Medicaid lookback

[Pink Partridge]

i know that in california some counties are VERY ACTIVE in enforcing the law that requires even distant blood relatives to provide for the disposition of remains (health and safety code sections §7100 and 7103). failure to act in a timely manner is a criminal misdemeanor violation and could result in the next of kin being required to pay up to three times the cost of the disposition. section §7100 of the health and safety code establishes next of kin. i was personalty subjected to this law and despite the fact that the decedent and i were estranged due to his (on police record) threats of violence against me i learned from a very well respected attorney in the county that contacted me that the particular county was very active in pursing enforcement and my failing to make arrangements immediately would have resulted not only in a criminal prosecution but that county would enact their practice of utilizing the most expensive form of disposition which i would be responsible for repayment to them at the rate of 3x (in addition to the civil penalties of up to $10,000).

This is absolutely terrifying. I can't wrap my brain around it. Even parents can give their sweet child up for adoption or to foster care and walk away.

But in some states, you have to care for your abuser. Use your hard earned money to give to a person that committed violent crimes against you. Disgusting.

 

[Pink Partridge]

Her mom died 2 years ago and I think she’s still paying off the debt.

Just awful.

 

[piccolopat]

Spending your mother’s money on her care & her living situation isn’t the state “taking her money” or “giving it to somebody else”. It’s her money being spent on her.

I’m sorry, but why shouldn’t she pay for her care? Why should Medicaid, funded by everyone, pay when she has her own money? Nice to give gifts to family, but not if it means the rest of us have to pay to make up the difference.

I'll give you an example of how unfair Medicaid can be. My DMIL and her SIL both were married and had similar incomes most of their lives. DMIL didn't waste money but spent smartly and saved for her later years. Her SIL on the other hand spent every dime as it came and had nothing left. When both had medical issues at the end, DMIL had to pay out of pocket for the nursing home once Medicare paid the first 90 days after her hospitalization. Her SIL got Medicaid right away because she saved nothing. Similar incomes but in the end it seemed unfair because mom was responsible and could have spent that money on herself earlier in life like her SIL. Perhaps it's time to have everyone pay more into Medicare while working so nursing home care is covered for a couple of years when you need it. Also, nursing homes cost too much for mostly custodial, not nursing, care. Too much profit at senior's expense. Having more benefits for in home care and payments for family members providing care (and having to stop working) could be an option as well.

 

[piccolopat]

Filling laws are also unfair. You have no right to how your parents spend their money when they're healthy but suddenly can be liable for their nursing home costs when they have nothing left.

 

[Pink Partridge]

Filling laws are also unfair. You have no right to how your parents spend their money when they're healthy but suddenly can be liable for their nursing home costs when they have nothing left.

Exactly. Imagine watching your parents spend thousands on lottery tickets or at the casino. Begging them to stop. And now you are responsible for their bills.

 

[OKW8297]

I never wanted or needed an inheritance, nor did my brother or children. I hear what you're saying about the state not really taking money. It's just frustrating that she could have been frivolous or extravagant for years, not worrying about having money put aside, but now a small gift that would add up to less than one month of care can't be made.

Never in a million years did we see dementia being in the picture. Never thought she would need to be in a care facility. She's frail, being 90 years old, but otherwise pretty healthy.

Frankly, such is life. Having seen my sister die from a massive heart attack without taking the trips she worked for, I say, take the trips and live. tour mother chose not to do so.

 

[OKW8297]

I'll give you an example of how unfair Medicaid can be. My DMIL and her SIL both were married and had similar incomes most of their lives. DMIL didn't waste money but spent smartly and saved for her later years. Her SIL on the other hand spent every dime as it came and had nothing left. When both had medical issues at the end, DMIL had to pay out of pocket for the nursing home once Medicare paid the first 90 days after her hospitalization. Her SIL got Medicaid right away because she saved nothing. Similar incomes but in the end it seemed unfair because mom was responsible and could have spent that money on herself earlier in life like her SIL. Perhaps it's time to have everyone pay more into Medicare while working so nursing home care is covered for a couple of years when you need it. Also, nursing homes cost too much for mostly custodial, not nursing, care. Too much profit at senior's expense. Having more benefits for in home care and payments for family members providing care (and having to stop working) could be an option as well.

How about universal healthcare that will pay for everyone from the get go?

 

[Dakota731]

In our state when money runs out and Medicaid kicks in, you are sent to our county home which isn’t very nice. I personally wouldn’t spend someone else’s money except on their care when they aren’t cognizant enough to make their own decision. That sounds like fraud

 

[Dakota731]

How about universal healthcare that will pay for everyone from the get go?

Who is going to pay for $15000 a month nursing homes for all? You’re going to put that on the backs of young taxpayers and free care for illegals that we already provide. Not to mention free college loans which is being pushed for. Sounds like the working poor in this country won’t have any paycheck left when they’re done paying for everyone else.

 

[Pink Partridge]

...but now a small gift that would add up to less than one month of care can't be made.

I think that is where you can get into some murky waters. Handing out $10,000 of your mom's money amongst four children is not a small gift. It is something that will get noticed. Best to let it be.

Dementia is terrible. I feel so sad for you and your family. But don't get yourself in trouble (or mess up Medicaid) by giving your mom's money away to others. That ship has sadly sailed. She could have set up a trust or two or ten when she was of sound mind. Sadly, we never think our mind is going to fail us.

 

[Pink Partridge]

...and free care for illegals that we already provide.

And isn't that the most frustrating thing? Here we are worrying, and someone can just break the law, come here, and get it all for free. Depressing.

 

[focusondisney]

I'll give you an example of how unfair Medicaid can be. My DMIL and her SIL both were married and had similar incomes most of their lives. DMIL didn't waste money but spent smartly and saved for her later years. Her SIL on the other hand spent every dime as it came and had nothing left. When both had medical issues at the end, DMIL had to pay out of pocket for the nursing home once Medicare paid the first 90 days after her hospitalization. Her SIL got Medicaid right away because she saved nothing. Similar incomes but in the end it seemed unfair because mom was responsible and could have spent that money on herself earlier in life like her SIL. Perhaps it's time to have everyone pay more into Medicare while working so nursing home care is covered for a couple of years when you need it. Also, nursing homes cost too much for mostly custodial, not nursing, care. Too much profit at senior's expense. Having more benefits for in home care and payments for family members providing care (and having to stop working) could be an option as well.

I absolutely agree nursing homes cost too much. Especially since they are notorious for paying workers low wages. Where does all that money go?? Maybe there needs to be more investigation & regulations of what they charge.

As for unfair, that applies to so many more instances than just Medicaid. People who run up credit card bills on trips & the latest gadgets get to declare bankruptcy at a certain point but keep most of their stuff. There’s people who do it multiple times too. Others just spend responsibly & pay their bills, but their kids don’t get to have the latest phones etc. Just because it doesn’t seem “fair” doesn’t make it right. Personally, I’d be thankful my parent had money to pay for a nicer care facility with a private room for years instead of a lesser Medicaid facility just to save an inheritance. But no matter what, I’ll never agree that taxpayers should pay when the person has their own money.

 

[RoseGold]

If OP's mom is "rich," she should have gotten an estate plan together decades ago. It's too late now, and sad all around. But smart planning in the past would have taken this off of OP's shoulders today.

I'm sorry you are going through this. It sounds really difficult.

 

[SteveH]

As the POA and executor of both of my parents estates and the one that had to make medical & end of life decisions after my fathers stroke, please consult an elder law attorney. If you are doing anything like considering gifting estate money the repercussions can be significant, not only legally but from family.

 

[Jeannie]

If OP's mom is "rich," she should have gotten an estate plan together decades ago. It's too late now, and sad all around. But smart planning in the past would have taken this off of OP's shoulders today.

I'm sorry you are going through this. It sounds really difficult.

She really isn't rich and an estate plan would never have occurred to her. She saved all of her money and handed over her pension to a financial advisor. (Her highest pay before retirement was $25k.) She had a will drawn up and assumed that was all she needed.

 

[Jeannie]

But what I learned is you can't start saving for retirement, or planning for needs like LTC soon enough.

Agreed! I retired several years ago and DH will be retiring in the upcoming year. It's an exciting, yet scary, time! We've run through the numbers with our financial planner as well as a retirement planner (fiduciary) and it looks like we're set. Like you, TV Guy, I got my financial planning mindset from my mother. I've always been a saver and cautious/sensible with my spending.

 

[kymom99]

Who is going to pay for $15000 a month nursing homes for all? You’re going to put that on the backs of young taxpayers and free care for illegals that we already provide. Not to mention free college loans which is being pushed for. Sounds like the working poor in this country won’t have any paycheck left when they’re done paying for everyone else.

They wouldn’t be able to charge that much

 

[kymom99]

In our state when money runs out and Medicaid kicks in, you are sent to our county home which isn’t very nice. I personally wouldn’t spend someone else’s money except on their care when they aren’t cognizant enough to make their own decision. That sounds like fraud

What state is that? In Kentucky if the facility is Medicaid certified you can stay in the same place. No one taking care of you knows if you are Medicaid or private pay.

 

[Forevermarypoppins]

For years my mother would always say that my brother and I would 'be rich' when she died. We would tell her not to worry about us, we were financially stable. Fast forward to today where she is in a memory care facility, costing $15k per month. Luckily her savings have been able to cover that cost. Once her money runs out, most likely in the next two years, Medicaid supposedly will take over. I'd like to give her four toddler great-grandchildren a monetary Christmas gift from her. I was thinking of a $2,500 I bond for each child. This total is less than the cost of one month at her facility. I don't want this to jeopardize her Medicaid eligibility in the future, nor do I want to have to pay it back. My name is on my mother's checking and savings accounts and my brother's is on her investment accounts. Both of us have power of attorney. I don't want to do anything wrong, but not sure who can best advise us. My regular financial advisor? The lawyer who handled my own will? An elder law attorney?

I'm happy you have the mindset to get advice first. Where I live, once my mom was placed in her memory care facility ALL monetaries can be and have been overseen.

 

[mjkacmom]

What state is that? In Kentucky if the facility is Medicaid certified you can stay in the same place. No one taking care of you knows if you are Medicaid or private pay.

The places I looked at for my dad had limited Medicaid beds, so you want to be private pay as long as possible to get a chance at getting one, otherwise they can send you anywhere when money runs out.