New $500 Resale DVC Transfer Fee

[maui22]

If we transfer our deeds to a trust, we now have to pay $500 per deed. Is this correct?

Also, if someone passes away and the deed is transferred to their children, the children have to pay $500 for each deed?

 

[VGCgroupie]

If we transfer our deeds to a trust, we now have to pay $500 per deed. Is this correct?

Also, if someone passes away and the deed is transferred to their children, the children have to pay $500 for each deed?

Great question. I am on the fence about transferring to a trust since many commercial renters also use trusts. But transferring to children in the event of a death I feel should be waived.
Edit I am not on the fence. Trusts should also have to pay the fee.

 

[eticketplease]

I don't think a $500 one-time fee will change a lot of people's minds. It is less than what deluxe resorts usually charge per night, or about 6 month's worth of dues on a 150 point contract. The resale market will still be robust, but yeah it will take a marginal hit.

Hey now!! said the CFW owner

 

[eticketplease]

If we transfer our deeds to a trust, we now have to pay $500 per deed. Is this correct?

Also, if someone passes away and the deed is transferred to their children, the children have to pay $500 for each deed?

I don't think so since that would not be considered a sale.

 

[Tatebeck]

The way it reads I do NOT think it will apply to retitles/gratuitous transfers. It specifically talks about reselling the contract and retitling/gratuitous transfers are by definition not selling as there is no money changing hands

Another way to think about it is "would this contract (if it was direct/grandfathered) lose it's benefits in this transaction?" If yes then it would incur the fee. If not, then I don't think it will incur the fee

Anyone buying directly into a trust would pay it, and anyone selling out of a trust would too. So it would still hit the commercial renters who strip and flip for a total of $1,000 for each strip and flip

 

[SL6827]

Isn’t another way of looking at it that they increased the cost of studios and decreased the cost of 1 bedrooms?

If I remember correctly, it wasn't just that. It was the fact that they were being able to create more points for themselves out of the deal.

 

[mrjack5]

I might suffer from a bit of persecution complex, but I strongly remember all the headwind we had to fight on this board to try to convince people that we could fight the point charts. Some even said that increasing the lockoff premium could be advantageous because it would increase room availability. I remember also people saying: we don't have the data, only Disney does, we cannot say for sure that 1BR book much less than 2BR.
At the end (by Disney statement) only a couple dozen people complained to them, even if it was recommended to write/call.

Anyway, you're also conflating two separate events. The 2020 original charts had the lockoff premium increase and a reallocation between Poly bungalows and CCV cabins and other units. The point charts with the 7 seasons that caused an increase of points depending on when Easter fell, happened later. Not sure when, I think 2023 point charts.

ETA: to complete the history of DVC playing dirty, there was the time a DISboard user (Bing Showei) managed to force DVC to rollback the way they handle tax refunds on dues for sold contracts.

No--the "lockoff premium" chart increased both. And that's why it was absolutely bonkers.

There is a good argument for raising studios and lowering 1BRs, but unfortunately doing so would probably require violating the Residential Unit is Constant provision in most resorts. If any RUs in any given resort have different ratios of studios and 1BRs, then you can't just reallocate between those room sizes without reallocating across RUs, because math.

There is also the problem that reallocating across unit sizes would violate the maximum reallocation values published in the governing documents, but that did not stop them when they reallocated across SSR, raising the 2BRs at the expense of Treehouses, so who knows?

I think the direction the wind is blowing is such that that DVC is no longer interested in reallocating across RUs, but I've been wrong before.

I remember that too, but that argument was wrong on its face. It was obvious to anyone paying the least bit of attention to availability that 1BRs are the last room size to book system-wide. So I never gave them much of my attention.

In fact, that might explain a few entries on my ignore list.

I suspect I was on your "this guy is a jerk" list, because my attitude was almost certainly: "Of course you are right, and these charts are crap. But a lawsuit is pointless, because if Disney wants to crush you, they will." Happily, we never had to test that hypothesis.

If I remember correctly, it wasn't just that. It was the fact that they were being able to create more points for themselves out of the deal.

I thought florida timeshare law, total bucket of "points" couldn't increase unless more inventory was added EG Island tower, Poly Bungalos, VGF more rooms added.

Unless there was an increase in inventory then if one season/room category increased then there had to be decrease somewhere else? Isn't that correct?

But even if that was true they could inflate studios point cost and decrease bungalos without ever having real world changes because very few people booked the bungalos?

 

[Sandisw]

I don't think so since that would not be considered a sale.

The language was there related to sale,,,but that doesn’t mean it’s only when it’s a sale.

It could be related to any change in ownership once the new deed has been recorded and sent.

However, my guess is that transfers to a trust or between family might not incur the fee.

I wlll be doing some estate planning next year and wlll get to test this out!!

 

[eticketplease]

But even if that was true they could inflate studios point cost and decrease bungalos without ever having real world changes because very few people booked the bungalos?

It is still a "real world" change as now you have a lot more people that can't book the accommodations that they bought points for at PVB.

 

[eticketplease]

The language was there related to sale,,,but that doesn’t mean it’s only when it’s a sale.

It could be related to any change in ownership once the new deed has been recorded and sent.

However, my guess is that transfers to a trust or between family might not incur the fee.

I wlll be doing some estate planning next year and wlll get to test this out!!

Right now all we have is that FAQ which only mentions resale, not direct or any other contract modification so fingers crossed for you and others.

Hopefully we will get a real document posted soon.

 

[RivShore]

Lots of timeshares have that. Most name-branded Hawaii locations for example. And as the system scales up cracks may appear because demand is not guaranteed to scale with supply.

By "robust" I meant not just lots of resale transactions but also at high point values, close to and in some cases more than the original cost. Do the HI ones consistently get decent resale prices?

Again, my knowledge of other time shares is limited to a relatives experience many years ago, with an RCI mountain area TS that they literally could not give away. Their experience actually kept us from even considering DVC until I dug a bit into the details and saw that they have an end date, so you are not locked in forever, and then I discovered the resale and rental market and realized we should have bought DVC 20 years ago! lol

 

[Brian Noble]

Do the HI ones consistently get decent resale prices?

Yes. That's exactly what I meant.

Plus, cheap resales are great...if you buy resale!