Mulan Is Back

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My lawyer CANNOT send him ANY KIND of communication- its ILLEGAL. And if they can't get his lawyer then guess what- that leaves me as the messenger!


Mulan

But in #125 or so, didn't you say you were going to have your Attorney's Assitant call him in regards to Father's Day to see if he was going to come? It's not illegal for a lawyer to contact the other party.
I'm sorry,but my problem is that you purposely had them sit to where he had to come in, etc. then you take them away when he doesn't take the paper. Whatever your problem is with DAMM,so be it, but it seems like neither one of you is looking out for your kids.
 
First, :hug: It's a learning process, and unfortunately, children are a part of that. Mine were, too, and it was hard and I made some mistakes, too.

Here's the important thing: YOU MUST COMMUNICATE THROUGH YOUR LAWYER OR CERTIFIED MAIL. It is not the police force's responsibility to deliver letters or make someone do what you want. They have no authority like that. If DAMM doesn't have an attorney, then the letter should be mailed certified return receipt. He will either sign for it and you'll have the receipt or he won't and it will be returned to you unclaimed. THEN you go to court and deal with it there, and can show that YOU are trying to be reasonable and follow the legal channels of communication.

My ex did all kinds of posturing, but when it came down to it, I had the righteous upper hand and prevailed and he basically dropped off the face of our earth for 14 years.

I just read this yesterday: Proverbs 20:22, "Do not say, 'I'll pay you back for this wrong!' Wait for the Lord, and he will deliver you."

I'll add what my Dad used to say, "wait for the Lord and keep your nose clean" ;) YOU do the right things and no one, not DAMM, not the judge, can say anything against you.

More :hug: :hug: :hug:
 
I'm sorry that things between you and DAMM happened to where you arent together anymore. But you aren't the only one things have happned to nor will you be the last.
These games between you and DAMM have gone on for a couple years now. You seek justice? Where is the justice when both have withheld having the kids talk to the other parent or kept them from the other parent? Or your glad when he doesn't show up, so what if you hate him? your kids don't, they can learn from themselves what kind of people you both are, so you need to realize your actions as well.
 

:hug: I think you have been "taken to the mat" enough today. Live and Learn, thats how we grow and become better people. Take care of yourself and your kids:hug:
 
I think it isn't a bad thing that he doesn't have a lawyer. Have yours communicate with him directly, in writing...and then just sit back and wait until he messes up without legal counsel to guide him. There has to be a limit somewhere to Judge Good Ole Boy's benevolence towards your ex.
 
:hug: I think you have been "taken to the mat" enough today. Live and Learn, thats how we grow and become better people. Take care of yourself and your kids:hug:

That's the problem she hasn't lived and learned. She is doing the same thing to her children that she has been for the past 2 years. She needs to be "taken to the mat" for the children. I think Mulan wants the best for her children and loves them to pieces, but she is mentally abusing them by using them as pawns. It's as if she doesn't see it at all and just excuses herself for these things by blaming her ex, the bad county, the bad judge. It is time she take responsibiliy for her own actions. I agree that we all make mistakes and heaven knows that I have done things to my children I regret, but I hope I learn from them. Mulan posts events here that shows she has not learned. I wish her the best, but will speak out against her for the children.
 
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IMHO, incidents like the one yesterday is exactly WHY the judge in :( county hasn't been moved over to your side yet. Yes, he's a "friend" of DAMM's (actually probably more like a good acquaintance), but the truth is, when DAMM steps well over the line, he has done something about it.

Part of the problem is that knowing that the judge is predisposed to side with dh, you create situations which put your judgement in question. To be quite honest, even knowing the whole story, I would be reluctant to cut off all contact between the children and their father. As much as you may regret it now, he was the person you chose to have children with, and for better or worse, he will be their father for the rest of their life.

As much as you are trying to protect them, many of your actions could be interpreted as "alienation of affection", and trying to turn your children away from you ex. And given his past behaviors, I honestly think you are doing this to a certain extent, in the name of doing what you believe is best for the children. I believe that the rest of it is done from a subconscious (or perhaps not-so-subconscious) need to get some revenge for his past transgressions, and to make sure that the children love you best. And it just shouldn't be about either of those things.

But the bottom line is, the judge's job is to make sure that the children have the best relationship possible with both parent's, regardless of who those people are. No one is a perfect parent. So the judge weighs the physical harm that dh may be doing to the children, and tries to contain it, while also trying to weigh the emotional harm you both may be doing to the children and trying to contain that.

When you react like you did yesterday, it tells those in authority that you aren't in an emotional place to be trusted to make sole decisions about what is best for the children, because your judgement is still clouded by the anger and resentment you are carrying from your history with your ex.

I wish you the best, but IMHO, until you learn to deal with your ex in an unemotional way, with the kids welfare ALWAYS coming first, the judge is not going to relinquish his authority over this case. Just like your ex doesn't seem to be able to go more than a couple of months without his anger getting the best of him, neither do you.

My intent in this post isn't to anger you. I intentionally stopped posting and just read the thread, keeping my opinions to myself. But I truly feel that you are the best thing for the children, and that if you could learn to control your emotions, and TRULY put the children first, you would be so much better off for it.

Lead with your head, not with your heart.

Best of luck. :grouphug: :grouphug:
 
IMHO, incidents like the one yesterday is exactly WHY the judge in :( county hasn't been moved over to your side yet. Yes, he's a "friend" of DAMM's (actually probably more like a good acquaintance), but the truth is, when DAMM steps well over the line, he has done something about it.

Part of the problem is that knowing that the judge is predisposed to side with dh, you create situations which put your judgement in question. To be quite honest, even knowing the whole story, I would be reluctant to cut off all contact between the children and their father. As much as you may regret it now, he was the person you chose to have children with, and for better or worse, he will be their father for the rest of their life.

As much as you are trying to protect them, many of your actions could be interpreted as "alienation of affection", and trying to turn your children away from you ex. And given his past behaviors, I honestly think you are doing this to a certain extent, in the name of doing what you believe is best for the children. I believe that the rest of it is done from a subconscious (or perhaps not-so-subconscious) need to get some revenge for his past transgressions, and to make sure that the children love you best. And it just shouldn't be about either of those things.

But the bottom line is, the judge's job is to make sure that the children have the best relationship possible with both parent's, regardless of who those people are. No one is a perfect parent. So the judge weighs the physical harm that dh may be doing to the children, and tries to contain it, while also trying to weigh the emotional harm you both may be doing to the children and trying to contain that.

When you react like you did yesterday, it tells those in authority that you aren't in an emotional place to be trusted to make sole decisions about what is best for the children, because your judgement is still clouded by the anger and resentment you are carrying from your history with your ex.

I wish you the best, but IMHO, until you learn to deal with your ex in an unemotional way, with the kids welfare ALWAYS coming first, the judge is not going to relinquish his authority over this case. Just like your ex doesn't seem to be able to go more than a couple of months without his anger getting the best of him, neither do you.

My intent in this post isn't to anger you. I intentionally stopped posting and just read the thread, keeping my opinions to myself. But I truly feel that you are the best thing for the children, and that if you could learn to control your emotions, and TRULY put the children first, you would be so much better off for it.

Lead with your head, not with your heart.

Best of luck. :grouphug: :grouphug:

:thumbsup2 ITA!! Great post!
 
For those of you who think this is all a sob story- its not! PM me and I will give you directions to :( co and you can meet DAMM first hand.

Did I expect something more from the police- yes I did! Boy, I guess I am stupider than I thought.

Mulan


I know you can't help who you fall in love with, but you CHOSE to be with him, stayedwith him. I have been reading since the 1st original thread when it started a couple years ago, but you yourself have made some mistakes as people do, but if he does something you did, then somehow it is different?Ya'll are responsible for your own actions because you are grown, but kids will remember these little moments of the game playing between you and DAMM. So you honetly need to think about what the future will hold, like I said, the kids can learn for themselves how you and DAMM really are. I have seen kids grow up in that type of situation and say bye to both parents.
 
I know you can't help who you fall in love with, but you CHOSE to be with him, stayedwith him. I have been reading since the 1st original thread when it started a couple years ago, but you yourself have made some mistakes as people do, but if he does something you did, then somehow it is different?Ya'll are responsible for your own actions because you are grown, but kids will remember these little moments of the game playing between you and DAMM. So you honetly need to think about what the future will hold, like I said, the kids can learn for themselves how you and DAMM really are. I have seen kids grow up in that type of situation and say bye to both parents.

Anyone else concerned that this poster has been following the thread for years, yet only has 5 posts? And has only been a member since june 2008? Something does not seem right. Wondering who this is? Could it be?
 
IMHO, incidents like the one yesterday is exactly WHY the judge in :( county hasn't been moved over to your side yet. Yes, he's a "friend" of DAMM's (actually probably more like a good acquaintance), but the truth is, when DAMM steps well over the line, he has done something about it. HUH??? THe judge has done NOTHING. If the judge cared about those kids their would be a guardian ad litem for them and supervised vists to make sure their so called father STOPPED ABUSING THEM!!!

Part of the problem is that knowing that the judge is predisposed to side with dh, you create situations which put your judgement in question. To be quite honest, even knowing the whole story, I would be reluctant to cut off all contact between the children and their father. As much as you may regret it now, he was the person you chose to have children with, and for better or worse, he will be their father for the rest of their life.

As much as you are trying to protect them, many of your actions could be interpreted as "alienation of affection", and trying to turn your children away from you ex. And given his past behaviors, I honestly think you are doing this to a certain extent, in the name of doing what you believe is best for the children. I believe that the rest of it is done from a subconscious (or perhaps not-so-subconscious) need to get some revenge for his past transgressions, and to make sure that the children love you best. And it just shouldn't be about either of those things.

But the bottom line is, the judge's job is to make sure that the children have the best relationship possible with both parent's, regardless of who those people are. No one is a perfect parent. So the judge weighs the physical harm that dh may be doing to the children, and tries to contain it, while also trying to weigh the emotional harm you both may be doing to the children and trying to contain that. Excuse me, you are telling me that physical harm is allowed?? What country are you from. The one I live in, it's against the law to physically abuse your child. Yes, you can punish and I have no problems with spanking...he goes beyond that, and it's the judges job to stop that. The child's welfare is more important than the fathers rights.

When you react like you did yesterday, it tells those in authority that you aren't in an emotional place to be trusted to make sole decisions about what is best for the children, because your judgement is still clouded by the anger and resentment you are carrying from your history with your ex.

I wish you the best, but IMHO, until you learn to deal with your ex in an unemotional way, with the kids welfare ALWAYS coming first, the judge is not going to relinquish his authority over this case. Just like your ex doesn't seem to be able to go more than a couple of months without his anger getting the best of him, neither do you.

My intent in this post isn't to anger you. I intentionally stopped posting and just read the thread, keeping my opinions to myself. But I truly feel that you are the best thing for the children, and that if you could learn to control your emotions, and TRULY put the children first, you would be so much better off for it.

Lead with your head, not with your heart.

Best of luck. :grouphug: :grouphug:


What Mulan has done at times isn't the best..but her heart and soul is in the right place. She is trying her best to protect her children. Her ex has NEVER done anything that's for the best of the children. The judge DOENS"T CARE. THere are hundreds of cases of this judge not caring. People make mistakes, adn Mulan did make one, but hey..she is angry and frustrated and has to jump through hoops she shouldn't have too. She has every right to feel angry and disgusted and upset.

At some point her ex will give up..hopefully the kids wont be seriously physcially hurt by him. Then Mulan will have the task of helping them get through the fact that their father is not around.

And yes, I think the kids would be better off without him as a father. He is abusive, physically and mentally and no child deserves that. I hope he gets tired of the games he is playing sooner rather than later...for their sakes.

Mulan, hang in there. You will do better next time, I know it's hard.
 
I am far from a troll. But it still doesn't change the fact that Mulan did these things, now does it? Mothers don't use their kids as pawns in little games let alone as a bargaining chip so DAMM will take the paper.
 
Then why aren't you posting under your "real" user name???????

Probably because she doesn't want to be labeled just because she doesn't agree with everything Mulan does. On this thread in the past posters have been flamed big time because they call Mulan out on some of her actions. I really don't care anymore if I get flamed for stating my opinion.

In the past whenever someone calls Mulan out for her mistreatment of her children, they pay the price with flaming and all Mulan supporters rally to her defense. Guess what? I'm a Mulan supporter. I just refuse to excuse her everytime she chooses to put her children between her and the ex. Mulan is not better, she is truly bitter and the events of last night prove it. She intentionally used her children to bait her ex. When it didn't work she grabbed her children and berated a police officer who had no control or place in this situation. She is very lucky she didn't end up in jail herself. Had she done what she thought about later, she probably would have ended up in jail. I know she was upset and angry, but it had been 2 years. She needs to take the high road and put her children above her anger.
 
Probably because she doesn't want to be labeled just because she doesn't agree with everything Mulan does.

IMO - If you won't stand behind what you post (posting under your "real" username not one created to post on a specific thread) then you shouldn't be posting it at all.

She is very lucky she didn't end up in jail herself. Had she done what she thought about later, she probably would have ended up in jail. I know she was upset and angry, but it had been 2 years.

OMG if we all did what we considered doing or thought about later we'd all probably be in jail, fired from our jobs, or have fights with all kinds of people :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: I mean come on. This was just a "blowing of steam" post and really everyone needs to cool it and let it go :idea:

Mulan - Only 1 day to go until those precious kids are back again! :wizard:
 
OMG if we all did what we considered doing or thought about later we'd all probably be in jail, fired from our jobs, or have fights with all kinds of people :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: I mean come on. This was just a "blowing of steam" post and really everyone needs to cool it and let it go :idea:

I agree we all think things we don't do. But she actually did things last night that were extreme. She used her children as bait. She expected the police officer to make her ex listen to her. These things are not rational. She had hours to cool off before she posted and longer to respond to unfavorable posts and she still didn't see she did anything wrong. Not even this morning did she acknowlege what she did to the children.

Mulan's defenders post here how the posters who haven't been there, done that, in Mulan's shoes don't understand. What about the posters who have been there, done that, in the children's shoes. I have and let me tell you what she is doing hurts worse than any beating. I'll stand by that because I know! When her children are 40 years old they will remember being stuck in the middle and being made to feel as if they need to choose who to love. I'll let it go when Mulan stops using (abusing) her children.
 
Probably because she doesn't want to be labeled just because she doesn't agree with everything Mulan does. On this thread in the past posters have been flamed big time because they call Mulan out on some of her actions. I really don't care anymore if I get flamed for stating my opinion.

In the past whenever someone calls Mulan out for her mistreatment of her children, they pay the price with flaming and all Mulan supporters rally to her defense. Guess what? I'm a Mulan supporter. I just refuse to excuse her everytime she chooses to put her children between her and the ex. Mulan is not better, she is truly bitter and the events of last night prove it. She intentionally used her children to bait her ex. When it didn't work she grabbed her children and berated a police officer who had no control or place in this situation. She is very lucky she didn't end up in jail herself. Had she done what she thought about later, she probably would have ended up in jail. I know she was upset and angry, but it had been 2 years. She needs to take the high road and put her children above her anger.


Ya know what. I really expect better from you. You are an attorney. You KNOW this judge. But you have never walked in Mulan's shoes, most of us haven't. It is a very difficult line to walk, I can't imagine..I honestly can't. My ex did me and my kids a favor and disappeared. My sons were better off not knowing him and they are fine.

Mulan made a mistake, she should not have done what she did. It doesn't mean we need to beat her over th ehead with it. But there are the naysayers here that make her out to be a criminal and worse then her ex.

She is not in the same league with him. She is a HUMAN BEING, we make mistakes. EVERYTHING she does is done out of LOVE for her kids. And soemtimes the anger at her ex, and her concern for her kids makes her see red, and seh makes some poor choices. OH WELL!! She is not beating her kids, or USING her kids, she wants them SAFE, and away from her ex. There is nothing wrong with that, he is BAD for her kids. If he changes his ways and decides to put his kids first and to love them, and not use then and torture Mulan, then i will change my mind. Right now he is only taking them to HURT MULAN. He doesn't give 2 figs for those sweet babies. And those kids would be so much better off if he was out of their life.

Yes, she made a mistake, but heck, with what she is going through...I would be surpised if she didn't. She is entitled...she has to deal with an ex who is HORRIBLE, a justice system and a judge that DON"T CARE. SHe is entitled to her angry, and her bitterness.


TO all the constant naysayers...walk 1 day in this women's shoes. Live her life, her fears, her feelings, then come her and tell us how you really feel.
 
HUH??? THe judge has done NOTHING. If the judge cared about those kids their would be a guardian ad litem for them and supervised vists to make sure their so called father STOPPED ABUSING THEM!!!

That's not true. The judge (as I stated) may be bias towards DAMM, but he has taken action against DAMM in the past. I've been here since the beginning, and there have been instances where the judge ruled in Mulan's favor because it was clear that Mulan clearly only had the interest of the children at heart.

As far as guardian ad litem, personally, I think it would be great for the children, but as one who has worked with children and courts for a number of years, with Mulan's current state of mind, this situation will not completely work in her favor. Although DAMM has his faults, Mulan has not been without her own faults (are any of us?). The guardian ad litem is there to protect the kids and only the kids.

Excuse me, you are telling me that physical harm is allowed?? What country are you from. The one I live in, it's against the law to physically abuse your child. Yes, you can punish and I have no problems with spanking...he goes beyond that, and it's the judges job to stop that. The child's welfare is more important than the fathers rights.

First I'm from the US, and unfortunately, I live in the real world. In the real world, all sorts of nasty things happen every day. Is it allowed to physically harm your child? No. Does it happen every day? Yes. Does social services and the courts turn their backs on what is going on? It's a matter of perspective. Ask anyone who has ever been a social worker, child advocate, teacher, foster parent or works in the family court system. The bottom line is trying to provide what is best for the child. And as much as you may not like it, at the current time in this country, that is considered for the child and the parent to maintain contact and maintain a parent/child relationship.

When you throw in the fact that BOTH parents have at times not shown the best of judgement, and haven't always acted in SOLELY the best interest of the children, things become even more clouded. And this is what I was telling Mulan. Like it or not, the children are going to have a relationship with DAMM. Frankly, as abhorrent as we find his behavior to be, it hasn't yet reached the level to remove parental rights. Custodial interference and alienation of affection are serious things, and can result in a change of primary custody, and I don't think anyone wants to see that. But it happens every day.

What Mulan has done at times isn't the best..but her heart and soul is in the right place. She is trying her best to protect her children. Her ex has NEVER done anything that's for the best of the children. The judge DOENS"T CARE. THere are hundreds of cases of this judge not caring. People make mistakes, adn Mulan did make one, but hey..she is angry and frustrated and has to jump through hoops she shouldn't have too. She has every right to feel angry and disgusted and upset.

At some point her ex will give up..hopefully the kids wont be seriously physcially hurt by him. Then Mulan will have the task of helping them get through the fact that their father is not around.

And yes, I think the kids would be better off without him as a father. He is abusive, physically and mentally and no child deserves that. I hope he gets tired of the games he is playing sooner rather than later...for their sakes.

Mulan hasn't always done the best thing, and DAMM hasn't always done the best thing. But the bottom line is that they are both the children's parents. To say that DAMM has NEVER done anything for the children is juvenile and most likely patently untrue. In the past 2 years, even Mulan has posted things that DAMM has done with the children that they enjoyed. To totally negate any good in their father is, psychologically to a child, the same as saying half of them has no redeeming value. It has long, unintended consequences.

Frankly, lately DAMM has been acting like the more mature of the two of them. He can't cope with having the children for 5 weeks, and although he probably knew that it was what Mulan preferred, he skipped out and didn't take the children. Horrible for the children, but in the long run, perhaps better than taking them and not being able to cope.

When he thought last weekend (Father's Day) was his, it was an opportunity for Mulan to be the bigger person. She could have said, "Look, it's my week, but since you were supposed to have them for the five week period now anyway, and it's Father's Day, I'll have the kids ready for you." That shows maturity. That shows someone who's putting the kids first. When she went back to court she could have shown how she was the bigger person. Instead it was an opportunity lost.

When DAMM tried to communicate through third parties and the every other week summer visitation was mentioned, it was knocked down as an "all or nothing", since Mulan knew (and he basically admitted) he couldn't handle the 5 weeks. As a parent, it would be PUTTING THE CHILDREN FIRST to agree to the every other week. His stress level will hopefully be lower, the kids will hopefully have a better experience. She would see them every other week and be able to observe how they were doing. There would be more accountability. Now where are we? Back at the point where it's probably going to go back to court. And the judge will probably offer DAMM another opportunity to have the children for 5 weeks this summer. And since Mulan won't/ wouldn't agree to the every other week scenario, He'll probably take the kids for the 5 weeks, foist them off on others part of the time, be unable to cope, and the potential exists for a bad situation for everyone involved. This is NOT in the BEST INTEREST OF THE CHILDREN.

For the most part, children are not better off without one of their parents. We hopefully give them coping skills, and they find a way to develop a relationship that works best for them, knowing that there are adults around who are watching out for their best interests. The parent with the higher level of disfunction usually isn't given custody unless the other parent is uncooperative with the courts, and fails to act in what the court deems is the best interest of the CHILDREN.

Under your guidelines children would be removed from all homes where parents were not only physically abusive, but alcoholics, drug addicts, anorexic, have PSTD, OCD or a variety of other mental/emotional issues. That doesn't happen in the US. That's not how our social services system is set up. That is not how our family courts are set up.

And one final note... for those of you who can remember back to the original posts... Mulan did not leave DAMM because he was abusive to her and the children. The relationship disinegrated to the point of divorce at HIS request. He had an affair and stated that he wanted out. At that point, she began to look at their relationship through different eyes, and realized that he had been controlling and manipulating her and that they had been in an unhealthy/abusive relationship. This was probably one of the best things that ever happened for Mulan and the children, but until that point, she hadn't reached the point where she felt that his relationship with the children was so harmful that she needed to seperate them.
 
Ya know what. I really expect better from you. You are an attorney. You KNOW this judge. But you have never walked in Mulan's shoes, most of us haven't. It is a very difficult line to walk, I can't imagine..I honestly can't. My ex did me and my kids a favor and disappeared. My sons were better off not knowing him and they are fine.

No, I haven't walked in her shoes, but I have walked in her children's shoes. Read my previous post. She and ex are destroying their children because neither will put them totally above their own feelings.

I have also represented women and men who think like Mulan. That is probably why her attorneys have been less than, IMO. She has posted that she doesn't always listen to what her attorneys say. Mulan uses her mistreatment from her ex to justify everything. It is time for her to move on. In a way I think her ex has moved on. Re-read her post from last night. Mulan intentionally put her children in the middle. Her ex had nothing to do with that!
 
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