My California Grill experience

[RossK]

Many of the best restaurants we've dined at in San Francisco, Chicago, etc use a Prix-Fixe. It is very common in fine dining.

Same in NYC.

Ok so to be clear I'm not talking about a tasting menu or chef's table or "the best restaurants". There are many top restaurants that are not fine dining. I'm specifically talking about fine dining, because that's how Disney classify this restaurant. You've been to actual fine dining restaurants that flatly refuse to make substitutions, or don't allow you order an extra course, or side dish (for a cost)? You must pick 1 starter, 1 main and 1 desert with no flexibility? I'm not saying it doesn't exist - but this is not common practice because it simply is not fine dining. Out of interest, where have you seen this?

As a European, I don't confess to know the 'fine dining' scene in San Fran or Chicago. However, NYC I do quite well, and I never came across this. No-where in Europe would class this cattle approach as fine dining - the restaurant might try, but no one here that knows food would ever put it in that category. To be in the fine dining category, at a bare minimum it would have to be a "full-service restaurant" - There is nothing full service/fine dining about a completely inflexible and limited offering at a set price.

 

[RossK]

Yeah, Le Cellier was just as unaccommodating recently and it's not prix-fixe. Not willing to swap sides, couldn't pay for the side on its own as a separate side dish.

We're paying too much for these pre-assembled plates. Seriously. Let us pay for what we want.

You are exactly right. Pre-Fixe menus are there to churn out buffet style food en-mass/quickly, which is not made to order, but with an exorbitant price tag. It really is an awful guest experience - particularly to be denied choice.

 

[gharter]

Not willing to swap sides, couldn't pay for the side on its own as a separate side dish.

That is surprising as they list 8 items as sides with a price for each. Ordering one of them separately should not have been an issue.

 

[NYCgrrl]

@RossK- I wasn’t speaking of tasting menus or chef’s table either; believe the question at hand was whether or not prix fixe menus could be had in other cities.

In NYC, it can be found at many eateries, both high and low, from La Bonne Soup (tourists and Midtown workers congregated here, pre-pandemic) to Le Bernardin, a Michelin rated eatery which has had one for at least the last 30 years. A variation also can be found around Times Sq. called pre-theatre menus.
I could certainly name places in various European cities that have this type of service but few with buffets.

 

[NYCgrrl]

If the mac & cheese pairs with the tomahawk, then it's a serving for two. Maybe that's why it could not be substituted.

We are planning to order the tomahawk for two, anyone had it yet?

Havent had it personally but it was shared by the man and DGD the last time we visited. They seems happy chewing away and goodness knows it’s a dramatic dish best served in a restaurant. The average home doesn’t have plates big enough for that rib bone, LOL.

 

[nerdboyrockstar]

That is surprising as they list 8 items as sides with a price for each. Ordering one of them separately should not have been an issue.

You would think, right? Unfortunately, it was the mushroom risotto which isn't listed as a side and they advised this time we couldn't swap or pay extra for it either. We've been able to substitute it in the past which was the surprising part.

 

[RossK]

@RossK- I wasn’t speaking of tasting menus or chef’s table either; believe the question at hand was whether or not prix fixe menus could be had in other cities.

In NYC, it can be found at many eateries, both high and low, from La Bonne Soup (tourists and Midtown workers congregated here, pre-pandemic) to Le Bernardin, a Michelin rated eatery which has had one for at least the last 30 years. A variation also can be found around Times Sq. called pre-theatre menus.
I could certainly name places in various European cities that have this type of service but few with buffets.

But this is my point. I’ve been to Le Bernardin; its a Michelin star restaurant with a tasting menu, this is what you go there for. They then additionally have a huge choice of pre fixe. And you are very welcome and free to substitute and order extra courses, unlike CG. I’m talking about non-tasting menu / chefs table restaurants here (i.e. similar to California Grill), just a normal fine dining restaurant. Pre pixe is not normal.

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

Ok so to be clear I'm not talking about a tasting menu or chef's table or "the best restaurants". There are many top restaurants that are not fine dining. I'm specifically talking about fine dining, because that's how Disney classify this restaurant. You've been to actual fine dining restaurants that flatly refuse to make substitutions, or don't allow you order an extra course, or side dish (for a cost)? You must pick 1 starter, 1 main and 1 desert with no flexibility? I'm not saying it doesn't exist - but this is not common practice because it simply is not fine dining. Out of interest, where have you seen this?

As a European, I don't confess to know the 'fine dining' scene in San Fran or Chicago. However, NYC I do quite well, and I never came across this. No-where in Europe would class this cattle approach as fine dining - the restaurant might try, but no one here that knows food would ever put it in that category. To be in the fine dining category, at a bare minimum it would have to be a "full-service restaurant" - There is nothing full service/fine dining about a completely inflexible and limited offering at a set price.

There are quite a few Michelin starred restaurants in the U.K. and Europe that only offer 5/7/9 course tasting menus on Fridays and Saturdays. They often request food allergies and preferences in advance but will not allow changes to the menu on the day. I think that for some of the smaller restaurants, it is the only way that they can maintain an exceptional quality of food. If it stops excessive food waste and is good for the planet, perhaps it is a good thing?

 

[NYCgrrl]

But this is my point. I’ve been to Le Bernardin; its a Michelin star restaurant with a tasting menu, this is what you go there for. They then additionally have a huge choice of pre fixe. And you are very welcome and free to substitute and order extra courses, unlike CG. I’m talking about non-tasting menu / chefs table restaurants here (i.e. similar to California Grill), just a normal fine dining restaurant. Pre pixe is not normal.

I think that is what you go there for; I’m perfectly fine with whatever they are offering. As for pre fixe menus, you asked for examples, I gave them and I guess even though a well known version of the dining scene, it’s just not your cup of tea as opposed to the “abnormality” you prefer to think of it as.

Enjoy your meal as you like.

 

[RossK]

I think we're talking about two different things... e.g. I know full well Michelin restaurants operate limited menus and already said this in my original post. It is ridiculous to even compare any aspect of CG to a Michelin star restaurant with a tasting menu. They are a completely different kettle of fish to non-Michelin fine dining.

And to use the words of NYCgrrl - "Enjoy your meal as you like" is exactly my point... This so-called fine dining experience at Disney doesn't let you do that at all. It's enjoy your meal in way that suits Disney, not the guest. This isn't a Michlin star restaurant. This isn't a restaurant with a small kitchen, or a small number of staff. And so all these arguments are moot - there's only one reason it is like this: It's designed to maximise profit, churn out food at lightning speed at-scale, and turn the tables as quick as possible, all at the expense of the guest experience.

But to each their own - I personally don't accept this garbage three course pre fixe as fine dining for this calibre and size of restaurant. For those that do, well, I'm super happy for you... But they won't be getting my dollars for this rubbish!

 

[gharter]

It's designed to maximise profit, churn out food at lightning speed at-scale, and turn the tables as quick as possible, all at the expense of the guest experience.

Have you dined there since the change?
I agree changes are made to increase profit, every company is doing that.
We were there 2 weeks ago. Our meal lasted 2 hours, as did most of those around us. We did not feel rushed at all, the food was served at a very reasonable pace. I did not feel the guest experience was diminished from any of our previous meals.

Pre-Fixe menus are there to churn out buffet style food en-mass/quickly, which is not made to order

Again not true. We were asked about any allergies, food you cannot eat. Entrees were prepared how you wished, medium rare steak, etc.

 

[RossK]

Have you dined there since the change?
I agree changes are made to increase profit, every company is doing that.
We were there 2 weeks ago. Our meal lasted 2 hours, as did most of those around us. We did not feel rushed at all, the food was served at a very reasonable pace. I did not feel the guest experience was diminished from any of our previous meals.



Again not true. We were asked about any allergies, food you cannot eat. Entrees were prepared how you wished, medium rare steak, etc.

No, I’ve not dined since the change because I find the menu very basic / boring to my taste (for a fine dining meal, anyway). Soup, salad, sushi rolls, pizza and wontons for appetisers. Very uninspired. Steakhouse 71 on the ground floor, which is not a signature, has a more interesting and creative set of appetisers! Oh and a choice of 7 different sides, and 7 different sauces. I’m not sure I understand your point around allergens or steak preference. You get asked these things at a carvery buffet, so I don’t see why they wouldn’t do it at CG.

If you love it, I’m genuinely happy for you. But it’s not for me. It’s boring, too rigid and is like a seated buffet to me. My view - I’m not trying to convince you not to like it. This is my reason for it coming off my list.

 

[gharter]

I’m not sure I understand your point around allergens or steak preference. You get asked these things at a carvery buffet, so I don’t see why they wouldn’t do it at CG.

You stated that the food is mass produced and not cooked to order. That clearly is not true.
You have not dined there and are making assumptions without any direct facts to back it up. I haven't been to Steakhouse 71 (yet, hoping to go in the spring). However, having had many great steaks in the midwest, a great steak doesn't need 7 different types of sauces to make it good.

I personally don't accept this garbage three course pre fixe as fine dining for this calibre and size of restaurant

Again, not true. I have dined in many restaurants larger than California Grill in many major cities that use the Prix-Fixe method. I get that you don't like it, but bashing something you haven't tried doesn't carry a lot of credibility.

 

[RossK]

You stated that the food is mass produced and not cooked to order. That clearly is not true.
You have not dined there and are making assumptions without any direct facts to back it up. I haven't been to Steakhouse 71 (yet, hoping to go in the spring). However, having had many great steaks in the midwest, a great steak doesn't need 7 different types of sauces to make it good.


Again, not true. I have dined in many restaurants larger than California Grill in many major cities that use the Prix-Fixe method. I get that you don't like it, but bashing something you haven't tried doesn't carry a lot of credibility.

You’re still missing the point. My view is that it’s garbage is completely true. It’s my view. The menu is boring and rigid. All food at Disney is mass produced with a very small number of exceptions - if you don’t realise that, then I’m not sure why we’re even debating this. If you look at many of the chef roles and titles at Disney, in their table service restaurants, you’ll find even Disney class most as banqueting and banqueting chefs.

I am perfectly able to “bash” something I haven’t tried on the basis of what Disney tells me to expect. A basic and limited range of options, with choices that don’t appeal to me whatsoever, in a format that doesn’t appeal to me whatsoever, inside a venue that was barely fine dining to start with because it was often like a zoo. Glad you find this experience fine dining though. You are obviously their target market - I am not.

Garbage to me. Great to you. Isn’t life wonderful.

 

[gharter]

You’re still missing the point. My view is that it’s garbage is completely true. It’s my view. The menu is boring and rigid. All food at Disney is mass produced with a very small number of exceptions - if you don’t realise that, then I’m not sure why we’re even debating this. If you look at many of the chef roles and titles at Disney, in their table service restaurants, you’ll find even Disney class most as banqueting and banqueting chefs.

I am perfectly able to “bash” something I haven’t tried on the basis of what Disney tells me to expect. A basic and limited range of options, with choices that don’t appeal to me whatsoever, in a format that doesn’t appeal to me whatsoever, inside a venue that was barely fine dining to start with because it was often like a zoo. Glad you find this experience fine dining though. You are obviously their target market - I am not.

Garbage to me. Great to you. Isn’t life wonderful.

I am so happy you have the ability to judge something you haven't been to or tried. My opinion, I've been there multiple times and disagree with your assumptions.
I question your concept of fine dining and where a prix-fixe menu fits in. I have dined in many places I suspect you can only dream of.
You don't like it, that's fine, but I dis agree with your assumption that you can bash something you haven't tried.
There are many on this thread who didn't care for the food or their experience at CG. I am totally good with that.
I have looked at many menus and decided it didn't look like something we might enjoy. But, I'm not going go in and try and trash it without actually trying it. YMMV.

 

[hereforthechurros]

California grill changing their format absolutely makes it easier on them for ingredients, staffing and profit. And it limits the choices of the diner. No denying that. Whether you like or not is up for debate. We do not; we prefer the original experience.

 

[LSUfan4444]

So Sunday is our booking day and the ONLY table service ADR we want is Cali grill. It's been hard for me me to see the difficulty in getting an ADR the last week or so because of the Holidays so am curious to hear how difficult it was for people to get an ADR 60+ 3 days out?

I haven' found any availability at all for the nest 60 days

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

So Sunday is our booking day and the ONLY table service ADR we want is Cali grill. It's been hard for me me to see the difficulty in getting an ADR the last week or so because of the Holidays so am curious to hear how difficult it was for people to get an ADR 60+ 3 days out?

I haven' found any availability at all for the nest 60 days

What day/time/number of people are you looking for? I will look for you.

 

[lpizzuro123]

We have reservations there next Thursday for our wedding anniversary with 2 other couples. We specifically want to eat there during the fireworks. We live in the area and go to Disney quite often and are looking forward to the meal and fireworks viewing.

 

[gharter]

We have reservations there next Thursday for our wedding anniversary with 2 other couples. We specifically want to eat there during the fireworks. We live in the area and go to Disney quite often and are looking forward to the meal and fireworks viewing.

We have reservations there next Thursday for our wedding anniversary with 2 other couples. We specifically want to eat there during the fireworks. We live in the area and go to Disney quite often and are looking forward to the meal and fireworks viewing.

Enjoy! We have been there multiple times including during fireworks. We loved our meal and enjoyed the fireworks.
Hope you have the same experience.