MDE/FP+ Poll Results

Pete was "shocked" at the results because only 10% of people didn't like MDE/FP+, yet the number of negative posts on the Boards belied a percentage that was much greater.

Why does this keep coming up. The # of posts will always indicate complete dissatisfaction with something. Seriously. If you read the Dis, you'd think half the world hates Disney World and has a miserable time there while half the world loves Disney World. This is true about everything. The forums about a product will focus on the few that had a problem they needed to research. A Kitchenaid forum will be weighted w the few consumers who had theirs break. While millions are using it happily and never seek out a voice.

The negative posts on the Boards could be coming from the 10%, the 49%, or some percentage in between. Logic dictates, (even if it is "fuzzy"), that it has to be some number between 10% and 49%. The closer the real number is to 10%, the more legitimate the "shock" is. The closer the real number is to 49%, then the number of posts becomes far less shocking. And we will never know.

You're positing that everyone will either like / love or dislike / hate the system. When it's just a system. The bulk of guests will simply "use" it and find it "sufficient" or "works as intended" expressing no such affinity emotions about it.

I use my keyboard. Right now, it's working well. I don't particularly like or dislike it, yet it's doing it's job just fine. I would buy it again because it is performing as expected.

It's just a badly worded poll to say that everyone must express an affinity-type emotion toward FP+. Suffice to say that of those who chose to actually answer the question and pick between "Like" and "Hate", however bad a question that may be, of those 61% who forced themselves to pick from the two actual answers, 84% chose like, and 16% chose hate. (51/61 and 10/61). The other 39% chose something along the lines of "I refuse to directly answer the question at this time due to some circumstance whether it be changes I'd like to see or the wording of the question".
 
As any group’s enrollment (in this case, the anit-FP+ crew) declines they become louder and more vocal.

There is no point in convincing the anit-FP+ crowd that it’s actually a workable system with benefits.

The Pro-FP+ crowd has essentially given up the argument.

FP+ is here to stay, get on board or get passed by.


It’s over. Deal with it.
 
Why does this keep coming up.

Because that was the whole point to the discussion on the Podcast. The conclusion there was "You guys who like FP+ need to do a better job of posting because the 10% of the people who live in Bitter Town are burying you on the Boards." So the question was, is, and will remain, is it really only 10% of the people who are posting negatively, or are those posts coming from some of the 39% as well. It really isn't that hard to follow. Everyone else seems to get it.

The # of posts will always indicate complete dissatisfaction with something. Seriously.
??? I have no idea what this is intended to mean. There are both positive and negative posts when it comes to FP+. Surely you know that.

You're positing that everyone will either like / love or dislike / hate the system. When it's just a system. The bulk of guests will simply "use" it and find it "sufficient" or "works as intended" expressing no such affinity emotions about it.
No. I am positing that everyone who took the time to bother to answer the poll will either like / love or dislike / hate the system. Hard to even respond to the poll if you don't fall into one of those categories. If someone couldn't pigeonhole themselves into one of those categories, they wouldn't have answered the poll.
 
51% outright approval isn't a good number except in elections where somehow it's always a mandate. :)

Ah... but in a case where...

51% of votes counted thus far are for
10% of votes counted thus far are against
39% of votes have yet to come in, and will eventually come in as for or against

I would want to have that 51 on my side. :)
 

BTW LT, thanks for he classic redirect, wouldn't be a 'discussion' without it! ;)

You're welcome, although it would be classically myopic to consider it a redirect by pointing out that most would be shocked at 51% approval without caveat when Pete was "shocked" at the results because only 10% of people didn't like MDE/FP+.

But I can understand how multiple points could be confusing at first glance, especially when blow dryers and power drills enter the discussion.
 
Ah... but in a case where...

51% of votes counted thus far are for
10% of votes counted thus far are against
39% of votes have yet to come in, and will eventually come in as for or against

I would want to have that 51 on my side. :)

But in a product satisfaction scenario, "more than half" isn't a milestone achievement or a victory. Certainly not in any of the marketing/customer service situations with which I've been personally involved. It's not a high enough score to rate well in customer satisfaction at all, even if you split the 39 in half, it's still not a great score on either side. 3 out of 4 satisfied customers isn't good.
 
Because that was the whole point to the discussion on the Podcast. The conclusion there was "You guys who like FP+ need to do a better job of posting because the 10% of the people who live in Bitter Town are burying you on the Boards."

Oh. Well it's simple. One who is content w something cannot go post happily about every thing they are content with. I see at least 200 things in my current line of view. From a pair of scissors on my desk, to my computer screen, to my keyboard, to my McD coffee.

Is it up to those who "like" their pair of scissors to go out and combat those who had theirs break? That way the guy who had his break isn't seen as 50% failure, but rather because 1,000,000 people posted that theirs didn't, his is seen in the correct light as being only a .000001 failure rate?

If a guy who had his break makes 50 posts on a forum about it, should I have to make 50 posts about how mine didn't?

No of course not. Those who like something simply have better things to do than to all come out and post about everything that worked as expected, and w the same fervor as those who had a problem or concern.

I placed a call on my phone today... and it... went through. Should I go out to an Android forum and post that, so that if someone else had a call not go thru, the correct proportions are reflected? :)
 
But in a product satisfaction scenario, "more than half" isn't a milestone achievement or a victory. Certainly not in any of the marketing/customer service situations with which I've been personally involved. It's not a high enough score to rate well in customer satisfaction at all, even if you split the 39 in half, it's still not a great score on either side. 3 out of 4 satisfied customers isn't good.

You're still counting the 39% as not satisfied.

51% are satisfied.
10% are not.

39% have yet to state if they are or not.
 
Ah... but in a case where...

51% of votes counted thus far are for
10% of votes counted thus far are against
39% of votes have yet to come in, and will eventually come in as for or against

I would want to have that 51 on my side. :)
39% have yet to state if they are or not.

What side would you want to be on if instead of the 39% being "yet to come in" they were actually "in its current form I hate it, but if they let me tweak it, I'd like it"? Don't assume that the 39% couldn't choose, or that they were simply undecided. Remember that the 39% weren't choosing: "I need more time", or "I can't make up my mind". They were choosing "Could be good, but needs work". Future tense. That sounds an awful lot like "I currently don't like it, but I am not giving up hope that future changes will bring me over to the other side." You seem to be ignoring or discounting to zero the "I currently don't like it" aspect of that choice. So did Pete.
 
Oh. Well it's simple. One who is content w something cannot go post happily about every thing they are content with.

You know, people often retreat to the "complainers complain more than lovers love" argument, but it just isn't true. Check out the average scores on Zagat or the average number of stars given out on Trip Advisor or Yelp. If people complained more than they praised, the typical restaurant in a Zagat guide would be around 10-10-10 instead of 22-22-22. And the average number of stars in Trip Advisor or Yelp would be 1.5 instead of 3.5-4.
 
But I can understand how multiple points could be confusing at first glance, especially when blow dryers and power drills enter the discussion.
Hehe!

Hey, the blow dryer thing wasn't half bad! ;)

However, a point we can agree on, we'd all like WDW to have a system that does more than just get the job done. We expect a system that would satisfy the Traditions of Safety, Courtesy, Show, and Efficiency to put the guest experience above all else. Unfortunately we are so far past Walt that these Traditions have been blurred and obscured. However, I still hold out hope for a system over time that is as good for the guest as it is for TWDC.
 
No, I split it in half. 51+19.5 = 70.5%, less than 3 out of 4.

That's fine, make any guesses you want. Why one would "guess" that the uncounted votes would come in 50/50 when the already counted votes have come in 84/16 is beyond me, but if you want to assume they'll be 50/50, you can draw any conclusions upon those assumptions that you like.

Gotta remember where we've come from. Just 2 years ago if you ran this same survey about FP- going away and if it getting replaced by a system that some have called 3-and-done would be "liked", the responses would have been like 10% like and 90% dislike. Now whether we're at 70/30 or 86/14 doesn't matter... it just shows that the public opinion has changed gradually over time, and polls have gone from "generally against" to "generally in favor" over the course of just two years.
 
That's fine, make any guesses you want. Why one would "guess" that the uncounted votes would come in 50/50 when the already counted votes have come in 84/16 is beyond me, but if you want to assume they'll be 50/50, you can draw any conclusions upon those assumptions that you like.
Because we are not dealing exclusively with folks who are undecided, (and maybe not at all). In a classic poll where "undecided" is an option, it is fair to think that once those people make up their minds, their percentages will follow the known. Instead, we are dealing with people who have expressed a view that in the future the system might be to their liking, but it is not to their liking right now. Remember that the "positive" response was merely "like" not "love". If they already "liked" it, they had a chance to vote that way. By being in the 39%, they have stated that they currently do not like it, at least, not enough to vote that way, and changes have to be made to win them over. What if the changes never come?
 
But in a product satisfaction scenario, "more than half" isn't a milestone achievement or a victory. Certainly not in any of the marketing/customer service situations with which I've been personally involved. It's not a high enough score to rate well in customer satisfaction at all, even if you split the 39 in half, it's still not a great score on either side. 3 out of 4 satisfied customers isn't good.

I agree with your statements in theory, but are we really talking about product satisfaction with this poll? FP+ and MDE aren't a product in and of themselves, they are a component of a product: WDW. A component that is marketed as a free perk. (Whether they're really "free" is open to debate.)

I can dislike certain aspects of my iPhone (and I do), yet I give the phone a very positive rating overall. So in this poll you have 51% of people who fully approve of FP+, 39% who dislike at least some part of FP+, and 10% who hate FP+. Assumptions can be made, but I don't think this poll shows us much as far as overall product (WDW) satisfaction.
 
That's fine, make any guesses you want. Why one would "guess" that the uncounted votes would come in 50/50 when the already counted votes have come in 84/16 is beyond me, but if you want to assume they'll be 50/50, you can draw any conclusions upon those assumptions that you like.

If it really were an "uncounted" vote, that might make sense. I'd tend to err on the side of "Could be good, but needs work" starts as inferring a negative, but was giving you the benefit of the doubt that they'd split 50/50.
 
Come on you put any poll results on the disboards... if it concluded that most guests hated FP+, you'd go... See? It's bad. When it's good, you go.... They must be spinning this. Others said 2 years ago that attendance would drop because of FP+. Now 2 years later attendance is roaring... and now it's... well, we don't know if it's because of FP+, maybe more people are just going for other reasons. .

Its so funny how you accuse others of "spin" essentially when that's all you are doing yourself.

We have actually had polls here where the majority of people said they didn't like FP+, and I don't recall anyone popping in and saying "see its BAD !, the majority thinks so !!!" Though I did see people pop in and point out, rightly that surveying people on the Dis isn't going to give you a representative sample.

And I will throw out your example again where Iger noted that 90% of 50% of people using magic bands rating their experience as positive showed that people Loved FP+ ... which was absurd.

Pot ... meet the Kettle.

As for the attendance, we don't know what the net impact of FP+ has been, we know there are people here on the boards who have chosen not to go because of it, but we can't isolate that impact from others. And if roaring means a 3% year over year gain .... I guess its "roaring"

But would you seriously argue that things like the dramatically improved economy wouldn't have an impact on increasing attendance, or the massive popularity of Frozen ? Are you really suggesting that even those two things alone wouldn't increase attendance ? :confused3

Bottom line is, MOST guests are "content to happy" with FP+.
.

Bottom line is you have no basis to make this statement. None. The closest thing we have to a representative survey is the one you yourself put forth from Iger, which didn't actually talk about how people felt about FP+, and which was pitched to Share holders who have just seen their company invest 1.5 Billion into this new system, so you can be damn sure they will put the shiniest polish on it they can.

I would tend to agree that most are probably content .... but anyone could also say MOST people are Unhappy to content with FP+ ... probably just as accurate as your statement.


Yes, there is a sliver of the population with a legit gripe, because they were the few users of FP- before, and it really helped them way more than most other guests. This is a known fact. But for most guests, the new FP+ gets them more fast passes than they used to. .

As yes your usual fall back position, with, again, zero factual evidence to support this. "A sliver of the population" way to down play the experiences of people who just don't agree with you. Listening to the pod cast the other day it sounded like more than just a sliver, looking around these boards its more than a sliver, going on just about any article posted about FP+ and reading the comments its more than a sliver, heck even poking around Facebook its a whole lot MORE than a sliver. But ... you know, spin spin spin.


As to "49% being good". Come on. This is a functional tool, not a sensational-type item. Like... if you surveyed people about a table. Do 99.99% of the guests review it? No. A leg breaks for ONE person, he posts a review, and the reviews speak 100% about table legs breaking. But really, most of the guests just put things on it, it's fine, if they were to rate it it would be "fine". Not great, magical, delightful or anything.

This is the same thing. It's a tool, you charge your purchases to it, it gets you on some rides. Did it work? Yes. Did you skip the 3 lines? Yes. Great. It worked fine, and it gets most users on more rides than they used to. That's why you're seeing 90% "content or better". You're not interested in those who are thrilled by a functional tool like a drill or a queuing system.

FP+ is just more successful than those who don't like it are simply willing to give it credit for. It worked, it was a success, it did not kill Disney World, and the takeaway is it's only going to grow from here. Disneyland, here it comes. :confused3 If you like FP-, go to DL now.

And then we get the most over simplified description of FP+ possible, without any considerations beyond "its a table, can you put stuff on it ? yes, then its doing its job" ... right, my $5000 table, all I care about is that I can put stuff on it. Bravo on that one.

And It worked, it worked at what exactly ? What is the purpose of FP+? Is it to decrease the time I spend in line, or enhance the experience people are having at the parks, because the reviews by a LOT of people, more than 10%, are saying that its not working.

But you know ... just pop stuff down on the table. In that case I have 4 2x4s, a sheet of plywood and some nails you can buy for $5000.
 
That's fine, make any guesses you want. Why one would "guess" that the uncounted votes would come in 50/50 when the already counted votes have come in 84/16 is beyond me, but if you want to assume they'll be 50/50, you can draw any conclusions upon those assumptions that you like.

Gotta remember where we've come from. Just 2 years ago if you ran this same survey about FP- going away and if it getting replaced by a system that some have called 3-and-done would be "liked", the responses would have been like 10% like and 90% dislike. Now whether we're at 70/30 or 86/14 doesn't matter... it just shows that the public opinion has changed gradually over time, and polls have gone from "generally against" to "generally in favor" over the course of just two years.

I just love how you manufacture a completely fictitious scenario and then use it to validate your point!

Oh, and while I don't "love" FP, I don't "hate" it either. I do find it to be an especially intriguing corporate exercise, and I think it could provide substantial benefit but only with substantial changes.

So that would put me (ME!) squarely in your 39% demographic. And I didn't even vote! (nor did that take 15 seconds.)
 
I mean, hey while we are at it using a poll of people who self select, from a group who has already self selected to follow the boards, as fans of WDW, to comment on a podcast about WDW as fans of WDW and spin spin spin it however we want ...

Lets pull up other ones !!!

Was FP+ and MBs a wise investment ???
http://www.www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3206914

Answer - Nope

Early poll about using FP+ and do you like it ?
http://www.dis.disboards.com/showthread.php?p=50245170

Answer - Sort of, but a lot of people who liked it without tiering


Oh here is a good one - would you prefer Legacy FP or FP+
http://www.htp.disboards.com/showthread.php?p=52514015

Answer - Legacy FP in a landslide ...

Oh Heck another one why not ...

Did the availability of the 4th FP make a difference to you ?
http://ww35.disboards.com/showthread.php?p=51113130

Answer - a little but most people still hate it !




Don't suppose anyone is going to hold these up as showing that FP+ has been a failure are you ? And for the record, these are probably as representative of a sample as the podcast Poll.
 














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