as opposed to selecting the (C,D,F drive?) thru the start menu which never made since to me.

I know more that a few people who have switched or added a Mac over the years and I think the majority of them felt the same way you did about the OS X at first, but after a short time that changed for them. A few of them actually prefer OS X now.

I'm with u on all this but I learned on Mac from 95 on. I have used windows for a total of maybe an hour in my lifetime. I'm actually the only one at my job who uses a Mac. I don't even k ow how I pulled off MacBook pros all these years when everyone else get 900 dollar hp's.

But I the only employee who never had their computer in for viruses or repair. I think OS X is rock solid and soooo easy to get around but again I grew up in this world. I will say pre os 10 life in college was hard especially for printing as some other stuff when macs weren't as wide spread for software. With all the windows users out there.

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards

 

[mikegood2]

I'm with u on all this but I learned on Mac from 95 on. <b> I have used windows for a total of maybe an hour in my lifetime. </b>

I use to be able to say that I could count the number of hours I have spend on a PC on my hands, now I would probably have to take off my shoes. I mainly use a PC to see if or website designs look on a PC. Our past trip to WDW in June 2011 I also brought a netbook, because of the size of it, to back up all of my photos. I have nothing against PCs I just have little use for them. That said I will be installing parallels on my iMac soon. I've also been using a Mac since the late 80s.

One thing in the PCs favor over the last few years is the fact that they have become much more photographer and designer friendly. I still think that macs are the better option, but there really is little advantage between them anymore. That was not the case a decade or more ago!

One thing that always scares me are clients that call me with questions of how to do something on a PC and I'm actually able to help them. They use PCs everyday and I understand their PCs better than they do.

 

[jimim]

I use to be able to say that I could count the number of hours I have spend on a PC on my hands, now I would probably have to take off my shoes. I mainly use a PC to see if or website designs look on a PC. Our past trip to WDW in June 2011 I also brought a netbook, because of the size of it, to back up all of my photos. I have nothing against PCs I just have little use for them. That said I will be installing parallels on my iMac soon. I've also been using a Mac since the late 80s.

One thing in the PCs favor over the last few years is the fact that they have become much more photographer and designer friendly. I still think that macs are the better option, but there really is little advantage between them anymore. That was not the case a decade or more ago!

One thing that always scares me are clients that call me with questions of how to do something on a PC and I'm actually able to help them. They use PCs everyday and I understand their PCs better than they do.

Ya know I must say I learned on a mac since 95 but I remember being a real young kid and playing a goat videogame on my uncle's Mac. God I have no idea what the name of it was but it was intro to the mac world. It's funny how he fell to the side with macs and went PC most of his life but now that he is retired and going alot more photography he went back to Mac a bout 2 years ago now and loves iphoto and idvd for family movies and slideshows. He always says to me that he should have listening to me from the start. lol