Monorails

[scottb8888]

Busses I ride every day. I am on vacation. I like the monorail the best. Folks who like busses can stay home and ride them.

 

[DancingBear]

I don't think the argument is whether people like riding monorails more than busses. Rather, whether it would be a good use of $$$ to expand the system.

 

[tigmickey]

Pre 9/11 there ws going to bo monorail expansion to AK, MGM and
Downtown Disney. The money was there. At least that was the rumor. I remember reading the rumors and telling my non disney friends and they all said that a new monorail system would be a reason to go to WDW. I hope that Disney expands the monorail and I hope that the people that think it is a bad idea don't ride it.

 

[KNWVIKING]

***" I hope that Disney expands the monorail and I hope that the people that think it is a bad idea don't ride it."***

I'm not going to go back & reread this thread, but I don't recall anyone saying that expanding the Mono was a bad idea. I think it's a great idea, but it shouldn't be given priority over more pressing issues.

 

[raidermatt]

Seems like this has been a hot issue for a while.

You have NO idea.

I think it's a great idea, but it shouldn't be given priority over more pressing issues.

I can agree with this. Looking back, the company has clearly made some poor investment choices, rather than dealing with some of those pressing issues.

Going forward, though, upgrading the transportation infrastructure in both function and show should be something that definitely gets done.

 

[Cobra B.]

I hate starting rumors, so here it goes.

A friend of a friend is an Imaginear. Word has it the monorails are back on the boards for the near future. The issue is that there are a lot of hotel rooms on the near future plans. And parking and transportation are a huge issue. The bus platforms are too small for the number of people waiting there. And IMHO so crowded they are dangerous. People (kids) are spilling over the pavements into the bus lanes. It's a mess. There are just too many buses concentrated in a couple of areas (i.e. MK,DTD). And with more people from more hotel rooms, there just is nowhere else to go. The thought is to possibly add a TTC and parking and also other bus stops to spread the volume. Also once the plans gets closer to reality it will be decided where it will be necessary to send the new monorail lines. Should they go to Resorts or Parks?

Remember I only speak in rumor.

 

[airlarry!]

I have faith in the human mind, that it can create a transportation model that can accomodate magical transportation around the entire property with monorail lines to the premium resorts and water or other type transportation to the non-monorail resorts...and do it all for a reasonable cost, without the need for ever increasing traffic lights, stop signs, bus lanes, exhaust fumes, and dark uncomfortable bus rides at the end of a long day.

Some will say it can't be done.

Oct 1971. It was done. And it worked. And it can be done again. Walt would never have allowed the property to be expanded without a specific plan for transportation. Heck, his Florida project was to show the world how to design a better community. Bus trips and yield signs ain't no better community.

 

[John Dobbertin]

Totally agree with "imagineerings'" opinions regarding bus set-ups & bus service challenges. We spend a lot of time at WDW -- about five weeks a year -- so we have many "interesting" bus experiences. But the cost of any Monorail addition has to be enormous. We once heard that for the distance of every three upright supports the cost was going to run $1 million -- and that was some time ago. Walt Disney was great at securing sponsorships -- way ahead of his time. Maybe WDW can copy Las Vegas on that one.

 

[ccotis]

I sure hope the rumors are correct. I am a DVC member and there has been a rumor involving the new SSR and DD for a while. I personally would like to see an extension to AK.

 

[old lost boy]

It seems to me that WL and AKL need to be put on the monorail line. All the other "deluxe" resorts or either within walking distance of EPCOT or on the monorail. If the million dollars a mile mentioned earlier is correct it would be pretty expensive to connect AK but not WL.

 

[John Dobbertin]

Old Lost Boy -- The cost estimate we heard was $1 million for every three major upright supports -- and that does not cover that much distance. It wouldn't take long to hit the billion-dollar mark on Monorail construction. WL is so close to the TTC & such a short bus hop Monorail wouldn't make much sense -- plus WL is connected to MK by boat. Extension from Epcot Monorail to MGM & maybe AK would appear feasible.

 

[DC7800]

Ever notice just how close the monorail lines (MK and Epcot) come to Wilderness Lodge? The western edge of the resort - not the bus depot, at the opposite end - is little more than a stone's throw from the MK monorail beam. The expense to make a slight diversion to a WL station would be minimal at even the most extreme cost estimates. It still woudn't be as close to the TTC as the Polynesian.

And some of the figures rumored around here about the cost of monorail expansion cannot possibly be correct. A mile of conventional railroad costs about $2.5 million. It's hard to make a direct comparison to monorail (elevated structure, but it doesn't need a prepared roadbed, etc.) and the swampy land of WDW potentially adds expense, but there is no way you can spend a billion dollars on monorail tracks.

 

[YoHo]

I have a hard time believing even in Florida's high water table that the monorail costs more then conventional Concrete tie welded 150lb welded rail. It's just doesn't make sense.

 

[DancingBear]

Again, I post this link, which seems to be a fairly educated opinion on the cost issue--and the lowest figure here is $6.5 million per mile.

http://www.monorails.org/tMspages/HowMuch.html

 

[tjkraz]

Originally posted by DC7800
And some of the figures rumored around here about the cost of monorail expansion cannot possibly be correct.

...there is no way you can spend a billion dollars on monorail tracks.

$650 Million in private funding was secured to build the 3.9 mile monorail expansion in Las Vegas. Do a Google search on "Las Vegas Monorail" and you'll see that figure stated over and over again.

In my mind, the bottom line is this: Disney World has had over 20 years since the opening of Epcot (and last monorail line construction) to add-on to the loop. I'm not going to say that it will never happen, but it seems to be getting more and more unlikely with each day that passes. Say what you will about Disney management, but they have always been open to embracing new ideas, particularly when there is a net cost savings to be realized.

If anyone at WDW thought that a monorail would be either a) a big draw to add new business to WDW, or b) a more cost-effective transportation solution, they would have done it years ago.

 

[John Dobbertin]

As far as recent cost of Monorail construction, need to check out the just-sort-of-opened line in Las Vegas. Not certain of its total length, but it runs from MGM to the Sahara -- miles, but not all that far-- maybe three or four miles total. Cost estimates at the time of building were close to one-billion. And the blooming thing is not working very well!

 

[John Dobbertin]

First estimates for the Las Vegas monorail were on the lower end -- something around $500 million -- that would have brought the system in at about $125 million a mile. Last "real count" we saw was $860 million and that was a while ago. Not certain if that included all the connections to the hotels/casinos, etc. Somewhere the billion-dollar figure has been floating around and since this is Las Vegas, what goes in Vegas stays in Vegas. But whatever number you want to believe, it's a darned expensive monorail. Start-up has been a disaster.

 

[Lewisc]

There was a lot of talk about some type of light rail, should be less expensive than a monorail since you don't have the expense of all the pilings.

There is an old rumor that Disney was considering building a second TTC (or maybe even replacing the existing TTC) near DTD. Funnel the guests through DTD at the end of the night similar to what Universal does with City Walk. Basically set it up for guests who are driving from the International Drive area. It might open up some of the theme park parking lots for park expansion and might even allow Disney to get rid of the existing TTC and put another monorail resort in it's place.

Tyler has posted on the bus issue. Buses allow Disney to transpot guests from the resorts to the parks directly. Buses do a better job allowing Disney to add capacity at peak times.

Disney has done a lot of planning, they decided buses is the most efficient way to transport resort guests.

 

[KNWVIKING]

***"There is an old rumor that Disney was considering building a second TTC (or maybe even replacing the existing TTC) near DTD."***

I don't know if this rumor and the proposed hi speed rail line between the airport & WDW are connected at all, but when the hi speed line was being discussed, Disney offer to donate approx 50 acres of land to the rail line and then move the TTC to that location. I believe the 50 acres was locate at Oceola Pkw and I-4.

 

[Lewisc]

Originally posted by KNWVIKING
***"There is an old rumor that Disney was considering building a second TTC (or maybe even replacing the existing TTC) near DTD."***

I don't know if this rumor and the proposed hi speed rail line between the airport & WDW are connected at all, but when the hi speed line was being discussed, Disney offer to donate approx 50 acres of land to the rail line and then move the TTC to that location. I believe the 50 acres was locate at Oceola Pkw and I-4.

These are separate rumors. The rumor I read was Disney trying to duplicate Universal. Huge parking garages so they could funnel the offsite guests through DTD at the end of the night. Light rail to get people to the theme parks.