Mold problem! Need legal advice fast!

[cinderella73]

Agree. Your first post is a little confusing. How did you just find this issue a week ago? It looks bad so it had to have been going on for months if not years, and definitely before you re-signed the lease this year. Also while it's true that molds can cause allergy symptoms in people it's strange that you only started coughing recently when based on the pictures it has been a problem for a long time. I would try to limit exposure to the basement and consider everything stored down there as a loss - I would not even try to touch or move anything at this point because you will just be sending stuff into the air. I too would try to find another place to live but unfortunately I don't know how much recourse you have with the landlord if it's taken you this long to report it.

There was no visible mold when we moved in. Only a typical musty smell. We were definatly sick before noticing the mold we just didnt know why at the time. Since its not a place we go down into frequently we dont know when it started. The way the humidifier is set up we dont walk all the way in we just go around the corner and right back upstairs.

I am guessing it started maybe around 2 months ago based on our symptoms and frequent doctor visits. Before that we had been fine. My cough turned into wheezing after moving stuff around. I still have it today after being down there last night. Its like a squeezing in my lungs. You also get a burning in your nose after being down there.

I was down there repacking stuff about 5 months ago and didnt notice any black mold. So it has to be within the last few months.

 

[cinderella73]

Not sure if this would help you, but call your local code enforcement office (usually in with the township/city hall building). My DH is a Building and Fire Inspector and has to occasionally deal with mold issues when it deems a house not fit for human habitation. Even if they can't help you, they might be bale to point you in the direction of who you could call to get the ball rolling. If you go this route, I doubt you landlord will be pleased, but when it is the safety of your family......

Thank you . I did just that. They are not in the office and have limited hours but I did leave a message detailing everything and my phone number. Hopefully I will hear back soon.

 

[Piglets Mommy]

Good luck with this! Black mold is so scary. I'd get out ASAP. If it's black mold, a dehumidifier isn't going to do anything...all the affected drywall and carpet will need to be removed, and you DON'T want to be there while they do it. I'd get a free inspection/estimate, and if they think it's black mold, get out now. Worry about the legal issues later.

 

[cinderella73]

She has not given you any assurance or any 'date' that anyone will actually show up to look at the problem.

She has already minimized the issue, and stated..... "hey, it's a basement, just get another humidifier...."

NO mention of treatment or mold removal.

They are, essentially, refusing to address your concerns.

That is not acceptable.

Do not delay....
It really doesn't matter what day of the month it is....
Doesn't matter if it is the first, the 31st, whatever....
What matters is that you are able to move ASAP.
I do not think that you will get moved into your new home overnight on the 31st... so just count on paying Nov. rent... You can be long gone before the landlord has a chance to get his ducks in a row.

And, remember, from your Landlord's side, it will also cost him a small fortune to sue you! And, why would he risk that if he knows that he can't win because of the mold problem.

Let's just say he offers to have professional mold removal.... HE STILL WOULD OWE YOU FOR YOUR ALTERNATE LIVING ARRANGMENTS (HOTEL OR APARTMENT) UNTIL THE JOB IS COMPLETE, OR HE CAN'T COLLECT RENT.

So, technically, if you find it necessary to move because of the mold issue, then suing him back for your rent and living expenses during this time (starting TODAY) is also a third possible lawsuit or countersuit against him.

I really don't think he will want to 'go there'.
He would have to be either very crazy or very stupid or both.
He doesn't have a leg to stand on.
I really doubt that forcing somebody to pay a full 12 months notice is even legal.
And, no matter what you signed, a waiver will never hold up.
One can not sign away their legal rights.
One can not give another person permission to break State or Local laws.

I think your landlord knows this, and they just don't care.

PS: You might possibly find a service that will provide a 'free estimate' or an initial free inspection.... CALL A PROFESSIONAL OUT THERE, TODAY.... YES, they can usually come within 24 - 48 hours. Call a service that offers 'emergency water restoration'. You really need to do this to have outside verication of the mold problem. I would not hold my breath waiting for your landlord to call somebody.

November's rent and a possible service charge for an inspection are a small price to pay to document your situation and get moved out.

I hope you are able to speak with this lawyer and get some good advice soon!

Really good advice thank you! I did call out a mold inspection company and they are coming on Thursday. They do a free " visual " inspection. They also have a air quality test that they do that costs 300.00 and takes around 10 days to come back . It identifies the type of mold present. They told me that they usually do that for places of business and in homes they dont usually test. That if they see it they just automatically recommend removal no matter what the type of mold since all mold spores can be unhealthy to breath in. If I want to be able to prove I have a toxic mold though I will have to do the test.

I did also get a hold of a lawyer. I should be hearing from them tomorrow. I might qualify for free advice. I will have to fill out some papers and see where I stand.

It looks like that I am on the right track now but unfortunatly I cannot afford the new homes security , months rent plus this rent at this house on top of everything else going on ( mold testing , dog payment , etc.)

That leaves me with 2 options I figure

Leave now and give use all of money toward the new house which gets us out of the mold but into a tricky legal situation.

OR

Give the people with the new house a deposit and ask them to hold it with a security till December and spend the month having the mold people, the lawyer , and the code enforcement people, and my landlord all figure it out. At least no one can say I didnt try to do the right thing . Except that of course means leaving windows open even when its freezing cold and dealing with the worry of potential health issues.

The ideal thing would have been to stay put and have professional come in . But that needs to happen fast. They dont want to move fast or deal with paying for professionals so thats out. The new home will be wonderful but a LOT more expensive so I go from from health worries to financial ones. But I would rather have financial ones then health ones.

Argh its a good thing I believe in prayer! I am going to go make some nice hot tea and relax . I did everything I could today. ( Well I still have to call my new potential landlords)

Thank you everyone for being so supportive and giving such great advice ! Big hugs for you all!

I will keep you all updated on how it goes. I am really curious to see if this is toxic mold. Something is telling me it is.

 

[GoodFairies]

Here is some good information.
http://www.cdc.gov/MOLD/stachy.htm

 

[cinderella73]

Good luck with this! Black mold is so scary. I'd get out ASAP. If it's black mold, a dehumidifier isn't going to do anything...all the affected drywall and carpet will need to be removed, and you DON'T want to be there while they do it. I'd get a free inspection/estimate, and if they think it's black mold, get out now. Worry about the legal issues later.

This is whats tearing me apart! I agree totally of course. But if we dont cover our bases first and he sues us and wins because I didnt take time to document and do things right we could lose the ability to pay for my sons service dog . So I am such a horrible state of anxiety. Thank god the kids are not coughing are seeming affected at the moment. It bothers everyone off and on. But my husband and I were down in the mess and I am thinking the way my lungs keep squeezing I have what seems like asthma.

The basement is open and the wall that backs up to it has the couch on it with a open cutout behind it that vents to the basement. ( I will post a picture later) So I keep them away from all those areas. The few days they sat there they were coughing and my daughter had that burning feeling in her lungs.

But now they are across the room by the open screen door and seem ok. So I keep fighting with myself saying " Its fine for one more month as long as they stay away from the openings to the basement " to " I need to get the heck out now!"

I dont have it but I think I will definatly think of a way to pay for that 300.00 mold test just to see if I am crazy here. lol I looked it up online and it sure matches everything I read about myotoxin producing mold right down to the shape of it. At least I will feel justified in all of this drama that seems to be stemming from it. The way the landlady acts you would think I was overreacting to worry!

 

[agnes!]

If the situation is as you described, then think you should get your family out of there as soon as you can.

*Seriously*.

agnes!

 

[cinderella73]

Here is some good information.
http://www.cdc.gov/MOLD/stachy.htm

Thank you for the link. Here are some points I came across.

From what I read is that the CDC does generally not recommend testing for specific molds as all molds need to be removed regardless. ( Unless u want to prove yourself you are not crazy lol)

Molds are everywhere ( that I knew) but obviously the molds in the home should not exceed what is found outdoors.

Certain individuals are more suceptable to problems with mold . Asthma , immune suppressed people , etc.

As far as whether or not to vacate it says that the choice needs to be made on a individual basis . Which of course would depend on most likely the severity of mold and the health of people in the home . I would personally think that mycotoxin mold would also be more of a reson to vacate but it does not say.


As I type this of course I am wheezing like crazy. I should have worn my mask last night but they are thick its hard to breath in them.

 

[coltink]

I work in the rental business in Virginia. Each state is different.

1. Legal Aid can provide advice for you and get you some one you can afford. Check this site out for your local areas: http://www.usattorneylegalservices.com/free-legal-aid-Pennsylvania.html
2. Keep a log of EVERYTHING! WHen you discovered it, has it gotten any bigger, when and how many times you contacted the owner and when and how they responded.
3. Does your lease have a section on repairs? And when they are to be completed?
4. I would definately send a certified letter to the home owner as well as your legal aid rep/lawyer. Make sure copy the legal rep on the letter so that the home owner is aware you have legal rep. In the letter document everything from when you found the mold, when you contact the home owner, how many times you contacted the home owner, and finally when you connected with the home owner. Also include when you contacted the clean up services. I would even include when you visited the doctors office and what his results were. DO NOT threaten him but state that you feel it is affecting your health (Note from doctor).
5. Does PA have Rent escrow options? In Virginia if a tennant feels a landlord is not doing what they are supposed to be doing the tennant can go to the court house and pay their rent in escrow. This shows the court that you are attempting to pay your rent but do not want to hand it over to the landlord because they are not holding up their part of the bargain.

Sorry I know this is jumbled all together and I wish I could put more but I have to run. I'll see if I can get any more info for you.

 

[GoodFairies]

From what I read is that the CDC does generally not recommend testing for specific molds as all molds need to be removed regardless. ( Unless u want to prove yourself you are not crazy lol)

The reason they do not recommend it is because you will have numerous molds growing (they are ubiquitous) and that doesn't necessarily tell you anything. Stachybotris (this is what people are referring to when they say "black mold" - there are other black molds but this is the one that causes the major issues) is a little slower growing than other molds and can even be outgrown by other fungi (in competition for the same nutrient source). Therefore it's non-detection from sampling doesn't necessarily mean it isn't there. Air-sampling is an imperfect detection method as well - and surface sampling just leads back to the first thing I said - as you will have a little bit of "everything" showing - molds, bacteria.

Unless the landlord gets a professional cleanup crew in there today or tomorrow, I'd probably just take the other place and go as soon as possible. I wouldn't even bother with the mold testers. It's money you don't seem to have right now and frankly it will most likely not tell you anything of value. I said it before but I'd also leave anything that's in the basement. It is a lost cause and you would just risk bringing the molds with you.

 

[Piglets Mommy]

This is whats tearing me apart! I agree totally of course. But if we dont cover our bases first and he sues us and wins because I didnt take time to document and do things right we could lose the ability to pay for my sons service dog . So I am such a horrible state of anxiety. Thank god the kids are not coughing are seeming affected at the moment. It bothers everyone off and on. But my husband and I were down in the mess and I am thinking the way my lungs keep squeezing I have what seems like asthma.

The basement is open and the wall that backs up to it has the couch on it with a open cutout behind it that vents to the basement. ( I will post a picture later) So I keep them away from all those areas. The few days they sat there they were coughing and my daughter had that burning feeling in her lungs.

But now they are across the room by the open screen door and seem ok. So I keep fighting with myself saying " Its fine for one more month as long as they stay away from the openings to the basement " to " I need to get the heck out now!"

I dont have it but I think I will definatly think of a way to pay for that 300.00 mold test just to see if I am crazy here. lol I looked it up online and it sure matches everything I read about myotoxin producing mold right down to the shape of it. At least I will feel justified in all of this drama that seems to be stemming from it. The way the landlady acts you would think I was overreacting to worry!

I understand your need to cover your bases. Hopefully the lawyer you speak with tomorrow can give you some guidance on that. TKeep trying to get the health department/code enforcement too....if they deem the house uninhabitable, then anything written in the lease won't matter. Is the other house you wan to rent vacant now? Can you move in now if that happens? Unfortunately, if there is black mold in the house, it doesn't matter where you are, the spores are in the air.

 

[S. C.]

Hope it all works out for you OP!

 

[surfgirl]

any updates ?


are you too busy moving households that you can't reply ? : )

 

[manning]

If you can't get out of your lease and can't move here is what you can do to protect your health. This works I know we had to do this to my MIL house. I also detected a musty smell in our basement and notice some mold spots. I mixed up the below solution and put it into a garden sprayer. I sprayed every inch of the basement. The smell disappeared and three years later has not returned.

This is an excerpt from a thread about mold. The auther is a member and an official with the Dallas Housing Authority.

4. so what works? According to the instructor of the mold class I attended, try a spray bottle with the following in it:

1/2 gal. white vinegar
1/2 gal. hydrogen peroxide-common peroxide available from your drugstore 3% solution
1 cup boric acid
keep closed tightly
mix well - use in a spray bottle on a dry surface.


Shake well and spray area well. The vinegar/peroxide kills active live mold and the boric acid keeps them that way. (Note: uncapped peroxide loses it's oxygen molecules to the air when not capped tight and becomes H2O [water], so keep this solution in a bottle that can be capped off tight).

Instructor stated that boric acid works on mold bodies like it does on roach bodies - cuts them and they bleed to death because they cannot "coagulate" (snakes and snails and puppydog tails).

I guess we all know that there are some very beneficial molds, too.

One last note on the above solution. This solution will not "bleach" out the mold stain. After mold is under control, then you can bring out the bleach and whiten the mold stains.

For all you shower lovers!!!!

 

[Darcy03231]

Any updates?

 

[louey]

I didn't read through the whole post but I would be sure to take pictures with the date on the photos. Hope everything works out ok for you.

 

[cinderella73]

On my way out the door to pick up stuff for Halloween tomorrow. Its also the day my landlord is coming ( Halloween - how ironic) lol . I have a bunch of updates and I will post when I get back later tonight.

 

[Piglets Mommy]

On my way out the door to pick up stuff for Halloween tomorrow. Its also the day my landlord is coming ( Halloween - how ironic) lol . I have a bunch of updates and I will post when I get back later tonight.

How did it go?

 

[jemzmom]

On my way out the door to pick up stuff for Halloween tomorrow. Its also the day my landlord is coming ( Halloween - how ironic) lol . I have a bunch of updates and I will post when I get back later tonight.

A breif idea to expand upon from the earlier Home Depot dehumidifier suggestion:

Our local home depot has started carrying a mold killer, nothing new here, but it can be used in a commercial "fogger" that you can rent at the HDpt rental center. This is the method used by the big insurance cleanup companies after a large water loss or fire loss involving firefighting water. Normally such equipment is prohibitively expensive, but renting is reasonable.

Also, watch out for your cloth items, the mold will turn them into swiss cheese in a very short time.

Sounds like a good time to consider relocation. Orlando?