Michael Moore and Disney back in business

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by scooby-the-doo
Er, his last film was a little documentary called 'Bowling For Columbine'. It was, I believe, an Oscar winner, Cannes winner, highest grossing documentary ever

Actually it should have never been considered a documentary as many of the scenes in the movie were made up or staged. However Hollywood being what Hollywood is the rules don't see to apply when the left comes into view.

 

[Golter]

Which scenes are you referring to? Have you even seen the movie? I seriously doubt it. I think people give "Hollywood" (and I don't know specifically who your are speaking of) too much credit. That's like saying the right bows down to Rush, Hannity and the such. I'll give you more credit than that. If you don't like what Michael Moore has to say, dont listen, dont watch his movies, heck send him a hate letter. But he, like you, are entitled to your opinion without fear of retribution. That's what our country was founded on. And just because you have the right bash him and anyone who disagrees with you doesn't make it right.

 

[rwodonnell]

Originally posted by Golter
Which scenes are you referring to? Have you even seen the movie? I seriously doubt it. I think people give "Hollywood" (and I don't know specifically who your are speaking of) too much credit. That's like saying the right bows down to Rush, Hannity and the such. I'll give you more credit than that. If you don't like what Michael Moore has to say, dont listen, dont watch his movies, heck send him a hate letter. But he, like you, are entitled to your opinion without fear of retribution. That's what our country was founded on. And just because you have the right bash him and anyone who disagrees with you doesn't make it right.

I tried to make some sense out of this post, but I just couldn't. Are you saying we can or we can't "bash" Moore? You say just because you can doesn't make it right? What a strange thing to say - we are talking about right and wrong, I thought. If something is wrong, we should not be doing it.

Also, you seem to imply that someone on this board is somehow causing Moore some "fear of retribution". What are you talking about? Dissent?

Finally, regarding the "documentary" as he labeled it, there are numerous web sites debunking the film, including this one:
http://www.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html

Let's call Moore what he is. He is not a documentarian, he is not a humorist, he is a bald-faced, hate-mongering liar. (Is that too strong?) Just the type of person Disney ought to be working with (sarcasm).

 

[EUROPA]

Here are a few more to chew on..

http://www.revoketheoscar.com/

http://www.moorewatch.com/

http://www.nationalreview.com/kopel/kopel040403.asp

But he, like you, are entitled to your opinion without fear of retribution.

Wrong..wrong. People are entitled to an opinion with fear of retribution from the government. Consumers on the other hand have no such restrictions. I have every right to watch and then bash what he has to say. I would hate for someone to think that they things he says are true.

Including great quotes like this from the idiot. Where he is speaking about the heros of Flight 93.

MM...
“the passengers were scaredy-cats because they were mostly white. If the passengers had included black men, he claimed, those killers, with their puny bodies and unimpressive small knives, would have been crushed by the dudes."

 

[Another Voice]

There was even a controversy in Hollywood – how can a "documentary" be nominated for Best Original Screenplay.

As for flocking away in droves – anyone who can get a series cancelled from Bravo because of low ratings can't be said to be wildly popular.

All of this Sunday morning talk show "shouting heads" stuff is distracting from the real matter of interest. Way would Disney want to do business with Michael Moore and why is Moore interested in doing business with Disney?

I can't think of two media creations at more extreme than Disney "Family Values" Studios and Michael "Eat the Rich" Moore. Certainly Disney has enough problems already with its perceived "core audience" that adding a character like Moore isn't going to help. And Dow Jones Titan Disney – owner of vast corporate media oliogpies and exporter of American Imperialist Cultural Domination – must turn Moore's stomach.

Would Moore work for Haliburton for the money? One begins to think he would.

Of course we could get the "he's so cleaver, he's using their capital against them" line – but that's not the case. Moore won't have any problems raising the money on his own – if Barbara Streisand can hand a couple million to the Democratic Party just by throwing a dinner, I'm sure she could raise the five million for a profit making movie like Moore intends to make.

In the end it comes down the single most truthful fact about "Hollywood Activism" – those screaming the loudest do the same lying, cheating and money grubbing they accuse others of doing.

 

[blackshirt]

Another Voice- Amen

Golter- Its often a good thing to have some background knowledge of the subject being debated. After reading the websites listed a little earlier, do you still feel the same way about Moore. The Hardy one, in particular, is extensively researched and documented. It shows Moore to be a clever and talented director who has no problem distorting the truth to serve his own agenda. But then again I guess that anything that is researched in a fair and methodical manner must be some plot by the evil, senior citizen starving, children hating, racist, anti-women far right wing- mainly the Republicans

 

[SnackyStacky]

Is there ANY question in ANYBODY'S head that Disney teaming up with Michael Moore isn't a goldmine for Disney?

Set aside your opinions on Bowling for Columbine, and the war in Iraq and Bush...

Look at the numbers. Call it a documentary, call it a piece of crap, but it pulled in 21.5 million AND, there was a 250% increase in grosses between the first and second weekend of releases.

Do you know what leads to that kind of increase? Controversy. You know what sells? Controversy. I think that there is plenty of proof that not ONLY is the subject matter of the film controversial, so is the director.

For once, Disney is making a move to increase the bottom line that makes good business sense. While the production and marketing budgets for Bowling for Columbine aren't available, I have a feeling that it was relatively inexpensive to make, and thus made a lot of money for MGM, who distributed the film.

Say what you want. Disney is going to make a lot of money on this.

 

[crusader]

Say what you want. Disney is going to make a lot of money on this.

No doubt. The unfortunate thing is that there will be a price to pay - negative publicity. Disney prostituting themselves by getting in bed with one of the most politically vile of beings for money is going to be slapped on every media outlet imaginable. What a salacious story.

 

[DC7800]

Originally posted by SnackyStacky
I have a feeling that it was relatively inexpensive to make, and thus made a lot of money for MGM, who distributed the film

According to Imdb.com, the film's budget was $4,000,000 with a final U.S. domestic gross of just over $21 million. A $17 million profit doesn't really seem like a sufficient return (particularly after everyone takes their cut) for having to be associated with Moore. Even if your only objective is making a buck, with no regard for reputation, standards, truth, decency, or how all the bad publiciity will affect your company in the long-term, it just doesn't seem worth it.

 

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by DC7800
Even if your only objective is making a buck, with no regard for reputation, standards, truth, decency, or how all the bad publiciity will affect your company in the long-term, it just doesn't seem worth it.

Now think back the last 6 years and you will see this decision is right inline with Eisner's current management style. “Burn you bridges and think of the short-term” Plus Eisner is pretty far left so this type of thing is right up his alley. Remember folks if you don't want Disney doing this you can write to the company and let them know your feelings. It seems to have worked with ABC and Janeane Garofalo as they have canceled her upcoming show.

 

[SnackyStacky]

Originally posted by DC7800
According to Imdb.com, the film's budget was $4,000,000 with a final U.S. domestic gross of just over $21 million. A $17 million profit doesn't really seem like a sufficient return (particularly after everyone takes their cut) for having to be associated with Moore. Even if your only objective is making a buck, with no regard for reputation, standards, truth, decency, or how all the bad publiciity will affect your company in the long-term, it just doesn't seem worth it.

Consider your source. Imdb.com gets their information from lay people, not people within the business, so their information isn't always as credible as one might believe. I have a feeling that the production budget is over-inflated.

Either way though, after the controversy of Bowling for Columbine, and then the speech he made at the oscars, I think this one will make even more than Bowling...

 

[d-r]

"Either way though, after the controversy of Bowling for Columbine, and then the speech he made at the oscars, I think this one will make even more than Bowling.."

yeah...there's one group of people who will go see it because they are curious or agree, and a bunch more who will go see it because they want to talk about how dumb and wrong he is - just like all the attention they are giving it to it already- I wouldn't go see it because I wouldn't care.
DR

 

[peedeejones]

Here is a copy of an email I received in response to my e-mail notifying WDW that the reason I cancelled my reservations was due to the news that Disney was involved with the new
anti-president movie by Michael Moore:

"Thank you for your comments regarding the film featuring Michael Moore.
I would like to clarify that Miramax is not the distributor of the film.

Please be advised that our Guests' comments are very important to us,
and your message has been shared with our corporate offices. Although
you will not receive another reply, please know that your comments have
been heard.

Thank you for contacting the Walt Disney World Resort.

Sincerely,

Joseph Paris
Executive Offices
Walt Disney World Resort"

So it is my choice where I spend my money and I choose not to patronize Disney products as long as this movie is still a go. I have been a full supporter of all things Disney for years including spending at least $40,000 on WDW vacations over the last 10 years. If Disney drops it, and I hope they do, they will again get my hard earned dollars.

 

[Planogirl]

So it is my choice where I spend my money and I choose not to patronize Disney products as long as this movie is still a go. I have been a full supporter of all things Disney for years including spending at least $40,000 on WDW vacations over the last 10 years. If Disney drops it, and I hope they do, they will again get my hard earned dollars.

I respect a person who stands up for what they believe but I doubt that most people will care or even pay any attention to Michael Moore. I base this on the failure of the Baptist boycott. But I suppose that you never really know.

 

[d-r]

"I would like to clarify that Miramax is not the distributor of the film."

Doesn't this say that Miramax is not the distributor of the film?

 

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by d-r
"I would like to clarify that Miramax is not the distributor of the film."

Doesn't this say that Miramax is not the distributor of the film?

I've fouind this little peice today..

http://www.bushcountry.org/news/jun_news_pages/g_061303_alvarez_disney_lying_america.htm

Is Disney Lying to America?


By now everyone has heard the rumors about Disney being involved with the vile anti-American Michael Moore and his latest project. The proposed title of it is "Fahrenheit 911" and it's rumored to be a conspiracy film aimed primarily at attacking President Bush. Many Americans are/were up in arms over this not only because of the nature of the film, but because many feel that Disney represents traditional American values (at least in theory).

Now, here's the lowdown on what we've discovered:

In mid-May, we spoke on NUMEROUS occasions with Disney CEO Michael Eisner's office. BTW, their number is 818-560-1000. Since the story was so upsetting, we felt it necessary to confirm before announcing our intentions to have nothing to do with Disney ever again for involving itself with this vile director and his offensive abuse of a national tragedy that is considered sacred to most Americans.

According to his executive secretary Mindy, Michael Eisner and Disney HAD BEEN CONSIDERING backing the Moore project, but had since taken a pass. This also included any type of bridge financing rumored to be in the works involving one of its companies, Miramax. Mindy, on several occasions, was ADAMANT in stating that there was NO WAY Disney or any portion of their company was going to involve itself. We accepted that as fact. Why would Disney lie to us? To do so AND ultimately reveal that they ARE involved would be entertainment suicide on a scale not unlike that of a certain female comic who still refuses to apologize to President Bush.

A recent spat of articles began appearing again that seemed to be reliant upon old information about Disney and Moore. So we decided to call Eisner's office AGAIN. This time, we got the same story, BUT, were actually given the name of Matthew Hiltzik at Miramax 212-625-2222. Matthew hemmed and hawed, but to our surprise he did ADMIT that a bridge financing deal is in fact, reality. Matthew seemed uncomfortable admitting this, claimed it's an old deal that was approved after Icon passed on the Moore project, and that he did not know of any future involvement between Miramax and Moore.

I must admit, I feel Disney has lied and misled in some attempt to cover this up. So now we have confirmation of a bridge financing deal that involves Miramax. This despite Eisner's statement that there was NO involvement with Moore whatsoever. They had refused over and over to issue a statement because they "never respond to internet rumors". So there you have it folks. it seems the Mouse is not only involved with Michael Moore in an indirect manner on a very taboo project, they lied to us.

Jon Alvarez

 

[MelissathePooh]

So not agreeing with the president makes you anti-american?

 

[crusader]

You know this is beginning to go way beyond the money and reeks more and more of politics. The clever "disengage while the heat is on" play is all to familiar. Maybe we should take a much deeper look at whose behind this - could be Mr. Mitchell has overstayed his welcome on the Board. Disney is being used here and will not emerge unscathed amass a bloodbath of network rivals.

 

[jlambrig]

quote:
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So not agreeing with the president makes you anti-american?
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That is basically the tone of many of these posts, which is rather sad. Another US President once said, "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. Nothing but the truth should be spoken about him or any one else. But it is even more important to tell the truth, pleasant or unpleasant, about him than about any one else."

The question becomes one of "truth". That is often debatable but, if you don't agree some find you horribly misguided rather than simply holding a difference in opinion.